Poll of the Day > Seriously how can we stop Trump if he can just fire anyone in his way?

(+) Yeah! (+)

How the hell will he be ousted?
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cold

hard

memes
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Blighboy posted...

cold

hard

memes

No, just no.

We need to get out and vote next year in the midterms. Get all the Republican traitors out of office and replace them with Democrats so that they'll be able to proceed with impeachment proceedings.
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WhiteWolf338 posted...

How the hell will he be ousted?

2020 election? Hopefully the dems have someone by then.
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InfernalFive posted...

2020 election? Hopefully the dems have someone by then.

2018 elections for congress
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InfernalFive posted...

WhiteWolf338 posted...

How the hell will he be ousted?

2020 election? Hopefully the dems have someone by then.

I bet it's going to be Hillary again.

And you miss the point of why people voted for Trump. It wasn't because they agreed with his views, it was because they were giving the middle finger to the establishment.
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"We" can't do anything. "We" are the reason he got elected...
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TigerTycoon posted...

InfernalFive posted...

WhiteWolf338 posted...

How the hell will he be ousted?

2020 election? Hopefully the dems have someone by then.

I bet it's going to be Hillary again.

And you miss the point of why people voted for Trump. It wasn't because they agreed with his views, it was because they were giving the middle finger to the establishment.

I hope not.

TigerTycoon posted...

I bet it's going to be Hillary again.

Kill me now...
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TigerTycoon posted...

And you miss the point of why people voted for Trump. It wasn't because they agreed with his views, it was because they were giving the middle finger to the establishment.

I actually just had this conversation with my mom.

*mother talks about how my grandma is moving into a nursing home that kicks their residents out after they run out of money. (For those unfamiliar with nursing homes their are nursing homes that will just keep you until you pass as long as you were there for a couple years.)

As we talk on the subject the fact that trumpcare is cutting from medicare comes up.

I remind her that she voted down ticket republican.

"Hillary would have been worse a socialist country is bad for everyone, we don't want the government running every business"
ask her how single payer health care will make the whole country socialist
"What is single payer healthcare?"
medicare for all?
*gives me a confused look
I decide to drop the conversation at that point.
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TigerTycoon posted...

InfernalFive posted...

WhiteWolf338 posted...

How the hell will he be ousted?

2020 election? Hopefully the dems have someone by then.

I bet it's going to be Hillary again.

And you miss the point of why people voted for Trump. It wasn't because they agreed with his views, it was because they were giving the middle finger to the establishment.

Srs doubt it.
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Make sure he doesn't get a second term. There are more Democrats than Republicans in this country. They just need to turn up come election time. Trump winning most likely woke them up. After coming out for Obama the last two elections, they thought this one would be in the bag. They did kind of come out, given HC won the popular vote by a large margin, but that's not how things work in the U.S. for some reason.
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People were excited about Obama. Nobody was excited about Hillary.
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FBI assassination as per us', duh.
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My god...he's unstoppable...
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TigerTycoon posted...

I bet it's going to be Hillary again.

Probably not.
She lost, and not horribly spectacularly, but she lost nevertheless and her investors wouldn't like that too much so she's getting less money.
With less money, the DNC will help her out less, then someone else will come along.

InfernalFive posted...

WhiteWolf338 posted...

How the hell will he be ousted?

2020 election? Hopefully the dems have someone by then.

Assuming he doesn't get rid of elections by then and become's New North Korea's permanent dictator.
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TigerTycoon posted...

And you miss the point of why people voted for Trump. It wasn't because they agreed with his views, it was because they were giving the middle finger to the establishment.

This "cut off every conceivable body part to spite your face" philosophy that most Americans seem to have is something I'll never get.
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Erik_P posted...

Blighboy posted...

cold

hard

memes

No, just no.

We need to get out and vote next year in the midterms. Get all the Republican traitors out of office and replace them with Democrats so that they'll be able to proceed with impeachment proceedings.

Focus on the bold part because it's the correct answer. If you don't like what the current administration is doing then vote and let your voice be heard next year and in 2020.
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WhiteWolf338 posted...

How the hell will he be ousted?

Considering that he's done nothing wrong, he won't be ousted. But keep up the propaganda machine. You guys already pushed for a recount which went nowhere, complained about Michael Flynn meeting with a Russian ambassador despite the FBI clearing him, etc.

And keep in mind that the FBI doesn't even have the authority to oust a president.
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slacker03150 posted...

TigerTycoon posted...

And you miss the point of why people voted for Trump. It wasn't because they agreed with his views, it was because they were giving the middle finger to the establishment.

I actually just had this conversation with my mom.

*mother talks about how my grandma is moving into a nursing home that kicks their residents out after they run out of money. (For those unfamiliar with nursing homes their are nursing homes that will just keep you until you pass as long as you were there for a couple years.)

As we talk on the subject the fact that trumpcare is cutting from medicare comes up.

I remind her that she voted down ticket republican.

"Hillary would have been worse a socialist country is bad for everyone, we don't want the government running every business"
ask her how single payer health care will make the whole country socialist
"What is single payer healthcare?"
medicare for all?
*gives me a confused look
I decide to drop the conversation at that point.

Why didn't you keep the conversation going and show her your reasoning? That's how you get people to think outside of their bubble, not by rolling your eyes and saying nevermind.
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Jiggy101011 posted...

Focus on the bold part because it's the correct answer. If you don't like what the current administration is doing then vote and let your voice be heard next year and in 2020.

Small problem, everyone has to agree on which person to back otherwise he'll just claim majority on brand recognition. You can't really rally the entirety of the US behind one ideology.
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You'll have to build a time machine and change the timeline
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Acting like democrats are the solution is a massive problem.

Trump isnt THE problem, hes a symptom of a much larger problem. The problem is:

Both parties are in bed with wall street and silicon valley
Both parties are for war (seriously, can we stop bombing syria? This country doesnt even have an air force why are we wasting money killing people)
Democrats are weak. Seriously the donors who put democrats in power are weak who give in to republicans

Finally, and perhaps most importantly, the problem is our society hasn't had a major lifestyle change since the mid 00s. We have been living the following life for a while now:

Wake up to our smartphone alarm, check social media as we get ready for work/school
Drive to work/school with our music app running
Get to work/school, perform activities while hearing about how economy has been shit since the collapse of 07/08
Get home and consume more internet media (Netflix, Steam, Reddit, Facebook, etc). If a Friday/Saturday maybe go out with friends
Go to bed

We havent had a major breakthrough like the superhighway system/TV in the 50s/60s. Or a personal computer of the 80s. Or a internet of the mid 90s through early 00s. Or even the smartphone/social media revolution of 2006/2007/2008. Its a major cultural stagnation. When culture stagnates, people like Trump get elected.
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Jiggy101011 posted...

Why didn't you keep the conversation going and show her your reasoning? That's how you get people to think outside of their bubble, not by rolling your eyes and saying nevermind.

Probably should have, but I have talked to her about it before and it doesn't stick. She is scared of the word socialist and thinks bernie and hillary who are socialists who will turn america into a third world country single handily in 4 years.

I wouldn't even really care if she had a reason for voting for trump, but her reasoning is pretty much just Hillary was bad even though she can't tell me about any policy positions either of them had. by the way we are in wisconsin and my mom isn't the only I know who thinks like this, so way to go hillary, real good choice not campaigning here at all.
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If people really want to get rid of Trump they're going to have to do something that they haven't done yet. They're going to actually have to get off their butts and vote and participate in the political system instead of complaining about how everything sucks but not actually doing anything about it. Seriously get off the internet put down the crack pipes and the beer bongs and try voting it actually work sometimes.
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Sensual_T_Rex posted...

If people really want to get rid of Trump they're going to have to do something that they haven't done yet. They're going to actually have to get off their butts and vote and participate in the political system instead of complaining about how everything sucks but not actually doing anything about it. Seriously get off the internet put down the crack pipes and the beer bongs and try voting it actually work sometimes.

Id have voted democrat if it was anybody but hillary. Thats just the way it iz.

Metal_DK posted...

Acting like democrats are the solution is a massive problem.

Trump isnt THE problem, hes a symptom of a much larger problem. The problem is:

Both parties are in bed with wall street and silicon valley
Both parties are for war (seriously, can we stop bombing syria? This country doesnt even have an air force why are we wasting money killing people)
Democrats are weak. Seriously the donors who put democrats in power are weak who give in to republicans

Finally, and perhaps most importantly, the problem is our society hasn't had a major lifestyle change since the mid 00s. We have been living the following life for a while now:

Wake up to our smartphone alarm, check social media as we get ready for work/school
Drive to work/school with our music app running
Get to work/school, perform activities while hearing about how economy has been shit since the collapse of 07/08
Get home and consume more internet media (Netflix, Steam, Reddit, Facebook, etc). If a Friday/Saturday maybe go out with friends
Go to bed

We havent had a major breakthrough like the superhighway system/TV in the 50s/60s. Or a personal computer of the 80s. Or a internet of the mid 90s through early 00s. Or even the smartphone/social media revolution of 2006/2007/2008. Its a major cultural stagnation. When culture stagnates, people like Trump get elected.

While the Democratic party establishment / "Clinton wing" of the party is as you describe, the "both parties" stuff is not really true and just serves to distract away from and lessen the fact that one party (Republicans) are far more in the pocket of corporations and pro-war than the other. Yes, Dems are too. But not nearly as much as Republicans.

Also...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khan_Shaykhun_chemical_attack

The attack was conducted by the forces of Syrian President Bashar Assad according to international human rights organizations and governments of the United States, United Kingdom, Turkey, Saudi Arabia, France, and Israel. The Assad government denied using any chemical weapons in the air strike.

I'd really like to know how the Syrian government manages to pull off airstrikes without having an air force. That's a damn impressive feat!

Not sure about the cultural stagnation leading to Trump argument, but we have indeed stagnated. It's mainly a result of the voodoo economic Republican mantra of cutting taxes on the wealthy as much as possible, and then lowering funding to infrastructure and scientific endeavors cause we don't have enough money.

Sensual_T_Rex posted...

If people really want to get rid of Trump they're going to have to do something that they haven't done yet. They're going to actually have to get off their butts and vote and participate in the political system instead of complaining about how everything sucks but not actually doing anything about it. Seriously get off the internet put down the crack pipes and the beer bongs and try voting actually work sometimes.

Agreed. But its more than just getting off the internet to vote. Its getting off the internet to go out to eat by yourself or with a friend. Its getting off the internet to join a club that meets in the flesh. Its getting off the internet to go out to a local business, get a small bite to eat, and read a book while occasionally socializing with the staff/others.

The problem is the internet has turned us all into a "well this is easy, ill just go on the net". We have shut ourselves out of the world by being so obsessed with tech. This creates fear in the actual world, and causes the internet world to take over. Hence pepe the frog being the mascot for the current president of the USA. The internet is spilling into the actual world, and its a dangerous game.
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Sensual_T_Rex posted...

If people really want to get rid of Trump they're going to have to do something that they haven't done yet. They're going to actually have to get off their butts and vote

No good parties and a too divided nation, we need to resolve social anarchy before looking at politics unfortunately.
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IAmNowGone posted...

Sensual_T_Rex posted...

If people really want to get rid of Trump they're going to have to do something that they haven't done yet. They're going to actually have to get off their butts and vote and participate in the political system instead of complaining about how everything sucks but not actually doing anything about it. Seriously get off the internet put down the crack pipes and the beer bongs and try voting it actually work sometimes.

Id have voted democrat if it was anybody but hillary. Thats just the way it iz.

Same here. I've always voted Democrat. This was the first election that I didn't because Hillary was that bad in my eyes. I actually preferred the orange buffoon to the wicked witch of the west which is both hilarious and tragic.
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streamofthesky posted...

While the Democratic party establishment / "Clinton wing" of the party is as you describe, the "both parties" stuff is not really true and just serves to distract away from and lessen the fact that one party (Republicans) are far more in the pocket of corporations and pro-war than the other. Yes, Dems are too. But not nearly as much as Republicans.

Hillary and the Democratic establishment purposely had fewer debates with Bernie. They purposely had strange superdelgate systems this whole time. Just because democrats don't hate gays (despite the fact that Obama and Hillary were pretty much the last democrats who showed up to that party) now doesn't make them good. They are definitely in bed with wall street. See: how Howard Dean goes from a presidential candidate in 2004 to a corporate lobbyist by 2008/2010. Its while Hillary supported fracking the fuck out of the USA despite the dems being the "environmentally friendly" party.

We can't afford "not as bad" anymore. Not as bad is what lead us to Trump. In 08 it was "we cant afford a hot head McCain, getting Obama in office is the most important election of our time". In 12 it was "we can't afford business executive Romney, this is the most important election of our time". In 16 a hothead business executive wins....

This whole "lesser of two evils" leads to the same path. Eventually we fucked.
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streamofthesky posted...

I'd really like to know how the Syrian government manages to pull off airstrikes without having an air force. That's a damn impressive feat!

Not sure about the cultural stagnation leading to Trump argument, but we have indeed stagnated. It's mainly a result of the voodoo economic Republican mantra of cutting taxes on the wealthy as much as possible, and then lowering funding to infrastructure and scientific endeavors cause we don't have enough money.

Its called exaggeration. The Syrian air force is a fucking joke, it never meant they have no fighter planes. Thats fucking you nit picking and you know it.

And cultural stagnation leads to personalities like Trump. Also sitting in front of the internet all day obsessing over "da memes!!!" leads to decay and stupidity. The centralized internet of everything revolving around facebook/youtube/reddit/wikis fucking is destroying our society.
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Metal_DK posted...

And cultural stagnation leads to personalities like Trump.

Aggressive capitalism and nepotism is what bred Trump.
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A strong sense of morality and work ethic leads to personalities like Trump.
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Metal_DK posted...

Acting like democrats are the solution is a massive problem.

Trump isnt THE problem, hes a symptom of a much larger problem. The problem is:

Both parties are in bed with wall street and silicon valley
Both parties are for war (seriously, can we stop bombing syria? This country doesnt even have an air force why are we wasting money killing people)
Democrats are weak. Seriously the donors who put democrats in power are weak who give in to republicans

Finally, and perhaps most importantly, the problem is our society hasn't had a major lifestyle change since the mid 00s. We have been living the following life for a while now:

Wake up to our smartphone alarm, check social media as we get ready for work/school
Drive to work/school with our music app running
Get to work/school, perform activities while hearing about how economy has been shit since the collapse of 07/08
Get home and consume more internet media (Netflix, Steam, Reddit, Facebook, etc). If a Friday/Saturday maybe go out with friends
Go to bed

We havent had a major breakthrough like the superhighway system/TV in the 50s/60s. Or a personal computer of the 80s. Or a internet of the mid 90s through early 00s. Or even the smartphone/social media revolution of 2006/2007/2008. Its a major cultural stagnation. When culture stagnates, people like Trump get elected.

While political corruption and influence peddling is an issue, the real problem is an incredibly divided populace and an economy gutted by trade policies. Even if our education system was better, the jobs still wouldn't be there afterward because we give the good jobs away to guest workers

Trump's election has nothing to do with cultural stagnation but instead the realization that Washington and party politics has not only failed the American people but they aren't even pursuing the right issues. Our political system has moved away from what made America great into life-long career politicians who focus on promoting often worthless pet issues (like a fictitious wage gap) while ignoring real problems.

And, because government is constantly growing and becoming more intrusive, the divide between Americans is only continuing to grow so the John Kasichs and Jim Webbs of the world will be ignored in favor of your Trumps, Cruzs, Sanders, and Hillaries who favor extreme stances over moderation.
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

Metal_DK posted...

And cultural stagnation leads to personalities like Trump.

Aggressive capitalism and nepotism is what bred Trump.

Considering that aggressive capitalism and nepotism has been around for a long fucking time, no.

The problem is there is no economic frontier right now. We've been living in 07/08 for about a decade now. This causes Trump. If there was an economic frontier to be excited for right now (i think medical/recreational marijuana COULD be one, as could stem cell research. As could even 3d printing but thats still not really mainstream), people would be happier and not angry at any establishment.

And while trickle down economics is bullshit, the number one reason for income inequality right now is assortive mating.

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2014/01/29/new-academic-study-links-rising-income-inequality-to-assortive-mating/
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Metal_DK posted...

streamofthesky posted...

While the Democratic party establishment / "Clinton wing" of the party is as you describe, the "both parties" stuff is not really true and just serves to distract away from and lessen the fact that one party (Republicans) are far more in the pocket of corporations and pro-war than the other. Yes, Dems are too. But not nearly as much as Republicans.

Hillary and the Democratic establishment purposely had fewer debates with Bernie. They purposely had strange superdelgate systems this whole time. Just because democrats don't hate gays (despite the fact that Obama and Hillary were pretty much the last democrats who showed up to that party) now doesn't make them good. They are definitely in bed with wall street. See: how Howard Dean goes from a presidential candidate in 2004 to a corporate lobbyist by 2008/2010. Its while Hillary supported fracking the fuck out of the USA despite the dems being the "environmentally friendly" party.

We can't afford "not as bad" anymore. Not as bad is what lead us to Trump. In 08 it was "we cant afford a hot head McCain, getting Obama in office is the most important election of our time". In 12 it was "we can't afford business executive Romney, this is the most important election of our time". In 16 a hothead business executive wins....

This whole "lesser of two evils" leads to the same path. Eventually we fucked.

I don't like lesser of two evils, but the lesser of two evils is still in fact the lesser of two evils.
Obama was quite active militarily, but Republicans still complained endlessly about how "weak" he was in exerting military force and McCain in particularly literally sang about bombing Iran while campaigning. Obama was far from a pacifist, but I have NO DOUBT he got us into less shit overseas than a Republican would have.

Not ideal, but *still* better than the alternative.

The lesser of two evils won't end until the two party system ends, which in turn won't end until we get rid of our ruinous First Past The Post voting system (vote for one person, most votes wins). Because FPTP inevitably leads to a two party system. If 60% of the country is right-of-center (to varying degrees) and 40% is left-of-center (to varying degrees) and the right-wingers split their votes roughly half and half on two conservative candidates but the liberals all vote for the same guy...40% of the population just won everything. And thus, the parties quickly consolidate down to only 2 real choices in order to avoid that.
But Dems and Reps love having a death grip on power, even if it means having to see-saw it back and forth to keep it. They will NEVER work to undo their godhood. The only way it will ever end is a constitutional convention ratified by 3/4 of the states themselves, and even that would be hard since the two parties dominate at the state level, too.

Zeus posted...

Trump's election has nothing to do with cultural stagnation but instead the realization that Washington and party politics has not only failed the American people but they aren't even pursuing the right issues. Our political system has moved away from what made America great into life-long career politicians who focus on promoting often worthless pet issues (like a fictitious wage gap) while ignoring real problems.

It does have to do with cultural stagnation. If there were economic frontiers to get people excited, Trump wouldnt be elected. Economic frontiers are always the most important thing to keeping people optimistic and avoiding Trump.
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streamofthesky posted...

don't like lesser of two evils, but the lesser of two evils is still in fact the lesser of two evils.
Obama was quite active militarily, but Republicans still complained endlessly about how "weak" he was in exerting military force and McCain in particularly literally sang about bombing Iran while campaigning. Obama was far from a pacifist, but I have NO DOUBT he got us into less shit overseas than a Republican would have.

We can't afford lesser shit overseas anymore. Furthermore "lesser of two evils" eventually leads to "why not try me?!?!?!" Which is exactly what Trump said to black america frequently on his campaign.
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streamofthesky posted...

While the Democratic party establishment / "Clinton wing" of the party is as you describe, the "both parties" stuff is not really true and just serves to distract away from and lessen the fact that one party (Republicans) are far more in the pocket of corporations and pro-war than the other. Yes, Dems are too. But not nearly as much as Republicans.

Except that's not even remotely true. Corruption is more endemic among Democrats than Republicans, whether it's state senators trying to sell guns to terrorists, mayors selling expensive real estate to their mistresses for a buck, a governor taking bribes for political appointments including a senate seat, or the very frequent misuse of campaign funds.

While the Democrats aren't always more pro-war, they're usually in the pockets of corporations, unions, and just everything else because when you expand government there's more money to go around. When you shrink government, there's less money to go around. Bureaucracies are inherently prone to corruption and the party trying to expand bureaucracies is going to be the more corrupt of the two.
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Trump reigns supreme and liberals just can't handle it! I love it!
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Metal_DK posted...

Considering that aggressive capitalism and nepotism has been around for a long fucking time, no.

Do you think Trump is a unique phenomena? He's not, society has simply eroded enough to allow a piece of shit daddy's boy with no concept of reality get power by throwing money and screaming "'MURICA!".

Metal_DK posted...

The problem is there is no economic frontier right now. We've been living in 07/08 for about a decade now. This causes Trump. If there was an economic frontier to be excited for right now (i think medical/recreational marijuana COULD be one, as could stem cell research. As could even 3d printing but thats still not really mainstream), people would be happier and not angry at any establishment.

There's no economic frontier because cash is pooling up in a few people's pockets more and more disproportionately over time and the ultra rich are ultimately focused on oneupsmanship, not innovation.

The general public default to the internet as it's cheap entertainment. People simply haven't got the disposable income to take on personally gratifying projects, if people had 20th century affluence then you would see 20th century progression, until then we have to suffer convenient social blame shifting and capitalistic oligarchy.
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

Do you think Trump is a unique phenomena? He's not, society has simply eroded enough to allow a piece of shit daddy's boy with no concept of reality get power by throwing money and screaming "'MURICA!".

Trump like figures becoming president have never happened in american history....

Kyuubi4269 posted...

There's no economic frontier because cash is pooling up in a few people's pockets more and more disproportionately over time and the ultra rich are ultimately focused on oneupsmanship, not innovation.

The general public default to the internet as it's cheap entertainment. People simply haven't got the disposable income to take on personally gratifying projects, if people had 20th century affluence then you would see 20th century progression, until then we have to suffer convenient social blame shifting and capitalistic oligarchy.

Agreed that cash is pooling up, but consolidation of our lifestyle has caused the cash pooling up. For example, having everything on your smartphone (camera, music player, day planner, alarm clock) causes fewer companies to have more power.

Also most economic frontiers start small. Really fucking small. We all know stories of apple starting in a garage (or a very small building or whatever) and what not. The problem is complexity of innovation is a lot larger in todays world than even as recent at the 50s/60s/70s/80s/90s.
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Metal_DK posted...

Hillary and the Democratic establishment purposely had fewer debates with Bernie.

Source? Because I'm pretty sure that claim was debunked.

Metal_DK posted...

They purposely had strange superdelgate systems this whole time.

Which has nothing to do with corruption.

Metal_DK posted...

Just because democrats don't hate gays (despite the fact that Obama and Hillary were pretty much the last democrats who showed up to that party) now doesn't make them good

And half of today's problems are embodied in your post: The re-framing of arguments to illogical extremes. "Against gay marriage? You hate gays and want them to die!" The country has lost a sensible middle ground and reasonable discussion.

Metal_DK posted...

Its while Hillary supported fracking the fuck out of the USA despite the dems being the "environmentally friendly" party.

Parties do not and should require litmus tests. But otherwise sure, a lot of each party's "mission" is more branding than substance. That's why a party that's supposedly for the working class levies such high taxes on the working class while supporting job-killing legislation like NAFTA and TPP.

Metal_DK posted...

We can't afford "not as bad" anymore. Not as bad is what lead us to Trump. In 08 it was "we cant afford a hot head McCain, getting Obama in office is the most important election of our time". In 12 it was "we can't afford business executive Romney, this is the most important election of our time". In 16 a hothead business executive wins....

The "badness" of Trump is vastly overblown. In 08, McCain was actually very moderate and not much of a hothead; his voting record at the time was very centrist. And, of course, Romney was a "conservative" governor who presided over a liberal state who put into place what was considered the prototype for the ACA. McCain was a highly qualified, incredible candidate. Romney was okay as well. Trump, who held no previous office, was the only true unknown.

Metal_DK posted...

Zeus posted...

Trump's election has nothing to do with cultural stagnation but instead the realization that Washington and party politics has not only failed the American people but they aren't even pursuing the right issues. Our political system has moved away from what made America great into life-long career politicians who focus on promoting often worthless pet issues (like a fictitious wage gap) while ignoring real problems.

It does have to do with cultural stagnation. If there were economic frontiers to get people excited, Trump wouldnt be elected. Economic frontiers are always the most important thing to keeping people optimistic and avoiding Trump.

Again, "cultural stagnation" is nonsense especially within the context you're trying to describe. The real issue was that the country wasn't going well and mainstream politics was blamed, leading to Sanders and Trump doing far better than they would within a stable system.
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

Do you think Trump is a unique phenomena? He's not, society has simply eroded enough to allow a piece of shit daddy's boy with no concept of reality get power by throwing money and screaming "'MURICA!".

He actually is unique, especially within US history where the country has never elected a candidate who didn't first hold some other form of office. Likewise, he entered into a unique situation where there was an overcrowded field with very little name recognition. But it was more than just the right conditions, because he ran an incredible campaign where he spent very little money -- practically nothing -- and beat out competitors who had massive war chests through gaming the system for massive free exposure. He also researched the issues that Americans cared about which politicians had been neglecting. And he was expertly able to connect with voters.

The idea that he got here by "throwing money" is a laughable ignorance of the worst kind, considering that his spend was miniscule compared even to people who did far worse than him. He was Obama to Hillary's Romney.
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Zeus posted...

Source? Because I'm pretty sure that claim was debunked.

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/427026/why-democrats-buried-their-debates-times-no-one-will-watch-brendan-bordelon

Zeus posted...

Which has nothing to do with corruption.

never said it was corrupt, but its not good. corruption and not a good idea are different things.
http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-blog/presidential-campaign/272638-democrats-superdelegate-system-is-unfair-and

Zeus posted...

And half of today's problems are embodied in your post: The re-framing of arguments to illogical extremes. "Against gay marriage? You hate gays and want them to die!" The country has lost a sensible middle ground and reasonable discussion.

and you not reading what i said and adding in dumbass shit like that to frame me does? Screw you

Zeus posted...

Parties do not and should require litmus tests. But otherwise sure, a lot of each party's "mission" is more branding than substance. That's why a party that's supposedly for the working class levies such high taxes on the working class while supporting job-killing legislation like NAFTA and TPP.

Ive been saying in this topic the dems at the highest levels don't give a fuck about the working class.....

Zeus posted...

The "badness" of Trump is vastly overblown. In 08, McCain was actually very moderate and not much of a hothead; his voting record at the time was very centrist. And, of course, Romney was a "conservative" governor who presided over a liberal state who put into place what was considered the prototype for the ACA. McCain was a highly qualified, incredible candidate. Romney was okay as well. Trump, who held no previous office, was the only true unknown.

I'm saying that was the sensationalist message that was being played, not about any truth to it...

Zeus posted...

Again, "cultural stagnation" is nonsense especially within the context you're trying to describe. The real issue was that the country wasn't going well and mainstream politics was blamed, leading to Sanders and Trump doing far better than they would within a stable system.

The country not doing well IS cultural stagnation.

WTH are you even saying in your pick apart attempt?
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Corruption is more endemic among Democrats than Republicans

Hahahahaha

No.

More Republicans are paid off by oil companies to deny climate change and promote anti environmental regulations than Democrats.
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Oh look Zeus is doing his "Trump has done nothing wrong but I totally don't support him" bit again
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The Zeus character needs to work on his act.
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