Board 8 > Xenoblade Chronicles 3 Mafia: 1-2 Something A Bit Meatier

(+) Yeah! (+)

JC and Plum as mates makes a ton of sense right down to being consistent with JC doing wifom joke early

Mafia is a thinking game

If the only scenario you can envision for heel turning suddenly is I am scum you need to come up with reasoning of why I would have done it as scum.

TheSultanOfSlam posted...

Hmm plum JC link? You suggesting this peaf or am I off?

Sultan is a sneaky good player. This is a plausible explanation. You souls need to argue why I would do it at that point of course but at least it's a plausible scenario.

I mean it's wrong, but I'm glad you are thinking this through instead of ooga Booga plum did something weird

Lopen voting me over JC is a scum tell though then according to his logic as JC if town is going to die anyways

If JC flips town then nothing is lost

If I flip town then you lose town for no reason. I would expect town lopen to think this through

masterplum posted...

Lopen voting me over JC is a scum tell though then according to his logic as JC if town is going to die anyways

If JC flips town then nothing is lost

If I flip town then you lose town for no reason. I would expect town lopen to think this through

A good point if he is arguing that link I suppose

Start of Page 8

I like Lopens first post regarding JC.
Ulti, still not acknowledging he totally effed up on Sultan just moved his vote to Lopen...

Ulti respects Lopen too much to let "bad mafia" get ignored and must vote for obvious scum Lopen.

Ulti's scum stock rising. He hasn't played in a few games, we must remember to respect his town play and vote for him here. >_> (but seriously, pretty sure Ulti is scum).

Peaf joins my team, Peaf you can be second in command, Lopen is Chief Engineer.

Ulti gives Peaf a pass saying its possible for people to agree and not be aligned.

Man, Page 8 is a banger and it hasn't even gotten 7 posts deep.

masterplum posted...

If the only scenario you can envision for heel turning suddenly is I am scum you need to come up with reasoning of why I would have done it as scum.

I was in the boat that jc is dumb but town who wanted to be cute, but sbell repeating my own posts back to me is making me reconsider.
So my explanation for you heel turning was that you realized that if jc is going to die anyway, you'd prefer that town gets rid of other town members instead.
Igcd is super town, for example, and you want to lynch him.

I think you can be scum if JC is town or scum. Ultimately your thought process has jumped on weird prompts this game. I'm not voting you because I think JC is for sure scum just noting that if he is you're likely that eagerly bussing scum that bails before it gets too hot I spoke of.

Lopen posted...

I think you can be scum if JC is town or scum. Ultimately your thought process has jumped on weird prompts this game. I'm not voting you because I think JC is for sure scum just noting that if he is you're likely that eagerly bussing scum that bails before it gets too hot I spoke of.

So how is that scummy

Scum has conclusions and has to fake logic or emotion to get there. I feel you've done both this game (logic on JC, emotion on IGCD)

Lopen posted...

Scum has conclusions and has to fake logic or emotion to get there. I feel you've done both this game (logic on JC, emotion on IGCD)

Hmm! So you think I'm faking something there

Why would I need to get off JC though? Why not ride it out instead of being on nobody?

It's less an issue of "why fake" and more an issue of "hard to believe it's not faked"

Scum are not master computers.

IfGodCouldDie posted...

No I wasn't, I was saying hypothetically if you decided not to contribute today plum should be just as pissed off at you as he is claiming to be at me. His biggest gripe is that he believes that I shot town and he must believe I am town otherwise how is he so sure I didn't shoot you to win as scum. Me being a day vig on the scum side this is exactly the kind of play I could get away with day 1. Yet he is so fucking sure that we are both town that I am actually talking myself into being suspicious of him as I write this.

Plum wasn't mad because he thinks you shot town. He was mad because you have zero concept of what Results Oriented Decision Making is and made a bad play. If you're playing Poker and have a hand that has a 95% chance to win, and you bet on that hand, it doesn't become a bad decision if the other player had the 5% hand he needed to win. You still would have made the correct decision to bet on the 95% chance victory.
It doesn't matter if you hit Town or Scum with your shot. The decision to make the shot in the way that you did was bad, because it was incredibly low info where you can just pass the buck to Corrik if things went wrong.
However I won't vote you with Plum, because I think it's better to wait for the day end and actually see what happens first. I'm not fond of purposely lynching someone we can soft confirm as town, even if you're playing badly.
Also aren't Scum Day Vigs INCREDIBLY rare? Or does B8 have more of a history with them?

We just had one 2 games ago

Lopen posted...

It's less an issue of "why fake" and more an issue of "hard to believe it's not faked"

Scum are not master computers.

But unless you are the exception, you are actually playing the game and trying to win which means there is some reason you do things. You dont randomly vote people.

So why as scum am I hopping off there? Your argument is I am scum because I just did it randomly. Why then can I not be town who did it randomly? If there is no rationale or reasoning how can it possibly be a scum thing to do?

htaeD posted...

We just had one 2 games ago

gross

EDumey posted...

gross

It was yes

That said, I still think IGCD probably isn't the lynch for today, so I don't like your frustration vote Plum.

Random is never random

You scum X JC scum - You couldn't know this was going to just die. You were doubting to gain clout if/when JC flips, but didn't want JC to actually be lynched and were looking for ways to bail and took the first vaguely reasonable argument town had to do so.

You scum X JC town - Doubting felt natural but you knew JC was telling the truth or at least partially. If he's telling the truth it's a suboptimal lynch. You don't really want to push it so much like above bailed at first opportunity.

The alternative is that you found hb's flavor meta to be super convincing which doesn't seem like something I'd expect out of you. Not when you were primarily on JC for giving up to begin with.

Continuing to read Page 8.

...and wohh, Red showed up and snuck in there too. Almost missed his response to Peaf.
I'll disagree with dumey. I dont think that Peaf has been deliberately trying to buddy up with people however I am feeling like my thoughts so far have buddied up quite well with Peaf.

Chaeix posted...

I wasn't going to say buddying up specifically but I have been getting a certain sense of performativeness from Peaf for whatever reason. Gets on peoples' cases for posting weak d1 reads and then all of a sudden has a weak d1 read on a whole bunch of the game apparently?

JC's first actual post of the game. I'll take this as JC and Peaf not being able to be Scum together.

Things are getting spicy and Lopen is continuing to go the same place my brain goes to thus far. JC and Ulti.
Peaf, who i have since placed on my Town list wishes to go in a direction of IGCD and Plum and while Plum is still on the radar for his non-flavor claim I can't see a reason to want to lynch IGCD at this very moment. I'm not a fan of the gambit (or that legit play) but that really needs to play itself out before i can get a real opinion about that.

Oh hey, Sbell showed up. First post in like forever and its not great. talking about myself and then agreeing with something peaf said that is inconsequential to the game at hand. Oh but then i started to actually post thoughts on the game so i look better. phew.

Wrapping up Page 8. Han unvotes Sultan and then talks about why he hesitates to vote for JC. No talk of why he isn't after Sultan anymore. Did he ever really have a reason to begin with? (head scratcher).

Plum posts at 4:42:50pm
masterplum posted...

Hey lopen

Go through the thought process of scum JC claiming this

Implying that Plum doesn't see why scum would claim this. Implying that Plum doesn't agree with Lopen in thinking JC is scum.

Plum posts at 4:56:23pm, 14 minutes later.
masterplum posted...

Yeah ok I've talked myself into it

##Vote:JC

Bottom of Page 8. i refreshed my own memory of a negative i had on Peaf regarding thoughts of the possible IGCD vig shot and percentages... Still at a town stance on Peaf but may want to do a full ISO eventually to make sure i'm secure with that.

Oh, got distracted by my own post at the bottom of the page I forgot to mention that Plum looks not great right now.

Okay unless HBtheBattle has another account that can defy ctrl+f
Then he has done almost nothing besides react to some minor arguments in favor of other players.
Trying to reason out JC's claim, questioning EDumey for stating conditional reads early (something I dont mind myself), and asking Lopen about Han.

I have no clue who HB suspects or considers town.

Town
1. Sultan
9. Sbell
10. Hb
12. Corrik
13. IGCD

???
2. Han (lean scum if JC is town)
3. Peaf (lean scum)
4. Edumey (lean scum)
7. Ulti (lean town)
11. Red (lean town)

Scum
14. 5starscream
15. Plum
5. Chaeix
6. Death

Current game vibes

Put Chang under ???

Lean town on Chang ultimately. Hard read but low effort town fits

Lopen posted...

Lean town on Chang ultimately. Hard read but low effort town fits

"Low effort town" - bro he has not suspected anybody! How do you do that when we have so many people butting heads? Calling people town as scum is easy because you know who is not scum.

I've agreed with you on many points you've made but this is absolutely not one of them.

I just know Chang cares about setup meta a lot so the meat of his interest going into talking out what JC'S role is feels genuine

Still waiting on those grievances, Lopen.

I mean I caught a few already now that I am reading up. But I also addressed those already and you seemingly ignored my answers then.

I'll list them when I'm ready to pursue you.

Your eagerness to battle me on them is odd. Do you think I'm scum or wrong town here?

htaeD posted...

I have no clue who HB suspects or considers town.

good thing for you, I just woke up! Heres a few thoughts
Town:
Lopen - chasing rabbit holes is classic town Lopen (though I do think this time he might be right on plum) it doesnt really feel faked this time
Sbell - strong trying to solve the game energy, even more than Ive seen from Han today!
JC - Theres just a lot scum would need on their safelist to try to claim this role and have it not blow up in their faces, and theyd need to come up with this plan in the first few hours of the day - and for what?

Scummish
Plum - Harping so much on mafia strategy and how IGCDs usage of his power is untenable to the extent of anything else feels like an easy way to generate content without actually needing to like, solve. Though I have my doubts about where IGCD even has a shot at all

Dumey- I dunno, somethings been off about him to me, and I still dont like his logic about the scum/scum vibe thing.

Super Ultra Confirmed Scum:
Chang - Im just saying, hes been accused and he hasnt posted the chart:tm: yet. Think about it

Thats just my MO when it comes to suspicion. Why leave things like that hanging when I can clear them up.
Plus it helps me read the accuser better.

But to answer your question. Leaning towards wrong town.
You sound like typical Lopen. Loud and all over the place, but I at least can give you that. And some of the stuff you said I agree with.

Man HB pulled a changmas.
"Get accused of having no reads and then put up a wallpost of opinions."

Might as well compare this one to changmas'

Dont forget Im not in the same timezone as you guys. When you guys are free Im usually busy, and when Im free you guys seem to be asleep. I still think IGCDs okay is super anti town but I guess that doesnt necessarily make him scum.

htaeD posted...

Man HB pulled a changmas.
"Get accused of having no reads and then put up a wallpost of opinions."

Might as well compare this one to changmas'

unlike chang i am not a coward so i will post a chart

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/5/5/1/AAceriAAEHzn.jpg

If I'm wrong wield me as a lethal scum slaying instrument. I have no desire to pursue you currently or at all today. If wagons come down to you and anyone else on my scum list I vote them.

Okay how do you really feel about Changmas tho, HB?

Man it's so hard to tell the difference between poorly playing town and scum that don't know how to fake scum hunt. I guess that's kind of the point of the game though. So many times I'm reading these catchup posts from players and thinking, "that's not really scummy, just not very well thought out town play."
Maybe I'm the one that needs to operate more on gut feeling than trying to find hard tells on D1.
##Vote: HB
HB, there have been a lot of people posting negative opinions on Death recently, but he's completely missing from your list. What do you think about Death specifically?

5tarscream posted...

Dont forget Im not in the same timezone as you guys. When you guys are free Im usually busy, and when Im free you guys seem to be asleep. I still think IGCDs okay is super anti town but I guess that doesnt necessarily make him scum.

This doesn't prevent you from posting when you are free. Look at SBell or Lopen's spree of posts last night for example! (Which by the way Lopen, I appreciated a lot of your posts last night, even if I disagree with some of your conclusions. :) )

I wouldn't call what hb did there a wall it was fairly concise

Grievance #84

Lopen posted...

I wouldn't call what hb did there a wall it was fairly concise

Grievance #84

Oh you.

But you are right, wall is the wrong word to use if I want to compare the two posts/
Pretend I said List.
Because its basically the same response: opinions vomited out because of suspicion.

Also consider my one good feeling about Changmas terminated. The only notable thing he did since was post that list. And while there were a few conclusive opinions on there, he doesnt seem to want to do anything with his info.

htaeD posted...

Okay how do you really feel about Changmas tho, HB?

A resounding "eh". Peaf's reasons for why he's scummy make sense, but nothing he's done has personally tripped my radar. So let's put him into "unknown, leaning scummy".

EDumey posted...

HB, there have been a lot of people posting negative opinions on Death recently, but he's completely missing from your list. What do you think about Death specifically?

he was also the one asking the question <_<. Anyway Death's always been a tough player for me to read and if IGCD is telling the truth, I'm not going to have to - all will be revealed relatively soon. With that in mind, I don't really feel the urge to dig deep into him today.

Hbthebattle posted...

if IGCD is telling the truth, I'm not going to have to - all will be revealed relatively soon. With that in mind, I don't really feel the urge to dig deep into him today.

This is very lazy. If anything, it could be more important to read what Death is saying and try to give your opinion, because if he does die, we will have confirmed his alignment.

Also I have no idea how Changmas can say he likes Red for the literal only post he has made at that point.
Even Red was confused by that one I believe.

I'd like Red to post more as well of course.

It's hard to get interactions and answers when there isn't anyone around. That was why I was asking death some questions to try see what he was thinking but he posted nothing. I was hoping he'd post some kind of read and I could use that to generate some conversation later. Alas he didn't.

##Unvote

I feel like Peaf has been super active and asked a ton of questions but I haven't really seen much follow up. Peaf what are your top 3 Scum and Town reads so far?

Death don't ignore 5starscream. :(

So your vote on IGCD was to get interactions from Death??

EDumey posted...

This is very lazy. If anything, it could be more important to read what Death is saying and try to give your opinion, because if he does die, we will have confirmed his alignment.

This is why I asked death if he thought he'd really been shot by IG or not. If he thought yes and he's town he'd surely want to get as much work done as possible to help town win. He basically hasn't done anything. He's like a tree blowing in the wind. He said he's leaning no on his belief but even so it seems like a big risk to take to have nothing on d1 with a potential timer on your head. Unless he's scum and just want to accidentally incriminate a teammate. Like, respond when needed but don't really say anything conclusive that be used later by town.
Leaning scum on death.

Right this moment?
Scum: Chang > ulti > plum
Then for town: igcd > lopen > jc=sbell

EDumey posted...

This is very lazy.

yes.

EDumey posted...

If anything, it could be more important to read what Death is saying and try to give your opinion, because if he does die, we will have confirmed his alignment.

sure, but Im not seeing why that has to be done right this second. Regardless of whether IGCD is telling the truth or not, stuff with Death is going to come to a head tomorrow, so tomorrow I will have dived deeper! But Im not seeing it as an urgent issue.

But I havent been ignoring 5tar???

5tar what do you want my opinion on?

5tar I think you are also confusing what timezone I live in

htaeD posted...

But I havent been ignoring 5tar???

5tar what do you want my opinion on?

I think I misunderstood, he clarified in the last post.