Lurker > 1337toothbrush

havean776 posted...

Nothing wrong with criticizing him. Just know that threatening to not vote does nothing to help anyone but Trump.

When have I ever threatened to not vote for biden or any democratic candidate? You're all making up strawmen to deflect from the real argument of "biden should stop supporting genocide" or as the opening post points out "biden should stop supporting genocide because it's hurting his poll numbers" since apparently biden only cares about poll numbers and doesn't give a shit about people's lives.

havean776 posted...

YOu are in a privliged postion where you can ignore the damage "the other guy" does. He is real, he can do huge damage and make laws that forever hurt my friends. You telling me to just ignore that is not an option for me.

Says the one taking the privileged position of ignoring genocide.

Kingfrost posted...

So you're saying women's rights are a small price to pay, as long as the democratic party maybe possibly learns a lesson (even though they won't.) I'm sure all those Democrats will be like "Man, we probably lost because of Israel, and certainly not because we didn't go further to the right and appeal to more centrists. We don't totally go more right to try to win more elections in the future or anything like that. Nope. We would never do that!"

So, again, you're saying genocide is a small price to pay since shutting down any and all criticism of biden is far more important.

havean776 posted...

How does Trump being elected stop that?

How does criticizing biden and having him change his actions get trump elected? Reminder that biden's handling has disapproval from 75% of democrats: https://news.gallup.com/poll/642695/majority-disapprove-israeli-action-gaza.aspx

havean776 posted...

So you are saying that my friends losing their rights and maybe their lifes is a small price you are willing to pay to send a message?

So you're saying genocide is a small price to pay?

WingsOfGood posted...

"Biden I dislike what you are doing with Israel so instead I will let Trump win who is worse than you on Israel and will ban Muslims and empower Nazis!"

strange message

You could make this argument about literally anything. Why improve anything ever since the other guy is worse? This is exactly why democrats love the "but the other guy" argument and this is why they fund fascists: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/oct/03/the-democrats-are-purposely-boosting-far-right-republicans-this-will-backfire

Heineken14 posted...

But it's not downplaying it. Shit in Palestine is turbo fucked and Biden is doing horrible with it and should do better. The problem is though... our hands are incredibly tied in what we can do

Actually there are many things biden can do. Hell, if biden did nothing it would be a vast improvement over the billions of dollars, weapons, military equipment, UN vetoes, etc that he is providing for israel that he doesn't have to.

Will_VIIII posted...

You're not using that word correctly.

noun: genocide; plural noun: genocides
the deliberate killing of a large number of people from a particular nation or ethnic group with the aim of destroying that nation or group.

Biden is not doing this.

"He's not technically flying the planes and dropping the bombs himself QED!!!!"

You can tell you're winning an argument when you choose to fight on insignificant technicalities and semantics.

havean776 posted...

But that's the thing they don't need to change because the other side really is that evil. I can't afford to take the moral high road when my friends lifes are at stake. It's nice you don't have that problem but understand we are not all as lucky as you.

You say this while Palestinians are actively being genocided with full support from biden. Kindly shut the fuck up about privilege.

Heineken14 posted...

I don't see anyone saying that people SHOULDN'T be pressuring Biden/democrats to do better.

Also, that option isn't on my ballot box.

I mean you're doing it right now by downplaying criticisms with an immediate "but the ballot box". We're all aware of the two-party system that democrats and republicans BOTH love and get all their power from. Bringing up the two-party system that democrats use to their advantage to have that "but the other guy" argument in the first place does nothing other than to deflect responsibility.

Heineken14 posted...

Explain to me what my options are here then. I get out my ballot that is mailed to me for presidential elections. What do I choose to have the best outcome not only for my country but for Palestinians as well?

You could put pressure on democrats to make a change by expressing criticism. Shutting down any and all criticism with "but the other guy" will ensure that democrats feel no need to change.

WingsOfGood posted...

You cannot vote to stop it as it will happen either way.

However Biden is the one who is more open to listen to protest.

Do you understand this?

Listening does jack shit if he's just continuing the genocide against the wishes of even 75% of his own party's voters: https://news.gallup.com/poll/642695/majority-disapprove-israeli-action-gaza.aspx

Do you understand this?

The upvote/downvote system tends to degenerate into that state. It's not conducive to an environment of discussion because a malicious actor can simply bot votes to promote or sink views depending on whether they agree or disagree with them. It's also why you see a lot of karma farming with low effort copy-pasted posts.

Cemith posted...

Again. This is a fake argument to feel morally superior to everyone else that lives in the two party binary reality.

We want actual change which is the exact reason we can't vote in Trump.

biden has the power to carry out actual change in this situation right now and he won't. If you want actual change, you won't get it with biden. Yes, go ahead and vote for the lesser of two evils, but don't delude yourself into thinking we're going to get actual change in the positive direction.

C_Pain posted...

Nah, their job is to participate in government.

They don't get to participate in government if they don't get the votes.

WingsOfGood posted...

did he not earn the votes by doing everything he did and having as in that image just 2 books on the scale vs. the opposition which literally wants to make himself king?

Voters are telling him he should stop supporting genocide. He should try listening to voters to get their votes.

WingsOfGood posted...

so are they criticizing Trump for supporting genocide or that is not an issue when it comes to him?

If you haven't noticed, biden is the president. He's the one who can actually do something about this right now, or do you think the over a million Palestinians on the verge of starving to death can wait this out until after the election?

C_Pain posted...

No, he quite literally can blame the voters! They're the ones that determine it.

It's literally a politician's job to get votes. They're not owed votes.

Rexdragon125 posted...

So you don't actually give a shit about genocide

Yes I do, which is why I want biden to stop supporting it. Meanwhile you're fine with genocide because "the other guy".

ScazarMeltex posted...

There is no voting strategy for US voters that stops the Israeli genocide of the Palestinian. I wish there was, but there isn't.

No amount of threatening to withhold your vote matters to the dems. Which is bullshit, but it's true. You saw that during the 2016 primary.

Hillary was confronted from the left, faced a far larger primary challenge than literally anyone expected and what did the dems do? Did they address in any meaningful way any of the things that Bernie or his supporters brought up? No. Did they perhaps take it into account when Hillary chose her running mate? LMAO no. They ran the most entitled and hubristic campaign in world and lost. They aren't going to change, they would rather lose than do anything to disrupt the status quo.It sucks, and I fucking hate them for it. You will not get them to change their position.

Thing is, I hate what the fascists will do the people I care about more. You can take your moral highground if you want, and I hope it keeps you warm at night while women are stripped of their bodily automony, trans people are forced to de transition and begin killing themselves in record numbers, and all the other things the GOP has promised to do. Are in fact planning on dismantling the system to the point that it allows them to do so. You'll have your sense of pride though that you didn't vote for Biden while all of that happens though and won't it feel so nice for you.

I'm going to be voting democrat, just like I did in 2016 (and all other times), but if democrats and their diehard supporters actually want democrats to win with the general population, they're going to have to make changes. The fact that democrats are happy to use the threat of republicans as a cudgel to get votes just goes to show how interested they are in actually improving things. The fact is that we're going to be voting for "not the other guy" for the rest of our lives, while things continue to deteriorate because under our system it's impossible for republicans to not win at least every once in a while. Holding the status quo does nothing to counteract that.

LightningThief posted...

Are you claiming anyone who post that meme is part of some deep coordination cabal or something?

Youre hitting conspiracy nut levels if this is your angle.

No one said anything about a cabal. You should try reading.

WingsOfGood posted...

This thread is about voting Trump over Biden or refusing to vote.

It isn't about just telling Biden he should do x or y.

So the image is PERFECT.

It shows people are forgiving and putting wool over their eyes to how disgusting Trump is to simply criticize Biden on one point that Trump is gonna do even worse.

This topic is about the general population of voters. They see a president who full-throatedly supports genocide. Are you that surprised they don't feel like putting in the effort to vote (no matter how small that effort may be)? They're not making calculated moves like you think. There is a very easy way around this, which is to *stop supporting genocide* which comes with the "side" benefit of *not supporting genocide*.

Umbreon posted...

Here comes ""centerist"" toothbrush to wag his finger at Democrats again.

Yes, here comes left-wing toothbrush to wag his finger at right-wing democrats over *their support of genocide*.

WingsOfGood posted...

or maybe some random dude made the picture after seeing a stupid 500 posts thread about how Biden will lose to DONAL TRUMP because Isreal and everyone else who had similar experience saw the image and was like "GOLD" and shared it?

not plausible?

The argument is "biden shouldn't support genocide" and this image is being spammed to pretend the argument is "both sides are the same".

Rexdragon125 posted...

Yes, the other guy is objectively worse about genocide. You tried

"but the other guy"

You didn't even try.

Gwynevere posted...

I'll keep this sentiment in mind for comfort when Trump and the Republicans have a blank check to do whatever they want to queer people, minorities, women seeking abortion, workers seeking to organize, etc.

At least we showed Biden, nice job team

Really makes you think why biden loves genocide so much as to refuse to stop supporting it so that he can get the votes to stop the republicans from doing those things.

WingsOfGood posted...

Y-y-you vote Democrat? Yet you claim this was made by a PR operative?

what even

You don't think democrats have a PR team that posts things online? That I've seen this slick new graphic posted all over the place instantly makes it look like a coordinated PR campaign. That's all I'm saying. It shouldn't distract from the fact that democrats are supporting a genocide.

WingsOfGood posted...

@1337toothbrush

maybe he shouldn't support them but you will still vote for him over Trump right?
right?

RIGHT?????

Yeah, like I've said a trillion times. I vote democrat straight down the ballot every single time. I should still be allowed to criticize them without people jumping down my throat.

LightningThief posted...

I'm stealing this.

You and all the other online democrat operatives. I've seen this image posted all over the place near instantly. It's almost like it's part of a coordinated PR campaign, fresh from the asses of the democrat marketing department.

Rexdragon125 posted...

Let's try again. Trump openly says he wants to be dictator, frequently uses Hitler speeches, threatens Jews, and said he'll finish the job in Gaza. Also, the Palestine issue predates Biden.

Now please try not to dismiss MY concerns and squawk about Biden more

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/f/fd9d0c36.jpg

bluezero posted...

Shhh...the adults are talking.

Yes, I am talking. Are you tugging on my pants to tell me that you approve of biden's support for genocide?

WingsOfGood posted...

so you are literally the guy in the image right?

No, because I didn't say both sides are the same. No one has said both sides are the same. You're just hamfistedly ignoring the actual point of "biden shouldn't support genocide" in favor of the "both sides" strawman.

Oh boy, a snazzy new graphic just dropped courtesy of the geniuses at democrat PR headquarters. The fact that they defend GENOCIDE with "but the other guy" should show you that there is no limit to the depravity they are willing to drop down to as long as they can point at "the other guy". Democrats' entire strategy is helping republicans be as shitty as possible so that democrats themselves have the license to do whatever awful things they want, including supporting GENOCIDE.

We're going to be voting for "not the other guy" until we die. Democrats see no need to actually improve things if they can use ol' reliable "the other guy" as an excuse to never improve things.

Rexdragon125 posted...

Not even addressing what was said, just squawk squawk squawk

I addressed what was said. You dismissed all concerns about genocide as "just magas".

Rexdragon125 posted...

They probably are just magas. This is like the 20th time I've seen this talking point being parroted, and magas are incapable of coming up with a single original thought

So we should ignore *GENOCIDE* and anyone who cares about *GENOCIDE* must be a trump supporter? Democrats ignore people's concerns, dismiss them with "they're either with us or against us", then wonder why they lose. If you want democrats to win, use a better strategy.

ScazarMeltex posted...

This.
Dude is allowing a genocide to happen.
Big Brains: welp better elect the guy who will accelerate the genocide and expand it to LGBTQ people in the US.

The biggest brains: "we shouldn't apply any pressure on the only party that would supposedly be willing to stop the genocide because other guy exists".

Cemith posted...

Are you kidding?

Are you? You're asking why we apply more pressure on the only party that would supposedly be willing to meet our demands. If you want to exit a room, do you apply pressure on a door or a wall? According to your argument, we shouldn't apply pressure to the door, we should be asking ourselves why a wall is harder to overcome.

Cemith posted...

It's always "why are the Democrats so bad" and never-

"Why is the GOP so overwhelmingly monstrous and evil."

Only Democrats are on the hook to change, that's so wack.

Which party do you think would be easier to change to do what we want?

Tanthalas posted...

Thats just an excuse to do nothing.

No it's not, it's just being realistic. I vote in primaries, promote candidates I hope will make a change, vote for ballot proposals that further great causes, etc, but I'm not stupid enough to think I can realistically fight against billions of dollars of opposition.

action52 posted...

Finding excuses to not do anything is 1337toothbrush's M.O.

Your M.O. is to blindly support the democrat party chosen one and attack anyone who writes even the lightest of criticisms against your dear leader.

action52 posted...

Well if you and enough people like you voted in primaries

You mean primaries dominated by democrat favorites like biden thanks to promotion by the party and their big media buddies completely controlling the narrative? You can tell that democrats are receptive to change when they come up with terms like "bernie bros" to silence opposition.

Plumeofdusk posted...

Anyone with half a brain should realize that Trump would advocate a scorched earth approach. It'd just be a smoldering ruin.

Anyone with half a brain should realize this is already the case. Here's an article from October of last year. It should be easy to imagine how things look now:
https://apnews.com/article/satellite-images-israeli-airstrike-destruction-gaza-4477db1cfc39f38ac6cfff55330a7635

SaikyoStyle posted...

You dont actually want to know the answer to that. It requires work and dedication. And we all know how much the terminally online left despises those things.

Work and dedication that is easily countered by billions of dollars and no amount of "vote blue even if poo" will change that.

DarkAssassin89 posted...

Its mind boggling that we may actually have an issue where Im starting to wonder if Trump might have handled this situation better than the current administration. Thats how bad the situation and Bidens handling of it is right now.

That's the critical point that diehard democrats don't understand. In 2016, the key issue was *CHANGE*. People's situations weren't great (and aren't great now either) but we had two candidates, one claiming everything is fine and the other saying that he's going to "drain the swamp". Now, of course he's a liar, but people will take their chances if they don't like their current situation, even if it potentially means a worse situation. That's how dictators rise. People are sick and tired of the bad status quo and take their chances with change.

If someone doesn't want to support genocide, what options do they have under our "democracy"?

bluezero posted...

Oh, you're one of those.

What is that supposed to mean?

Irony posted...

TIL Trump doesn't want to do this.

Nobody said this. People are saying we need to put pressure on biden, but you instead shriek "WE CANNOT CRITICIZE THE DELICATE BIDEN AT ALL!!!!" and think it's fine that we have a president that full-throatedly supports genocide because the other guy does too.

bluezero posted...

I guess let the fascist dictator in? Is that the point of this topic?

I guess let the genocide continue? Is that the point of this post?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wKbU8B-QVZk

• We need to save our democracy
• Our democracy lets you choose between a genocide supporter and a genocide supporter

Something funny with this picture, don't you think?

It's alright, though there are much better sweets. Also, is that guy's job to just stand there and pick up the things that she makes?

Seaman_Prime posted...

They probably still dont understand that the audiences dont give a shit about all the human stuff

I need the humans or my tiny brain wouldn't be able to relate to the story and would be all confused and lost.

What are you talking about? Prices will always go up to infinity!

I found this stream entertaining:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qpb35ITztw

Also like how it's less than an hour long. I wish more streamers would keep streams to about an hour (not that Randon usually does, but it's just something I like, generally speaking).

I think AI will hit a local maximum. There's a lot of hype and there are certainly concrete use cases already, but the utility is overstated due to hype.

They meant Robocop.

When I posted the video it was already at over one million views. Pekomama is extremely popular. I don't think Fauna knows about this topic, most people who reference gamefaqs do so because of the faqs.

Mint confirms she's not going to be a part of VShojo.

Oh yeah, forgot to mention this great april fools stream:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8RNfOikz3Is

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CjN67re3BWI

vijisanji