Board 8 > ace attorney topic: the return (spoilers for 1-5, AAI1-2)

(+) Yeah! (+)

SSBM_Guy posted...

7. 6-3 (wouldn't Tahrust and Zeh'lot count as the same crime scene?)

Technically not. Tahrust died in the actual sanctuary, and Zeh'lot died in the hideout behind it, although you could consider it largely the same thing.

SSBM_Guy posted...

8. 4-2

get out
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LeonhartFour posted...

Lolo_Guru posted...

you're going to provide the translation for the 3ds games that never got over here, right?

can't wait

I finally convinced dowolf to do it

don't ask how

William Petenshi is Angelus Shookspear, that one is easy, but what to do with Decargo Mieterman? I could keep Mieterman, maybe spell it differently, sure, but Decargo has to go... Chinwell (as a play on Shinwell Johnson), maybe? Though that might sound awkward to anyone who failed to get the reference...

...not that this is actually happening or anything <_<

I still love the fact that both me and the other group gave Horace Knightly the same name. Obvious pun was obvious >_>
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5-6's crime scene was pretty cool too, though it doesn't measure up to the aquarium itself.
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5-6 has some of my favorite backgrounds in the series. I love the Aqua Tunnel.
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actually if I can add one further criticism to the fan translation team after watching a few AAI2 videos: they always spell "Whoa" wrong

also there's a lot of comma splicing
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I just started 5-3 and oh god I have a really bad feeling about these mock trial guys
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oh man 5-3

keep us posted
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LeonhartFour posted...

actually if I can add one further criticism to the fan translation team after watching a few AAI2 videos: they always spell "Whoa" wrong

also there's a lot of comma splicing

yeah, "woah" makes me die inside

i think comma splicing might be due to direct translation. different languages have different comma usage.
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it hurts me so much I can't even type it out
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Finished day 1 of trial

More details later but I'm happy to report that it's been more interesting than I anticipated!
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5-3 is good stuff

There were many reasons to be skeptical of that case at first glance, so I was pleasantly surprised by it.
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Sigh

I'm going through my replay of E2-2 right now, and in a span of about a minute, both Kay and Justine have said "take responsibility for your own words/statements" which is just... a weird line, especially out of Kay. Sometimes this translation's not very good!

I picked a wrong option and Justine literally said the exact same "take responsibility for your own statements" line again like three lines after saying it

take responsibility for your translation

Okay, so, when I complain about AAI2's translation not being quite up to par, it's stuff like this. Here's an excerpt from E2-2:

Courtney: "That is what turned the polar bear black?"
Ray: "Uncle Ray can't understand why that would turn it black either."
Courtney: "Would you care to provide an explanation?"
Sebastian: "I-I can understand it even without his explanation!"
Edgeworth: "Hmph..."
Courtney: "Please refrain from making such meaningless statements."
(damage)
Edgeworth: "M... mmph. (It wasn't this...)"

Even for a pretty unnotable block of wrong-answer text, this is boring and awkward. I'm going to play dialog puncher-upper now.

Courtney: "...And how, exactly, did that turn the polar bear black?"
Ray: "Uncle Ray doesn't get how that would turn it black, either."
Courtney: "I don't suppose you can provide an explanation, Mr. Edgeworth?"
Sebastian: "W-well, I don't need it to be explained! It makes perfect sense to me!
Edgeworth: "You see? It's obvious, even to someone like Prosecutor Debeste here."
Courtney: "Sebastian, please don't pretend to understand Mr. Edgeworth's bluff. It's not a good look."
(damage)
Edgeworth "...Hmph. (I suppose Ms. Courtney is not as easily taken for a fool.)"

That took like one minute, so it's probably still worth another pass, but without even knowing what the original text said, I'm going to guess that this gets across the feeling of the conversation a little bit better. And I enjoyed taking the opportunity to have a little more fun at Sebastian's expense.

another thing that hurts dialogue flow for me is that they use "had" past tense conjunctions (like saying "I had begun") way too much (the DGS LP does this ALL the time too) and it doesn't sound natural at times because that's not the way a person would say it
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one word that appears a lot in translation and that you eliminated with your localization, para, is "understand." the use of it always feels very literal.
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also re:"had begun," i notice a ton more past participle usage from my foreign friends. it's how you learn "correct" english much moreso than how americans speak. fits the nature of translation too!
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SeabassDebeste posted...

i think comma splicing might be due to direct translation. different languages have different comma usage.

Yeah. Japanese commas basically represent a pause, or take the place of a dropped particle. (e.g., (Watashi wa tsumaranai hito desu) becomes (watashi, tsumaranai hito desu)) You also get things like "(demo,)" a lot, which if you translate literally gets you "But," except but-commas are the most aggravating comma splices of all because the entire point of starting a sentence with a coordinating conjunction is to sound "fast," and that comma feels like zooming off the starting line only to immediately slam on the breaks!

I think what I would've done on the passage Paratroopa brought up is make it more clear that the "Hmph" is actually Edgeworth laughing at Sebastion. Courtney's line is being addressed to Edgeworth as well, though I kinda like Para's version too? *shrug*

The overuse of "had"'s is pretty weird to me for JP->EN translations, especially considering that Japanese doesn't have a pluperfect tense in the first place. I'm not really sure where it comes from? But that's never been something I've really paid attention to. Maybe I should >_>
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Man, I can't even tell who "please refrain from making meaningless statements" is being addressed to, which is part of the reason it's such a problem. That and it's just such an unnatural line - and it's not the only time it comes up, since Edgeworth says it a lot to Kay. It's a really stilted use of language.

Paratroopa1 posted...

Man, I can't even tell who "please refrain from making meaningless statements" is being addressed to, which is part of the reason it's such a problem. That and it's just such an unnatural line - and it's not the only time it comes up, since Edgeworth says it a lot to Kay. It's a really stilted use of language.

It sounds like Courtney is just ignoring Sebastian there, and is thus saying it to Edgeworth.
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no question it's stilted, but i just attributed that to the stuffy edgeworth and the protocol-whoring courtney
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So, about 5-3 (spoilers to be safe)

For a second there I thought Robin was gonna just be a dude who likes to dress up like a lady sometimes, or even that we would get our first canonical non-straight Ace Attorney character who isn't an offensive stereotype, but of course they went with the "secret woman" twist instead. Also figures that her personality changes drastically as soon as she's revealed to be a ~girl~ and she starts doing twirls and shit. I'm gonna give the game the benefit of the doubt and chalk it up to her being "forced" to pose as male (what the hell kind of parents does she have?) and her female persona being her actual self.

The first time I met the school kids I was afraid it was going to turn out to be a dumb teenage melodrama, and while there is some of that, it's not nearly as bad as I expected. The end of day 1 actually makes it seem like a genuine friendship between those three, it made even Hugh seem like slightly less of an asshole. I think I had some memory of transience or someone calling the "You're a goner!" thing bullshit, because I recognized the significance immediately, and it didn't seem like that much of a stretch to me. I was mostly worried the payoff would get postponed to the end of the trial or something, but fortunately they addressed it pretty quickly. Right now I'm thinking Means is the most likely culprit because his philosophy was so completely at odds with Courte's and he would have no problem killing her if he felt it was justified to reach his "ends". Hugh might be an accomplice but I'm leaning towards all three of the friends being innocent.
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_Harmonica_ posted...

So, about 5-3 (spoilers to be safe)

For a second there I thought Robin was gonna just be a dude who likes to dress up like a lady sometimes, or even that we would get our first canonical non-straight Ace Attorney character who isn't an offensive stereotype, but of course they went with the "secret woman" twist instead. Also figures that her personality changes drastically as soon as she's revealed to be a ~girl~ and she starts doing twirls and shit. I'm gonna give the game the benefit of the doubt and chalk it up to her being "forced" to pose as male (what the hell kind of parents does she have?) and her female persona being her actual self.

The first time I met the school kids I was afraid it was going to turn out to be a dumb teenage melodrama, and while there is some of that, it's not nearly as bad as I expected. The end of day 1 actually makes it seem like a genuine friendship between those three, it made even Hugh seem like slightly less of an asshole. I think I had some memory of transience or someone calling the "You're a goner!" thing bullshit, because I recognized the significance immediately, and it didn't seem like that much of a stretch to me. I was mostly worried the payoff would get postponed to the end of the trial or something, but fortunately they addressed it pretty quickly. Right now I'm thinking Means is the most likely culprit because his philosophy was so completely at odds with Courte's and he would have no problem killing her if he felt it was justified to reach his "ends" (also fuck that smile). Hugh might be an accomplice but I'm leaning towards all three of the friends being innocent.

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5-3 - I think the way Robin is handled could have ended so badly. I'm surprised at how positive I felt about it afterward. She's G-R-E-A-T.
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you're a goner is definitely some convenient idiotic bs

AA6 one-ups it though
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I... didn't find Robin funny. That's all I really want to say on the matter.

I like Robin
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you're a goner is top tier

Robin has that AA magic of making questionable things work. She's pretty likable.
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I like how the 3D models make the most mundane stuff look strangely cool just because it's such a novel thing in AA games. This shot of Fullbright looking down at you from the school window is great.
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"Biological female whose parents raised her as a male" is a manga/anime trope dating all the way back to Tezuka and was codified by Rose of Versailles in the 70's. It's definitely been used to explore some themes of feminism and gender identity over the years but when you still see it in modern works like AA5 that aren't explicitly about those subjects it's probably just as a trope.
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Yeah, I love Robin. Maybe I should have more problems with her characterization, but I don't.
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SeabassDebeste posted...

also re:"had begun," i notice a ton more past participle usage from my foreign friends. it's how you learn "correct" english much moreso than how americans speak. fits the nature of translation too!

Yeah, I get it, but it's not how the normal English speaker talks, so it messes up the flow of the dialogue. At least use contractions if you're going to use it that much.
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you guys care way more about words than I do

(I also wonder how deep you would go if it wasn't known to be a fan translation, but that's not worth going too deep on)
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I'd like to think I'd notice that the writing's not up to standard. There's a lot of lines that are just downright strange.

I'd go deep on any script because I do indeed care a lot about words and dialogue flow because I enjoy English in general and I enjoy writing, too. It's easy for me to catch unnatural sounding dialogue even in text-based games because I like to read dialogue aloud (oddly enough Jeff Zero is also like that so we had fun with my Xenogears playthrough). I'll even catch myself auto-correcting to something I think flows better at times.
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The miracle never happen
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lol never mind my last post. you're a goner is stupid again

also I just noticed I used quote instead of edit before, oops
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on my side on my side
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she wasn't saying you're a goner she was saying You're Harmonica
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you're a goner is indeed really stupid

oh man the first two episodes of the Ace Attorney anime dub are on Funimation now

I'll phone in the verdict after I watch them
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Okay, initial impressions of the English voices!

Phoenix - I've come around on it after the first trailer. The more I hear of it, the more I like it (although he calls Mia "Boss" instead of "Chief" which probably shouldn't annoy me but it kinda does)
Edgeworth - Not digging it, but he's only had a few lines so far, so maybe I'll come around on him, too.
Maya - A little too childish, I think, but she brings the right amount of energy and enthusiasm to the role
Mia - Fits her pretty well
Gumshoe - Pretty much spot on
Judge - Sounds like an old man so he passes
Larry - Fits pretty well
Winston - Could stand to be a little more high pitched but it works
Sahwit - Liked his voice a lot
Grossberg - Eh, it's fine, I guess
Redd White - Abso-posi-lutely perfect (Seriously, whoever his VA is nailed it)
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this sounds worth a rewatch
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Oh right, I meant to mention this, too, but I forgot.

It's ramen, not burgers.
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Phoenix and Maya actually go out to eat ramen later on so that couldn't be avoided. The subs tried to use "burgers" but got caught when the ramen showed up on screen.
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Yeah, I knew they'd get backed into a corner if they tried it, but I was still curious what they'd do.
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Stay alive.
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I finished 5-3. I like how they cranked up the silliness near the end after some grim Athena backstory foreshadowing, they clearly had fun with their new 3d toys. Next case looks to be significantly less funny.

you're a goner is still dumb
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Recreating the statue is a top tier moment
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You're not into this kind of stuff, are you
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