Lurker > abaddon41_80

https://reason.com/2020/05/24/the-cdcs-new-best-estimate-implies-a-covid-19-infection-fatality-rate-below-0-3/

I am not going to argue with you, @DoctorPiranha3 . Just actually do some reading.

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I HATE ALEX SMITH

averagejoel posted...

cool. now do convenience store workers

In 2017, the fatal-injury rate for law-enforcement officers and firefighters in 2017 was 7.7 in other words, for every 100,000 full-time employees working in this sector, 7.7 died on the job because of homicide or other fatal injuries. Out of 100,000 retail workers, 1.6 died because of fatal injuries on the job in 2017.

I am not sure what your point is, though.

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Zeeak4444 posted...

Another fun one is cops killed vs people cops kill.

2019 you had 48 cops killed during line-of-duty.

vs 1004 killed by cops.

Now avoiding everything else in this topic, avoiding for profit prisons and 13A and just so much more we havent even scratched the surface on... how can you even argue that cops are the ones in threat of danger.

For every cop killed 20 civilians died. Maybe the vast majority of those were active shootouts or something, but its still an absolutely absurd ratio.

It is pretty easy to argue. There are roughly 800,000 sworn law enforcement officers in the United States. That means law enforcement officers are killed by civilians at a rate of 0.00625%. There are roughly 329,000,000 civilians in the United States. That means civilians are killed by officers at a rate of 0.0003%. Law enforcement officers have a ~20 times higher chance of being killed by civilians than civilians have of being killed by law enforcement.

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I HATE ALEX SMITH

I am kind of surprised this is even a discussion, to be honest. Look at the videos.

The first video shows the cops trying to cuff the suspect and him actively resisting. They are not using any undue force in this video. The suspect breaks free, attacks them, steals the taser from one of them, and runs away. The cop that still has a taser attempts to subdue the suspect with his taser, you can see and hear it in the video, but it does not work.

The second video shows the suspect fleeing while the cop is still trying to use his taser, and it still isn't working. The suspect is much closer to the cop with his taser than the other cop is to them. The suspect turns and points the taser at the closer cop. At this point the closer cop goes for his gun but it seems the trailing cop beats him to it and shoots the suspect. The trailing cop, knowing the suspect could likely reach his partner and take his gun before he reaches him, either has to do nothing or let the suspect potentially his partner's gun, as it does not seem like he can close the distance before the suspect could.

The trailing cop's options where to a)let his partner possibly be shot with the taser and hope the suspect did not incapacitate his partner and attempt to take his gun or b)do nothing. Yall really out here advocating for the latter. It's wild.

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I HATE ALEX SMITH

This is the most offensive topic I have seen in my time on GFAQs.

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@V-E-G-Y- is an elite poster and should be respected as such. The man makes good topics.

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I HATE ALEX SMITH

1 fo sho.

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I think everyone is at least a little gay.

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RemixRBG posted...

They resigned from their department but are still on the force

Ah. I have not read into what they did.

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AlephZero posted...

The police can be replaced by volunteers from the community. Once the police are gone crime will disappear. Let communities police themselves.

Do you really believe crime is caused by the presence of police?

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How can they be fired if they already resigned?

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hockeybub89 posted...

Yikes

I apologize if this offends anyone. I am very emotional about this subject because I am tired of the media acting like my people are using poverty and "systemic racism" as reasoning for committing crimes. I grew up in a poor black home in poor black neighborhoods around other poor black people. Not one black person I have spoken to in-person about this whole "situation" is talking about defunding the police or the need for police reform. The police do need change but we need change, too, and it isn't going to come from defunding the police or more money for charities and community programs.

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P4wn4g3 posted...

Yeah obviously.

If it is that obvious, why are people upset?

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I think he is just saying that we need to work together to create equality, like T'Challa instead of Killmonger.

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legendary_zell posted...

I don't think that less than 10 percent difference is enough to justify people constantly using it to deflect from police brutality and harassment. People don't even use it in a statistical sense, they use it as a cudgel to beat down people who raise too much fuss about injustice.

10% is a pretty big difference, especially when you consider the population demographics of the United States. Only 8% of black people murdered in 2018 were murdered by white people and white people make up 76.5% of the population. Black people only make up 13.4% of the population yet we accounted for 88.9% of black people murdered, and 15.5% of white people murdered.

It should not be used as a cudgel, as you say, but it needs to at least be discussed. Black-on-black violence is a much, much larger problem than police-on-black or white-on-black violence. The argument could be made that systemic racism, i.e. the man keeping us down, is a partial cause of that but all that does is deflect responsibility, as some people in this topic have mentioned.

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legendary_zell posted...

Everyone is killed by their race at much higher rates than they are by anyone else. Most murders are personal and family and friend networks are very likekly to be with others of the same race. That's literally just how murder works, it's not some pathology unique to the black community.

Yes but it is higher for us, 88.9%, than it is for white people, 80%.

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Ryan__Leaf posted...

There are two SEXES. "Gender" can be open to interpretation if you want.

Actually, I mispoke earlier. This is correct.

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And for the "we only people commit violent crimes because white people keep us in poverty" crowd, that is also false. Even if you assume 100% of the violent crimes in 2019 were committed by people living in poverty, we still commit those crimes at twice the rate of white people. It is like four times the rate just looking at murder. We are responsible for about 16% of white people murdered, twice the 8% of black people killed by white people.

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While it is hard to say is systemic police racism is a myth, I think this topic would be better phrased if the subject stated, "Systemic police racism in terms of police killings is a myth."

What can be proven is that there is no racial bias when it comes to police killings, contrary to what the media would have you believe. Michigan State did a study last year showing that it isn't race that predicts the percentage of police shootings, it is violent crime rates. Black people are actually more likely to be shot by black officers.

https://msutoday.msu.edu/news/2019/the-truth-behind-racial-disparities-in-fatal-police-shootings/

It is true that black people are killed at a higher rate by police when you look at the rate using the entire population as the denominator but if you use the violent crime arrests as the denominator, the rate of police shootings is the same for white people as it is for black people. In 2018, 399 white people were killed by the police and there were 230,299 violent crime arrests for white people. In 2018, 209 black people were killed by the police and there were 147,734 violent crime arrests for black people. The rate difference is miniscule but it is actually slight higher for white people, 0.17%, and it was for black people, 0.14%.

On the other hand, police are killed by black people at a much higher rate than they are killed by white people. There were 28 police officers feloniously killed by white people in 2019 and 15 police officers feloniously killed by black people. Accounting for the fact that the US is 76.5% and 13.4% black, that means black people kill police officers at three times the rate white people kill police officers.

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Garioshi posted...

Loaded question, gender is a social construct that is just used to put people into boxes

There are only two genders from a scientific perspective, I guess maybe three if you count intersex. There are absolutely no more than three genders.

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averagejoel posted...

all cops, as part of the terms of their employment, agree to enforce all laws. this includes laws that are unjust or cruel.

cops are not bad because of the actions of a few of them; they're bad because they're cops.

Which unjust and cruel laws are you referring to?

gunplagirl posted...

Don't forget that statistic that says 40% of all officers are guilty of domestic abuse. And that's just the ones we're aware of. Most never actually get punished for it.

People who keep quoting mentioning that number, are you aware the studies done are from the early 1990's?

http://womenandpolicing.com/violenceFS.asp

Two studies have found that at least 40% of police officer families experience domestic violence, (1, 2) in contrast to 10% of families in the general population.

Those two studies are from 1991 and 1992. Domestic violence incidents per person have dropped drastically since then.

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shiby with it posted...

Because "good cops" are the minority and when the "good ones" step up, they get framed for crimes they didn't commit or ostracized by their colleagues.

A lot of people in this topic are simply stating things like this but as Patchwork has pointed out, there is no statistical evidence that "good cops" are the minority.

If you show me 8000 videos of different police officers abusing their power or committing "brutality," and I seriously doubt anyone could even find half of that, I will show you 1% of sworn law enforcement in the US. If you could somehow provide proof of 80,000 bad police officers, I will show 10% of sworn law enforcement. If you are saying good cops are in the minority, you are saying over 400,000 officers are bad.

I keep on hearing talk of police officers being murderers but they are significantly more likely to be killed by the general population than the general population is to be killed by them.

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Patchwork posted...

Numbers are racist.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-myth-of-systemic-police-racism-11591119883

In addition to this article,

https://msutoday.msu.edu/news/2019/the-truth-behind-racial-disparities-in-fatal-police-shootings/

We found that the race of the officer doesnt matter when it comes to predicting whether black or white citizens are shot," Cesario said. "If anything, black citizens are more likely to have been shot by black officers"

Many people ask whether black or white citizens are more likely to be shot and why. We found that violent crime rates are the driving force behind fatal shootings, Cesario said. Our data show that the rate of crime by each racial group correlates with the likelihood of citizens from that racial group being shot."

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The police force, and authority systems in general, is comprised of people from the population. They represent the population. The percentage of bad people in the police force is likely the same as the percentage of bad people in the United States.

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You are right, TC. I have been saying the same thing since this all started. People are actively using whatever they can find in order to hate the other side. Your statement is clearly very neutral and reflective but there are many here who will just assume you are some "alt-right troll" for even saying it.

Now is not the time for hatred and disdain, especially hatred and disdain that you go out of your way to create. All it does is create a larger rift between the two sides and make it more "us against them," which only leads to further escalation.

I have mentioned it in the past but everyone needs to read MLK's "Letter from a Birmingham Jail." If the greatest civil rights leader of our time denounces hatred and violent responses, maybe that means something? He pretty much described exactly what is happening now, except in this instance the police are playing the role of white people and the general population is the black community. As anyone who has read a lot of what he wrote will tell you, if MLK were alive today, he would be ashamed of the way people are acting in the name of equality and fairness.

"I have tried to stand between these two forces, saying that we need emulate neither the "do nothingism" of the complacent nor the hatred and despair of the black nationalist. For there is the more excellent way of love and nonviolent protest. I am grateful to God that, through the influence of the Negro church, the way of nonviolence became an integral part of our struggle. If this philosophy had not emerged, by now many streets of the South would, I am convinced, be flowing with blood. And I am further convinced that if our white brothers dismiss as "rabble rousers" and "outside agitators" those of us who employ nonviolent direct action, and if they refuse to support our nonviolent efforts, millions of Negroes will, out of frustration and despair, seek solace and security in black nationalist ideologies--a development that would inevitably lead to a frightening racial nightmare."

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I didn't get modded. Nothing I posted was against the ToU and if it offended anyone, I do apologize. I deleted the messages because they were so stupid that I could not believe I posted them.

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One person accusing me of being warned at some point, when I do not believe I have ever been warned and my post history will show that, and another person telling me to shut up. Sick discussion, guys.

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NoMeLx22x posted...

He's taken this approach to every single topic about this movement. He's basically played Devil's Advocate for every single article or whatever that's been posted. He's basically the Unfair Represent of this shit.

I wouldn't call it playing Devil's Advocate or "sea-lioning," I looked that up so I know what it means now. It is really more just being in awe at the powers of deductive reasoning on this board, and places like Twitter and Reddit in general right now.

This video is 20 seconds long. At no point in the video is there any proof the men the cop is talking to are members of the Proud Boys. At no point in the video is there any proof that, even if you could prove they are Proud Boys, the cop knows they are members. This is a video of a police officer warning a man with a gun to stay inside to avoid violating curfew, presumably other men as well since he says "you guys." This video shows that the police officer is indeed playing favorites with whoever these men are. That is all this video shows.

The men in the video may be members of the Proud Boys and the caption may be exactly what the video shows. The problem here is that you all are taking the caption of a video posted on Reddit as 100% true information. This proves the cops, are at least this specific cop, are playing favorites with a group. The video doesn't have any evidence as to who that group is. Any inferences you make past that are just guesses. They may be right but to act like this video and the caption are proof is wrong.

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I read it. It doesn't change the point. The cops are in the wrong for warning them but why is it surprising that they did warn them?

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I do not know why this is news. I do not know who the "Proud Boys" are exactly but I imagine they are supportive of the police? Is it really news that the police would want to avoid hurting some of the few people they feel do not hate them at this point?

PSA - I am not arguing the validity of the hatred towards the police, simply stating a fact that people are more likely to be willing to hurt people who hate them.

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V-E-G-Y- posted...

She has a nice dat ass doe

False.

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Imagine saying the phrase "dat ass" when discussing Bella Thorne.

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Unknown5uspect posted...

So why aren't you out there protesting too?

What do you mean? Do you think I am white?

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UnfairRepresent posted...

The population is also 75% white.

Also you're wrong. In 2019 it was 370 white guys shot to 235 black guys shot by police.

That's not twice as many.

I will respond to more later when I have time but I said unarmed people. There were 21 unarmed white people killed by police in 2019 compared to nine unarmed black people. It doesn't make up for the population percentages but there are still twice as many unarmed white people killed as there are black people.

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KINDERFELD posted...

Disliking and distrusting people who literally enslaved and murdered your people back then and now is not being racist.

There has never been a time in the history of this country where a black police officer killed an unarmed white man the way Floyd and many others were murdered.

What white people did to our ancestors in the past doesn't have anything to do with today's world. I hate it when other black people bring up slavery or other things that happened so far in the past that most people who participated are dead by now. That is meaningless.

What happened to George Floyd is horrible and should never have happened. The people responsible should be punished to the full extent of the law. That is not commonplace, though. It certainly hasn't been something that happened to "many others" in recent times. There were twice as many unarmed white people killed by police as there were black people last year. That doesn't make up for the population difference but to act like it doesn't happen is false.

SquantoZ posted...

No, you don't agree with racism. Posting this shit continues to change the narrative. You are part of the problem.

The background behind these statistics are largely rooted in systemic racism. The poverty that was forced upon people of color after the civil war through redlining and continued implicit bias. Guess what continued poverty tends to lead to?! Read up on it. Educate yourself, my friend.

I do not need to look up anything about poverty and people of color. I grew up in a household with seven siblings being raised by a single mother in neighborhoods, over a dozen of them because we kept getting evicted, that were mostly other black people. What does being in poverty have to do with violent crimes? Neither I nor any of my siblings, nor most of the other black people I grew up with, have committed any violent crimes. It is your opinion that these numbers are largely rooted in systemic racism and that is part of the problem. It deflects the responsibility from us. There are things out there we cannot control but there is plenty we can try to control that we just ignore in favor of blaming it all on white people. To me, you are more part of the problem.

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My problem with The Black Lives Matter movement is that it comes from a place of false information. We are killed at a higher rate per capita than white people by police but black people killed by police are more likely to be killed by black police officers. Michigan State did a study last year that shows, and I quote, "If anything, black citizens are more likely to have been shot by black officers, but this is because black officers are drawn from the same population that they police." There results found "that its not racial bias on behalf of white officers relative to black officers when it comes to fatal shootings."

In addition they found, "violent crime rates are the driving force behind fatal shootings, Cesario said. Our data show that the rate of crime by each racial group correlates with the likelihood of citizens from that racial group being shot. If you live in a county that has a lot of white people committing crimes, white people are more likely to be shot. If you live in a county that has a lot of black people committing crimes, black people are more likely to be shot. It is the best predictor we have of fatal police shootings.

The data would seem to agree with that statement. We only account for 13.4% of the US population but we commit 37.4% of violent crimes and 53.3% of murders. We kill white people at twice the rate they kill us and we kill police officers at four times the rate white people kill them. Almost 90% of black people murdered are murdered by other black people. BLM ignores all of this and tries to deflect blame 100% to white people by focusing on the minority of times where white people do murder us.

I agree that racism is a thing, I have seen it and been the victim of it. There are racist white people out there. There are also racist black people out there. Maybe we have more reason to be racist because of our experiences but that isn't going to make anything better. If anything, stereotyping and racism to combat stereotyping and racism is going to create a further divide. We seemingly want to punish all white people for the sins of the incredibly small minority while excusing behavior within our race. Maybe white people do that, too, and maybe it just feels like we do it more because I mostly move in circles of other black people.

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DrizztLink posted...

You tell us.

Got em.

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Pretty much anything. The hotter you are, the more you can get away with.

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Yeah boy!

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She definitely has some yabos on her, that is for sure.

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I HATE ALEX SMITH