Board 8 > FFXIV Topic 10 - Forge Ahead

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GANON1025
12/02/21 3:13:33 PM
#51:


Paladoes what Dark Knont

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Dels
12/02/21 3:13:46 PM
#52:


HeroDelTiempo17 posted...
Hmm...Bard got a lot of changes from the media tour which is a bit unnerving because the media tour build looked basically perfect to me. MB got nerfed in exchange for a third bloodletter stack (really don't understand the logic to this) and the tooltip for procs is extremely vague. The internet is doomsaying and interpreting this to mean procs are no longer based on dots which would be TERRIBLE but...I'll believe that when I see it.



WHEN do I get the 80% chance, yoshi-p??? what does this MEAN???

I am assuming the 80% on server tick, aka at the same time you'd get it from DoT ticks, except not based on the DoT anymore. It's just awkward because they have no way of saying that, most players don't know about server ticks.

And yeah, it's another in the long line of changes meant to simplify things. Same with Sidewinder not requiring the DoTs anymore either.

Honestly I get why people are upset, but in practice, I don't think it changes much - if you're playing properly you will have the DoTs up all the time anyway. Lowers skill floor by a lot though because it doesn't punish you for dropping the DoTs ever. And it does lower the thematic flavour of the job.
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Not_an_Owl
12/02/21 3:14:15 PM
#53:


BK_Sheikah00 posted...
Paladin strong. Potentially six atonements in Fight or Flight.
Only if you skip a Goring Blade refresh, which would be a greater potency loss overall. It's a good idea to keep in the back of your head for optimizing phase transitions, but not at all what you should be trying to do for the normal rotation.

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tcaz2
12/02/21 3:27:14 PM
#54:


I gotta say I'm not a huge fan of their crusade against DoT mechanics. I mean I think removing them from Summoner is fine in general from a flavor stand point, but removing them from nearly every job and making them less important for jobs that do still have them is pretty dumb.
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Steiner
12/02/21 3:59:40 PM
#55:


i'm part way through Heavensward and just starting to enjoy myself and am outraged at this 24 hour server maintenance

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UshiromiyaEva
12/02/21 4:25:12 PM
#56:


What job are you playing? You may have a surprise on the way depending!

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Steiner
12/02/21 4:39:14 PM
#57:


ninja

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UshiromiyaEva
12/02/21 4:42:06 PM
#58:


Depending on your level, you're going to see Assassinate and Dream Within a Dream turn into the same move, and you'll have the new Huraijin ability, both by 60.

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HeroDelTiempo17
12/02/21 4:42:25 PM
#59:


Dels posted...


Honestly I get why people are upset, but in practice, I don't think it changes much - if you're playing properly you will have the DoTs up all the time anyway. Lowers skill floor by a lot though because it doesn't punish you for dropping the DoTs ever. And it does lower the thematic flavour of the job.

Hmm...this is both true and not. The biggest point here I agree with that it loses flavor and uniqueness. Dots used to tie the kit together, now they're just there. And it is also lowering the skill floor. Personally, I think they WAY overshot the mark on simplification with these changes. I've argued all through Shadowbringers that because ranged doesn't have to deal with positionals or melee mechanics, they should have MORE complex rotations, but the devs seem to want phys ranged to be the simplest and most straightforward job designs. This is just a disagreement with design philosophy that affects my personal enjoyment, but I'll try to set that aside.

I would maybe be okay with a flat 80%/tick rate in a vacuum as it works out to roughly the same rate. I don't think this affects the gameplay TOO much in single target besides making it a little more consistent and boring. Except for Mage's Ballad. I don't know what the fuck is going on here. Bloodletter charges were the change I was most looking forward to, because it solved the problem of wasting double procs and late procs. Except...they removed the ability to double proc. And they nerfed Mage's Ballad to only give you HALF a bloodletter per proc? They fixed one problem three different ways! Complete nonsense design choices.

And as far as AOE goes, multidotting was an extremely fun part of the job and it sucks to see it go. It was a bit unintuitive and awkward but very rewarding to pull off. I agree with tcaz about the devs's anti-dot crusade. I don't know if an intentional design choice, or a technical limitation, or if they just don't want to balance around it but I'm not a fan.

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Dels
12/02/21 4:45:20 PM
#60:


Yeah, I was thinking of single target. For multi-target, it felt really great to DoT multiple enemies as the tank was pulling, then when they land you're set up to get an infinite number of procs.

I think they've said the DoT thing is because in large encounters, an enemy's HP bar will just have a million debuffs under it. They want less for technical reasons because once it goes past a certain point they just stop working I think, but also probably visually it's a lot of clutter.
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Dels
12/02/21 4:46:26 PM
#61:


And yeah I haven't quite wrapped my head around how Bloodletter works now. I think you're right they corrected the problem but then re-corrected it in a way that the original correction makes no sense anymore.
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Steiner
12/02/21 5:00:53 PM
#62:


UshiromiyaEva posted...
Depending on your level, you're going to see Assassinate and Dream Within a Dream turn into the same move, and you'll have the new Huraijin ability, both by 60.

oh cool i won't have to use that macro i found in the ninja controller setup guide then

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X_Dante_X
12/02/21 5:04:21 PM
#63:


Dels posted...
They want less for technical reasons because once it goes past a certain point they just stop working I think, but also probably visually it's a lot of clutter.


iirc it was 30 debuffs shown, 60 actually applied, but this regularly got hit on any world mob (s ranks) and also eureka/bozja. so for that reason alone i like having less/consolidated dots but i agree it feels worse on a personal level to lose complexity/kit
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LordoftheMorons
12/02/21 5:18:57 PM
#64:


I havent played much BRD since getting it to 80 but Im kind of of two minds wrt multidotting. On one hand getting constant procs felt very fun, but the dots themselves only lasting for a small fraction of their time on trash because they die so fast felt very bad (especially at lower levels where you werent getting those procs; putting up your dots at all felt like a waste).

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HeroDelTiempo17
12/02/21 5:31:11 PM
#65:


X_Dante_X posted...
iirc it was 30 debuffs shown, 60 actually applied, but this regularly got hit on any world mob (s ranks) and also eureka/bozja. so for that reason alone i like having less/consolidated dots but i agree it feels worse on a personal level to lose complexity/kit

Frankly, I think trying to design jobs around the mass player instances is a bad idea. They keep running up against this ancient and unsolvable technical limitation trying to cram more players in instances, but most of the game is not that. I get the small amount of culling they did to make 24-mans better, and I'm fine with hunts and world bosses being a little jank, but in dungeons and trials where this almost never comes up it's pretty limiting for class design.

I think it would be better if it was like PvP and some skills changed when you went into Bozja. Or if raids shift away from 8-mans and we start seeing a huge focus on 24 and 48 man content this also makes sense, but I doubt that's the case.

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tcaz2
12/02/21 5:32:45 PM
#66:


X_Dante_X posted...
iirc it was 30 debuffs shown, 60 actually applied, but this regularly got hit on any world mob (s ranks) and also eureka/bozja.
I gotta say I've always found this argument weird

The only world boss mobs that ACTUALLY have any difficulty to them at all are S and SS ranks and there are usually so many people there that said difficulty doesn't matter. I've literally never seen a wipe on a hunt boss.

Bozja is maybe a slightly different story (and I've not done Eureka yet) but I also can't say I've ever really been like "damn the dot limit sucks I can tell I'm not contributing because of it" or even THOUGHT about it in the middle of a fight, really.

It's just not something that seems to matter, to me. Unless there are some really bad technical limitations that are seriously hampering them and they just haven't said its as bad as it is (which doesn't make sense to me because the devs are usually pretty open about issues like that) it feels like they are fighting kind of a 'phantom problem' that is a problem that doesn't ACTUALLY matter at all.

Admittedly I'm sure the devs have a lot more information on what actually is going on than I or any player does, so I could definitely be wrong on the impact of it all. Still, from my point of view at least the whole thing just seems silly.
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BK_Sheikah00
12/02/21 5:32:54 PM
#67:


What seemed to happen is that in MB you get Bloodletter procs all time tou have to spam the button. While in WM you're sitting there and not getting your Pitch perfects. Felt rigged.

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UshiromiyaEva
12/02/21 5:48:01 PM
#68:


I thought multidotting on Bard for trash was the single worst thing in the entire game other than Summoner pet ability drops.

So...my stance should be obvious.

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Radix
12/02/21 5:48:44 PM
#69:


hopefully a DoT focused caster happens at some point

maybe just rework 2.0 summoner into something new

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Isquen
12/02/21 5:54:37 PM
#70:


I dunno, as resident BRD dabbler, the fact you could "force" procs felt really nice. I felt more like I was overcapping Minuet, honestly, 'cuz I had to work on weaving it so much.

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Dels
12/02/21 6:03:46 PM
#71:


Radix posted...
hopefully a DoT focused caster happens at some point

maybe just rework 2.0 summoner into something new

i think summoner still has some work before it's done

like, it's really awkward that the skill is still called "fester"

there's nothing to fester anymore lol. it only makes sense if you've poisoned them!
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HeroDelTiempo17
12/02/21 6:14:07 PM
#72:


UshiromiyaEva posted...
I thought multidotting on Bard for trash was the single worst thing in the entire game other than Summoner pet ability drops.

So...my stance should be obvious.

It's all about those fat Apex Arrows, man. Best aoe skill in the game. Multidotting to charge it up faster was pretty obscene. If things don't live long enough for that then QN/RoD spam is still your friend.

Now I can't do either!

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UshiromiyaEva
12/02/21 6:20:41 PM
#73:


The results are great but the set up is dull and clunky as sin.

I don't consider it a worthwhile tradeoff.


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HeroDelTiempo17
12/02/21 6:25:37 PM
#74:


UshiromiyaEva posted...
The results are great but the set up is dull and clunky as sin.

I don't consider it a worthwhile tradeoff.

Just set up dots while the tank is pulling. It's fine!

Also I don't see how you get more dull than basically the same 1-2 aoe combo almost every job has. I like all the jobs with absolute weirdo aoe rotations, it makes dungeons less braindead.

edit: and listen if they had just given bard a nerfed version of bane like I've BEEN saying we wouldn't be having this conversation, but the devs are dot-hating cowards

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UshiromiyaEva
12/02/21 6:32:11 PM
#75:


Trash dies too fast and it feels like a waste of time.

Also controller targeting makes Bard feel bad.

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UshiromiyaEva
12/02/21 6:32:54 PM
#76:


HeroDelTiempo17 posted...
edit: and listen if they had just given bard a nerfed version of bane like I've BEEN saying we wouldn't be having this conversation, but the devs are dot-hating cowards

Hey now, I said the same thing months ago! I'd be fine with that solution.

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LordoftheMorons
12/02/21 6:33:17 PM
#77:


JonThePenguin posted...

My wife doesnt game much and definitely doesnt follow them so now I have to explain SquEnixs marketing team to her.
This is relevant to several of my interests!

Listening though not as good as the original

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JonThePenguin
12/02/21 6:44:10 PM
#78:


LordoftheMorons posted...
This is relevant to several of my interests!

Listening though not as good as the original
There's a video too. Mostly trailer clips, nothing spoilery.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ez9S8PS2E3I

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UshiromiyaEva
12/02/21 8:04:58 PM
#79:


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kilafer
12/02/21 8:13:20 PM
#80:


Preload is up.

Edit: On consoles at least. My friends on PC are saying it's giving an error.

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LordoftheMorons
12/02/21 8:18:30 PM
#81:


Yeah I'm getting a version error on mac

Edit: oh wait, when I dismissed the error window this time an update bar came up!

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GANON1025
12/02/21 8:22:29 PM
#82:


Look for FFXIV_BOOT.cfg file, open in text editor, and change BootVersionCheckMode from 0 to 1. Fixed this issue for me.

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BK_Sheikah00
12/02/21 9:49:26 PM
#83:


Endwalker installed on Playstation. Aaaaaaahhhhh how much more maintenance

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Shadow Dino
12/02/21 10:00:00 PM
#84:


Endwalker fully installed, time to wait

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KanzarisKelshen
12/02/21 10:06:23 PM
#85:


Installed and ready. Let's go!

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WhiteLens
12/02/21 10:24:12 PM
#86:




I gotta say, considering that most of this was from like the past 3 months, thats pretty impressive.

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Dels
12/02/21 10:25:40 PM
#87:


heard that the people in the data-mining server who are posting all the leaks are saying they are surprised by the scale of the expansion

and we were already told it was going to be big!
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tcaz2
12/03/21 1:45:35 AM
#88:


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Xiahou Shake
12/03/21 3:33:06 AM
#89:


Patched and ready to go! Probably won't be able to play until tomorrow night and that'll all be 5.5 wrap up, but I'm still super excited!

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UshiromiyaEva
12/03/21 3:58:34 AM
#90:


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red13n
12/03/21 4:01:00 AM
#91:


Login servers are destroyed already.

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UshiromiyaEva
12/03/21 4:02:45 AM
#92:


1028 in queue not bad not bad!

Let's see if I can escape my GC barracks, though.

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LordoftheMorons
12/03/21 4:04:26 AM
#93:


1656 for me

I can deal with that

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X_Dante_X
12/03/21 4:04:56 AM
#94:


i got in the lamia queue at 1,111 after it crashed once, yeaaahhh
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DoomTheGyarados
12/03/21 4:06:36 AM
#95:


I will take 2,118 considering my client froze first try.

Faerie

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red13n
12/03/21 4:08:36 AM
#96:


I can't even get to the queue.

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DoomTheGyarados
12/03/21 4:09:36 AM
#97:


While we wait,

How is WoW, Red? Is it as bleak as it looks?

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HeroDelTiempo17
12/03/21 4:10:38 AM
#98:


My launcher isn't loading so that's where I'm at.

edit: nevermind, complaining about it was the fix as usual

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red13n
12/03/21 4:12:02 AM
#99:


DoomTheGyarados posted...
How is WoW, Red? Is it as bleak as it looks?

The last patch with any new content was...a long time ago.

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DoomTheGyarados
12/03/21 4:13:54 AM
#100:


I feel like I chose wrong all those years ago when I was deciding between WoW and XIV when we were in a wow content draught. We had a lot of fun times but damn I feel like I wasted a lot of time

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