Board 8 > oh hell yeah ffvii is on switch (playthrough?)

(+) Yeah! (+)

You get an item that lets you put out the flames eventually, but not for a long time.

Also, defeating all levels of the pagoda is tough at this point, especially since you don't have an Enemy Skills materia.

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Leonhart4 posted...

especially since you don't have an Enemt Skills materia.

MartinFF7 posted...

Now this'll be interesting. I hope you don't remember the next step from your last run... I wonder how a blind player handles that part, I remember some real global wandering on my part, though that was 22 years ago...

Also Yuffie would've messed up your materia order when she gave it to you but sounds like you switched characters anyways so that prob sorted it out (though Cloud's might be messed still)

oh god so it's not obvious... i almost 100% looked it up last time... i had a feeling this yuffie stuff was a gaiden... augghh

and yeah i always spend like 5 min rearranging materia when i swap party members (including on cloud). i tend to beset everyone with summons so they're physically frail, lol. cloud has cover and counter and is highest-leveled with fewish spell materias

even though atm he has edincoat which just adds an absurd number of slots!
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I only keep one summon materia on a character at a time because it's so detrimental to your stats to stack them and you don't use them often anyway.

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yeah, the HP hit is very noticeable. but i want them leveled up...!
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Mastered summon materia isn't worth very much and the ability to use summons more than once per battle isn't really useful except for one or two of them.

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Tons of runaround. I pay visits of course to the main new place, which tells me that I need a Lunar Drop or something to pass the forest to the North, but which also tells me I need a Keystone to enter the Temple of the Ancients, owned by a "rich man."

I sail freaking everywhere I can, including all the way back to Midgar, Nibelheim, Cosmo Canyon, the rocket launch pad, and that siege defense tower (what a bizarre minigame!) I also stop by same random islands, and man, the random encounters there seriously up their game. They don't do a ton of damage, but they do have a lot more HP. One of the enemies, in particular, is a dinosaur on which I can't use Sense, but which has endless HP. For kicks, I also return and KO the Midgar Zolom.

Eventually, mainly by luck/experimentation, I reach this unmarked shack, where a guy says he had the Keystone but was forced to sell it... to Dio, the head of the Golden Saucer. I knew that there was unfinished business there. I sail back there and attempt to walk in, but I encounter quicksand all around it, with the hint that "even a Chocobo couldn't cross it," along with a suggestion of a more powerful vehicle. I wind up retreating to the land cruiser, boarding it, and taking it to the Golden Saucer. 3x speed was absolutely killer here, by the way.

Can't believe I managed to figure out what to do in only one session! Next time we play we're starting up the plot again!
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Yeah, that can be confusing without a clear sense of direction.

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SeabassDebeste posted...

Never finished this game (or disc 1, even). With the quarantine, I was browsing what was on Switch and discovered this!

Let's mosey.

Stealing my thunder!

Nah, just kidding, I ended up getting started on it while I didn't have access to a computer to make a topic so I decided not to bother with the playthrough topic. Also I've already forgotten what I've played so far because I've been consumed by FE3H ever since I got it for the holidays. I didn't make it that far in.

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oh god what the hell

repeated scenes of quicksand

kill me
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Yeah, you literally can't cross that without the buggy so abandon ship

Go back to North Corel and ride the tram

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I figured it out before reading your comment, proud to say!

Is there a world map where you have the names of the towns you've visited? I vaguely remembered that the tram was to the north and was able to do it from memory, but it'd be nice to know "hey this is the Gold Saucer" or whatever. Rolling with Tifa/Cait Sith atm.

It's fairly painless getting the Keystone - it's right on display near the battle area, and Dio offers to give it to me if I go into the fighitng pit. I'm embarrassed to say that when Dio throws me into the fighting pit, I... well, I lose on the second stage to the petrification. I was dumb, trying to use Quake2 (which didn't slay the petrifying bastard) and not OHKOing it, whereas I could have probably OHKO'd with the regular attack.

Anyway, the tram is broken, which provides Cait Sith the opportunity to tell us to stay the night. We gather round and do a bit of plot recap, which is actually pretty helpful. Sephiroth is after the Ancient Land, where Aeris and the Ceta ultimately go. He's after the Temple of the Ancients and also a mysterious Black Materia, which no one knows much about. Aeris is resolved to go, of course. Meanwhile, we suspect that the hooded figures with tattooed numbers, in Nibelheim, are Hojo-victims... Nanaki is worried about going insane himself.

At night, Tifa comes out (proud of picking the two most plot-relevant characters for this segment of the game!) and takes Cloud on a date. Wish the nearest save point were closer so I could easily pick every option, because they're all super-fun. In the end I give Tifa the kiss and it's incredible watching Cloud and Tifa pirouette their way out. Did not see that coming.

The gondola ride is also really sweet, though I have to say that Cloud's being stodgy and uncaring toward Tifa takes me out of it a lot. She's pouring her heart out and Cloud is just sitting there... it makes me feel embarrassed for her and kinda annoyed at him! It's interesting that she's almost jealous of Aeris, who's expressed no romantic interest in Cloud, but whose flower-girl personality ironically is more forthcoming and open than Tifa's angsty childhood BFF who fights with her fists and blows up reactor cores. While they can all be defended on individual merits, I think it's probably fair to say that this is a very male-oriented set of female characters...

Here comes the Cait Sith betrayal that was mentioned before. He's hinted at it earlier in that town in the south, and now it's coming to roost - he steals the Keystone, we give fruitless chase, and he passes it off to Tseng in a chopper. He also refuses to leave, since he's got Marlene hostage. Then he tries to buy sympathy briefly, but Tifa quickly wrecks him. So Cait Sith is a homunculis controlled remotely by a Shinra employee... great.

In the end, we're still going to the Temple of the Ancients, with Aeris in tow. I choose Vincent (he's leveled up without being in the party - I guess that's normal?), and that's all for now.

Wonder if there will ever be any true comeuppance for Cait Sith or at least some resolution there - guy is just a straight-up, unrepentant bad guy that we know of, but who's just staying there.

I think I'm at a little less than 21 hours, btw.
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The date scene is a lot of fun. I enjoy picking all the wrong options in the play. And I wouldn't say Cait Sith is unrepentant. You can sense some moral conflict in what he says after the reveal.

Also, your inactive party members gain half the EXP of your active members.

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Into the temple, and Aeris starts having visions, starting by falling down, hugging the bridge. We find the defeated Tseng (who's been felled by Sephiroth, as we discover by looking into a pool). Aeris muses that while Tseng has been an enemy to her for her whole life... at least he knew her for her whole life. And that means something in and of itself, friend or foe.

Following those bouncing guardians helps a lot; they clearly indicate where to go and offer both healing and save points, always welcome. The random encounter rate is manageable enough, and enemies go down quickly enough, that I never really lose track of where I am.

You know who does lose track of where he is? Cloud. He has visions throughout the march through the temple, with Sephiroth constantly in his head and hinting he'll always be there. Sephiroth appears and laughs maniacally and decides that he's going to be fusing himself with the planet after pulling some sort of cataclysmic event. Aeris deduces this means casting Meteor, which is granted by the Black Materia too powerful for anyone to use. As Sephiroth flies off, we deal with a rather quick boss that grants us Bahamut as materia.

Cait Sith almost redeems himself here by saying he'll fetch us the Black Materia, though his "sacrifice" winds up having him perfectly fine, so I'm not sure why the big production was needed. MEH. Well, we'll just drop him from the rotation.

As we're escaping a crumbling dungeon, we run into a second boss who's much stronger - I keep trying to get off Bahamut with Vincent, but he reduces more than half of Vincent's health with a single hit. Eventually I give up and just beat him with Aeris healing and Cloud attacking, since his HP isn't too high.

On escape, Sephiroth really hijacks Cloud's brain; he beats up Aeris and hands the Black Materia to Sephiroth. Aeris decides he's untrustworthy and wants to stop Sephiroth herself. This doesn't seem likely to end well, wherever the City of the Ancients is. We wake up in Gongaga, vowing to look for her. Barret informs us that "There ain't no getting offa this train we're on."

except now i have no idea where to go

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* The Temple of the Ancients is a pretty bad dungeon, tbh. I didn't even like the music there.

* Aeris actually does flirt with Cloud here, asking Cait Sith to read their fortune. So I guess Tifa's jealousy isn't totally misplaced.
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Temple of the Ancients is a tough dungeon but it's got some great story beats.

Go back to Bone Village.
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I wasn't exactly sure what Bone Village was, but given that I've learned the names of most places, I wasn't too surprised to find that it was the area to the north that you need Tiny Bronco to reach. They say that Aeris has gone through the forest, but I still need a Lunar Harp. Fortunately, it seems we can... mine it? It takes me a few tries to understand exactly what's happening (I thought that the five guys were going to dig, but apparently they're just there to triangulate your position, and you don't need all five). Once I get the hang of it, it's really fun to do, so I do it an extra time for good measure and wind up getting I think some nice armor.

The route that follows is a little hard to parse visually. This is the forest that Cloud saw in his dream with Aeris. But it's not too long, and soon we're out on the other side and headed into the City of the Ancients. The visual design here is fantastic. In my eyes, this aesthetic is vastly superior to the temples of FFX, which are clearly similarly inspired. There's not too much going on here, whereas it feels overly ornate there. This segment of the game doesn't have random encounters, allowing me to bask in its glory. We encounter some runes on the wall, but they don't speak to Cloud, other than to give him even more of a headache.

At some point, there's a napping point. We take it, and then night falls, and Cloud is even more determined to go seek Aeris. My exploration stops there largely; I'm no longer able to walk through one of the routes of the tree, so down the hole I go. The descent here is another visual feast, and at the bottom is a set of platforms leading to... Aeris, sitting and apparently meditating alone. There was a point earlier in the story where Barret essentially ceded leadership of the party to Cloud, though it wasn't exactly clear to me why... but Cloud, as both leader and Aeris's closest confidant, is the only one to cross the platforms. And the moment he gets there, he has another psychic break, this time resulting in his drawing his sword.

This next part I didn't know about: Cloud walks up and is about to kill Aeris. It's really cool to experience it - like in one of the closing segments of MGS3, the game forces you to perform the actions yourself to lift the sword above Aeris's head; Cloud actively resists if you hit anything other than A to advance his motions. He's shouted out of his trance by Barret and Tifa. Aeris continues sitting and smiling placidly. And that's when Sephiroth descends and puts his sword through her back.

This is the most famous spoiler of all time, so I, er, was not exactly shocked when it happened. That said, the circumstances behind it are really interesting to me. I expected it to happen at the end of the winding Temple of the Ancients, perhaps following a grueling boss fight, perhaps right when we were about to get an upper hand on Sephiroth, perhaps as part of a clear sacrifice, perhaps with a rousing speech and tragic/ironic parting words from Aeris. Instead, we've been looking at her face for a few minutes, and it feels almost random. But the way Cloud reacts to it is brilliant. It's understated - a sort of "what is this unpleasant sensation I'm feeling," "why would you do this," and most crushingly, a short lament of all the things Aeris will never again do, one of which is speak. Perhaps the craziest part of her death is that she doesn't get to have any words at all in her death scene.

This version of Sephiroth isn't at all what I expected from the game; he's entirely unhinged already, and not in a particularly charismatic or funny way. He just cackles maniacally and says more nonsense about merging with the lifestream before taking off again (and honestly, the fact he can fly looks kinda goofy; his walk is full of menace and is super-badass).

Music is so capable of twisting the heart. From the moment we met Aeris, I was touched by her theme song and the way life sprouted around her - the best way I could characterize it is plaintive. It's peaceful, but it almost pleads for that peace. And it's viciously denied her. That theme doesn't play during the part of the scene where Aeris is alive, but rather in the wake of her death, as Sephiroth flies off. Chills run down my spine as we get a boss fight... with no interruption to Aeris's theme. (Sephiroth really gonna just keep droppin pieces of mommy, I guess). It's utterly heart-wrenching.

Jenova-LIFE's first attacks are pretty weak, and by the time I get around to using Sense on it, it's already down to under half its 10K health. Great. This also informs me that it's weak to Earth. Hey, Cloud has Quake3... I cast it, and I guess I probably should've paid more attention to the "Reflect" spell it cast... it hits Cloud himself for 2400ish damage, leaving him at around 300, and Jenova makes short work of me with a few attacks that hit for 1200 apiece. (It's the same Aqua Lung attack that was hitting a single dude for 300 before; whyyyyy!) I die and have to experience Aeris's death again, though this time I don't attack into Reflect and dispatch Jenova-LIFE cleanly. Barret with heal powerz OP.

Cloud lifts Aeris's body and deposits her into the water of her city, and that's the end of Part 1 of the game.
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If you found the Water Ring at the beginning of the Forgotten City, it nullifies all water damage, which makes that boss fight impossible to lose if you equip it on someone.

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ah yeah, i found that, but i remember looking at the city and going "who's gonna hit me with water damage here?"

(not a joke)

(in general, i just leave whatever amulet is attached to someone attached to em. being protected from random status effects is useful too.)
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So the World Map in the North is desolate. Very desolate. It's barren, and I don't even have strong enemies to keep me company, which makes me think I'm hilariously overleveled.

We eventually hit a village, which is evidently known for its snowboarding; several people are there on vacation. In one of the houses there is a tape of a scientist (a young Hojo...?) and Ifalna (!), who gives us a spiel on how the Cetra were transformed. The Cetra apparently weren't always monsters; they were mutated by something that attacked from space, two thousand years ago. And that strike is the reason why the north is glacial.

Well, okay. No one actually reacts to this. We further explore the town and grab a map that we'll need to go further north, where apparently this lady's husband has disappeared for twenty years. We hear chatter that there's a woman atop a glacier from a bartender, but it's "just a myth." Totes believe ya.

As we try to leave, an old man is very insistent that we learn to snowboard, and then Elena shows up, accuses us of what happened to Tseng, and punches Cloud in the face. (I really wish they'd give second chances at these mini-games, like trying to out-squat Big Bro; I can barely read how to avoid the punch before she's punched me and I haven't reacted in time. Bleh.) Anyway, we're then barred from leaving via the South, and the old man refuses to let us go without getting a snowboard, so we shake down a crippled kid and steal his.

The snowboarding is actually pretty fun, but I crash a whole ton. This doesn't handle quite like Mario Kart, I'm afraid! The map isn't super-helpful, but I wander around through many screens of snow until I wind up exiting via the north.

The trek continues there; I need to use markers to indicate where I've been because the map gets disoriented from the wind. It's a pretty cool concept! I actually lose track of direction, but I manage to reach some sort of small cave-like shelter, and from there I'm able to orient myself based off that. Going further north, I find an unlikely residence - where that old lady's husband has taken up residence. He offers us shelter and a save point, plus the opportunity to go further north. I'm rolling with Red XIII and Vincent still, but I enjoy the awe that Barret expresses at nature. It's almost enough to make you forget about politics and the world down south...

We play a silly minigame of warming ourselves while climbing; I never exactly feel in danger of freezing, but it's mildly enjoyable. I eventually find myself in a cave with a prominent save point; I save there and then start taking a loop. The random encounters here kick it way up; specifically, a nasty giant scorpion inflicts massive damage with some of its attacks, and he can absorb a lot of punishment, too.

On the upper level, there are four... icicles. The battles with them are straightforward, and defeating them forms a bridge. Paused there for the moment.

Cloud is on his Level 3 Limit Break now, Meteorain, and it's crazy.
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Moment of truth: Did you manage to get Trine?

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Cait Sith almost redeems himself here by saying he'll fetch us the Black Materia, though his "sacrifice" winds up having him perfectly fine, so I'm not sure why the big production was needed. MEH. Well, we'll just drop him from the rotation.

The best theory I recall reading is that Cait Sith's "sacrifice" is there to make players think they've already seen the token Party Member Death, so that the actual casualty catches them off guard.
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MalcolmMasher posted...

The best theory I recall reading is that Cait Sith's "sacrifice" is there to make players think they've already seen the token Party Member Death, so that the actual casualty catches them off guard.

Plus his immediate return distracts the edgelords from noticing what else goes on in the Temple of the Ancients.

...Is it a good or bad thing that so many people forget what happens in that dungeon?

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Thenenen posted...

Moment of truth: Did you manage to get Trine?

he presumably still has no Enemy Skills materia
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yeah, no enemy skills materia. i have no idea what it even does
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Its essentially the blue mage stuff of the game.

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Did you miss Ramuh? Its onetime only I think in the Chicano waiting room after the desert prison? Also theres another summon available between the snowboarding and Holzoffs. Thats not one time only though.

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yeah, must have missed ramuh. i think i went into that room too...

now that i think about it... it seems pretty plausible that i actually got ramuh, but it was wiped out after i died on the world map after beating dyne, and then i rushed that part of the game next time i played
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Nah. That would've been after Dyne. It's I'm the waiting room before the chocobo race.

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oh yeah, in any case it was between the desert and the next save point, so i'm guessing there's a good chance i got it the first time and skipped it the second time
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Agree about City of the Ancients being exceptionally beautifully drawn. That sequence once you get out of Bone Village has this odd climactic yet calm atmosphere. And I enjoyed Aeris' character for much the same reasons - plaintive, yes, chasing after a peace she knew she'd never get...

FFVII is special - I played it six years after release (after VI, VIII, IX and X, and many other RPGs) and was still blown away because its scope.

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Theres another summon floating around in the forest between bone village and city of the ancients too

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5tarscream posted...

Theres another summon floating around in the forest between bone village and city of the ancients too

If he hasn't been using a guide until now, then he doesn't need to start now.

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yeah I don't see any point in him trying to become a completionist now

FFVII isn't a hard game so you can beat it even if you miss a bunch of stuff
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LeonhartFour posted...

yeah I don't see any point in him trying to become a completionist now

FFVII isn't a hard game so you can beat it even if you miss a bunch of stuff

It mostly relies on whether or not you grind for the highest-level limit breaks, though. And there's a LOT of grinding needed to obtain those.

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Eh, I think I beat the game my first time with no one higher than Level 2 Limit Breaks!
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LeonhartFour posted...

Eh, I think I beat the game my first time with no one higher than Level 2 Limit Breaks!

isn't this game 3 discs

i just started disc 2 and cloud's on his L3 limit break...!
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well when I first played I was 11 and I was fleeing from most random encounters!
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i honestly don't even know how to flee from random encounters

i'd prob be a lot less patient with no 3x speed though, for grindy battles
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It's either L1 + R1 or L2 + R2, I forget which!
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rip game manuals that were thrilling to read
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FFVII was a good manual! I learned everyone's heights, birthdays, and blood types.
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SeabassDebeste posted...

rip game manuals that were thrilling to read

rip box art blurbs that were more accurate than journalistic reviews

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Thenenen posted...

rip box art blurbs that were more accurate than journalistic reviews

"Quite possibly the greatest game ever made."

I still remember that tagline on the back of the FFVII case!
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LeonhartFour posted...

I still remember that tagline on the back of the FFVII case!

same!

the backs of game boxes used to be better too

i think my first relative disappointment might have been SSBM's box, which looked more like advertising than the inside flap blurb of a book cover
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the back of Nintendo boxes in general have been disappointing since the GameCube era
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LeonhartFour posted...

"Quite possibly the greatest game ever made."

I still remember that tagline on the back of the FFVII case!

This quote is the reason I picked it over another game when given the option to buy something at the store, and I'm pretty sure it played at least a partial role of my initial thought that it was the best game ever.

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I mean they wouldn't lie to you would they
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They didn't!

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Still catching up on the topic and enjoying it -- do I understand right there are power-up perks right away at the beginning of the game like immediate Limit Breaks? Are there other perks like that? I'd like to replay FF7 but only if I can breeze through it this time.

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HaRRicH posted...

Still catching up on the topic and enjoying it -- do I understand right there are power-up perks right away at the beginning of the game like immediate Limit Breaks? Are there other perks like that? I'd like to replay FF7 but only if I can breeze through it this time.

Turbo mode, instant Limit Breaks, and no encounters

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Yeah okay, think I'll just enjoy ff7 on ps4 in a few days instead but enjoy your old toy while Sony proceeds to do what Nintendont

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