Board 8 > Politics Containment Topic 301: Home of Antifa Leadership

(+) Yeah! (+)

SuperNiceDog posted...

BT is right, the protestors are not organized and do not have a legitimate plan to solve racism in the USA. Because there is no solution, the protestors are in the wrong. Their plan is to "raise awareness" but no one knows how or if that can be measured.

where do you get these ideas? Their goal isnt solving racism, its police reform and justice for people murdered by police.
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SuperNiceDog posted...

BT is right, the protestors are not organized and do not have a legitimate plan to solve racism in the USA. Because there is no solution, the protestors are in the wrong. Their plan is to "raise awareness" but no one knows how or if that can be measured.

Kids, you tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is, never try.

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oh wow the photo-op he gassed peaceful protestors and medics for was made into a dumb video too

https://twitter.com/WhiteHouse/status/1267676026391404544

like... even as a photo-op and for video propaganda it's....... so incredibly weak. for the photos we just got that bizarre grump Trump holding up the bible like he's never known of a book before, and in video form it just sums up the stupidity of walking across the street [brutalizing peaceful protestors out of the way first], holding the bible awkwardly, then walking back as the blatant photo-op it was

meanwhile pissing off the church itself, with the bishop openly condemning his actions and the whole clergy opening up about what went on ( https://twitter.com/jackmjenkins/status/1267644542762864641 )

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SuperNiceDog posted...

Why was this issue basically forgotten about on May 24, the day before George Floyd's death? Where was the awareness/activism on this issue before Floyd died? Between 2017- May 24 2020 there was little to no discussion on the topic.

Of all the takes in the past three topics, this is the most mindblowing one of all.

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Grimlyn posted...

oh wow the photo-op he gassed peaceful protestors and medics for was made into a dumb video too

https://twitter.com/WhiteHouse/status/1267676026391404544

like... even as a photo-op and for video propaganda it's....... so incredibly weak. for the photos we just got that bizarre grump Trump holding up the bible like he's never known of a book before, and in video form it just sums up the stupidity of walking across the street [brutalizing peaceful protestors out of the way first], holding the bible awkwardly, then walking back as the blatant photo-op it was

meanwhile pissing off the church itself, with the bishop openly condemning his actions and the whole clergy opening up about what went on ( https://twitter.com/jackmjenkins/status/1267644542762864641 )

If this hadn't been posted by the WH twitter account I would have assumed it was a parody

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It's still a parody. Just not an intentional one.

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BlAcK TuRtLe posted...

https://preview.redd.it/zid292b6d5251.png?auto=webp&s=ca29db486127e43e8f62417810096dee73a04b66

He is a basketball player apparantly, I didn't know his name and had to look it up because lol nba

So, your black basketball player... is a white ex-ESPN sports reporter.

But you know.

I'm sure BT assumed he was a rich black hypocrite out of good faith.

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I have to say that you are woefully misinformed if you think a peaceful protest has ever worked. Every single peaceful protest youve ever heard about only worked because there was another element invoked that the powers thats be feared more. If they werent scared of Malcom X they would have never listened to the less extreme one. Yes, even Ghandi didnt work, he was jailed over and over for years till Muhammad Ali Jinnah showed and then they got scared and then all of a sudden they wanted to listen to what Ghandi has to say. MLKs peaceful protests were still met with beatings, vicious dogs, tear gas. A peaceful protest working is the lie they reinforce in our schools so you will keep doing it and wonder why it isnt working. Obviously because you arent peaceful protesting hard enough.

I disagree with that, peaceful protest certainly works, it just takes a lot longer. This isn't an argument against violence by the way, just saying.

But anyway, I said this in another topic, but the global community really needs to come down on America for this, and they need to treat it the way that apartheid was treated. America has been allowed to get away with deliberate systematic racism and atrocities for ages just because "hurr economy big". If it was any other country it would have had a far harsher international response, but because it's America it can just allow the police to mass murder civilians and face minimal consequences.

Let's put it in non-specific terms. There is a country which is governed by a far-right politician elected under suspicious conditions where members of an ethnic group are regularly persecuted and murdered by the police (in addition to countless other extrajudiciary killings) that is now seeing widespread violence committed by the police and the leader is actively encouraging this and teargassing peaceful protesters for photo-ops. Think about the way this would be treated in any other country on earth.

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In my opinion, the most achievable goal of peaceful protest is to convince the masses of feckless idiots that you're on the right side of history when you eventually get met with violence

Also, this whole "People are only okay with this until it affects them then they change their tune" is just false. I'm sure that's true for some, even many, people. But we have tons of concrete examples of people affected by this who have not only maintained their support for the protests but made a point to raise their voices in support even more after.

https://washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/05/31/my-familys-restaurant-caught-fire-protests-let-it-burn-oppressive-systems-with-it/

A man had his family's restaurant burned down in Minneapolis but when his daughter (the author of the op-ed, who admits her initial reaction was anger) checked on him she says she overhears him say, "Let my building burn. Justice needs to be served."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/religion/bishop-budde-trump-church/2020/06/01/20ca70f8-a466-11ea-b619-3f9133bbb482_story.html

The church Trump used for his photo-op? A fire had been set in its basement amid the protests on Sunday. What were they doing Monday morning (literally earlier in the day before Trump decided to show up?) handing out water bottles and granola bars to the protestors.

Again, sure not everyone are going to have the view of these people, but it's been coming off to me that some in the topic are acting like it's some immutable truth that anyone affected by the property damage just flips a switch and becomes anti-protest and that's just not true.

In an ideal world there'd be no violent aspect to these protests but we're pretty damn far from an ideal world right now (in an ideal world the protests wouldn't be necessary because these things wouldn't keep happening!) and the situation keeps being escalated and it's doing people a disservice to think that some of them can't see that and understand even when it is their lives being affected.

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Paratroopa1 posted...

In my opinion, the most achievable goal of peaceful protest is to convince the masses of feckless idiots that you're on the right side of history when you eventually get met with violence

This is a pretty good way of putting it. I thought of the Peterloo massacre, in which the initial response was actually much harsher restrictions on freedoms, but ultimately it led to a mass changing of public opinion that eventually resulted in more modern democracy in the UK (it also directly led to the founding of The Guardian). Unfortunately, in modern democracies governments seem to have realised that you can just ignore peaceful protests. With that said, the current US government is not nearly sly enough to do that.

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My favorite part of the trump photo op is that, when a reporter asked him an easy layup question of "Is that your bible?", he responded with "it's a bible."

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Peace___Frog posted...

My favorite part of the trump photo op is that, when a reporter asked him an easy layup question of "Is that your bible?", he responded with "it's a bible."

Of all of the things to actually tell the truth about!

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For something a bit more lighthearted...

https://twitter.com/Timodc/status/1267544279783583745

Lewandowski is basically the toilet from this legendary Better Call Saul scene

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MelewF3DLo0

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Prefacing this by saying it's secondhand info from a coworker and I don't have sources for it myself offhand (though I was shown a video from the local ABC affiliate that backs at least some of this up, specifically the fact that the protesters were nonviolent) but I just learned that Dallas PD essentially took a group of peaceful protesters, led them to a shut-down bridge, then trapped them on it and tried to arrest them all for being on the bridge. Apparently complete with tear gas/pepper spray/rubber bullets.

The local DA is refusing to charge any of them, which is good. The vast majority of them appear to have been released, which is also good.

But what the fuck DPD, that department used to be better than this.

(ABC video: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Xnnl8sonB8U relevant part starts around the 2h mark. Curfews are mentioned, but this bridge is outside the curfew zone)

Reading an article from an NBC Dallas-Fort Worth affiliate they make it seem like the protestors were marching outside the curfew zone, went to the bridge as part of their march, the police showed up at the end they were marching towards to block them from completing their crossing, then a second line of police came up from behind them to essentially trap them on the bridge and yeah opened with tear gas, etc.

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https://twitter.com/garfieldeatsapp/status/1267827167963934732?s=21

How do you even unpack this
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My first thought was does this mean Garfield thinks black people, and only black people, don't eat lasagna?

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Jakyl25 posted...

How do you even unpack this

By first recognizing that they're clogging up the hashtag that people use for actual activism (if you're doing the blackout, please use that tag without the BLM), and then secondly realizing that a lot of companies are trying to get off easy by doing something stupidly simple without even thinking it through.

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wow.
Cuomo just shit on de blasio and the nypd, threatened to displace him, and said they failed last night due to the rampant looting.

shouldn't have gone after Macy's and all the other places in Herald Square.

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Speaking of De Balasio, did he... do anything about his own daughter getting doxxed?

Or is she learning how "brave" he really is?

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The Trump announcement yesterday had me so shook up that I had to take a 30 minute pause during work to go take a shower to cool down.

Seeing the reaction on the state level mostly be "uhhh yeah he can't do that, we ain't doing that shit" has been at least a bit cooling.

https://twitter.com/suckmyunicornD/status/1267767217392934917?s=19

Thread. Man sheltering protestor's got his home tear gassed because cops claimed his house was being invaded. He tired to tell them it had not been and they pinned him against the wall of his home. Thankfully looks likes it's been resolved.

It was being invaded.

(By them)

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Reminder that the US has a far-right leader in a colossal global role because of a system that both gives an inordinate amount of power to one person and an electoral system that effectively disenfranchises a large majority of the electorate.

I'd say I was surprised it took so long, but he's probably not the worst president on a historical level, so perhaps it is surprising that it took people this long to notice. The office of president shouldn't be this way, and it certainly shouldn't be elected that way.

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True! As I've been saying all along, the police are the rioters and looters, and that's how history is gonna see it.

Lightning Strikes posted...

but he's probably not the worst president on a historical level

I mean, at this point... who ya got?

Buchanan? W? Reagan?

Because I think I'm willing to say Trump is the worst president at this point.

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https://twitter.com/RepKarenBass/status/1267665611200610307?s=19

xp1337 posted...

I mean, at this point... who ya got?

Buchanan? W? Reagan?

Because I think I'm willing to say Trump is the worst president at this point.

I mean...

How are we judging Harrison here?

xp1337 posted...

I mean, at this point... who ya got?

Buchanan? W? Reagan?

Because I think I'm willing to say Trump is the worst president at this point.

Buchanan probably

Trump is really trying though
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UshiromiyaEva posted...

How are we judging Harrison here?

DNP (Illness)

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If only Trump could be more like William Henry Harrison
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is anyone even talking about the upcoming election right now... crazy that few people are. Riots are starting to die down a little so maybe they'll start discussing it

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Hey can you fuck off.

SuperNiceDog posted...

is anyone even talking about the upcoming election right now... crazy that few people are. Riots are starting to die down a little so maybe they'll start discussing it

bold of you to assume there will be elections

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xp1337 posted...

I mean, at this point... who ya got?

Buchanan? W? Reagan?

Because I think I'm willing to say Trump is the worst president at this point.

The three you mention, plus definitely Johnson and possibly Nixon. Don't get me wrong, Trump is trying his best here, or perhaps worst would be more fitting.

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SuperNiceDog posted...

is anyone even talking about the upcoming election right now... crazy that few people are.

Good point, the election is only 5 months away. If we don't start talking about it right now, we won't have any time left to figure things out.
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Lightning Strikes posted...

The three you mention, plus definitely Johnson and possibly Nixon. Don't get me wrong, Trump is trying his best here, or perhaps worst would be more fitting.

You mean Andrew Johnson, not LBJ, right?
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Lightning Strikes posted...

Reminder that the US has a far-right leader in a colossal global role because of a system that both gives an inordinate amount of power to one person and an electoral system that effectively disenfranchises a large majority of the electorate.

I'd say I was surprised it took so long, but he's probably not the worst president on a historical level, so perhaps it is surprising that it took people this long to notice. The office of president shouldn't be this way, and it certainly shouldn't be elected that way.

You know the song Rule Britannia? The writers understood geopolitics very well:

When Britain first at Heaven's command
Arose from out the azure main
This was the charter, the charter of the land
And guardian angels sang this strain:

Rule Britannia, Britannia rule the waves
Britons never shall be slaves

Britain, the US, Rome, Mongolia, or any other great empire can get away with things other countries cannot. Because they have power. The writer of that song understood. Freedom is not the product of justice, fairness, righteousness. Freedom is won through power and it is in short supply in the world as only the few can wield power at any time.

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Correct, Andrew Johnson.

History will also not be kind to Andrew Jackson due to various atrocities.

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red sox 777 posted...

You know the song Rule Britannia? The writers understood geopolitics very well:

When Britain first at Heaven's command
Arose from out the azure main
This was the charter, the charter of the land
And guardian angels sang this strain:

Rule Britannia, Britannia rule the waves
Britons never shall be slaves

Britain, the US, Rome, Mongolia, or any other great empire can get away with things other countries cannot. Because they have power. The writer of that song understood. Freedom is not the product of justice, fairness, righteousness. Freedom is won through power and it is in short supply in the world as only the few can wield power at any time.

Britain didn't get away with it though. The end result was WW1 (and WW2 as a direct consequence), and the violent collapse of the empire. This isn't unique to Britain, basically every major European power had a bloody reckoning in the same time period, France, Germany, Russia, the Ottomans. And hey, I am originally from Britain and live in a country that both has extremely close ties with Britain now but also came out of that violent collapse, and let me tell you - they haven't forgotten or let Britain get away with it.

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Lightning Strikes posted...

Britain didn't get away with it though. The end result was WW1 (and WW2 as a direct consequence), and the violent collapse of the empire. This isn't unique to Britain, basically every major European power had a bloody reckoning in the same time period, France, Germany, Russia, the Ottomans. And hey, I am originally from Britain and live in a country that both has extremely close ties with Britain now but also came out of that violent collapse, and let me tell you - they haven't forgotten or let Britain get away with it.

Every empire eventually falls. Power - and freedom - are both fleeting. That's the message of the song as well - the implication is that Britain will be free only so long as she rules the waves. I think in practice, great empires tend to be treated better by their conquerors than they treated the conquered. Attila did not, for instance, tear down Rome stone by stone and sow its fields with salt. Perhaps it's because exceptional cruelty and thirst for power is one of the things that makes you into a great empire in the first place.

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Okay.

Colonial Britain sucked. It was a brutal capitalist dictatorship that valued property more than people. It certainly wasn't free, and the regular citizens did not enjoy the freedoms that the upper class did. The actual freedoms and quality or life Britons enjoy came out of reformists who fought against that system.

There are various surveys showing that what Britons are most proud of is nothing to do with that period, but is the NHS, which was a direct product of moving past that period of history. The NHS, the welfare state, public services and a high level of education came about as a result of the same Labour government that really began dismantling the empire, and rightly so. That is what makes Britain great (in some ways), nothing to do with having some big guns 150 years ago.

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https://twitter.com/hasanthehun/status/1267258306508152834?s=19

https://twitter.com/liveinochi/status/1267504585926557696?s=09

NYPD officers have started covering up their badge numbers.

they haven't just started now, and it ain't just NYPD!

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This one's a big oomph, cops assisting landlord and her daughter with fake tagging their own building to blame on protestors.

https://twitter.com/_bea96/status/1267647163598659585?s=19

It is so weird watching this topic unfold with news stories in slow motion.

Interesting things I saw throughout this.

1. Tons of looting being done. Looters using protesters as shields basically just a block from cops to loot. This has been seen pretty prevalently on Washington DC and New York live streams that aren't at the main events.

2. A very large number of protestors have tried to stop looting and rioting. Saying this is not out message. This is commendable. Unfortunately, while it has worked in some places, it hasn't been successful in many.

3. The African-American man was shot in Omaha and the bar owner released without charges.

4. I have seen a few films of beating people with weapons and such. Most clips of these justify it with saying they were called slurs (this is relevant to 3 also). However, I cannot hear slurs on any of them. The DA said there was none on the shooting in 3 and the witnesses from protestors and his side all agreed there was none. Thus, it is questionable if this is being used as a justification for crime after the fact.

5. There have been multiple doctored videos up showing that police are doing the damage to property and blaming it on protestors. All of these so far have been doctored or misunderstood. The main one was a video of police smashing out their windshield in Boston. Video was cut off to show protestors smashing the windshield. Cops were trying to knock it out completely to make to driveable.

6. Many of the instigators and people trying to instigate have been white. The livestreamer in one scenario asked the African-Americans to flip a truck. The protestors chased him off after asking if he was seriously. We have videos of people handing out bricks to African-American protestors and reports of firebombs trying to be handed out. These are generally seem to come from white people.

7. We have the molotov cocktails on police and a police station. Largely unreported.

8. We have the burning of the courthouse in Memphis which seems to have been done by a likely white supremacist taking advantage of the situation.

9. We have a ton of people getting weird with filming because they don't want their faces on film when they are looting.

10. Many livestreamers are doing what they are doing to get clicks and subscribers and not for any other reason. The Zack and Matt stream in DC, the streamer called an African-American woman a bitch when she asked him to stop filming us. He was seconds from being beat on the streets before a protestor stopped the mob. Then the streamer decided to go home and immediately thought African-Americans walking behind him meant he was being followed. He questioned the movement and it's wanting of allies after the situation.

11. The Atlanta streamer was putting out chants of support. Then when it came to being out after curfew and those around her getting arrested said she had nothing to do with the protests and was filming for historical documentation. She was surprised when arrested for breaking curfew.

12. The al.com and other media that got mugged and robbed on the streets in the center of protests for no reason. Another unsuccessful attempt by some protestors to stop the violence.

13. People said on Saturday night that police instigated the violence in DC. This is uncategorically false as the church across the street was already burning as well as another property before their push.

14. In Portland, the African-American organizer stated that the Coronavirus was a hoax and just another means to try and control them as he led the crowd at the courthouse.

15. The police have had many incidences of losing cool and lashing out in rage. This is likely someone who shouldn't be working in law enforcement and is the kind of person that crimes in the job come from.

16. A police officer and another detained a white protestor. The police officer had his knee on the protestors neck the same as the way against Floyd. Two people in the crowd pleaded to remove the knee. The cop ignored them. Eventually after about 30 seconds of pleading by the crowd, the other cop assisting forcibly lifted the cops knee and moved it to his back off his neck.

17. We have cops and military police who have kneeled in support and been harassed by surrounding cops. Other areas where this was acceptable but they still did their job as told to.

18. We had a white cop push an African-American woman behind him kneeling on the ground to the ground. An African-American cop verbally berated him for his action.

19. We had 5 cops detain an African-American protestor. He played nice until they dropped their guard and then ran away. 5 cops let someone under arrest get away.

20. We can see someone organized is dropping off water crates and milk crates to combat tear gas in protests. In New York, we have examples of cops zeroing in on these shipments and destroying them.

21. We have a video of cops detaining an African-American man supposedly who is FBI during the protests. The supposed FBI man berates cops as dumbasses the whole time. Video is real but fakely doctored. From 2018 and was a mistaken identity case. Man arrested was not in the FBI.

22. We have multiple cases of gas filled bottles being found across neighborhoods around bushes and houses.

23. The man who drove a truck into the crowd was deemed to likely be accidental. The truck clearly purposely drives into the crowd. However he stops when the crowd doesn't fully disperse. The man was beaten severely by video, and it looked like there was intent at some point to throw him off the freeway. Protestors stopped the violence there and he was arrested. There are text messages that many are saying he did it deliberately. However, the text messages clearly show him joking about not getting out of the delivery area alive due to the protests. Not intent to drive through any.

24. In Philadelphia people literally parked their cars in streets to run in to loot stores. A man documented a shoe store getting robbed. One lady laughed about it when he asked her a question about it. She then later returns 2 minutes later to loot more. This is during broad daylight.

25. A man in Alabama wanted to burn down a power station. The media crew was able to talk him out of it before he went through with it.


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