Lurker > Lopen

Would argue Cid P and Fang were both jokes but neither being jokes makes more sense than one.
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Wigglytuff?
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StealThisSheen posted...

if they're low on time, doesn't that suggest Lickitung's ending up being one of the last ones people think of? >_>

I never argued it's not one of the later ones thought of, cause it is. Lot of things going against it.

Just not a really strong candidate for the absolute last. Probably in the bottom quarter pretty reliably though.
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Shaduln posted...

one real character vs one joke character in the final each year.

Last year was two joke characters so we're trending downwards
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Marche was just a lot of people posting goofy pictures in support of Marche and it gaining steam as more and more people had their mains drop and pitching in. It wasn't about hurting or helping any one person in particular just a chaos faction thing.
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Marche was a collaborative community effort with the propaganda. The comics are better yes but Marche propaganda had a certain feel where it wasn't just about one person so it was hard to not feel like part of the team if you had any interest, and that's hard to duplicate.
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Would say Exeggutor and Kangaskhan are the hardest to spell by a lot.

Lickitung is in the same neighborhood of a lot of moderately difficult ones that are all probably being dinged by various degrees

Keep in mind the dynamic of how Sprocle quizzes work too. The time limit is a factor as is the order you will think of a Pokemon. If you don't think of Lickitung until you've got like 3 minutes left it may not feel prudent to waste time thinking about him if you miss a time or two when you're running low on time. Compare to Gyarados who is probably one of the earliest to think of and yeah.

Sprocle should be used as evidence but not a definitive guide-- just a lot of factors going in there
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Lightning losing would not surprise me. I expect this one to be close. Definitely her best chance yet but she could surely lose again
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Voting for user content is fine.

If you remove the user element entirely you get a lot less absurd finals across the board. If the user content shows a lot of soul and entertainment that's better than something less blatant I think.
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I stand corrected I would have saved Auron if that offer was out

It's over now though

Auron if it isn't
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I've decided I won't be voting

Even if by some miracle it lasts 3 more minutes
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Larg is no Dycedarg or Dycedarg's Older Brother but he is a draw for sure
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I'm torn

Edward comics canon has him reaching 2nd place

On the other hand Lightning vs Auron is probably a better final
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Oh my gosh I didn't even consider people can't spell tongue in my calculations

A veritable maze of spelling blunders this Pokemon
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You guys are trying to unleash my murderous grammar intent aren't you
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All I'm hearing is we can add Licktung and Licktongue and Liktung to the misspelling list!
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Lightning
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Lickytung
Likytung
Likitung
Likitongue
Likytongue
Lickitongue
Lickytongue

I just named 7 easy misspellings off the top of my head. It's not as easy as you think. If you don't spell Licky or Tongue like the actual words it opens up a whole can of worms on combinations

Honestly I would say it's as hard as Exeggcute to spell thinking in terms of potential errors. Exeggutor is the worst though.
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The sample size being very large doesn't mitigate the factors that taint the data. People don't suddenly get better at spelling because you poll more of them.
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I think he's got a memorable design but he is one of the higher number Pokemon that isn't a legendary and is a one Poke line so he is going to have trouble. I think Chansey is that low for the same reason.

But if you're gonna say like Dodrio or Doduo are more memorable than Lickitung I just can't agree with you.
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I still argue Lickitung is not an easy one to spell either

Tung not Tongue
Licki not Licky

The egg brothers are harder but they're more memorable too. Like Lickitung isn't super memorable but throwing out the spelling issues he's probably up a good 10% higher imo.
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I just took the quiz. Got like 135. Missed some dumb ones. Kinda think the answer is Shellder/Cloyster or Cubone/Marowak (latter might get some help after Detective Pikachu) considering what I missed and percentages. I'll post em in case anyone wants the list without taking it.

004Charmander94.6%
001Bulbasaur94%
006Charizard92.4%
007Squirtle92%
025Pikachu91.6%
005Charmeleon89.5%
002Ivysaur89.2%
009Blastoise89%
151Mew88%
026Raichu85.5%
008Wartortle85.3%
150Mewtwo84.8%
003Venusaur83.6%
016Pidgey83.4%
010Caterpie83.3%
012Butterfree83%
011Metapod82.5%
018Pidgeot82.4%
013Weedle81.9%
014Kakuna80.8%
015Beedrill80.7%
017Pidgeotto80.2%
019Rattata77.6%
145Zapdos77.1%
144Articuno76.7%
146Moltres75.8%
149Dragonite74.6%
020Raticate74.5%
074Geodude74.5%
133Eevee73.5%
023Ekans72.9%
147Dratini72.1%
021Spearow72.1%
148Dragonair72%
024Arbok71.8%
022Fearow71.3%
029Nidoran70.5%
032Nidoran70.5%
063Abra70.5%
095Onix70.3%
034Nidoking70.1%
136Flareon70%
134Vaporeon69.9%
031Nidoqueen69.8%
129Magikarp69.8%
092Gastly69.5%
135Jolteon69.5%
076Golem69.2%
064Kadabra69%
093Haunter69%
030Nidorina68.7%
065Alakazam68.4%
033Nidorino68.4%
075Graveler68.4%
094Gengar68.2%
039Jigglypuff67%
143Snorlax66.7%
052Meowth65.5%
043Oddish65.3%
066Machop64.8%
037Vulpix64.7%
068Machamp64.6%
044Gloom64.5%
041Zubat64.1%
038Ninetales64%
067Machoke63.7%
059Arcanine63.2%
035Clefairy62.1%
042Golbat62%
053Persian62%
120Staryu62%
058Growlithe62%
050Diglett61.6%
040Wigglytuff61.3%
051Dugtrio61.3%
131Lapras61.1%
130Gyarados61%
121Starmie61%
069Bellsprout60.4%
126Magmar60.1%
045Vileplume60%
036Clefable59.6%
077Ponyta59.2%
124Jynx59.2%
118Goldeen58.8%
100Voltorb58.6%
106Hitmonlee58.6%
028Sandslash58.6%
027Sandshrew58.5%
109Koffing58.4%
078Rapidash57.9%
107Hitmonchan57.7%
140Kabuto57.4%
122Mr. Mime57.4%
110Weezing57.2%
125Electabuzz57.2%
101Electrode57%
123Scyther56.1%
132Ditto56.1%
141Kabutops55.7%
119Seaking55.7%
089Muk55.4%
081Magnemite55.4%
054Psyduck55.3%
070Weepinbell55.2%
056Mankey54%
082Magneton54%
055Golduck53.1%
086Seel53%
088Grimer52.9%
048Venonat52.7%
142Aerodactyl52.6%
071Victreebel52.5%
060Poliwag52.4%
049Venomoth52.1%
128Tauros52.1%
113Chansey51.9%
061Poliwhirl51.6%
138Omanyte50.8%
139Omastar50.7%
072Tentacool50.5%
046Paras50.4%
057Primeape50.4%
073Tentacruel50.2%
116Horsea50%
062Poliwrath49.9%
087Dewgong49.5%
084Doduo49.4%
097Hypno49%
047Parasect48.5%
079Slowpoke48.2%
112Rhydon48.1%
137Porygon47.8%
111Rhyhorn47.6%
096Drowzee47.5%
117Seadra47.4%
104Cubone47.3%
080Slowbro47.1%
115Kangaskhan47%
127Pinsir46.4%
085Dodrio46.2%
083Farfetch'd46%
105Marowak44.5%
091Cloyster44.3%
114Tangela43.8%
090Shellder43.1%
098Krabby42.5%
099Kingler41.1%
102Exeggcute39.5%
103Exeggutor39%
108Lickitung37.4%
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MZero11 posted...

GenesisSaga posted...

Mine went out in 54th and I'm still out here fighting for the best result.

I mean, you could have saved him >_>

Would you believe Tidus is my favorite character in the field too.

I'm not sure I've saved Tidus a single time since he won.
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Not in the finals it doesn't. He's not a total idiot he knows what he's doing.
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MWC hates Lightning and is absolutely doing this in a self aware way to try and sabotage her

Don't be swayed by him
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And your opinion is based on a circular logic argument so yeah
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I have never saved based on a user that's dumb
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Not saying it's a total mindblower or anything but it's a risky move that imo was done for artistic vision reasons and not to maximize profits because a committee did research and said "oh, yeah, we need to end it right HERE that'll put the butts in the seats.
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I mean there were definitely ways to end that movie in a much more conservative way that still gives you a cliffhanger and 3 act structure and whatnot.

Like I said children were literally crying. Coming out of a family friendly film series and having that happen is shocking for sure. Empire Strikes Back does not really compare in terms of gravity.
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Edward Chris Von Muir
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Eddv posted...

Ponyta is a solid answer. I only ever remember it that its practically a required pokemon in gen 4 if you don't take Infernape

I mean that is a good reason for anyone who played Gen IV-- that's the reason I remember it. Batista the Ponyta/Rapidash got so much use for me.
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Kefka
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I haven't seen any movies in genre or with that kind of mainstream appeal where the villain just wins. It was shocking to end it there yes. There were much safer places to end it.

Like I know it's cool to just be elitist but it's kinda just hot air without counter examples, which I notice you didn't provide due to being too busy fellating yourself over your elite tastes.
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Sorozone posted...

Well if the top 3 are;
3) Exeggcute

2) Exeggutor

1) Lickitung

I'd say it has to do more with people not knowing how to spell their names rather than just forgetting

As someone who learned how to properly spell Exeggutor (hold the c) after frustration with a Sprocle quiz I can vouch this is a thing.
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I'll do it for Lightning if you trust me to get a save (technically I did get Kefka this round!)
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My vote is for Tangela

Feel like most of the other Pokemon are part of evolutionary lines with at least one memorable poke in it (which will jog your memory on the others) or are notable singles

Krabby/Kingler or Horsea/Whatever Second Horsea is are also good picks though
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Also me only getting on save this round was totally defective Discord ping's fault

At least RM came up two short so I don't feel super bad
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True story as a supporter of year of XIII Fang was one of the only characters I never saved from it (other one being Hope).

So yeah it was pretty disappointing
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Kefka
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Gravy is what you put on a meal that has been poorly prepared to mask its shortcomings.
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I mean it's funny because I think the "laugh track" metaphor is spot on despite the needlessly dismissive "grow up"

It's just then if you're actually thinking about the metaphor you're making, you gotta realize that in a metaphor the thing scorsese is taking umbrage with is the laugh track, and saying any comedy is not ~ARTISTIC COMEDY HUH HUH MY LEXICON~ if it has a laugh track.

So why is a Marvel Movie Two and a Half Men and not Seinfeld?
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Two and a Half Men is more like Jurassic Park Forgotten Kingdom. A movie devoid of any merit that stands entirely on its big budget.

Marvel Movies are actually good comedies with a laugh track, which do exist.
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Nelson_Mandela posted...

Scorsese's not arguing that these movies by committee can't be entertaining or make people feel a certain way or be well-made. He's saying that he has a very specific definition of "cinema." To him, cinema is a movie that projects a visionary's feelings onto screen in a way that only motion pictures can accomplish. And I don't think that any MCU movie, save Guardians 1, was made by a person or group of people who were like "we need to use this medium to express a certain part of my soul."

Not every movie needs to do that, sure. But "cinema" in Scorsesean lexicon does.

Or in other words we'll arbitrarily reduce the number of movies that fall into the "cinema" umbrella to win arguments until the word loses any sort of meaning that anyone should give a crap about to begin with

Was it worth it. What did it cost you?
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Nelson_Mandela posted...

I think that they spent 8 figures on market research and audience testing. And the decision on this ending was made based on that, not based on artistic vision.

And I disagree, and you can't really prove me wrong on that much, given that part 1 made a pretty good percentage of what part 2 did and part 2 was going to get a boost just by being "part 2" assuming any sort of cliffhanger.

Did part 1 end in the "right" place? Yes
Did part 1 end in a place that by some definition could be considered risky? Yes.
Can you prove that part 2 makes less by ending part 1 in any other place? No.

At this point you're basically just saying it can't be artistic vision because it was made as a big budget movie that wants to be profitable. Nice circular logic there.
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Are you literally arguing that the entirety of why it made so damn much was because of that one decision? lol
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Nelson_Mandela posted...

I think it was very clinically manufactured in order to sell tickets to Endgame, rather than an artistic decision.

I think there are a lot less risky ways to do that that don't tank Endgame's ticket sales in the least. You basically got all the legwork you needed for hyping tickets when you spent a dozen movies worth of hype building to that one moment and put "Part 2" on it. For as many people that get a bit more hyped, there are angry parents that don't want to take their kids to Endgame. If it was truly about being safe, cutting a bit before the big battle would have been much easier.
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Like are you trying to argue that nothing that's a sequel to well received movie can be cinema? Because that sounds a lot like what's being argued.

Is Terminator 2 not Cinema due to the success of the first one?
How about The Empire Strikes Back or Return of the Jedi?
How about The Two Towers or Return of the King?
Is Logan not cinema because of the X-Men franchise?

Does every movie out there have to be completely unique, devoid of any existing material to work off of, or be disqualified? Can we expand this to actors? There is a certain brand name value that an actor brings that mitigates risks. Is Forrest Gump not cinema because Tom Hanks is in it?
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Nelson_Mandela posted...

There's a reason why it brought them billions of dollars.

Are you arguing that ending the movie in a slightly less risky point would have held those billions from it? lol.
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SgtSphynx posted...

Edit in the politics flair

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Depending on your definition of what "vetted" is you can apply that thinking to a lot lot lot more than Marvel stuff. Basically any movie that has some theme that has already been done has some amount of market research-- that's just a consequence of a glut of movies to view that's ever expanding, and a society that's becoming more and more connected-- it has nothing to do with the movies playing it safe and everything to do with the definition of what safe is expanding at a rapid rate.

Also, keeping it to Marvel Blockbusters, I feel like Infinity War was a risk for sure to name the most simple one. Children were literally crying at the end of that movie in my theater and that's not a unique story-- I'm rather surprised it didn't really get any backlash for that. You can say there's no risk because it's adapting existing material-- but the movies don't follow the comics exactly either (and the audience by and large hasn't read the source material anyway)
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