Board 8 > Anagram Aces Ace Attorney Topic 2: Penny Nichols Edition (spoilers)

(+) Yeah! (+)

Underleveled posted...

I can't believe 1-4 is shorter than 2-3 and 3-3.

I can, and it relates to the reason why I don't hold 1-4 in the same high regard as the other final cases. As intimidating as Manfred von Karma is as a prosecutor, he goes down in only four evidence presentations--same as Frank Sahwit. I really feel like 1-4 would be much better if Yogi's conviction/Edgeworth's confession happened at the end of Day 2's trial session and Day 3 was devoted solely to proving Edgeworth's innocence in DL-6.

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LordoftheMorons posted...

(And in fact is the best case)

facts
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NFUN posted...

facts

My favorite as well

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- Why does Larry even have Edgeworths phone number? I could maybe believe Edgeworth would give his number to Phoenix, but Larry?
- Edgeworth is in another country, yet can return to Los Japangeles in like an hour, I guess. Dude must own a house in Korexico.
- Edgeworth is like I thought the cops would have arrested Larry instead of Iris, and man, I also expected that. I figured this was going to be a thing where we defended Larry in the first case and the last case, but apparently not.
- Alright, Ill accept Edgeworth not recognizing Dahlia after five years and dyed hair.
- I like how no one even considers using a public defender.
- I like how Edgeworth just accepts the psyche-locks in stride. Hes never had direct experience with magic before, but hes like This must be what Phoenix was talking about and figures out how they work in one second, but doesnt know the terminology so he keeps calling them psycho-locks.
- Edgeworth, I accept that youre Phoenixs friend and he believes in you, but maaaaaaybe a delirious hospital patient telling you to do the opposite of your normal job isnt the person to listen to.
- Im wondering how sympathetic Dahlia will be in the end. They made her out to be pretty villainous in her previous appearances, and now shes acting at least somewhat sympathetic.
- Wait, Maya is still trapped on the other side of the bridge? Do the cops not have helicopters?
- The best possible twist to Dahlia saying shes not the murderer is a revelation that she hired a professional assassin, parting her hair to reveal two scars, and pulling out a glass of wine.
- I thought in this world, the defense attorney isnt allowed to speak to witnesses before the case starts, but Gumshoe is like Edgeworth, go talk to the witness.
- Oh man, the snowmobile isnt covered in snow anymoreeeee.
- I refuse to believe immaterial spiritual nuns care so much about the specific time of things.
- Calling it now: the gem in the wizard staff was Dahlias 2 million-dollar gem.
- Edgeworth has requested a different judge, eh? The greatest plot twist in Phoenix Wright would be a third judge.
- Edgeworth can just choose the prosecutor if Godot disappears? I assume itll be Franziska.
- I even chased [a girl] to Japan. Jesus Christ, Larry.
- Countries important enough to be on this flag line: UK, Ireland, South Korea, Greece, Switzerland, Japan, USA, France, Germany, Italy. Screw you, China and Russia.
- I like Edgeworths annoyance at having to do the psyche-locks again.
- I really enjoy the turnaround of playing as Edgeworth in the final case. This is a great way to bookend things with your rival in an unexpected way while finding something for Edgeworth to do in the story, and to get more of his perspective. Gumshoe as his Maya is kind of fun.
- I also like how the cops have put zero effort into finding Pearl.

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Anagram posted...

I like how no one even considers using a public defender.

Well, it's pretty much a guaranteed loss in the Ace Attorney world! It's brought up in 1-2 when Phoenix gets arrested, and that's why he chooses to defend himself instead.

And Edgeworth's role in T&T is fanservice done right.

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I was so stoked when I realized I was about to play as Edgeworth and still something I look forward to whenever I replay AA3.

A side note on the country thing, I believe in Japan, the foreign country that Edgeworth goes to is actually America, but I'm not entirely certain on that one.

One thing I AM certain of though is that in the Japanese versions, the von Karmas are from America.

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Don't they explain away the helicopter thing by saying there's nowhere to land?

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In the original draft, Winston Payne was Phoenix's public defender. So yeah, I think you can see why nobody wants to go that route.

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Anagram posted...

- Edgeworth can just choose the prosecutor if Godot disappears?

He has so much clout in that justice system it's not even funny. Really shows how much respect he demands, even in spite of being abroad for most of the past two years and the endless controversy that surrounds him and everyone he comes in contact with.

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NBIceman posted...

Don't they explain away the helicopter thing by saying there's nowhere to land?

They say there's a lot of turbulence in the air, so they can't make a safe extraction, yeah.

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LeonhartFour posted...

Well, it's pretty much a guaranteed loss in the Ace Attorney world! It's brought up in 1-2 when Phoenix gets arrested, and that's why he chooses to defend himself instead.

My impression was that most lawyers in the AA world are garbage, and the main characters are the exceptions.

LeonhartFour posted...

And Edgeworth's role in T&T is fanservice done right.

That definitely sounds right. I don't even want Phoenix to get better, except maybe to be a witness as joke.

Underleveled posted...

One thing I AM certain of though is that in the Japanese versions, the von Karmas are from America.

That shocks me. I completely bought them being German.

NBIceman posted...

Don't they explain away the helicopter thing by saying there's nowhere to land?

No, but they do say there's not a lot of room around the inner temple.

Mewtwo59 posted...

In the original draft, Winston Payne was Phoenix's public defender. So yeah, I think you can see why nobody wants to go that route.

But he's a prosecutor, and as we know from Phoenix, that's the opposite of a lawyer.


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Underleveled posted...

He has so much clout in that justice system it's not even funny. Really shows how much respect he demands, even in spite of being abroad for most of the past two years and the endless controversy that surrounds him and everyone he comes in contact with.

Well okay then, but didn't he almost get drummed out in 1-5?

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Anagram posted...

Well okay then, but didn't he almost get drummed out in 1-5?

Some people wanted to get rid of him because he's already got so much clout and influence, but they needed an excuse to do so. 1-5 provided them one until Gant got caught.

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Anagram posted...

Well okay then, but didn't he almost get drummed out in 1-5?

That's part of what I mean by controversy.

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Anagram posted...

My impression was that most lawyers in the AA world are garbage, and the main characters are the exceptions.

That definitely sounds right. I don't even want Phoenix to get better, except maybe to be a witness as joke.

That shocks me. I completely bought them being German.

No, but they do say there's not a lot of room around the inner temple.

But he's a prosecutor, and as we know from Phoenix, that's the opposite of a lawyer.

prosecutors never act as defense attorneys in this world, correct
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LeonhartFour posted...

Some people wanted to get rid of him because he's already got so much clout and influence, but they needed an excuse to do so. 1-5 provided them one until Gant got caught.

Underleveled posted...

That's part of what I mean by controversy.

Alright, fair enough.

Regardless, my real question right now is how Godot will factor into this. If Edgeworth really brought in another prosecutor, the only other ones with sprites are Franziska and Payne, so it's obviously her. Why they'd bring in the Canadian judge I can't guess, though.

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LeonhartFour posted...

Well, it's pretty much a guaranteed loss in the Ace Attorney world! It's brought up in 1-2 when Phoenix gets arrested, and that's why he chooses to defend himself instead.

AFAIK public defenders' offices in the US are typically severely underfunded and understaffed, so it's a disadvantage even if they know what they're doing

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Anagram posted...

Why they'd bring in the Canadian judge I can't guess, though.

I think this was already explained but just in case it wasn't I'll spoiler tag it (it's not that big a deal anyway).

The main Judge knows Edgeworth very well. No doubt he'd recognize him and object to him sitting in the defense chair. But he only met the Canadian judge once and banks on him not remembering/recognizing him.

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Underleveled posted...

I think this was already explained but just in case it wasn't I'll spoiler tag it (it's not that big a deal anyway).

The main Judge knows Edgeworth very well. No doubt he'd recognize him and object to him sitting in the defense chair. But he only met the Canadian judge once and banks on him not remembering/recognizing him.

Oh, I didn't realize he wasn't allowed and was just cheating his way in, okay.

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I also think that's giving too much credit to the main judge's memory after 3-3, but okay.

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Yeah, Edgeworth and Phoenix could both get disbarred if they get caught.

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Playing as Edgey was so fun

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LeonhartFour posted...

Yeah, Edgeworth and Phoenix could both get disbarred if they get caught.

I refuse to believe you can be seriously punished for anything in this universe other than murder. Even von Karma wasn't punished for evidence shenanigans, only murder.

By the way, now that the game has introduced playable Edgeworth, we'd better keep playing the rest of the case as him, and not have Phoenix take over halfway through.

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For the record, this was the case that inspired the Edgeworth games because the fan response to getting to play as him here was overwhelmingly positive. I don't think I've ever heard anyone say a bad word about his part in the case.

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I love 3-5.

I'm sad Elise died, I really liked her vibe. Also Sister Bikini is adorable.

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LeonhartFour posted...

For the record, this was the case that inspired the Edgeworth games because the fan response to getting to play as him here was overwhelmingly positive. I don't think I've ever heard anyone say a bad word about his part in the case.

We'll see! ... But actually I've really enjoyed it.

Raka_Putra posted...

I love 3-5.

I'm sad Elise died, I really liked her vibe. Also Sister Bikini is adorable.

Is she the first victim we meet before they die? I feel like the answer is yes, but I'm not absolutely confident.

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- Dahlia seems barely fazed by Larrys actions. He accidentally set all of this in motion, didnt he?
- I just realized we havent seen modern Edgeworths face all game. There had been be some kind of wacky reveal in the court where he has a scar or something.
- Goddammit, its just normal Edgeworth. Thats a huge missed opportunity.
- You know, if I was Edgeworth and I could choose my opponent, I would probably have chosen Winston Payne. Thats the smart choice, right? I guess maybe Payne would recognize him and not keep silent, but still.
- I cant believe its the Canadian judge who raises the first objection to Franziskas whip.
- Its fun to see Edgeworth learning more about how Phoenix feels during court. Too bad well never see Phoenix the Prosecutor I assume. The only problems are that Edgeworth always looks too smug when asking completely ordinary questions, but Ill chalk that up to Edgeworth edgeworthing, and his pointing gesture is much less dramatic than Phoenixs. It does feel odd to have no wingman, though.
- A foolishly foolish idea born from the foolish mind of a foolhardy foolish fool.
- This has been fun so far, but I have the same problem with Franziska I had before: she just straight-up does not seem like Phoenixs or Edgeworths equal. Shes constantly surprised by everything, whereas Edgeworths only surprise comes when Bikini chides him for asking how long she was in the bath for. That said, pitting Edgeworth against Franziska is still a clever use of resources, so Im fine with it.

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Anagram posted...

Is she the first victim we meet before they die? I feel like the answer is yes, but I'm not absolutely confident.

Mia

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There was also Turner Grey.
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LordoftheMorons posted...

Mia

****ing derp.

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Anagram posted...

its just normal Edgeworth. Thats a huge missed opportunity.

Wrong! It's mirrored sprite Edgeworth, with an attorney's badge on his lapel!

And yeah, while Franziska is clearly not in Edgeworth's league, this is the one time it actually feels satisfying to beat her down because of their perceived rivalry with one another.

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Does the defense bench have a kick me sign on it!?
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3-5 spoilers, anagram don't click

this reminds me of when I played Mega Man 4 as a kid, I was so certain Dr. Cossack would be Dr. Wily because Mr. X was Dr. Wily in Mega Man 6, and I was SHOCKED when it turned out that Dr. Cossack was actually a real guy instead of Wily in disguise

LeonhartFour posted...

Wrong! It's mirrored sprite Edgeworth, with an attorney's badge on his lapel!

And yeah, while Franziska is clearly not in Edgeworth's league, this is the one time it actually feels satisfying to beat her down because of their perceived rivalry with one another.

I did miss the badge, okay.

NFUN posted...

Does the defense bench have a kick me sign on it!?

I mean, Phoenix has gotten tased, splashed with hot coffee, and whipped, so maybe.

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- I could never take a life. I dont think this series would pull this, but this had better not be a twin. Is there going to be some secret reason behind all of Dahlias actions revealed that makes her not fully responsible for her first two cases?
- Just touching me will make you eternally unhappy.
- No court of law will ever acknowledge that people can fly! Actually, there is some precedent for this.
- Thats what hed do Then we get an image of Phoenix, as if Edgeworth could be talking about anyone else. How many men does he even know? Phoenix, Gumshoe, the judge, Larry Butz, and a few witnesses from his previous cases?
- That stupid crystal sphere is 100% going to be the container of the 2 million-dollar gem or be the gem itself cut into a sphere. Id bet almost anything on it.
- Edgeworth says his job here was to pass the case back to Phoenix? Nooooooo
- So Edgeworth is going to somehow be replaced by Phoenix, eh? Then Franziska somehow will be replaced by Godot. Not just because he hasnt shown up yet and we need to resolve his story, but also because the series isnt going to end with Franziska as the final boss.

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Yeah, you can't set up all the stuff the prologue of the case did and then have Phoenix just disappear for the whole case!

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edgeworth segment of 3-5 is arguably the GOAT of AA
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I LOVE Bikini's testimony. She doesn't lie and she's not wrong about anything she saw/experienced .... and yet it doesn't make sense. Sifting through the contradictions is so satisfying.

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- Dun dun dun, turns out Phoenix Wright was reading about Mias case from a hospital bed.
- I wouldnt have minded just playing as Edgeworth the whole case, but Phoenix is like NOPE IM BACK BABY.
- Her open hostility is kind of cute. No smirking!
- Gumshoe fixes the bridge, because thats somehow his job and something he knows how to do, so he calls the police to go investigate the other side of the bridge, equipped with food and supplies in case Maya is sick and ready for trouble since theyre entering an unsecured location that may have been involved in a murder. Oh wait no, its just him, Phoenix, and Franziska.
- Im Franziska von Karma, the prodigy. Jeez, Id assumed she only introduced herself that way in courtrooms. My mistake.
- As far as investigation sidekicks go, Maya > Pearl Ema > Gumshoe > Franziska.
- Game, Im willing to go along with the conceit that this is in America somehow, but I refuse to believe Franziska thinks this Japanese scroll is American art.
- Wow, Godots throwing out some pretty sexist remarks. Although I approve of calling her Lady von Whippingberg.
- Being extradited from Hell is a tedious affair. My dad is a lawyer, and I can confirm he speaks like this. This is actually a little succinct for him.
- Godot says Im going to imply who I am without saying it, which is strange because the audience already knows. And I blame you for Mias death even though you werent with her when she was attacked, which makes complete sense. Knew it. Knewwwww itttttt.
- Oh man, Elise Deauxnim was Mayas mother? I didnt see that coming.
- Bikini is just about to tell us why she came out of hiding when theres an earthquake! Its too bad they set the game in Los Angeles instead of like Omaha or something, then I could have made another joke.
- I love how Phoenix is worried about the people in the Inner Temple, and he first thinks of Edgeworth and not Maya or Pearl. Reminds me of this: https://compote.slate.com/images/519accbf-d2a3-4312-ae39-c69611936550.jpg
- Edgeworth is like whoops let Iris escape, my bad, and Phoenix is like nah bro shes in the inner temple, no point in calling the police to mount a search just in case Im wrong.
- We get to the temple, and it looks like Iris has put even more locks on the gate. Dun dun dunnnnnnn

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Anagram posted...

- Oh man, Elise Deauxnim was Mayas mother? I didnt see that coming.

Yeah, that one caught me off guard, too. I love when you find the talisman in the garden and it's literally labeled "Master's Talisman," and it's like the game is beating you over the head with it like it can't believe you haven't figured it out yet.

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LeonhartFour posted...

Yeah, that one caught me off guard, too. I love when you find the talisman in the garden and it's literally labeled "Master's Talisman," and it's like the game is beating you over the head with it like it can't believe you haven't figured it out yet.

It feels like the game is trying to wrap up all loose ends.

So I checked it out and it seems like I can play the remaining AA games on my phone. Is that viable? This isn't a Square situation where they completely butcher the games while porting them, is it?

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From what I've heard, the mobile versions are pretty solid. I've never played them myself though.

I don't think the Edgeworth games are on mobile though, and you'd have to emulate and patch the second one anyway. I don't think the Layton/AA crossover is on mobile either, but that's a non-canon game anyway. And the Edgeworth games are pretty much self-contained, so you won't miss out on anything in the mainline games if you don't play them.

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Thanks. Looks like the Edgeworth games are only on the DS, which I don't think can download stuff online.

All I know about the post-3 games is:

• Phoenix is replaced by Apollo Justice, who's the Raiden to his Snake
• There's a redheaded girl named Athena who's also playable somehow
• There's a girl in a blue magician's outfit who gives off sidekick vibes ala Maya and Ema
• There's a mystical Indian-looking guy with beads?
• People complained about Apollo, so one of the games lets you play as both him and Phoenix
• Edgeworth wears glasses

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Apollo > Phoenix imo but that's all I'll say

Sounds like you know pretty much all you need to know!

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LeonhartFour posted...

Sounds like you know pretty much all you need to know!

I wish I could replay them all over again only knowing this amount.

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Whoever mentioned AA5 animations being bad, I direct your attention to Crab and Sniper, whom I just met
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I do recommend playing Layton vs. AA eventually. It's not especially great by either series' standard, but it's still decent and worth playing. And I really like one of the prosecutors there.

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Yeah, Layton/AA is still a good game, and it has one case that I think ranks up with some of the best in the entire series.

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Yeah, Layton/AA has some great character design. Plus I really dig the music and it's fun if only to have the main four characters interacting and palling around.

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