Board 8 > Jeff Zero & Leonhart in Different Houses: The Odyssey Concludes [JZLF]

(+) Yeah! (+)

he's the most surprising one of all
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Well, a lot of my friends and family will be happy about Georgia winning the SEC Championship and (presumably) making the playoffs.
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In Yu Yu Hakusho, Koenma explains stuff like the demon tunnel, barriers, ranks, etc. and Hiei gets offended because his rank isn't high enough. Apparently, there's a group of seven bad guys (with a dude with a mole in the middle of his forehead as the leader) who are at the center of this arc, and they all have dumb code names that reflect their special abilities. It's nice to see some depth and variety in the plot again.
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Finished Last Recode Vol 3 postgame.

Now I can finally move on to the ~new material~ of Vol 4. Which is supposed to be really short so I guess I'm close to wrapping this up.
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In Yu Yu Hakusho, Yusuke and company face off against the first member of the seven member psychic group that definitely needs a catchy nickname, the Doctor. These two episodes were basically building up to answering the question of whether Yusuke was willing to kill a human being, and the answer seemed to be...maybe. He's certainly not on the level of Vash the Stampede, if nothing else. They put him in a pretty extreme situation against a completely unhinged and unsympathetic guy with lots of people's lives on the line, so I dunno if I'd blame him regardless. He still managed to save everyone without having to kill him, so I guess it's a happyish ending for everyone.
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congrats Kiritsugu you officially suck

I'd say you too Maiya but you sucked from the moment you showed up
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In Fate/Zero, bad stuff happens and my excitement and hope rapidly diminish. Irisviel says the only person who can defeat Kiritsugu is Kirei, so I guess I've gone from low-key rooting for him to outright rooting for him. Unfortunately, I guess that means Rider and Berserker have to die first because they're essentially down to having no chance to win, too, so yeah, this show has some hard work ahead of it if it wants to end well.
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Beat Last Recode Vol 4. At first I wasn't feeling it too much but then in the last act it got really great. It's super short though. =(

Oh well, just glad we got it at all. I guess next up will be Chaos;Child. Practically by default since Amazon apparently wants me to wait an extra week for Tokyo Xanadu eX+ so even if I had wanted otherwise, whoops!

LeonhartFour posted...

congrats Kiritsugu you officially suck

hahaha

Assuming you watched what I think you did, you just saw why I was 99% sure you wouldn't like Kiritsugu and also kinda why I never really pushed to rec Fate/Zero to you even though it's a Top 3 anime for me. >_>
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Yeah, that scene is one of the reasons I didn't think you would like Fate/Zero.
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There was a reason I recommended he start with Fate/Stay Night and it wasn't just the usual reasons in this case >.>

It is surprising that you seem to be rooting for Kirei though. That's definitely not one I would have predicted. I was expecting like Waver/Rider or maybe Kariya.
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xp1337 posted...

. I guess next up will be Chaos;Child

Between DGS2 coming out and everything else in my life, I never did finish CC... Maybe you playing it will finally get me to get my butt in gear and do it.
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Oh, I like Rider and Kariya better and they're much easier to root for, but the show has made it clear they have no chance to win. It's all heading toward a Kiritsugu/Kirei showdown. Kirei is actually a fascinating character though, and at the very least not a self-righteous hypocrite (his speech to Saber was complete and utter garbage if you want to know the exact moment I officially checked out on this guy), so he's got a leg up in my book.
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I love the Kamiya "fight" in the anime. Really interesting animation direction.

I don't think every protagonists needs to have a no killing policy, do it's nice to see he has his limits, even if it didn't really go through with it.
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dowolf posted...

Maybe you playing it will finally get me to get my butt in gear and do it.

!!

LeonhartFour posted...

(his speech to Saber was complete and utter garbage if you want to know the exact moment I officially checked out on this guy)

fun fact! the reason i said 99% and not 100% was i thought there was a 1% chance kiritsugu's speech might sway you/get you to withhold judgment

whoops
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I don't really care whether a protagonist has a no killing policy or not, I guess partly because I'm used to playing RPGs where protagonists killing people is completely mundane since it happens in random battles all the time. I think it tends to be a bit hackneyed if they do because you can expect the cliche plot line of a villain testing how far that policy really goes. It occasionally works with characters like Spider-Man, but part of that is his no killing policy isn't really touted that much. He has it, and you know he has it, but that's it.
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Kiritsugu's speech could be summed up as, "I don't care about stuff like right or wrong...buuuuuuuuut my way is right and your way is wrong."

all right then
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LeonhartFour posted...

Kiritsugu's speech could be summed up as, "I don't care about stuff like right or wrong...buuuuuuuuut my way is right and your way is wrong."

all right then

Well, I feel that's an oversimplification.

I took it more as "The very concepts of heroes and chivalry inherently glorify war and therefore contribute to the destruction and suffering they bring."

which yeah if you boil that down even more you get what you said but you can do that to almost anything if you wanted
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I mean yeah war sucks either way but he's basically trying to say "my way of killing lots of people is inherently better than your way of killing lots of people"

both ways suck man because either way lots of people are dying

like I could get what he was saying if he was a pacifist or something but come on man you're killing people just as brutally as anyone
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Kiritsugu basically takes "sacrifice the few to save the many" to the extreme.

I could say more but it'll probably be better to save that for later, if you even want to discuss it by then.
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xp1337 posted...

Kiritsugu basically takes "sacrifice the few to save the many" to the extreme.

I agree with Saber that while the idea is to keep it to a few it almost inevitably leads to many. I tend not to be a fan of the "well-intentioned extremist" trope because doing the wrong thing for the "right" reason usually leads to bad results. You're just substituting one bad thing for another bad thing.

I'm also wholesale on the side of "Ramza was right, Delita was wrong, regardless of the outcome," and Kiritsugu is essentially trying to take the Delita approach here, but yeah.
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So Capcom just announced Mega Man 11

I still need to play 9 and 10 at some point I guess

As well as MMX4 and up and the MMZ games

I keep falling further behind despite the fact that Mega Man games hardly ever come out
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mega man 2 is the only mega man game I need
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I wanted a mega Man x9 that I could pretend is the real X4
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I want Mega Man ZX3
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pjbasis posted...

I wanted a mega Man x9 that I could pretend is the real X4

Have you played 20XX?
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What's that
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pjbasis posted...

What's that

It's a roguelike MMX-style game on Steam. I played it way back in January so I imagine they'll have updated it since then but I thought it was alright
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What makes it MMX style exactly? Like wall clinging/jumping?
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In January it was still Early Access. They actually released it a couple months ago.

It feels exactly like MMX in every way, pj. Even has a Zero-style character you can play as.
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Sounds cool, I'll keep it in mind.
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In Yu Yu Hakusho, we enter into "after school special" mode as Kuwabara proves to Seaman that not everyone in the human race is a bully by the fact that he fights for his friends and never gives up. Also, his spirit power reawakens, and Seaman thinks that he's the one they've been looking for to break the barrier preventing the release of all these demons. Apparently, there's a video tape full of humanity's greatest atrocities, and Sensui has been using it to "convert" people to his cause. I mean, I might be inclined to agree with Seaman that humanity has great capacity for evil and its basic nature is bad, but I wouldn't go so far as to say it's irredeemable, and I certainly wouldn't go so far as to say that extinction via demon invasion is what humanity deserves because the demons don't exactly seem like fine, upstanding folks either! I think you've gone just a tad off the deep end there...!

oh right and apparently this Sensui dude was the Spirit Detective before Yusuke but that doesn't seem very important
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Oddly enough, the third arc of YYH is the one that I remember least.
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In Fate/Zero, we get two episodes of backstory on Kiritsugu. Man, this guy will just kill anyone, huh? I honestly fully expected that second episode to end the way it did.
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How do you feel like he should have handled the situations he was put in?
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maybe not act like she willingly sacrificed herself for the greater good when you blew her out of the sky without telling her
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Iirc the incident at the end of the second flashback episode was actually mentioned near the beginning of the show!
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yeah some of the stuff there sounded familiar and I knew I'd heard them before, particularly the stuff about the special bullets
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LeonhartFour posted...

maybe not act like she willingly sacrificed herself for the greater good when you blew her out of the sky without telling her

I was under the impression that they were having a dual layered conversation and she totally expected him to do that.
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More Fate/Zero stuff:

Like, I think my biggest problem is that Kiritsugu's first instinct when there's even the slightest chance anything might go wrong is just to kill someone. The second episode implies that it's guilt because he was unwilling to kill that girl and it caused the entire village to get exterminated, but he never even seems to consider the possibility that you could solve a problem without having to kill someone. Natalia surely understood that the easiest thing to do in that situation to ensure nothing goes horribly wrong was just to dive bomb the plane into the ocean, but she apparently didn't want to do that and/or didn't think it was necessary. Kiritsugu just bypasses it and kills her and everyone on board, and I don't think that was necessary. These zombies couldn't figure out how to get from room to room on the plane, so I don't think there was a huge risk of them just getting loose out of the plane and running wild. You could have contained them on the plane. Like, if you have to kill them because there's no other way, sure, but you didn't have to kill Natalia, too.
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Mac Arrowny posted...

LeonhartFour posted...

maybe not act like she willingly sacrificed herself for the greater good when you blew her out of the sky without telling her

I was under the impression that they were having a dual layered conversation and she totally expected him to do that.

again why not just crash the plane yourself

It didn't really feel clear to me that she expected him to do it or wanted him to do it. Maybe she did. She was talking about seeing him again there at the end, and it didn't feel like she meant the afterlife to me.
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Robazoid anime update: I haven't been commenting because I've mostly been watching current anime (which actually does belong more in the Anime topic even if Leonhart doesn't mind that I post here), but I've also been steadily watching Working!! As great as it is, it isn't the type of anime that lends itself to deep discussion. I finished the second season tonight, though, so I figured I'd post a character ranking.

Inami > Taneshima > Yamada > Takanashi > Sato > Yachiyo > Soma > Otoo > Kyoko

Kyoko is really the only one I don't like and even she has her moments. I gather from the character ranking in the opening post that Leonhart likes Yachiyo (though it could be a different Yachiyo for all I know) so I'm going to preemptively defend myself by saying that she suffers mostly by being so closely tied to Kyoko. As for Inami, I would've ranked her last shortly after her introduction but she's managed to climb the entire ranking since then and now I'm really invested in her.

Anyway, it's a fun anime and I'm looking forward to the third season. Thanks again for the recommendation in the last topic!
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Robazoid is an Inami fan, huh? Never thought he'd like someone whose primary characteristic is punching people...!

also yes Yachiyo is great

Sato is the actual best character on the show though
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Yamada way better than all those other losers.
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Yamada is probably the best overall, but even she has her weak moments.
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Soma/Sato/Yachiyo are top 3
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LeonhartFour posted...

Robazoid is an Inami fan, huh? Never thought he'd like someone whose primary characteristic is punching people...!

Hey, I was surprised too! That's why I would've ranked her last initially. I think it helps that she acknowledges that it's a fault and is so proactive about fixing it. It's also cute watching Takanashi help her.

As for Sato, I like him a lot, but his ranking suffers because he gets caught up in the Kyoko vortex too. So many of his interactions are with Yachiyo talking about Kyoko. Sato is way better when he's interacting with Taneshima or Inami.
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Sato is excellent precisely because he's caught up in that vortex, and he's the only one who doesn't want to be.
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Every scene with Sato and Yachiyo is terrible. Hate all of their interactions.
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man that's almost as bad as my Kiritsugu takes
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I finally beat Zelda!

The ending was a let down, but for a game like that I guess it doesn't matter. Cool beans I'm actually excited for the next Zelda news.
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