Poll of the Day > PotD's very own hardcore punk music topic.

(+) Yeah! (+)

I've made this topic before. THE topic for discussing punk music of all kinds. I put hardcore in the title because the classics from the 80s are some of my favorites, but, shit, you might like Television, or, like The Minutemen, or X, or whatever. Anything loosely fitting under the punk banner is allowed, though I am not really going to be a stickler.

Anyways, this topic is going to be kicked off with my favorite song by one of my favorite bands, Bad Brains. That song is Pay to Cum, which has one of the most furious vocal deliveries I have ever heard:

There are several versions of this song, such as this one from the compilation album Black Dots, which is still good but not as ferocious and you can kinda figure out the lyrics somewhat but my favorite is from their first studio album

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZsKufs8jMA

Now, one thing about it is there are like 5,000 more bands I need to check out. I have a lot of music I like, but I tend to dip into various punk subgenres with a few bands but never was one of those people to listen to absolutely everything. So...what I consider to be the best or to be classic in my mind is, but still about 5,000 bands I need to check out.

Here is the Black Dots version of Pay to Cum....I don't like it quite as much but its still a ripper

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTRfvq7q1O8

Never been a big fan of hardcore punk. I'm more of a metal guy. But I used to play in a band that covered bad brains. I don't remember which song it was though

I lean towards genres that mix in heavy metal, especially crust punk and metalcore bands.

Amebix are considered progenitors of crust punk and they were tearing it up in 1983:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-blW7TYfdj0

But I don't think anyone beats Dystopia:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agjf_QK4I9o

Coalesce would be my favorite metalcore band. Their music is great, but they were nuts live:

https://youtu.be/sRqktwKb5vQ?t=25

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Thats cool you guys covered bad brains. They're one of my all time favorites. If their only good album was their first theyd still be legendary but they have more and their first funk metalish album(i against i) is pretty rockin.

I've always been more into punk than metal but i do respect metal. When it comes to really harsh stuff i prefer stuff on the punk side like powerviolence though im going to be checking out those links. I have listened to coalesce before and they were good. I like the song Bob Junior. And nice time changes/transitions/ whatever i am not musically inclined/ make me happy.

argonautweakend posted...

I've always been more into punk than metal but i do respect metal. When it comes to really harsh stuff i prefer stuff on the punk side like powerviolence though im going to be checking out those links. I have listened to coalesce before and they were good. I like the song Bob Junior. And nice time changes/transitions/ whatever i am not musically inclined/ make me happy.

I was into metal long before I was into that kind of music so that's probably the only reason I gravitated toward the metal-influenced stuff. I like the more dark, depressive tone of crust punk. I was a 90's kid so I had to go through grunge and nu metal before I could branch out.

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All it takes to ruin a good topic like this is a little GG Allin.

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Eh, not a fan of the guy from what I can tell, but he would fit under the banner.

I liek Pigface

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argonautweakend posted...

i against i

I think that was the song actually lol

How do you feel about rapcore? I used to love these guys:

https://youtu.be/JNwiVG1uPqc

Downset, some early Biohazard, and of course Rage Against the Machine. Maybe even early Beastie Boys?

And since you mentioned powerviolence, I recently discovered these guys and I think they're pretty cool. I really dig the vocals.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q89RaRF2Mvs

I think the only thing closest to straight up hardcore punk that I have is Integrity and I'm sure you know who they are.

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Here's Mr Bungle doing an Exploited cover

https://youtu.be/6PMz0frVKkc

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I'll be being more active here later, but speaking of the exploited I find it hilarious enough a band can release an album in 1981 called "Punk's Not Dead"

I get it in the historical context but a lot of my favorites came after 1981!

https://youtu.be/v9FkQLjOSZ8

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Okay so rap core is alright to a degree. I don't hate it but it doesnt get me going like other things. And i've also never heard of Integrity but I will give them a shot. As stated I am no expert and there is like literally 5,000 bands I need to check out still on this musical journey. Rare that I haven't heard of a band outright though, but I welcome it.

I've heard Man in the Bastard before but I will probably have to re evaluate. When it comes to Powerviolence, I love Charles Bronson and Infest is also super awesome. There really is something about these 20 songs in 12 minutes type of bands that I really dig.

For Charles Bronson they have every song ever on a compilation called "complete discocrappy" but not all of that is good or worth checking out. I'd straight up just go with their only actual full length, Youth Attack! They use a lot of movie/show/whatever clips to begin or end their songs, often to hilarious effect. Really does the name "Youth Attack!" proud

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2oN0LZtfce4

As far as Infest goes...I don't know, but both of their LPs are killer. Slave and No Man's Slave...but they also killed it live too

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=41iW8GByREI

I am listening to Double Nickels on the Dime by the Minutemen...this is an album that is good, but it does have 43 tracks, which is a lot.

But a lot of it sounds like small snippets of notebook scrambles, and as a result the songs aren't too long. IF you like funk this is a good album for you.

I mean, COME ON

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSsGEfi6Nu4

cohesion is chill af

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https://youtu.be/302oEzSPCqE

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Don't really need to say anything about that song because, what the fuck could I even say? CLASSIC

I've also found all the tracks from Double Nickels with swear words and am removing them so I can play the album in the store I work at.

Thank god some of my favorites do not have bad language(such as if Glory of Man had a bad word I might have to let it slide and deal if a customer wants to complain because...just listen to it!), but some, like History Lesson Pt. II do ("We were fuckin' Corndogs" - a line so nonsensical it shouldn't even count as a swear)...

OhhhJa posted...

Never been a big fan of hardcore punk. I'm more of a metal guy. But I used to play in a band that covered bad brains. I don't remember which song it was though

Sailing On?

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I was big into "X" years ago, mostly because a local Boston band I really loved called Trona was constantly compared to them (vocally mostly- but I hear Pixies in there too). There are a few songs I really liked like Los Angeles, Hungry Wolf, and Motel Room in my Bed but overall I think Exene's vocals get REALLY grating after awhile. John Doe's voice is awesome though. Then they went hillbilly music for some reason haha.

I am a huge fan of a Canadian band called Nomeansno to this day. This is a GREAT band, I love them. They have many awesome albums but for those interested in what they sound like here's a great example:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WSZ4zaNBreI


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Oh yeah, X is a great band. They got Ray Manzarek to produce and play keyboards on their first few albums because he read a review of an X show in the newspaper where they were called trash and he just had to see what they were all about. That is pretty impressive, but his keyboard really stands out. I've never had a problem with the vocals, but I tend to take a lot of things as they come like that.

The one NoMeansNo album I really liked was Wrong. Lots of great songs on there and kinda has that funk/jazz/whatever style to it which I like.

argonautweakend posted...

Oh yeah, X is a great band. They got Ray Manzarek to produce and play keyboards on their first few albums because he read a review of an X show in the newspaper where they were called trash and he just had to see what they were all about. That is pretty impressive, but his keyboard really stands out. I've never had a problem with the vocals, but I tend to take a lot of things as they come like that.

The one NoMeansNo album I really liked was Wrong. Lots of great songs on there and kinda has that funk/jazz/whatever style to it which I like.

Wrong is excellent! Listening to it you'd think it was recorded in the mid 90s but I think it was in 87 or 88. Way ahead of their time. I got into it at first because it was suggested to me that as a bass player I'd appreciate their stuff. The bass is so loud in the mix it almost reminded me a bit of Primus, even though the music of course sounds nothing like it. Rob's singing sounds a lot like Rollins on that record too. Classic stuff!

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https://youtu.be/J0XB652KtME

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Black_Crusher posted...

Sailing On?

After doing a little research I think it was pay to cum. Surprised I didn't remember that lol but it's been about 10 years

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHR-rzUjCzU

I had (well, still have, it's in storage) a shitty little solid-state Crate amp, and with the onboard distortion cranked, I could kill that solo of Greg's. It just stabs into your ears, it's perfect.

Kinda surprised not to see any Minor Threat in here yet.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aaOTilBjTyY

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lpqfPsxeqyM

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Minor threat is one of my all time favorites. Id have posted them eventually.

I love Ian Mackaye as well. I could listen to him talk for hours about stuff.

Does this count?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12kcpP-8jfM

My roommate in college was deep into that sort of thing. Actually invited Orange 9mm (I think it was Orange 9mm, it might have been some other band of the era) to a party at our apartment when they played a gig in Atlantic City.

I also went to school with some of the band members from The Youth Ahead and Social Butterfly. I don't think either of those ever really made it out of the Northeast scene, though I think Youth Ahead played the Warped Tour at one point.

That roommate was also huge into Fugazi.

I only half paid attention to whatever he was listening to, I was never hugely into punk. Bad Religion actually kind of caught my attention with a couple of songs, though (they're more melodic than most punk is).
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The problem with Fugazi is I love one guy's voice and the other is pure meh. And unfortunately it's this guy that gets most of their songs. That first (?) album with Waiting Room on it is great regardless.

Any love for Dead Kennedys? Too Drunk to Fuck is pretty hilarious as is Let's Kill the Landlord man lol.

edit: I am way more a prog guy but occasionally I expand my horizons. I think it's the best way to grow as a musician, so almost nothing's completely off the table.

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The only punk band I ever liked was The Dead Milkman.

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ParanoidObsessive posted...

Does this count?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12kcpP-8jfM

My roommate in college was deep into that sort of thing. Actually invited Orange 9mm (I think it was Orange 9mm, it might have been some other band of the era) to a party at our apartment when they played a gig in Atlantic City.

I also went to school with some of the band members from The Youth Ahead and Social Butterfly. I don't think either of those ever really made it out of the Northeast scene, though I think Youth Ahead played the Warped Tour at one point.

That roommate was also huge into Fugazi.

I only half paid attention to whatever he was listening to, I was never hugely into punk. Bad Religion actually kind of caught my attention with a couple of songs, though (they're more melodic than most punk is).

I was wondering how long it would take for someone to bring up Bad Religion. Not exactly "hardcore" but I certainly wouldn't put them under "pop punk" with the likes of Green Day.

Leaning towards more melodic punk without running smack dab into bubblegum shit, you can't go wrong with NOFX, Operation Ivy, the Decendants, or even pushing towards ska the first couple of Mighty Mighty Bosstones albums.

From there you'll end up on Dropkick Murphy's eventually and if you didn't pass obvious stops like the Misfits, Rancid, Social Distortion, Dead Kennedy's, the Ramones, Fugazi, Black Flag, and Sex Pistols you weren't paying attention on the whirlwind punk tour.


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Asking if Bad Religion fits in a punk topic....

One of my favorite albums of all time is Suffer. An absolute classic, and I feel like a worthy introduction into punk music. Its just a fast, concise album but you can actually understand the vocals for the most part and the lyrics use awfully big words, which I have always liked, such as in my favorite part from the song "Delirium of Disorder"

"I am just an atom in an ectoplasmic sea
Without direction or a reason to exist
The anechoic nebula rotating in my brain
Has persuaded me contritely to persist"

Anyways, Fugazi is another good band. They have a lot of good songs. What I like about them is how they perfected the art of being super heavy and then super slow and smooth. Two examples are "Shut the Door" and "Reclamation"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WHAnkJFOMs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILZ-Jn-GIgQ

I would be curious to know which vocalist you didn't like, Crusher. I actually find it kinda interesting how Fugazi itself is a punk supergroup, though it organically formed that way.

Not to discredit the histories of Joe Lally or Brendan Canty, but the vocalists Ian Mackaye and Guy Piciotto were in two hugely influential bands prior.

Ian Mackaye was in several bands, most notably the DC area hardcore group Minor Threat as referenced above. This band was super loud and fast, and the lyrics always hit hard, with very personal observations about the world around them. This band also started the "straight edge" movement with their song of the same name. Now, they didn't intend for this but it happened, but I find it super cool. They had a lot of songs with messages critical of alcohol; fugazi never did interviews in magazines with alcohol advertisements as well. The song "In my Eyes" has lyrics that do cut deep as fuck

"You tell me you like the taste
You just need an excuse
You tell me it calms your nerves
You just think it looks cool
You tell me you want to be different
You just change for the same
You tell me it's only natural
You just need the proof
Did you fucking get it?
It's in my eyes
And it doesn't look that way to me
In my eyes
And it doesn't look that way to me
In my eyes
You tell me that nothing matters
You're just fucking scared
You tell me that I'm better
You just hate yourself
You tell me that you like her
You just wish you did
You tell me that I make no difference
Well at least I'm fucking trying
What the fuck have you done?
It's in my eyes
And it doesn't look that way to me
In my eyes
And it doesn't look that way to me
In my eyes"

Ian's vocal delivery is very shouty and not really refined, though you can kind of understand him. It's not my favorite, but it's more then adequate given the circumstances.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsAu-nOg3Tw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2jEHyhBXe8

The other vocalist, Guy Piciotto has a different history within the DC scene. So, a fact about the DC scene is that it is where the term "emo" ultimately comes from. It started out as "Emotional Hardcore" which began in washington DC around 1985. Around this time the scene grew weary of straight up hardcore because of the violent nature of it(Not sure if this is what it was, but I am speculating. By violent I mean like people getting hurt at shows, and the general nature of agressive and fast music). Guy was in what is often credited as the first emotional hardcore band, Rites of Spring. Ian Mackaye was also in Embrace which had a similarly more emotional style. Guy didn't like the emotional hardcore label, because he didn't feel his particular vocal delivery was any more emotional than anybody else, it was just his particular way of expressing himself. But when you write lyrics like "If I started crying, yeah would you start crying" called " "theme(If I started Crying)" and you sound like you want to die...what do you want us to say? Guy's vocal delivery definitely sounds like he wants to die, the kind of screaming that just sounds in a way like it stabs your heart. His vocal delivery style is one of the defining traits of emo music.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q0tp-Go5IKE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ra5y1SwQIb8

Between the two of them, this remains my favorite all time vocal performance, for one part in particular.

Listen to Guy on the Fugazi song "Full Disclosure" off of their last studio album, The Argument. The part from 2:25 onward. But just listen to the whole song, though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VzCwXbakHQ0

argonautweakend posted...

Asking if Bad Religion fits in a punk topic....

One of my favorite albums of all time is Suffer. An absolute classic, and I feel like a worthy introduction into punk music. Its just a fast, concise album but you can actually understand the vocals for the most part and the lyrics use awfully big words, which I have always liked, such as in my favorite part from the song "Delirium of Disorder"

Its a tough call, but I'd probably start a newbie on Against the Grain first, but that's always been my go-to BR album. Pretty sure it was the one that came right after Suffer, so it's hardly a tonal whiplash either way. Both very solid albums.

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Black_Crusher posted...

Any love for Dead Kennedys? Too Drunk to f*** is pretty hilarious as is Let's Kill the Landlord man lol.

I love DK, and was reminded of this Faith No More cover:

https://youtu.be/xZ3ig3goNrI

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@argonautweakend

It's Ian I like, just had to double check to be sure haha.

Nornally a band like Midnight Oil wouldn't belong in a thread like this however they had a great period in the early 80s where they were a full-on energy assault. Specifically, this clip I keep coming back to:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LogqbxpCFcc

That guitar sound is SICK.

i still love this band but this era is long gone now.

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Far-Queue posted...

I love DK, and was reminded of this Faith No More cover:

https://youtu.be/xZ3ig3goNrI

Haha that's great but it sounds like the damn Doors or something lol

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https://youtu.be/SGJFWirQ3ks

I'll always love this track for the intentionally absent missing hi hat smash in the intro as a bass player.

By not hitting an instrument at the exact perfect time, this track ascends to a wholly different level by the absence of an instrument.

Total mindfuck. +1

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Even better version...

https://youtu.be/S0el25cdCnE

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WhiskeyDisk posted...

https://youtu.be/SGJFWirQ3ks

I'll always love this track for the intentionally absent missing hi hat smash in the intro as a bass player.

By not hitting an instrument at the exact perfect time, this track ascends to a wholly different level by the absence of an instrument.

Total mindfuck. +1

It's true that knowing when not to play is just as important as knowing when to play.

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Black_Crusher posted...

It's true that knowing when not to play is just as important as knowing when to play.

I also idolize Trent Reznor and Maynard James Keenan who never saw an instrument or gritty mechanical sound they didn't cream themselves over...

But in this particular case the conspicuously absent percussion on that beat was brilliant on a CAKE bass level.

If your brain isn't asking what's missing on that measure or mentally filling in a double stack hi hat or cowbell, your smooth brain is never going to catch up to this conversation. There's only three sounds on earth that fill that spot. Two are brass percussion and one is silence and Fugaz's drummer went with silence and It's smarter than most punk bands deserve musically. It's something I'm always going to consider a musician's in-joke because it's going to go over the head of 90% of the audience if it isn't explained to them.

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When you're listening to Tool, just remember that they're not like other bands. Their music is incredibly artistic, almost to the point where you have to be paying complete attention to them to even remotely understand them. I remember listening to a song on Lateralus (though I can't remember what it was), where I thought a song was absolute bollocks during the listen. Then, I closed my eyes for a second, and all of a sudden the song had an entirely new meaning. It was insane the way Tool could just become something so different when you take a look into the music.

Another thing you should note about Tool is that it's easy to get a headache listening to them. Not because they're a bad band, but because of how many ideas their music is riddled with and how complex they are. Soon enough your head will fill to the brim and the rest will just sound like noise to you. Just turn it off and give it a listen the next day.

If you don't like the music, you'll definitely at least enjoy reading through the lyrics, and picking apart the song itself and all of the artistic values that go into making it the complexity that it is.

LB1 posted...

When you're listening to Tool, just remember that they're not like other bands. Their music is incredibly artistic, almost to the point where you have to be paying complete attention to them to even remotely understand them. I remember listening to a song on Lateralus (though I can't remember what it was), where I thought a song was absolute bollocks during the listen. Then, I closed my eyes for a second, and all of a sudden the song had an entirely new meaning. It was insane the way Tool could just become something so different when you take a look into the music.

Another thing you should note about Tool is that it's easy to get a headache listening to them. Not because they're a bad band, but because of how many ideas their music is riddled with and how complex they are. Soon enough your head will fill to the brim and the rest will just sound like noise to you. Just turn it off and give it a listen the next day.

If you don't like the music, you'll definitely at least enjoy reading through the lyrics, and picking apart the song itself and all of the artistic values that go into making it the complexity that it is.

I've seen Tool live in a fairly small venue. They're on a whole 'nother level. I still hear new things on nima almost 20 years later.

Funny thing is, I ended up at Tool via Tea Party and Morphine...

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The Screamers - 122 Hours of Fear

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MdCRcrgX080

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LB1 posted...

When you're listening to Tool, just remember that they're not like other bands. Their music is incredibly artistic, almost to the point where you have to be paying complete attention to them to even remotely understand them. I remember listening to a song on Lateralus (though I can't remember what it was), where I thought a song was absolute bollocks during the listen. Then, I closed my eyes for a second, and all of a sudden the song had an entirely new meaning. It was insane the way Tool could just become something so different when you take a look into the music.

Another thing you should note about Tool is that it's easy to get a headache listening to them. Not because they're a bad band, but because of how many ideas their music is riddled with and how complex they are. Soon enough your head will fill to the brim and the rest will just sound like noise to you. Just turn it off and give it a listen the next day.

If you don't like the music, you'll definitely at least enjoy reading through the lyrics, and picking apart the song itself and all of the artistic values that go into making it the complexity that it is.

Somehow I've always found 'slipping into' their music really easy and never encountered any headaches. That's weird.

My only guess is that I must be so braindead it can't fill my head to the brim.

(Or anxiety and overthinking being my natural state? Maybe that's it idk.)

The only way I have to calm is to fill my brain with thoughts I want. Or dissociate. Haven't found anything else that works. I create the most ridiculous scenarios in my head near constantly.

LB1 posted...

When you're listening to Tool, just remember that they're not like other bands. Their music is incredibly artistic, almost to the point where you have to be paying complete attention to them to even remotely understand them. I remember listening to a song on Lateralus (though I can't remember what it was), where I thought a song was absolute bollocks during the listen. Then, I closed my eyes for a second, and all of a sudden the song had an entirely new meaning. It was insane the way Tool could just become something so different when you take a look into the music.

Another thing you should note about Tool is that it's easy to get a headache listening to them. Not because they're a bad band, but because of how many ideas their music is riddled with and how complex they are. Soon enough your head will fill to the brim and the rest will just sound like noise to you. Just turn it off and give it a listen the next day.

If you don't like the music, you'll definitely at least enjoy reading through the lyrics, and picking apart the song itself and all of the artistic values that go into making it the complexity that it is.

lmao haven't seen this in a while

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Punk, and especially hardcore punk is one of those things I have a lot of near misses with. Like I have some Jello Biafra, but it's the country/western album he cut with Mojo Nixon (P.S. it's awesome). Metal has a lot of cross pollination: I'm more familiar with Danzig as a metal artist. I listen to Psychobilly which is punk's weird cousin. You get the idea.

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His Hero Is Gone was another amazing hardcore/crust punk band.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdGE8fFtmwc

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Good to see this thread kind of organically taking off. When I get some more time I will actually provide feedback for some of these posts with videos/recs and post more from my own brain.

Right now I am listening to "Tim" by the Replacements. My favorite album of theirs, and I swear it's not just because my name, and my dad's name, is Tim. They weren't totally underground, signed to a major label at one point(which Tim was recorded under), but this is a band that crafted hard rockin' songs so well its almost a shame they weren't HUGE.

Anyways, one of the best "fuck you, we don't wanna make one" music videos ever made, for the song Bastards of Young.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fl9KQ1Mub6Q

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QO0pw6MCxBU

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