Board 8 > oh hell yeah ffvii is on switch (playthrough?)

(+) Yeah! (+)

I love contest season

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I can deal with those features...!

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davidponte posted...

I love contest season

was thinking this!
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Played for a few uninterrupted hours last night.

Almost immediately out of the save point inside Mt. Gaea, I run into one of those Nibelheim hooded figures... who yells out, dies, and immediately drops us with a boss fight against a two-headed dragon. This guy's pretty tough; Red XIII is using Cure on probably a solid majority of his turns, and Vincent's transformation winds up healing one of the heads sometimes (since I guess one is fire and the other is ice; the ice guy heals Cloud a bunch due to Aurora Armlet). When he dies, he does an annoying self-destruct which is as powerful as any attack he did when alive. Great. Later, a random encounter bomb actually kills Cloud; he showed up in a pair, but the second was more easily dispatched.

The ensuing scene is again really fun to watch from a cinematic perspective - having reached the summit, we peer over it and into a massive crater, the scar on the earth that the previous meteor left. (I'm not sure if the game has confirmed this yet, but it now seems clear that Jenova came from that meteor, and it's what corrupted the Cetra.) It takes us a while to descend it, and in the meantime we see that Rufus, Hojo, and co. have come in their massive air carrier as well. They're drooling over the giant hunk of materia... and realizing that inside it is a massive, mystical beast known as Weapon. In our party, we see more of the insane hooded people who seek this "reunion" as we twist into the Whirlwind Maze.

At the end of it, we anticipate seeing Sephiroth, so Tifa hops in because it's PERSONAL. I pair her with Yuffie, the lowest-leveled character on the roster. I keep thinkign Cloud will be wrong, but we do indeed see Sephiroth again, who laughs and says something about no longer needing this body. The voices in Cloud's head resound, and Cloud hints that he's beginning to understand what's going on. Sephiroth will be there, despite teleporting and having us question things... Without further ado, Sephiroth bounces and leaves us with another Jenova fight: Jenova-DEATH. We give it the smackdown (it's satisfying to have something with a lot of HP to sink a Meteorain into...) and Cloud explains that everywhere Sephiroth goes, he's leaving Jenova cells... and in fact that Sephiroth's "bodies" have all been Jenova cells. We pick up the Black Materia. (Why would Sephiroth drop this...?)

We're then given a choice to whom to hand the Black Materia. Red XIII notably appears. Since we know he's scared of turning insane, I hand it to him, because that seems most entertaining.

We give chase to Sephiroth, and indeed we find yet another iteration of him. This time we get some more color: some major hallucinations, as we revisit Nibelheim five years ago... but with a black-haired SOLDIER instead of Cloud. (His name hasn't been stated, but thanks to B8 cultural osmosis, I know it to be Zack, who I'll always have a soft spot for, for turning the board into ZackFAQs for 24 glorious hours.) Tifa clearly knows something's up, but is withholding - indeed, Zack is the one in that photo with Tifa and Sephiroth, not Cloud. (Also, Zack appears taller than Cloud; he towers over Tifa and is not as noticeably short compared to Sephiroth.) Tifa keeps pleading Cloud not to think about it. (LOL.)

Poor Nanaki then gets duped by some version of Sephiroth into bringing the Black Materia over to Cloud. It's hilarious how bad of an idea this is; they explicitly gave him the BM so Cloud wouldn't have to hold it. WELP.

The illusions stop, and our party and Red XIII are all surrounded by Shinra's party (including Heidegger and Scarlet, who dislikes Tifa). There's some sniping at one another, but the bottom line is that we learn why Sephiroth puppets Cloud: Cloud is a Sephiroth clone, but a failed experiment by Hojo. Sephiroth did die five years ago (presumably he and Zack killed each other in that duel?) and therefore Cloud was only created then, implanted with false memories. Tifa also fills in some gaps; apparently Cloud is real, and the memories with Tifa are real... but Zack is definitely the Nibelheim one. This seems to confirm that Sephiroth also wasn't "born" five years ago, but rather it's when his clones were "born."

Now it's clear that Sephiroth's clones are made with Jenova cells. But even five years ago, Sephiroth was convinced that Jenova was his mom. So the original dude must have had Jenova cells in him, too... right...? We also see that "reunion," in fact, means Sephiroth's cells/clones reuniting and reforming his body. In other words, aside from the past, none of the screen Sephiroths have been the O.G... the O.G. himself opens his eyes in the frozen materia. Maybe that version will be cooler! Again, the physical presence is super-badass, but to be fair, he has yet to do anything!

Unsurprisingly, Cloud flips and gives Sephiroth the BM. (There's an amusing Spider-Man perspective as he chills from the ceiling, hanging upside-down.) Then things go straight to hell as Weapon bursts out of its materia cage, and people flee with Shinra...

We wake up as Tifa/Barret. She's been KO'd for a week, and during that time, Weapon has been terrorizing the world. We're in Shinra's captivity, and the moment Tifa wakes up, we're being sent for exeuction. The cynicism here toward leadership and the masses is amusing and now depressingly relevant. Cait Sith, having infiltrated the grunts, helps Barret out, but we're unable to rescue Tifa from poison gas. Yuffie joins Barret/Cait Sith on a sprint out onto the helipad at the top of the complex. (I really liked that we finally got to revisit this area; when Cloud infiltrated Shinra before we were able to go here, but it was plot-irrelevant - it's awesome that it's making a return! Chekov's hangar!)

During a breathtaking assault from Weapon - love the panning shots and watching the massive cannon fire directly into Weapon - Tifa has to play a dumb minigame to break out. Since it's all hands on deck for Shinra, we don't have to fight anyone... except for Scarlet. This "rivalry" feels like utter bullshit; they've never even met face to face prior to this latest segment. The fight is literally a slapfight (and hey, I win it), and then we're spirited off onto the airship.

The airship is a true staple of the FF series! I like the remixed world map theme. Apparently these guys literally just defected from Shinra because they disliked Rufus and Heidegger, and they respect Cid. So now we got the Highwind, and we're looking for Cloud. It's suggested that Cloud might still be stuck under the ice, or maybe south of the Lifestream? I didn't quite catch everything.

So since then I've flown all around the world. The materia area is impassable, surrounded by an energy barrier, and I can't really

That part of the game is so good. The word "clone" in FFVII doesn't mean the same thing as we think of it, as like an exact duplicate. It just means someone who went through the same process Sephiroth did (being injected with Jenova cells, etc.) in hopes of creating another Sephiroth.

Also, for goodness sake, get the Enemy Skills materia in Chocobo Sage's shack.

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figure!

i did get the materia! how do i use it though...?
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You have to get enemies to use certain skills on you (while you have to equipped, of course) and you learn them. It'll be a little weird since you didn't find one until so late in the game but I can give you a few pointers if you want them.

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Yay, progress GET! Thinking that Chocobos are plot-important, we head to the northern Chocobo area (leading from the City of the Ancients to the neck of the north) and catch one... it uh, does nothing for me. Okay, so scratch that.

We fly around a bunch and in fact do explore the southern isles, and we encounter a town in the woods that seems familiar, but turns out I haven't been to before. Its name is Mideel and they've got a rather cavalier attitude toward the world ending and oh hey they're talking about a Mako-eyed kid with a sword who washed up on the shore a while ago. Indeed, it's Cloud... and he's invalid. His head turns aroudn vaguely and then droops. It's comical to see from a Lego-character-model perspective, but with time, it turns really poignant and hurts. Tifa talks to him and decides to stay. Barret agrees it might be for the best, given that we don't know whether Cloud at this point can be trusted to be anything other than Sephiroth's shadow again.

So what next? The remaining party (Red XIII, Barret, Cait Sith, Yuffie, Vincent, Cid) pile into the airship again, and Barret expresses his frustration: it's only lately that he's learned that being the leader isn't necessarily what he wants. He arbitrarily designates Cid to be the leader. I've controlled Tifa, Barret, and Cid recently. It's bizarre realizing that I hadn't actually seen any of their running animations prior to now (given that like any JRPG other than Chrono Trigger, you only see the protagonist unless there's an event happening). Cid's running animation is absolutely hilarious.

Cait Sith now decides to remind us he's a Shinra spy, and that he has the ability to listen in on Shinra. We witness Rufus/Heidegger/Scarlet discuss HUGE MATERIA. You tell 'em, Heidonald Trump. They've already hit Nibelheim and will target Mount Corel and Fort Condor next.

We head to Corel first, which we vaguely remember as Barret's hometown but which Barret reminds us of (Haven't they been through enough?!), though we actually wind up omitting Barret - Cid/Red XIII/Yuffie for this run. At Mt. Corel, we charge north and back through the train tracks, into the reactor. I love this; just like the previously unused giant helipad, it felt weird that no plot-events happened at this reactor after we'd learned about reactors being so important. Now the Huge Materia is being mined, so we have stuff to do with it! But it's going away on a train, and our only hope is... Cid!

"I'm Cid! Leave it to me!" We're following along thrillingly. Less thrilling is pulling the brakes, which feels pretty lame, but whatever. The "urgent action music" override here is as good as anywhere; I'm reminded very strongly of the mine cart sequence in FFVI as (with a real-time timer ticking down) we charge forth and encounter a series of escalating enemies. We finally halt the cart and obtain the Huge Materia... and Ultima materia. Another FF (lategame) staple, love it!

The people of Corel are grateful for our having stopped the train, and (in writing) I feel a little bad for not bringing Barret to soak up the praise. (Does he get redemption from them?) But they seem a little more inclined to #resist Shinra now. They're even defiant about Meteor! After all, they're miners - they'll just tunnel underground and survive, as they always have. It's a nice thought... This also makes me wonder if there's redemption for Wutai.

Next is Fort Condor. I actually can't remember exactly what Fort Condor is, but my first try is that siege defense tower place... and hey, it's actually correct! I'm absolutely on fire lately. We head in, and it's time to defend our territory again. I won't really recap this battle, but it's fairly expensive (I think I end up spending 10K-20K?) and it's essentially pay-to-win. It's also extremely long; I'm fairly sure I spend over forty minutes in the one battle. Probably should have used turbo-mode and just spent even more money.

Having eviscerated them all, we witness the birth of the giant baby condor atop the fort. It's a beautiful sight, and when we visit it, we're granted Phoenix materia. Haven't thought about it til now, but presumably this will give us the ability to regenerate our life when killed, like Life3? That'd be neat. It also turns out they've already got the Huge Materia - the only reason they really wanted our help was for the condor's sake. I approve!

Having gotten our fill of Huge Materia, we're now tasked with paying Cloud/Tifa a visit. Hey, that's sooner than I'd expected!

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Notes from last update that I missed:

- Yuffie's seasickness on the airship is adorable.

- Forgot to mention it before, but I loved Cid's description of Cloud: "Just when you'd think he was smart, he'd so something to prove himself stupid again... Everything about him from his movements to his speech were kinda odd." You said it man.

- Tifa comments that her cheeks kinda hurt when she gets rescued, due to the slapfight.

- Neo Bahamut and Bahamut were pretty great against Jenova-DEATH! Tifa was a machine.

Notes from this update:

- Cid with the MOP. It has zero materia slots and only a tiny upgrade in offense over the Dragon Lance, but whatever. I actually really like the Lancer archetype in general. I really didn't anticipate liking Cid - he has zero emotional stake in this; he showed up last; he generally is aloof - but his character design is growing on me, and again, I do like that he's the party's spearman (and can hang combat-wise).

- Cid is also the guy who's got the Cover/Counter materia combo, which I adore. Barret was the (short-lived) previous holder of this combo, and before that, Cloud had had it ever since I got them.

- Comet is also great. Expensive, though.

- Pilot-in-training (LV3) has leveled up all the way to LV5 now!

- Why does Scarlet need to dress like a lady of the evening?
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Cid has the best running animation in gaming

You can actually fail to stop the train and the plot will progress

You can also do absolutely nothing at Fort Condor and let the enemy reach the fort, and all you need to do is win a boss fight

Also, yes, Phoenix is super useful

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Leonhart4 posted...

You can actually fail to stop the train and the plot will progress

i'm actually kinda surprised i stopped it; i usually have missed these! and the save point before it is WAY before it, as usual...

Leonhart4 posted...

You can also do absolutely nothing at Fort Condor and let the enemy reach the fort, and all you need to do is win a boss fight

this might have been preferable - i enjoy boss fights...!
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Yeah, you also save a bunch of money!

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well in practice i guess i've gone from 190K to like 170K
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For the record, you can sell a mastered All materia for 1.4 million Gil.

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Im slowly making my way through this thread, as FF7 is probably my favorite single player game of all time. After the first 50 posts, I just wanted to comment on these:

SeabassDebeste posted...

After getting run out by Reno and the Turks (what a fantastic theme song!)

When I first played this game during its initial release, I would just put the controller down and do other things in my room while the Turks theme played. I loved it. This game has fantastic music as a whole.

SeabassDebeste posted...

- Regular battles rarely stretch long enough, but deep into the music it's really great.
- Boss battle music is also energetic and strong, though this boss itself was bland in design. Scorpion-dude was more interesting.

The FF7 battle theme is my favorite across the entire series (followed closely by FF13). I can remember being in high school and this song would just play on a loop inside my head for long stretches. Its a gem.

Im not as high on the FF7 boss battle theme as most people, but its still good. I actually think it picks up a lot after the opening guitar riffs. For what its worth, FF6 has my favorite boss battle theme (again, followed closely by FF13 with Saber's Edge).

SeabassDebeste posted...

In something of an awkward sequence, Red XIII joins us, Aeris is rescued, we have a quick boss battle, and then President Shinra imprisons us. (Shoutout to Tseng and Rude.) That's followed by us getting out immediately. It's really cool the sense of dread from the trails of blood.

I was going to make a comment about how great this game is at building up Sephiroth at key points (blood trails in Shinra Tower, the impaled Zolom, etc), but Rollthebones2 summed it up very nicely, so Ill just repost what he said. It echoes my thoughts:

Rollthebones2 posted...

I have to say that I absolutely love that part of the game - from Shinra tower through the flashback and Zolom - for how effectively it builds up the threat of Sephiroth.

Obviously the iconic fire scene and descent into madness is great, but the way the mechanics of the game build him up as something so far beyond the team. The flashback has him casually killing monsters that Cloud can hardly touch, while the Zolom reveal tells the player that - despite all their work to safely cross the swamp and avoid the Zolom - Sephiroth can make short work of it in a seemingly theatrical fashion.

From the atmosphere when we see the carnage in the tower through to the Zolom reveal, I really can't think of a stretch in any game that builds up its villain the way FF7 does through that part of the game. Nothing is in the present and on screen, and yet the player and every character has been humbled by the sheer power difference.

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Fort Condor is one of my favorite parts of FF7. I can't speak to how effective it was to play by its expected rules versus just fighting the boss at the end, but I always liked its take on the tower defense set-up.

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Speaking of being able to fail the train mission, I learned something new in my last FF7 playthrough last fall, what happens if you fail at Fort Condor. Played the game 30+ times, probably closer to 40 and still learning new things...

I was doing a "only mandatory battles" playthrough, made easier with the No Encounters option (fun fact: whether you get MBarrier in time for a certain boss that uses "Lapis Laser" comes down to whether you get the EXP from the bats in the icicle fights or not. And that boss without MBarrier is not a fun time. Big Guard is of course impossible, obtained from optional battle!)

I always give up on Fort Condor and just do the boss fight since it's easier + you get Imperial Guard armor. This time I lost the boss fight for the first time ever, in the spirit of it not really being mandatory since you can lose without a game over.

Not only do you get booted out of the Fort, and miss your chance to get Phoenix, but they withdraw the rope ladder to climb up there. By losing the boss fight you're apparently prevented from ever re-entering Fort Condor, lol.

MartinFF7 posted...

Speaking of being able to fail the train mission, I learned something new in my last FF7 playthrough last fall, what happens if you fail at Fort Condor. Played the game 30+ times, probably closer to 40 and still learning new things...

I was doing a "only mandatory battles" playthrough, made easier with the No Encounters option (fun fact: whether you get MBarrier in time for a certain boss that uses "Lapis Laser" comes down to whether you get the EXP from the bats in the icicle fights or not. And that boss without MBarrier is not a fun time. Big Guard is of course impossible, obtained from optional battle!)

I always give up on Fort Condor and just do the boss fight since it's easier + you get Imperial Guard armor. This time I lost the boss fight for the first time ever, in the spirit of it not really being mandatory since you can lose without a game over.

Not only do you get booted out of the Fort, and miss your chance to get Phoenix, but they withdraw the rope ladder to climb up there. By losing the boss fight you're apparently prevented from ever re-entering Fort Condor, lol.

What lmao. Its 2020 and I'm still learning new shit about FF7

I only knew that because the Versus Guide mentioned it!

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So, here's Cloud and Tifa. No update. It's a rough sight, but nothing a well-timed earthquake and upsurge of Lifestream splitting apart the village can't cure!

Weapon attacks us in the midst of it all. It's a pretty tough fight! It resists Sense, and Cid gets KO'd. Thankfully, those monster summons and some extremely high-level magic and a few limit breaks do the trick, and Weapon runs off.

Tifa and Cloud, however, fall right into the Lifestream, which seems to allow Tifa to enter Cloud's mind for whatever reason. This is one of those great segments that's also hammy at the same time - we see a comically huge, transparent Lego-Cloud, on his knees, holding his head, moving it around... floating above us. Along with three regularly blocky Clouds with their kiesters parked on different paths. It's hilariously goofy. But it's also incredibly effective episodic storytelling.

We start by visiting Nibelheim-Cloud; we're now aware that Zack is the one who came with Sephiroth. Tifa in particular shares her memory with Sephiroth, which was of a generally cold reception. But we're not ready to progress any further here, so instead we go back to revisit the scene under the stars. Tifa knows this is real, but as she points out, Cloud's memories appear to have been re-formed based on what Tifa has said in the past, so he needs to come up with something other than Tifa's anecdotes to establish his true self.

And that leads us down route three, as we look at what motivated Cloud to join SOLDIER to begin with. It's older - "tender memories... no one can ever know." We find out that Tifa's idealized version of Cloud really is colored by his joining SOLDIER; before that, they weren't that close, and Cloud in fact resented her and popular kids for excluding him. He joined SOLDIER to impress her... and it worked. Toxic masculinity: it results in your kid joining sketchy operations to prove themselves, plus results in mental health issues! I really like the music stoppage they use during this scene before we see kid-Cloud doggedly pursuing Tifa, past the point where all her friends have dropped.

That leads us back to Nibelheim, where we follow Zack and Sephiroth. But Cloud actually is there - he's one of the faceless grunts. Nice! We find out (if we're to believe this) that Cloud took the Buster Sword from Zack and stabbed Sephiroth in the back, then later, impelled, threw Sephiroth to his death with sheer willpower. WELL DAMN SON! We whole now!

The party is reunited at last. I take Tifa with me, for plot loyalty, and tack on Vincent, because Vincent's awesome. Cait Sith provides the next impetus of plot: the location of another Huge Materia. This one is situated in Junon. Now Junon looks vaguely familiar, possibly as a place in the South early, but I have trouble finding it. I do discover a subplot over in the first town out of Midgar, where some guy in an attic talks cryptically of how I can help him with some fetchquests.

But after enough browsing, I stumble into the military town, where I once saved that girl from a mutated giant fish. Aha! I turn the town upside-down in search (and am accosted by Priscilla's demand that Cloud marry her), and revisit the areas in the military base like a dozen times, trying to figure things out. Eventually, after an embarrassingly long time, I stumble into the entrance to the Underwater Reactor and head down.

This next segment is just filled with a striking amount of dialogue from nameless characters, almost all of whom we kill. This is one of the bloodier segments in a JRPG I've played; usually grunts are nameless or non-human or finger-lickin' evil. Cloud, Tifa, and Vincent mow down dozens of troops just for being in the wrong place at the wrong time (and, I guess, for serving the wrong cause). A gal is hanging out in the elevator, and we terrify her by getting into a fight with the submarine crew, who state that the survivor gets to ask her out. When one of them asks "Hey, what if we both--" the other cuts him off of even suggesting the possibility. (It's funny to imagine that he's offended by the idea that both sould live, which is how I first read it.)

Ultimately, after a beautiful aquarium-esque meander underground, we wind up confronting Reno. He's in charge of the Huge Materia in the sub, but we can't get to him because he drops a massive boss on us. We manage to weather his attacks, but then he kills Cloud. As I'm trying to focus on getting him back online, one of its arms grabs Tifa. Huh? And then the other arm grabs Vincent and I'm done. WAIT WHAT. I restart and this time I remember that I didn't use my summons. Bahamut, Neo Bahamut, Cure 3, and Meteorain make short work of them this time.

Unfortunately, the sub gets away from us during this time, we it's time for a sub chase (and sparing three lucky soldiers who just really wanted to do their victory celebration. GREAT callback!) The instructions say we have to "get in front of" the red sub, leading to repeated failures and agonizing timeouts as I search for the sub. Finally, on my fourth try to so (resetting the game each time) I stop trying to get in front and instead just follow the enemy sub and fire repeatedly at it. This works, and I wind up with... er, I thought it was materia? but now I can't find it...

Nonetheless, either way we're summoned to the airport, where welp, we're too late. It's taking off to the Rocket Launch Pad, where we have to put Rude to bed. We discover that the plan is to send the Huge Materia off into space, where it blows up Meteor. Man, Square should sue Michael Bay for Armageddon. Palmer cackles and blasts us off, and I actually stopped playing there so I'll be revisiting Rude the next time I play...

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* Cloud and Yuffie bonding over motion sickness made my day.

* I have to admit it's not always clear to me why we're doing stuff. Sephiroth and Shinra seem to be mostly opposed, and since leaving Midgar, we've basically just been chasing Sephiroth. His goal is some sort of generic omnicide, while Shinra just continues to do what they've always done. But we're opposed to both of them, and "We have to stop Sephiroth's kinda vague plan!" and "We have to stop Shinra, even though we don't know their plan!" seem kinda strange. I guess AVALANCHE is an anti-Shinra, environmentalist cell, so the goal here is to prevent the draining of the Huge Materia?

* I'm now confused when Cloud was treated with Mako and injected with Jenova/Sephiroth cells. It was after this? And did he just willfully delude himself as is implied, or did that treatment completely butcher his memory? It's unclear why Sephiroth/Hojo would want Cloud's true memory wiped, and Cloud definitely expresses why he personally wanted those memories erase

Lifestream Dive is great.

You can go back to find the sub to collect the Huge Materia.

Also, go to the Shinra Mansion basement to get your answer to the question you asked a while ago, as well as the one you just asked.

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Leonhart4 posted...

You can go back to find the sub to collect the Huge Materia.

to jinon's underwater reactor core?

Leonhart4 posted...

Also, go to the Shinra Mansion basement to get your answer to the question you asked a while ago, as well as the one you just asked.

will do next time...! (assuming shinra mansion is nibelheim's)
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No, you'll have to use the sub and go underwater just outside of Junon, and you should be able to find it. Just click on it and you should recover it.

And yes, the mansion in Nibelheim.

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I was waiting for the "grab game over" as soon as I started reading the overview of that part. I didn't remember that the last time I played and when it picked up two characters and it was instant game over it was a serious "What??" moment.

Okay, let's pick up where we left off... Cid was joining our party, we were finishing off Rude, and then we were getting launched into space. Cid says something about sacrificing himself and making a difficult choice, which I don't exactly understand. What choice? In any case, we get the Huge Materia by randomly breaking a lock with four letters; Cid gives a bunch of slightly helpful hints which still leave us with 20+ possibilities. We game-over the first time but succeed the second time (after going through Rude and everyone again).

Then boom! Shera was right - engine 8 was a problem! Cid's pinned, and for a moment I think that the "sacrifice" had to do with the "up to you" part that happened. Instead, Shera appears and everyone arrives home, safe and sound. At this point, everyone kinda talks about how cool space is and decides to pay Bupenhagen a visit. I swap in Red XIII for this and add Barret.

Returning to Cosmo Canyon is great; I still love the music, but we so quickly get to a cutscene that the music doesn't go on for long, and that sucks. Essentially, everyone kinda agrees that we should try to figure out what Aeris's plan was, and Bupenhagen wants to come along. More importantly, we also store the Heavy Materia there. It seemed unwise at first, but I'm pretty sure it's actually safe there and that it's really an excuse to provide a space for interacting with it. There are four Heavy Materia up there (from the train crash, the condor nest, the submarine, and the rocket, presumably), but I can only interact with one - the cold light, which uses my Bahamut and Neo Bahamut, apparently, to synthesize Bahamut Zero. Man, these characters are definitely not gonna be able to afford to cast all these summons.

But I've been lost ever since. I've returned to the Forgotten City and found nothing; I've gone back to Midgar and found a guy saying he needs a buried key; I've gone to Bone Village and excavated (but foudn absolutely nothing); I've gotten the Heavy Materia from the sub (and gotten slaughtered by the monster there); I've been back to Shinra Mansion and relived a flashback that proved that the two escapees were in fact Zack and Cloud (and perhaps this is how Cloud's memories got messed up?) I've gone through the entire snowboarding sequence and up the mountain again, only to find it blocked off. I've gone down to the Lifestream again (Barret hints at Aeris being part of the Lifestream) and found nothing there. I've captured Chocobos (hey, we can keep them at the farm now!).

I'm sure there's still more stuff to try out, but I'm wondering if I missed a very obvious piece of dialogue somewhere...

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- The cutscene of the liftoff is really beautiful.

- "It's got Sephiroth festerin' inside it like a sickness... the planet's like a kid, and it needs someone to protect it." This along with Cid's awesome theme song is vaulting him higher! The speech about the greatness of SCIENCE was enjoyable too, though not experiencing it three times.

- The Learner Pilot has gone from LV8 to LV10 to now LV11!

- I love the running joke about the two easily distracted pilots.
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SeabassDebeste posted...

(and gotten slaughtered by the monster there)

Oh, you found Emerald Weapon! That's another FFVII rite of passage.

Also, there's a certain area in the Forgotten City you need to go in order to trigger the next cutscene, but it's not immediately obvious that you can actually get there.
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Also, if you want to find the key to get back into Midgar, tell the crew you want to find normal items, and the dig crew should eventually point you in the right direction.

It just lets you go back to Sector 6 and Wall Market. There's nothing particularly special there except for Tifa's ultimate weapon.
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LeonhartFour posted...

Also, if you want to find the key to get back into Midgar, tell the crew you want to find normal items, and the dig crew should eventually point you in the right direction.

It just lets you go back to Sector 6 and Wall Market. There's nothing particularly special there except for Tifa's ultimate weapon.

hmm, i tried for both good items and normal items, but was unsuccessful, turning up nothing at all. i don't think i'm that bad at excavating?

LeonhartFour posted...

Oh, you found Emerald Weapon! That's another FFVII rite of passage.

Also, there's a certain area in the Forgotten City you need to go in order to trigger the next cutscene, but it's not immediately obvious that you can actually get there.

it was called something different from that i think!

i'll re-explore that city...
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Well, it's just a random chance of getting it, but it only shows up if you choose normal items. But choose to set all five guys out before you detonate the bomb and they'll turn toward the item to help you locate it if you didn't know that already.

And did you find a sunken ship you can actually go inside and explore? There are some really good items, but the enemies are tough.

Oh right, did you open the treasure chest with the Leviathan Scales in it when you were in the underwater reactor? That's what puts out the flames in the caves in Wutai. You could probably beat the pagoda with Yuffie now, too!

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ah yeah, i think i did get leviathan scales! wutai is definitely somewhere i want to revisit to give yuffie a reason for some burn

i think i did find a cool item, but not the sunken ship. since there are no random encounters, i might do a lot of sub exploration after going further in the plot/doing other minor sidequests
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There aren't many uses for the sub. Just finding the red sub you sank, the sunken ship, Emerald Weapon, one storyline item you'll be trying to find shortly, and one optional storyline area.

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Always save before the sub cos emerald is a pain

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Right back to it. I first knock out the next plot event by returning to the Forgotten City and going to that awesome temple-room that seemed otherwise kinda pointless, which triggers Bupenhagen telling us about Holy and White Materia, the antitheses of Meteor and Black Materia. While we can't grab the White Materia since it was lost to the Lifestream, we do see that it's glowing, indicating that it's been a success.

Cait Sith and his Shinra updates continue to drive the plot. They are moving their cannon, now dubbed Sister Ray, but this triggers Weapon to emerge... and head toward Midgar.

We take a quick plot break to head to the sub and search around. I'm entirely unable to find the area mentioned with sunken ship, even though I run around everywhere I can several times. I am able to surface in a random cave in the middle of the "central" continent, which calls out "Vincent..." I learn to take a hint and swap out Red XIII for Vincent himself, and a ghost materializes... Lucrecia, Sephiroth's true mother, who is also unable to die fully due to Jenova cells. Vincent once loved her, though she wound up bearing the son of a scientist instead. Vincent was punished by Hojo for trying to act on her behalf, and Sephiroth appears to be the son of one of the scientists Gast and Hojo. He tells Lucrecia that Sephiroth died truly and is at peace.

With this done, we head right back to the airship and plant our asses in front of Midgar - and in front of the enormous Weapon. The battle starts without any preamble, and whoops, turns out we've got Vincent in our party, with zero materia attached since he was a temporary swap... No matter. I figure I'll just die, respawn, and then put Red XIII (who's equipped with Restore) back in. Barret goes ham with the Bahamut materia and Ultima until he runs out of MP, then is responsible for using items to heal; Cloud goes with Quake3 mainly and regular attacks; and Vincent very quickly turns into his second Limit beast. Once my MP is gone, Vincent is actually the most reliable source of damage, and... eventually, I'm able to outlast Weapon, unexpectedly. (I picked the right character to show up with no materia...)

At this point, we go back to Gya-ha-ha and Kya-ha-ha, who finally fire off Sister Ray to the North... and pierce Weapon, apparently wasting it for good. As its dying attack, Weapon also fires blasts high at Midgar, resulting in in Rufus's wordless death. Uhhh, damn. The man competed. The barrier around the North appears broken broken by Sister Ray, but Cait Sith's eavesdropping informs us we need to finish off Shinra: Hojo has hijacked Sister Ray (or something), which is a huge fucking issue for Heidegger and Scarlet. We need to take care of him, and it's into Shinra we go. (It also appears to confirm that Cait Sith's controller is Reed, the sympathetic dude in Shinra?)

But the roads from the slums are all cut off. In other words, we need to enter by air... by parachute. It's a pretty exciting scene, watching everyone skydive to Cid's Theme. I pick Red XIII (who had been swapped out for Vincent for the big Weapon showdown) and Yuffie (my lowest-leveled character other than Cait Sith). And thus begins a final winding, grinding navigation through the industrial tunnels of Midgar. It's really beautiful, and I wind up picking up very high-tier weapons in boxes. It's fun watching Tifa and Barret and Vincent and Cait Sith hanging out around the area, all focused on heading to the right spot. I intentionally circle back and forth on the most circuitous path I can and I *think* I get all the big-time items.

Notably, Cait Sith informs me that I shouldn't go into Shinra HQ. I do it anyway and search the tower top to bottom (except from 66+, which is inaccessible) and wind up taking home what seem to be some major weapons for Cid, Tifa, and Barret. The random encounters in these train tunnels are a cut above many in difficulty; annoyingly, Cloud keeps getting confused, so I finally give him a Peace Ring to prevent it. Once I get on the right track to exit the train tunnel, there's a save point, followed by a change in the Random Encounters - three-tier robots that keep killing Cloud (and reducing the rest of the party a lot afterward, too!)

And then boom, Scarlet and Heidegger, in a big mecha called Proud Clod (?!) for a boss fight. They're pretty strong, and they also have three components, but a broad-spectrum dose of Bahamut Zero, Neo Bahamut, Phoenix, Comet2, Quake3, and the like soon reduce them to rubble, and that's the end of those two chuckleheads. I'm granted Ragnarok for the battle, though I don't do anything with it yet... instead I run off and save and swap out Red XIII for Cid (now lowest-leveled, somehow), and find myself in front of Hojo. Hojo confirms that it was his mistake to underestimate Cloud, who became the most successful Sephiroth clone, and that while he let Gast experiment with him, Sephiroth is Hojo's son.

For some reason, the Hojo fight catches me off guard. I guess I should totally have expected it, given that... well, duh? Maybe it's because I already just fought, and Hojo doesn't seem like the fighting type... but he's injected himself with Jenova cells. It appears all he does is summon creepy-ass helpers, who are easily wasted by Neo Bahamut and a few smaller summons and a few direct attacks to his person. But then he transforms into a Jenova-like mess capable of doing a lot more damage, and with two arms. Worried, I use a bunch of target-all attacks but perform focused attacks on the arms... which doesn't work out that great, actually - Hojo regenerates it. No matter - I focus on Hojo himself and wreck him.

But then he transforms a third time, and this time it's the boss type that most annoys me: the status-effect boss. Hojo doesn't inflict massive damage in this form, but Cloud spends the majority of the battle asleep, and the Regen Cid casts wears off as poison eats away at everyone's HP. There's a point where all three of Cid, Yuffie, and Cloud are asleep for fifteen seconds or so. (Also annoying: Cloud wastes a turn trying to Sense, and this is an enemy on whom Sense does not work). But eventually, Cloud wakes up and we lay waste to him.

Let's pour one out for Hojo. What an awful person, perhaps the most monstrous of everyone we have met. It's not hard to lay the largest portion of the blame for the ills of the planet at Hojo's feet, and he's also tormented so many people on the small scale - Sephirtoh, Lucrecia, Vincent, Cloud, Aeris, Red XIII, Zack...
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With Shinra finished for good, all that's left from the plot perspective is to finish things with Sephiroth and try to save the planet. We've got seven days apparently, and Cloud takes the lead to inform us that for him, it's personal - and that it should be for everyone, if not with Sephiroth then for the specific people they want to save - Marlene for Barret, for instance. Cloud dismisses the crew to spend time with their loved ones, and he and Tifa enjoy a nice night together under the stars. Since it's a JRPG aimed at teenagers, nothing is actually said from this "romantic" sideplot and it feels a bit tedious, but the discussion of this being the last night on Earth, the last time of seeing everyone, is somber.

But then everyone shows up the next day, reenergizing us (and making us wonder at least a little what the point of making this such a big deal was). We don't get a chance to complete sidequests - we're flying North.

End of Part 2

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* LV11, LV13, LV14 - this pilot is getting CONFIDENT.

* Barret renouncing his terrorism is a nice bit for someone who didn't get a ton of development on this front. While it's ignored, Scarlet does point out that we killed a lot of good Shinra soldiers. (During the Weapon threat, Cait Sith took shots at Barret for AVALANCHE attacks.)

* It's cool getting to fight real SOLDIER first-class enemies as random encounters, though I only ran into one.

* I do hope I get some opportunity for sideplots in Part 3 before just fighting Sephiroth! I think I might actually give Cait Sith some run if I do, since I did like Reed.
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you've missed out on a few ultimate weapons, looks like!

there were a couple in Midgar you could've picked up

also go back to that cave with Vincent later
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HaRRicH posted...

Fort Condor is one of my favorite parts of FF7. I can't speak to how effective it was to play by its expected rules versus just fighting the boss at the end, but I always liked its take on the tower defense set-up.

it's pretty neat. i guess it's probably more strategic if you don't have unlimited funds?

The Popo posted...

The FF7 battle theme is my favorite across the entire series (followed closely by FF13). I can remember being in high school and this song would just play on a loop inside my head for long stretches. Its a gem.

Im not as high on the FF7 boss battle theme as most people, but its still good. I actually think it picks up a lot after the opening guitar riffs. For what its worth, FF6 has my favorite boss battle theme (again, followed closely by FF13 with Saber's Edge).

i've played a fair amount of 4, 6, 7, and 10. 10 has solid tracks, but they don't really chart for me. 4 wasn't that good musically IMO, especially in battle. i agree with you though; 7 has the best regular battle theme, while 6's boss theme is insanely good.

7's boss theme isn't its best track maybe (and if you get to listen to it in its whole, the regular battle theme wins for its later parts). but due to context, i get more hyped for the boss battle. also, regular battles very often end before the best part! that's partly why the music override sequences are so great!
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LeonhartFour posted...

there were a couple in Midgar you could've picked up

wait was one of them a microphone for CS? i think i did get that. i also equipped red XIII with something that gives him monster attack, but only like 75 accuracy.

i think the only character i don't have ultimate weapons for are... probably yuffie and vincent? i'll double-check my equips tomorrow!
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If you didn't bring Barret along for the Hojo fight, you can't get his because there's a chest that only produces the weapon if he's in your party.

There are a few you shouldn't have yet unless you neglected to mention the thing you did to get it.
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The ultimate weapons all have 4x2 linked slots and no materia growth. I think you maybe missed Barretts in Midgar, you need him in your party when you climb the stairs to fight Hojo. The rest are obtainable still I think.

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5tarscream posted...

The ultimate weapons all have 4x2 linked slots and no materia growth. I think you maybe missed Barretts in Midgar, you need him in your party when you climb the stairs to fight Hojo. The rest are obtainable still I think.

then i definitely don't have those i think

i just died an hour into north cave to a seemingly random encounter after getting to the earth's core

why are there no save points
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SeabassDebeste posted...

then i definitely don't have those i think

i just died an hour into north cave to a seemingly random encounter after getting to the earth's core

why are there no save points

you have one save crystal that you find at the very beginning of the dungeon and you can use it at any point in the dungeon (most people set it up either at the part right before your party splits up or right before the last part)
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SeabassDebeste posted...

then i definitely don't have those i think

i just died an hour into north cave to a seemingly random encounter after getting to the earth's core

why are there no save points

Because they give you a portable one lol. Well, portable until you put it down the first time.

When I was a kid, I put it right at the beginning of the Cave. Whoops.

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shouldn't have hoarded that... didn't realize when the cave was ending

those random encounters are just straight up unfair though. the single harmless looking dude randomly OHKOs cloud but not the others; scissors OHKO everyone; parasites are mass damage sponges...
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oh and let's not forget the stupid gargoyles that cast death on everyone when you kill them

and the honeypots that take no damage but steal items

i ran from a LOT of battles starting like halfway through
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sounds like you might be underleveled! I don't remember them being that difficult
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SeabassDebeste posted...

and the honeypots that take no damage but steal items

yeah you're supposed to give them elixirs or they'll steal your items
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there should no way i'm underleveled... bosses have fallen really easily, i've gotten lost a lot, and i've fought every random encounter... cloud was at 60 or so entering the dungeon!

did you not get OHKO'd by the scissors?
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I don't remember the fights on the way to the core being problematic, but it's been a long time since I've played that part of the game.
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I remember running away from basically everything my first time through.

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The scissors have an instant death attack, gargoyles is a level based instant death, any party member thats level divides by either 4 or 5 I think dies. Im guessing the tonberry is the other enemy their attack everyones grudge deals damage based on your kills. Its the characters kills x10 I think.
So if Cloud has killed 20 enemies during the whole game the attack does 200. They have a secondary attack after they walk right up to one character which again causes instant death.
Did you get the Safety Bit item from the snow area? It protects against instant death.

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5tarscream posted...

The scissors have an instant death attack, gargoyles is a level based instant death, any party member thats level divides by either 4 or 5 I think dies. Im guessing the tonberry is the other enemy their attack everyones grudge deals damage based on your kills. Its the characters kills x10 I think.
So if Cloud has killed 20 enemies during the whole game the attack does 200. They have a secondary attack after they walk right up to one character which again causes instant death.
Did you get the Safety Bit item from the snow area? It protects against instant death.

thanks! i don't think i have safety bit but will check.

will probably continue to run from gargoyles and honeypots and tonberry since he has endless HP. scissors will KO me before i can run and are otherwise fair so i'll fight em straight up

looks like cloud having the fully leveled counter/cover combo simply isn't as good here, with instant death on the menu
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