Poll of the Day > California legislation suggests fine or jail time for misgendering a transgender

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ImCallingYouOut 08/28/17 8:41:25 PM #1:	http://www.dailywire.com/news/20299/california-moves-jail-people-who-use-wrong-pronoun-emily-zanotti California legislators are set to vote this week on a bill that could criminalize using the wrong pronoun to refer to a transgender individual. The bill, which passed the California state senate in May, has moved into the California state assembly as part of a slew of gender-based "anti-discrimination" laws designed to protect California residents who don't believe they fall into the gender binary. Titled the "Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, and Transgender Long-Term Care Facility Residents Bill of Rights," the new law would allow transgender individuals living in care facilities like nursing homes to use bathrooms in line with their preferred gender (not necessarily their biological gender), and would punish any caregiver who "knowingly" uses the wrong gender pronoun to refer to one of their patients. Use "he" instead of "she" and you could face a $1,000 fine and up to a year in jail for gender-based discrimination and harassment. The law, which says "knowingly," does not seem to identify a specific standard, leaving interpretation of motive up to authorities. Unsurprisingly, free speech advocates and faith-based care facilities are upset about the development, partly because they would be compelled to act in a way that defies their religious dogma and partly because there's absolutely no way the state will limit the bill's protections just to care facilities. “How can you believe in free speech, but think the government can compel people to use certain pronouns when talking to others?” a representative of the California Family Council testified to the assembly late last week. The state senator who authored the bill, Scott Weiner, was particularly vocal when it came to exempting religious organizations from the law: he wasn't going to do it because, he claimed, religion has no place in public life. “Everyone is entitled to their religious view,” Weiner said. “But when you enter the public space, when you are running an institution, you are in a workplace, you are in a civil setting, and you have to follow the law.” Fortunately, in this case, the law — at least, the larger law and the Constitution — may be on California residents' side. According to law professor Eugene Volokh, the law itself seems too vague, and it's likely California wouldn't strictly interpret the law and limit their enforcement to nursing home caretakers only. Its "pretty unlikely that, if this law is enacted, such prohibitions would be limited just to this scenario," he told National Review. That would mean California could face litigation once they start enforcing the rule, and precedent isn't on California's side. @Ziggistardust --- I'm sick of trolls and garbage posters <cite>ImCallingYouOut posted [p:885621839] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>http://www.dailywire.com/news/20299/california-moves-jail-people-who-use-wrong-pronoun-emily-zanotti <quote>California legislators are set to vote this week on a bill that could criminalize using the wrong pronoun to refer to a transgender individual. The bill, which passed the California state senate in May, has moved into the California state assembly as part of a slew of gender-based "anti-discrimination" laws designed to protect California residents who don't believe they fall into the gender binary. Titled the "Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, and Transgender Long-Term Care Facility Residents Bill of Rights," the new law would allow transgender individuals living in care facilities like nursing homes to use bathrooms in line with their preferred gender (not necessarily their biological gender), and would punish any caregiver who "knowingly" uses the wrong gender pronoun to refer to one of their patients. Use "he" instead of "she" and you could face a $1,000 fine and up to a year in jail for gender-based discrimination and harassment. The law, which says "knowingly," does not seem to identify a specific standard, leaving interpretation of motive up to authorities. Unsurprisingly, free speech advocates and faith-based care facilities are upset about the development, partly because they would be compelled to act in a way that defies their religious dogma and partly because there's absolutely no way the state will limit the bill's protections just to care facilities. “How can you believe in free speech, but think the government can compel people to use certain pronouns when talking to others?” a representative of the California Family Council testified to the assembly late last week. The state senator who authored the bill, Scott Weiner, was particularly vocal when it came to exempting religious organizations from the law: he wasn't going to do it because, he claimed, religion has no place in public life. “Everyone is entitled to their religious view,” Weiner said. “But when you enter the public space, when you are running an institution, you are in a workplace, you are in a civil setting, and you have to follow the law.” Fortunately, in this case, the law — at least, the larger law and the Constitution — may be on California residents' side. According to law professor Eugene Volokh, the law itself seems too vague, and it's likely California wouldn't strictly interpret the law and limit their enforcement to nursing home caretakers only. Its "pretty unlikely that, if this law is enacted, such prohibitions would be limited just to this scenario," he told National Review. That would mean California could face litigation once they start enforcing the rule, and precedent isn't on California's side.</quote> @Ziggistardust</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
dragon504 08/28/17 8:42:24 PM #2:	What a stupid law. --- http://myanimelist.net/profile/dragon504 http://followmy.tv/u/dragon504/time_wasted <cite>dragon504 posted [p:885621886] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>What a stupid law.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
TheCyborgNinja 08/28/17 8:42:35 PM #3:	Wow..................... Let's keep blaming Donald Trump for destroying everything. This is Nazi-level fuckery. --- "message parlor" ? do you mean the post office ? - SlayerX888 <cite>TheCyborgNinja posted [p:885621895] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>Wow..................... Let's keep blaming Donald Trump for destroying everything. This is Nazi-level fuckery.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
InfernalFive 08/28/17 8:43:40 PM #4:	And here I thought Californians couldn't get any dumber. --- http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lyfabsU4xH1qzy531o1_500.jpg http://i.imgur.com/ggCrHk8.jpg <cite>InfernalFive posted [p:885621948] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>And here I thought Californians couldn't get any dumber.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Smarkil 08/28/17 9:23:19 PM #6:	Are there a lot of 85+ year old transgender people? --- If my daughter was in it, Id have to be the co-star - Deoxxys on porn <cite>Smarkil posted [p:885624265] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>Are there a lot of 85+ year old transgender people?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Lokarin 08/28/17 9:25:46 PM #7:	They should make a law where criticizing any government official counts as harassment since it threatens their pensions. --- "Salt cures Everything!" My YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/Nirakolov/videos <cite>Lokarin posted [p:885624386] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>They should make a law where criticizing any government official counts as harassment since it threatens their pensions.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
wolfy42 08/28/17 9:26:17 PM #8:	Um, freedom of speech? You should be able to call anyone anything you freaking want. You have to deal with the consequences, and if you incite a riot or something that could be illegal, but how can you legally state someone can't say something, even if it's calling someone a name? I mean it's not even illegal to use racial slurs etc, wth? --- Proud member of the Arv The Great is great fan club!!! Join today by putting it in your sig. <cite>wolfy42 posted [p:885624418] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>Um, freedom of speech? You should be able to call anyone anything you freaking want. You have to deal with the consequences, and if you incite a riot or something that could be illegal, but how can you legally state someone can't say something, even if it's calling someone a name? I mean it's not even illegal to use racial slurs etc, wth?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Blue_Thunder 08/28/17 9:28:24 PM #9:	PyroBlade1985 posted... dragon504 posted... What a stupid law. --- FC: 2724-1435-8055 - IGN: PSI_BLUE Spelling errors make me laugh. <cite>Blue_Thunder posted [p:885624557] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>PyroBlade1985 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>dragon504 posted...</cite> <quote>What a stupid law.</quote></quote></quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Krazy_Kirby 08/28/17 9:28:47 PM #10:	stupid law. they cant prove they are the gender they claim to be. their birth certificate shows their real gender --- Kill From The Shadows. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idiot <cite>Krazy_Kirby posted [p:885624585] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>stupid law. they cant prove they are the gender they claim to be. their birth certificate shows their real gender</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
streamofthesky 08/28/17 9:29:21 PM #11:	This isn't real....right? Like, this is actually from The Onion? <cite>streamofthesky posted [p:885624611] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>This isn't real....right? Like, this is actually from The Onion?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Sahuagin 08/28/17 9:36:02 PM #12:	we already had something like this pass this year in Canada. welcome to crazy. wolfy42 posted... how can you legally state someone can't say something it's a little worse than that even, since you have to use particular words. it's compelled speech. --- *The truth basks in scrutiny.* http://i.imgur.com/GMouTGs.jpg http://projecteuler.net/profile/Sahuagin.png <cite>Sahuagin posted [p:885624984] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>we already had something like this pass this year in Canada. welcome to crazy. <cite>wolfy42 posted...</cite> <quote>how can you legally state someone can't say something</quote> it's a little worse than that even, since you have to use particular words. it's compelled speech.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Clench281 08/28/17 9:37:24 PM #13:	wolfy42 posted... Um, freedom of speech? You should be able to call anyone anything you freaking want. You have to deal with the consequences, and if you incite a riot or something that could be illegal, but how can you legally state someone can't say something, even if it's calling someone a name? I mean it's not even illegal to use racial slurs etc, wth? It's for cases that are willful and repeated, after being informed how they would like to be addressed. In essence, a form of verbal harassment. This is for long term care facilities, which I presume would be elderly patients. This verbal harassment could constitute mental abuse, defined as: Deprivation by a caregiver of things or services that the elder or dependent adult needs to avoid physical harm or mental suffering. --- Take me for what I am -- who I was meant to be. And if you give a damn, take me baby, or leave me. <cite>Clench281 posted [p:885625075] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>wolfy42 posted...</cite> <quote>Um, freedom of speech? You should be able to call anyone anything you freaking want. You have to deal with the consequences, and if you incite a riot or something that could be illegal, but how can you legally state someone can't say something, even if it's calling someone a name? I mean it's not even illegal to use racial slurs etc, wth?</quote> It's for cases that are willful and repeated, after being informed how they would like to be addressed. In essence, a form of verbal harassment. This is for long term care facilities, which I presume would be elderly patients. This verbal harassment could constitute mental abuse, defined as: Deprivation by a caregiver of things or services that the elder or dependent adult needs to avoid physical harm or mental suffering.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Nade Duck 08/28/17 9:37:33 PM #14:	this is fucking ridiculous. --- http://i.imgur.com/ElACjJD.gifv <cite>Nade Duck posted [p:885625083] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>this is fucking ridiculous.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ClarkDuke 08/28/17 9:37:37 PM #15:	InfernalFive posted... And here I thought Californians couldn't get any dumber. How apathetic, laying blame on all Californians, ok? --- http://i.imgur.com/qL0DHFI.gif http://i.imgur.com/JL9rRLt.gif <cite>ClarkDuke posted [p:885625093] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>InfernalFive posted...</cite> <quote>And here I thought Californians couldn't get any dumber.</quote> How apathetic, laying blame on all Californians, ok?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Boobsicle 08/28/17 9:38:26 PM #16:	Reap what you sow Californians. You let this kind of shit fester for too long. --- Its good to be alive <cite>Boobsicle posted [p:885625134] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>Reap what you sow Californians. You let this kind of shit fester for too long.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mead 08/28/17 9:38:34 PM #17:	ImCallingYouOut posted... punish any caregiver who "knowingly" uses the wrong gender pronoun to refer to one of their patients. This makes sense. It specifically refers to caregivers of patients, and "knowingly" would need to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt, so this would only be enforceable against anyone that was being overtly bigoted --- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mead "I'm Mary Poppins ya'll!" <cite>Mead posted [p:885625143] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>ImCallingYouOut posted...</cite> <quote>punish any caregiver who "knowingly" uses the wrong gender pronoun to refer to one of their patients.</quote> This makes sense. It specifically refers to caregivers of patients, and "knowingly" would need to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt, so this would only be enforceable against anyone that was being overtly bigoted</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
myghostisdead 08/28/17 10:36:16 PM #18:	Clench281 posted... wolfy42 posted... Um, freedom of speech? You should be able to call anyone anything you freaking want. You have to deal with the consequences, and if you incite a riot or something that could be illegal, but how can you legally state someone can't say something, even if it's calling someone a name? I mean it's not even illegal to use racial slurs etc, wth? It's for cases that are willful and repeated, after being informed how they would like to be addressed. In essence, a form of verbal harassment. This is for long term care facilities, which I presume would be elderly patients. This verbal harassment could constitute mental abuse, defined as: Deprivation by a caregiver of things or services that the elder or dependent adult needs to avoid physical harm or mental suffering. It is weird it is so specific to long-term care elderly. Ho do you prove it was done purposefully. It is hard to tell some people's gender and even more so with some old people. Then you have honest mistakes of someone who sees many patients a day and just plan forgets. How many times is considered excessive? How can a nursing home person ( if this is what they mean)who might have memory problems, or a heavily medicated person keep track of who insulted them or even if they really did? My 84 year old great grandmother loses things and thinks certain people stole the items and she hears things but gets angry when you tell her otherwise. Firing them makes sense if they are assholes to old people but fining or jail time is well overboard. <cite>myghostisdead posted [p:885628681] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>Clench281 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>wolfy42 posted...</cite> <quote>Um, freedom of speech? You should be able to call anyone anything you freaking want. You have to deal with the consequences, and if you incite a riot or something that could be illegal, but how can you legally state someone can't say something, even if it's calling someone a name? I mean it's not even illegal to use racial slurs etc, wth?</quote> It's for cases that are willful and repeated, after being informed how they would like to be addressed. In essence, a form of verbal harassment. This is for long term care facilities, which I presume would be elderly patients. This verbal harassment could constitute mental abuse, defined as: Deprivation by a caregiver of things or services that the elder or dependent adult needs to avoid physical harm or mental suffering.</quote> It is weird it is so specific to long-term care elderly. Ho do you prove it was done purposefully. It is hard to tell some people's gender and even more so with some old people. Then you have honest mistakes of someone who sees many patients a day and just plan forgets. How many times is considered excessive? How can a nursing home person ( if this is what they mean)who might have memory problems, or a heavily medicated person keep track of who insulted them or even if they really did? My 84 year old great grandmother loses things and thinks certain people stole the items and she hears things but gets angry when you tell her otherwise. Firing them makes sense if they are assholes to old people but fining or jail time is well overboard.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Sahuagin 08/28/17 10:40:11 PM #19:	Clench281 posted... In essence, a form of verbal harassment. ... This verbal harassment could constitute mental abuse. then it should already be covered by existing laws... --- *The truth basks in scrutiny.* http://i.imgur.com/GMouTGs.jpg http://projecteuler.net/profile/Sahuagin.png <cite>Sahuagin posted [p:885628909] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>Clench281 posted...</cite> <quote>In essence, a form of verbal harassment. ... This verbal harassment could constitute mental abuse.</quote> then it should already be covered by existing laws...</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
KevinceKostner 08/28/17 10:42:33 PM #20:	Sahuagin posted... Clench281 posted... In essence, a form of verbal harassment. ... This verbal harassment could constitute mental abuse. then it should already be covered by existing laws... But people would just laugh it out of court if you tried so maybe this is something they need, I dunno I didn't think it really was a problem. <cite>KevinceKostner posted [p:885629036] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>Sahuagin posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Clench281 posted...</cite> <quote>In essence, a form of verbal harassment. ... This verbal harassment could constitute mental abuse.</quote> then it should already be covered by existing laws...</quote> But people would just laugh it out of court if you tried so maybe this is something they need, I dunno I didn't think it really was a problem.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
dioxxys 08/28/17 10:45:53 PM #21:	HELLLL NO get out of here with that, canada can keep that <cite>dioxxys posted [p:885629221] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>HELLLL NO get out of here with that, canada can keep that</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Yellow 08/28/17 10:48:51 PM #22:	Nursery homes caregivers. You don't call an obvious trans person the other gender if you're tasked with taking care of them. Fair next and outrage culture. Idgaf <cite>Yellow posted [p:885629392] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>Nursery homes caregivers. You don't call an obvious trans person the other gender if you're tasked with taking care of them. Fair next and outrage culture. Idgaf</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Sarcasthma 08/28/17 11:03:56 PM #23:	Mead posted... ImCallingYouOut posted... punish any caregiver who "knowingly" uses the wrong gender pronoun to refer to one of their patients. This makes sense. It specifically refers to caregivers of patients, and "knowingly" would need to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt, so this would only be enforceable against anyone that was being overtly bigoted I was getting ready to call this legislation stupid. Guess I should've read it first. --- What's the difference between a pickpocket and a peeping tom? A pickpocket snatches your watch. <cite>Sarcasthma posted [p:885630243] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>Mead posted...</cite> <quote><cite>ImCallingYouOut posted...</cite> <quote>punish any caregiver who "knowingly" uses the wrong gender pronoun to refer to one of their patients.</quote> This makes sense. It specifically refers to caregivers of patients, and "knowingly" would need to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt, so this would only be enforceable against anyone that was being overtly bigoted</quote> I was getting ready to call this legislation stupid. Guess I should've read it first.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
WalkingWiki 08/28/17 11:10:12 PM #24:	Blue_Thunder posted... PyroBlade1985 posted... dragon504 posted... What a stupid law. --- Currently playing: Watch Dogs, Far Cry 4, Diablo III: Ultimate Evil Edition, Borderlands <cite>WalkingWiki posted [p:885630610] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>Blue_Thunder posted...</cite> <quote><cite>PyroBlade1985 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>dragon504 posted...</cite> <quote>What a stupid law.</quote></quote></quote></quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
RedPixel 08/28/17 11:12:36 PM #25:	WalkingWiki posted... Blue_Thunder posted... PyroBlade1985 posted... dragon504 posted... What a stupid law. --- Working in a team is great! It always helps to have someone else to blame. <cite>RedPixel posted [p:885630722] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>WalkingWiki posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Blue_Thunder posted...</cite> <quote><cite>PyroBlade1985 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>dragon504 posted...</cite> <quote>What a stupid law.</quote></quote></quote></quote></quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ChrisHanson24 08/28/17 11:26:57 PM #26:	what a fucking joke <cite>ChrisHanson24 posted [p:885631395] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>what a fucking joke</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Iamwauwa 08/28/17 11:27:28 PM #27:	This should get thrown out pretty quickly, as it's a clear violation of basic constitutional rights. Mead posted... ImCallingYouOut posted... punish any caregiver who "knowingly" uses the wrong gender pronoun to refer to one of their patients. This makes sense. It specifically refers to caregivers of patients, and "knowingly" would need to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt, so this would only be enforceable against anyone that was being overtly bigoted The law itself is bigoted, basically saying believe a certain way or else. And since it comes with fines and jail time, it is definitively fascist in principle. People are free to live how they want, and if a company doesn't want to hire someone who won't follow their policies, they don't have to. But applying a legal punishment to someone for living peacefully according to their beliefs is wrong. <cite>Iamwauwa posted [p:885631425] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>This should get thrown out pretty quickly, as it's a clear violation of basic constitutional rights. <cite>Mead posted...</cite> <quote><cite>ImCallingYouOut posted...</cite> <quote>punish any caregiver who "knowingly" uses the wrong gender pronoun to refer to one of their patients.</quote> This makes sense. It specifically refers to caregivers of patients, and "knowingly" would need to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt, so this would only be enforceable against anyone that was being overtly bigoted</quote> The law itself is bigoted, basically saying believe a certain way or else. And since it comes with fines and jail time, it is definitively fascist in principle. People are free to live how they want, and if a company doesn't want to hire someone who won't follow their policies, they don't have to. But applying a legal punishment to someone for living peacefully according to their beliefs is wrong.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
IronBornCorps 08/28/17 11:27:58 PM #28:	Yay! Seriously though, knowingly misgendering someone and misgendering a stranger are two different things. Who is this law bigoted against? <cite>IronBornCorps posted [p:885631452] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>Yay! Seriously though, knowingly misgendering someone and misgendering a stranger are two different things. Who is this law bigoted against?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mead 08/28/17 11:31:13 PM #29:	Iamwauwa posted... The law itself is bigoted, basically saying believe a certain way or else What you believe and how you act towards someone are completely different things. A caregiver is expected to have a reasonable level of respect for a patient. Deal with it --- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mead "I'm Mary Poppins ya'll!" <cite>Mead posted [p:885631605] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>Iamwauwa posted...</cite> <quote>The law itself is bigoted, basically saying believe a certain way or else</quote> What you believe and how you act towards someone are completely different things. A caregiver is expected to have a reasonable level of respect for a patient. Deal with it</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Zeus 08/28/17 11:32:38 PM #30:	tbh, there are countless stupid laws proposed in California and... well, mostly California which are either just for show (ie, no hope of passing) or get shot down by people who know their heads from their ass. However, even if it got passed, it would be ruled unconstitutional. --- (\/)(\/)\|-\| In Zeus We Trust: All Others Pay Cash <cite>Zeus posted [p:885631676] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>tbh, there are countless stupid laws proposed in California and... well, mostly California which are either just for show (ie, no hope of passing) or get shot down by people who know their heads from their ass. However, even if it got passed, it would be ruled unconstitutional.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
IronBornCorps 08/28/17 11:36:38 PM #31:	I actually agree that it's worded too vaguely to realistically be enforced. Isn't using racial, sexist, or homophobic speech already a crime in certain settings though? Misgendering is a form of transphobia, so it should just be included with that. <cite>IronBornCorps posted [p:885631850] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>I actually agree that it's worded too vaguely to realistically be enforced. Isn't using racial, sexist, or homophobic speech already a crime in certain settings though? Misgendering is a form of transphobia, so it should just be included with that.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ZiggiStardust 08/29/17 9:33:32 AM #32:	lol why was i tagged in this? --- http://www.twitch.tv/agenttrav <cite>ZiggiStardust posted [p:885648686] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>lol why was i tagged in this?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Krazy_Kirby 08/29/17 9:47:23 AM #33:	Mead posted... Iamwauwa posted... The law itself is bigoted, basically saying believe a certain way or else What you believe and how you act towards someone are completely different things. A caregiver is expected to have a reasonable level of respect for a patient. Deal with it medically the patient is the gender they were born as. Deal with it. p.s. some medical professionals believe it is a mental disorder. they shouldn't have to alter their opinion when treating someone --- Kill From The Shadows. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idiot <cite>Krazy_Kirby posted [p:885649210] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>Mead posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Iamwauwa posted...</cite> <quote>The law itself is bigoted, basically saying believe a certain way or else</quote> What you believe and how you act towards someone are completely different things. A caregiver is expected to have a reasonable level of respect for a patient. Deal with it</quote> medically the patient is the gender they were born as. Deal with it. p.s. some medical professionals believe it is a mental disorder. they shouldn't have to alter their opinion when treating someone</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Nichtcrawler X 08/29/17 9:52:57 AM #34:	Krazy_Kirby posted... stupid law. they cant prove they are the gender they claim to be. their birth certificate shows their real gender Birth certificates list sex, not gender. --- Official Teetotaller of PotD Dovie'andi se tovya sagain! <cite>Nichtcrawler X posted [p:885649413] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>Krazy_Kirby posted...</cite> <quote>stupid law. they cant prove they are the gender they claim to be. their birth certificate shows their real gender</quote> Birth certificates list sex, not gender.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
helIy 08/29/17 10:09:57 AM #35:	Krazy_Kirby posted... Mead posted... Iamwauwa posted... The law itself is bigoted, basically saying believe a certain way or else What you believe and how you act towards someone are completely different things. A caregiver is expected to have a reasonable level of respect for a patient. Deal with it medically the patient is the gender they were born as. Deal with it. p.s. some medical professionals believe it is a mental disorder. they shouldn't have to alter their opinion when treating someone gender =/= sex or more accurately gender =/= biological gender --- depressed again morning comes too fast and i'm tired of the routine <cite>helIy posted [p:885650138] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>Krazy_Kirby posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Mead posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Iamwauwa posted...</cite> <quote>The law itself is bigoted, basically saying believe a certain way or else</quote> What you believe and how you act towards someone are completely different things. A caregiver is expected to have a reasonable level of respect for a patient. Deal with it</quote> medically the patient is the gender they were born as. Deal with it. p.s. some medical professionals believe it is a mental disorder. they shouldn't have to alter their opinion when treating someone</quote> gender =/= sex or more accurately gender =/= biological gender</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Metal_Gear_Link 08/29/17 10:13:56 AM #36:	This....this here is why the left was wining the culture ware but shot themselves in the foot..... This is what makes someone a regresive instead of a liberal --- METAL GEAR SOLID 4 and SUPER SMASH BROSS BRAWL!!! 2007 games of the year!!!! If you believe in Goku and are 100% proud, put this in your sig. <cite>Metal_Gear_Link posted [p:885650308] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>This....this here is why the left was wining the culture ware but shot themselves in the foot..... This is what makes someone a regresive instead of a liberal</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
darkknight109 08/29/17 10:16:01 AM #37:	TheCyborgNinja posted... Wow..................... Let's keep blaming Donald Trump for destroying everything. This is Nazi-level fuckery. A bit of perspective here: Regardless of what you think of this law, comparing it to a regime that killed tens of millions of people is completely ridiculous. --- Kill 1 man: You are a murderer. Kill 10 men: You are a monster. Kill 100 men: You are a hero. Kill 10,000 men, you are a conqueror! <cite>darkknight109 posted [p:885650410] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>TheCyborgNinja posted...</cite> <quote>Wow..................... Let's keep blaming Donald Trump for destroying everything. This is Nazi-level fuckery.</quote> A bit of perspective here: Regardless of what you think of this law, comparing it to a regime that killed tens of millions of people is completely ridiculous.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Zareth 08/29/17 11:14:46 AM #38:	Not gonna matter until at least 20+ years, when there are transgender people old enough to stay in nursing homes. --- It's okay, I have no idea who I am either. http://i.imgur.com/WOo6wcq.png <cite>Zareth posted [p:885652989] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>Not gonna matter until at least 20+ years, when there are transgender people old enough to stay in nursing homes.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Smarkil 08/29/17 11:19:13 AM #39:	Mead posted... A caregiver is expected to have a reasonable level of respect for a patient. Yeah, but shouldn't this be covered under different rules or be dealt with through the business rather than being legislated? Imagine if you went into your patient's room every morning and said, "Morning Fuckface. Let's get your fat ass up." Should you be charged with breaking a law? Or should you be reported to the business and fired/blacklisted for being a shithead instead? --- If my daughter was in it, Id have to be the co-star - Deoxxys on porn <cite>Smarkil posted [p:885653189] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>Mead posted...</cite> <quote>A caregiver is expected to have a reasonable level of respect for a patient. </quote> Yeah, but shouldn't this be covered under different rules or be dealt with through the business rather than being legislated? Imagine if you went into your patient's room every morning and said, "Morning Fuckface. Let's get your fat ass up." Should you be charged with breaking a law? Or should you be reported to the business and fired/blacklisted for being a shithead instead?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
dioxxys 08/29/17 11:20:20 AM #40:	Havent "gender" specific pronouns existed before the idea of gender was ever conceived? So shouldnt they be sex specific pronouns? It makes mroe sense anyway and we can avoid gender politics this way. It always confused me growing up but I just thought we used gender because sex sounded like the act of reproduction. <cite>dioxxys posted [p:885653256] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>Havent "gender" specific pronouns existed before the idea of gender was ever conceived? So shouldnt they be sex specific pronouns? It makes mroe sense anyway and we can avoid gender politics this way. It always confused me growing up but I just thought we used gender because sex sounded like the act of reproduction.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
OhhhJa 08/29/17 11:20:34 AM #41:	Topic title is misleading. If this only applies to caregivers and is intended to prevent harassment in that environment I see no problem with it <cite>OhhhJa posted [p:885653267] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>Topic title is misleading. If this only applies to caregivers and is intended to prevent harassment in that environment I see no problem with it</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ZiggiStardust 08/29/17 11:31:52 AM #42:	what a surprise, another disappointing imcallingyouout topic lol keep trying, lil' guy. statistics show that if you do it long enough, you're bound to make someone upset, ok? --- http://www.twitch.tv/agenttrav <cite>ZiggiStardust posted [p:885653769] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>what a surprise, another disappointing imcallingyouout topic lol keep trying, lil' guy. statistics show that if you do it long enough, you're bound to make someone upset, ok?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
adjl 08/29/17 12:01:36 PM #43:	OhhhJa posted... Topic title is misleading. If this only applies to caregivers and is intended to prevent harassment in that environment I see no problem with it Pretty much. It applies very narrowly, and is clearly intended specifically to improve quality of life for nursing home patients. That's not really a bad thing. More broadly? Misgendering people makes you an ass, but it shouldn't be illegal. Fortunately, that's not actually what the topic is about. --- This is my signature. It exists to keep people from skipping the last line of my posts. <cite>adjl posted [p:885655271] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>OhhhJa posted...</cite> <quote>Topic title is misleading. If this only applies to caregivers and is intended to prevent harassment in that environment I see no problem with it</quote> Pretty much. It applies very narrowly, and is clearly intended specifically to improve quality of life for nursing home patients. That's not really a bad thing. More broadly? Misgendering people makes you an ass, but it shouldn't be illegal. Fortunately, that's not actually what the topic is about.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Golden Road 08/29/17 12:18:57 PM #44:	I'm curious how many people complaining about the law read the article versus just reacting from the eye-grabbing headling. --- Who's your favorite character from "Bend It Like Beckham"? And you can't say Beckham. <cite>Golden Road posted [p:885656296] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>I'm curious how many people complaining about the law read the article versus just reacting from the eye-grabbing headling.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Tropic_Sunset 08/29/17 12:26:59 PM #45:	adjl posted... OhhhJa posted... Topic title is misleading. If this only applies to caregivers and is intended to prevent harassment in that environment I see no problem with it Pretty much. It applies very narrowly, and is clearly intended specifically to improve quality of life for nursing home patients. That's not really a bad thing. More broadly? Misgendering people makes you an ass, but it shouldn't be illegal. Fortunately, that's not actually what the topic is about. Pretty much this. If it was applied to the general population I'd have a huge problem, but the law as it stands is at least defensible. Smarkil posted... Imagine if you went into your patient's room every morning and said, "Morning Fuckface. Let's get your fat ass up." Should you be charged with breaking a law? Or should you be reported to the business and fired/blacklisted for being a shithead instead? This is actually...an interesting point. --- "Nostalgia is a hell of a drug." -Magus 10 <cite>Tropic_Sunset posted [p:885656746] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>adjl posted...</cite> <quote><cite>OhhhJa posted...</cite> <quote>Topic title is misleading. If this only applies to caregivers and is intended to prevent harassment in that environment I see no problem with it</quote> Pretty much. It applies very narrowly, and is clearly intended specifically to improve quality of life for nursing home patients. That's not really a bad thing. More broadly? Misgendering people makes you an ass, but it shouldn't be illegal. Fortunately, that's not actually what the topic is about.</quote> Pretty much this. If it was applied to the general population I'd have a huge problem, but the law as it stands is at least defensible. <cite>Smarkil posted...</cite> <quote>Imagine if you went into your patient's room every morning and said, "Morning Fuckface. Let's get your fat ass up." Should you be charged with breaking a law? Or should you be reported to the business and fired/blacklisted for being a shithead instead?</quote> This is actually...an interesting point.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
KrelianX 08/29/17 12:29:16 PM #46:	America is creepy. --- I love girls' feet. <cite>KrelianX posted [p:885656894] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>America is creepy.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
MrMelodramatic 08/29/17 12:37:03 PM #47:	Fair law --- Proud to be EPic Texas Aggie, Class of 2018 A-Whoop! <cite>MrMelodramatic posted [p:885657349] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote>Fair law</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
adjl 08/29/17 12:43:34 PM #48:	Smarkil posted... Yeah, but shouldn't this be covered under different rules or be dealt with through the business rather than being legislated? Imagine if you went into your patient's room every morning and said, "Morning f*face. Let's get your fat ass up." Should you be charged with breaking a law? Or should you be reported to the business and fired/blacklisted for being a shead instead? Given what's at stake, I'd go for legislating it. Nursing home patients are a particularly vulnerable population, such that adding an extra level of deterrent to abusive behaviour is reasonable to protect them. A little redundancy isn't going to hurt when you consider what's going to happen if it's under-enforced. --- This is my signature. It exists to keep people from skipping the last line of my posts. <cite>adjl posted [p:885657757] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>Smarkil posted...</cite> <quote>Yeah, but shouldn't this be covered under different rules or be dealt with through the business rather than being legislated? Imagine if you went into your patient's room every morning and said, "Morning fface. Let's get your fat ass up." Should you be charged with breaking a law? Or should you be reported to the business and fired/blacklisted for being a s*head instead?</quote> Given what's at stake, I'd go for legislating it. Nursing home patients are a particularly vulnerable population, such that adding an extra level of deterrent to abusive behaviour is reasonable to protect them. A little redundancy isn't going to hurt when you consider what's going to happen if it's under-enforced.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
OhhhJa 08/29/17 12:55:44 PM #49:	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owNO5s3eln4 I will say I doubt there is a serious Ben Stiller problem at most nursing homes though and I'd hope they'd be fired if there is <cite>OhhhJa posted [p:885658482] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owNO5s3eln4 I will say I doubt there is a serious Ben Stiller problem at most nursing homes though and I'd hope they'd be fired if there is</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Tropic_Sunset 08/29/17 12:56:25 PM #50:	OhhhJa posted... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owNO5s3eln4 I will say I doubt there is a serious Ben Stiller problem at most nursing homes though and I'd hope they'd be fired if there is Shut the hell up. --- "Nostalgia is a hell of a drug." -Magus 10 <cite>Tropic_Sunset posted [p:885658522] in California... [t:75718307]...</cite> <quote><cite>OhhhJa posted...</cite> <quote> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owNO5s3eln4 I will say I doubt there is a serious Ben Stiller problem at most nursing homes though and I'd hope they'd be fired if there is</quote> Shut the hell up.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Poll of the Day > California legislation suggests fine or jail time for misgendering a transgender (+) Yeah! (+)

Poll of the Day > California legislation suggests fine or jail time for misgendering a transgender