Board 8 > Stranger Things

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neonreaper
07/01/22 7:52:10 PM
#1:


this Surfer Boy Pizza van sucks

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GuessMyUserName
07/01/22 7:53:06 PM
#2:


hey i literally just started a few hours ago

from season 1 so i'm a total noob

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HanOfTheNekos
07/02/22 5:36:39 PM
#3:


I'll bump this up.

They did some really good things with this season. Even with what I would consider to be some big misses, the season as a whole just felt really good to watch. Show isn't as clean as The Boys, but the way they did this season manages to make me stay enthralled in a whole long episode even when it's hitting some of its lows.

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XIII_rocks
07/02/22 9:35:31 PM
#4:


I'm impressed that this was the best season since the first while having so many plates to spin

Definitely felt like it was losing a few of those plates at times but it mostly fit together pretty well

Biggest asspull is definitely the Demogorgon being in the Russian prison. That whole plotline was contrived as hell. But still, good shit

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ChaosTonyV4
07/02/22 11:28:50 PM
#5:


Volume 2 was good, shame they killed the best character.

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StartTheMachine
07/03/22 1:27:09 AM
#6:


Incredible season. Definitely think it's the best one so far, though I've not gone back for any rewatches.

That final episode is truly the Return of the King of TV episodes (with like 7 "this could be the ending" moments). Has even a series finale of a show passed that run time?

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Pokewars
07/03/22 1:48:13 AM
#7:


ChaosTonyV4 posted...
Volume 2 was good, shame they killed the best character.

Steve exists so impossible.

They actually made me cry for Max's death only to still not be able to pull the trigger but I'm conflicted because I literally said "No" as tears streamed down my face but then revived but braindead? And in a coma. Man fuck that.

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HanOfTheNekos
07/03/22 1:51:19 AM
#8:


Max became a part of Vecna. We learned that's how it works. Her body is alive so that she can return to it





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Forceful_Dragon
07/03/22 2:01:09 AM
#9:


XIII_rocks posted...
I'm impressed that this was the best season since the first while having so many plates to spin

Definitely felt like it was losing a few of those plates at times but it mostly fit together pretty well

Biggest asspull is definitely the Demogorgon being in the Russian prison. That whole plotline was contrived as hell. But still, good shit

Spinning plates is a good way to put it. I felt like the pacing from hopping from group to group wasn't so great and the plot choices to try and connect the groups wasn't so great. I think the split party worked better in s3.

In S4 I just kept thinking "why is THIS the plan??"

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StartTheMachine
07/03/22 2:03:08 AM
#10:


Pokewars posted...
Steve exists so impossible.

I'm basically rooting for Steve in this whole love triangle now. But also they didn't really give Jonathan any good moments at all this season to endear you more to his character, so you know... Well played, puppet masters.

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xp1337
07/03/22 4:48:51 AM
#11:


First watched/Marathoned the series after Volume I was released and just now finished Volume II and definitely my favorite season. The Russia plot was just pure nonsense and the road trip gang was just dull in Volume I and not much better in Volume II but the Hawkins thread, which was most of the season, was the best. Losing Max is the worst because she was the best. At least we still have Dustin and Steve.

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Bane_Of_Despair
07/03/22 11:45:36 AM
#12:


I also thought the Russia plotline was the weakest of the bunch, with the California crew being the next weakest but they still did a decent job of having it all come together. Honestly I do wish they fully pulled the trigger on Max dying as that whole scene really got me, but I get why they did it the way they did and it's fine.

Strong season, 2 is definitely the weakest and 1 it's been a while since I've seen but I still pretty much love 3 and now 4 was great too. Hope they end the show strong too.

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OrangeCrush980
07/03/22 11:59:57 AM
#13:


Is this show good? I hadn't heard of it until Running Up That Hill blew up in popularity just because it was used in an episode or something.

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#14
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GANON1025
07/03/22 12:31:54 PM
#15:


I thought season 4 was great! Up there with the first one, for me.

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HanOfTheNekos
07/03/22 12:42:02 PM
#16:


I don't get how people can like the California stuff more than the Russia stuff.

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Bane_Of_Despair
07/03/22 12:57:06 PM
#17:


HanOfTheNekos posted...
I don't get how people can like the California stuff more than the Russia stuff.
Mostly because I actually really like how the bullying thing was done and how fuckin real it got with the rollerskate to the face and how horrific that would be if it happened in real life. Which granted was the starting stuff of the California plotline but I also admired how Mike handled what El was going through too and how supportive he was throughout it all

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#18
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ChaosTonyV4
07/03/22 1:28:57 PM
#19:


Bane_Of_Despair posted...
I also admired how Mike handled what El was going through too and how supportive he was throughout it all

This is very confusing, Mike was awful. He watched her get bullied and did literally nothing.

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Bane_Of_Despair
07/03/22 1:34:14 PM
#20:


ChaosTonyV4 posted...
This is very confusing, Mike was awful. He watched her get bullied and did literally nothing.
Are you thinking about Will? The whole thing was Mike didn't know she was getting bullied because she kept telling him she was fine in letters and then when he finally saw with the rollerskate incident, he wanted to make sure she was ok. But also even Will was trying to cheer her up as it went on, he just didn't do enough. Which sure you can debate on that he should have done more, but being an extremely shy and non-confrontational person I could see why he might be like that. Like it's not great obviously but again, believable at least to me.

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Pokalicious
07/03/22 1:39:25 PM
#21:


Jonathan, Will and Mike were just the worst this season. Mike in particular, is just a shitty friend and boyfriend.

California plotline was definitely the worst of the bunch.

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MysteriousStan
07/03/22 1:52:01 PM
#22:


Somehow in a show about psychics and D&D monsters coming to life I simply couldn't take two civilians getting into Russia let alone storming a Russian prison during the Cold War and coming out alive along with the person they're trying to rescue believable at all. Everything that happened during that plotline I was just kept going "how?" Which puts it below the California plotline for me.
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GANON1025
07/03/22 1:52:49 PM
#23:


What did Will do that could make you not like him?

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Bane_Of_Despair
07/03/22 1:55:26 PM
#24:


MysteriousStan posted...
Somehow in a show about psychics and D&D monsters coming to life I simply couldn't take two civilians getting into Russia let alone storming a Russian prison during the Cold War and coming out alive along with the person they're trying to rescue believable at all. Everything that happened during that plotline I was just kept going "how?" Which puts it below the California plotline for me.
yea this is kind of where I'm at with it too. I don't hate it but it's definitely the "clear 80s movie scenario fantasy dream" plotline of the season which I'm not as invested in generally, I like some more doses of realism with my crazy supernatural stories, at least in this show.

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ChaosTonyV4
07/03/22 2:04:35 PM
#25:


Bane_Of_Despair posted...
Are you thinking about Will? The whole thing was Mike didn't know she was getting bullied because she kept telling him she was fine in letters and then when he finally saw with the rollerskate incident, he wanted to make sure she was ok. But also even Will was trying to cheer her up as it went on, he just didn't do enough. Which sure you can debate on that he should have done more, but being an extremely shy and non-confrontational person I could see why he might be like that. Like it's not great obviously but again, believable at least to me.

No Im talking specifically at the roller rink, when El is in the center getting bullied and Mike goes to the DJ. He should have been swinging on the kid filming and especially the kid who threw the milkshake. Literally anyting but standing there like

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xp1337
07/03/22 2:12:04 PM
#26:


Yeah, Mike going for the DJ struck me as a bit weird in the moment too. I was surprised he didn't go to to El and the bullies on the rink.

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IfGodCouldDie
07/03/22 2:12:37 PM
#27:


MysteriousStan posted...
Somehow in a show about psychics and D&D monsters coming to life I simply couldn't take two civilians getting into Russia let alone storming a Russian prison during the Cold War and coming out alive along with the person they're trying to rescue believable at all. Everything that happened during that plotline I was just kept going "how?" Which puts it below the California plotline for me.
You doubt Karate?

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HanOfTheNekos
07/03/22 2:13:40 PM
#28:


For me, Russia had the best acting. I wasn't quite as high on it as I might be implying, but the performances were enough to keep me hooked. I also didn't find anything about California/El particularly engaging aside from Pizza guy.

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Bane_Of_Despair
07/03/22 2:14:06 PM
#29:


ChaosTonyV4 posted...
No Im talking specifically at the roller rink, when El is in the center getting bullied and Mike goes to the DJ. He should have been swinging on the kid filming and especially the kid who threw the milkshake. Literally anyting but standing there like
ChaosTonyV4 posted...
No Im talking specifically at the roller rink, when El is in the center getting bullied and Mike goes to the DJ. He should have been swinging on the kid filming and especially the kid who threw the milkshake. Literally anyting but standing there like
Part of the way El was reacting was to all the noise so Mike probably thought turning the music off would help alleviate that, and it was the closest thing to him that he could get to the fastest. And then he ran to her when they threw the milkshake on her. So like I dunno, in the moment I think what he did was at least something to try to help and split second action won't always be the most level-headed.

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Bane_Of_Despair
07/03/22 2:16:49 PM
#30:


Oh dunno how I double quoted but sure

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xp1337
07/03/22 2:25:56 PM
#31:


The thing about Russia for me is that most of the issues arise from Season 3 boxing them in. Hopper being alive and captured is arguably the most egregious instance of plot armor/contrivance in the entire series. He should have died there in Season 3 but IF he survived, that he was recovered by the Russians is another layer of absurd. Joyce and Murray don't see him and the military was inbound but they get him out of there and out of the country? Same with them having Demo-creatures. Season 3's stinger established both of these so 4 had no choice to run with these and it can't really salvage it. There's some good moments in there but also a bunch of nonsense. Yuri is also pretty intolerable too.

California Road Trip gang is a bit better IMO because we get to see how El is doing without her powers and trying to integrate into a normal life and I think the fact that it's going terribly is relatable and makes sense within the story. Jonathan is mostly just there and real talk I did not care for Argyle at all in Volume I (liked his moments a lot more in Volume II), Mike continues his spiral into unlikeability and Will is basically screaming internally at being stuck in this situation both in and out of universe. Volume II is a lot better for this crew because Will's conversation with Mike is one of the more impactful scenes as is Jonathan talking to Will later on at the pizzeria and once they link up with El again it feels more like a genuine leg of the plot but for most of the season it was just not great.

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Pokalicious
07/03/22 5:47:49 PM
#32:


GANON1025 posted...
What did Will do that could make you not like him?
Literally just that, he did nothing the whole season.

He knew (and saw, on multiples ocassions) that Eleven was being bullied and did literally nothing to help. He could've stood up for her, or hell, at least go to his mom and tell her what was going on. But nothing.

Once Mike arrived, all he did was act all weird and awkward while tagging along with his friends. And he didn't even open up to his best friend until Vol. 2 (kind of, sort of).

It's like the writers don't even know what to do with him anymore.

And yes, I know what's being foreshadowed about his sexual orientation and what not. But it went nowhere this season.

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Suprak the Stud
07/03/22 11:34:21 PM
#33:


I thought it was mostly great, with the Hawkins story line being so much better than anything else. The Russia stuff was okay-ish mostly because I liked the characters, but everything in California was a mess outside of Pizza guy.

I do feel like the are getting increasingly cowardly with the writing, coming up with more and more convoluted ways to be like "no this core cast character" isn't dead and instead killing off the one season side character instead. Hopper is the worst still, but Max this year was bad as well. I look forward to whatever character they introduce episode 1 next season dying in the finale instead of anyone of actual importance.

Also, I get that everyone likes Steve and they want him to end with a love interest, but man they could not make Jonathan any less likable. He has one good scene where he's basically like "hey man it's ok" to his brother and then he's just an absolute charisma void the rest of the season. Not that anyone in that whole plotline was any good but he stands out as somehow the least likable of this crew of unlikable characters.

Again, though, complaints aside, Hawkins saved it for me this season and I think this is very close to my favorite season of the four. If they had killed Max in that first Vecna interaction, I think that would've been an all time top tv scene for me.

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HanOfTheNekos
07/03/22 11:56:31 PM
#34:


Max dying in episode 4 would have been third grade level writing. You can't kill her there. It removes any tension from Vecna for the rest of the season. Everybody else becomes invincible.

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Bane_Of_Despair
07/03/22 11:59:36 PM
#35:


Suprak the Stud posted...
If they had killed Max in that first Vecna interaction, I think that would've been an all time top tv scene for me.

During the first encounter? Absolutely not, Max running out towards the light with Running Up That Hill playing is absolutely iconic now. Second time, yea like I said earlier I sort of wish they pulled the trigger however they at least didn't do a complete cop out with it, she got fucked up, and there was a nice interpretation of Max through the whole season that another poster on another forum I frequent had. Basically it's a journey that she's still striving towards, and I respect that there will be a light at the end of the tunnel for her (presumably)

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Suprak the Stud
07/04/22 12:35:03 AM
#36:


Erp, not first. Final. The scene after the final encounter with Vecna where we see the aftermath and Lucas is sobbing with Max in his arms and we just watched Lucas say goodbye to Eddie. That was such a fantastic scene only for 11 to show up and go "actually, no". It is the same problem as the finale to season 3 where we get the big emotional goodbye to Hopper only for the post credits scene to go "actually, no".

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HanOfTheNekos
07/04/22 12:36:26 AM
#37:


I imagine their plans make sense for keeping Max alive, though whether it's good or not, we'll have to see.


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Suprak the Stud
07/04/22 12:39:08 AM
#38:


I mean it is such a cowardly way to manipulate the audience. We get the big emotional impact of killing off Max without actually having to deal with writing the consequences with killing off Max. 11 having whatever the hell powers she can pull out of her ass to seemingly bring people back to life is just the absolute worst sort of writing, and instead of worrying about core cast members being in danger we don't have any of that tension next season. Of course Max is coming back because why the hell tease her death only to be "not really" otherwise.

It was just such an insanely frustrating conclusion to what should've been a fantastic capstone to the season.

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Suprak the Stud
07/04/22 12:42:27 AM
#39:


HanOfTheNekos posted...
I imagine their plans make sense for keeping Max alive, though whether it's good or not, we'll have to see.

After what they did with Hopper, I'm very pessimistic they actually have any plans other than "no Max is great we can't actually kill her".

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#40
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Suprak the Stud
07/04/22 12:59:22 AM
#41:


I'm actually ok with Max surviving that first encounter. It sets up what Vecna is and what Vecna is doing, and without it they'd need some sort of crazy way to explain exactly what the hell is going on to the rest of the Hawkins crew.

It is that final encounter where Vecna basically wins and kills Max. Bones broken, eyes blinded, can't feel anything at all and we see "holy shit Vecna was right. Vecna won" and then 11 pulls Jesus powers out of her ass and no, Max is actually only in a coma! She's ok! She'll be back in the next season flying a helicopter and swinging a sword in some side story you care half as much about as the main plot! That I hated.

The basketball bully getting torn in half just so they could resolve that storyline and ensure he wouldn't be around to whip the town up in a fury against Lucas who he saw with Max is just icing on top of the cake.

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ChaosTonyV4
07/04/22 1:01:02 AM
#42:


Suprak the Stud posted...
I mean it is such a cowardly way to manipulate the audience. We get the big emotional impact of killing off Max without actually having to deal with writing the consequences with killing off Max. 11 having whatever the hell powers she can pull out of her ass to seemingly bring people back to life is just the absolute worst sort of writing, and instead of worrying about core cast members being in danger we don't have any of that tension next season. Of course Max is coming back because why the hell tease her death only to be "not really" otherwise.

It was just such an insanely frustrating conclusion to what should've been a fantastic capstone to the season.

I think this is completely wrong.

Eleven went inside Max at the hospital and finds literally nothing, just darkness.
Max is completely dead.
All El did was keep her body alive.

Interpretation/theory that could potentially be next-season spoilers:

They literally said that when Vecna/Henry/001 kills someone they become a part of him. So Max will probably wake up next season, and Eleven may have a moment of confusion but she'll be so happy she won't think too hard on it.

Max might even seem a little different throughout the season, but because Henry has all of her inside of him, he can put on a good show...until a big reveal that will probably be heartbreaking and involve another character getting backstabbed.


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Suprak the Stud
07/04/22 1:09:02 AM
#43:


That would be a lot better than what I'm anticipating, so I hope you're right.

With fan favorite Hopper escaping what should've been a fatal explosion, a Russian prison (twice) and fighting off a demogorgon with a sword, I think whatever they do ends with a Max getting her mind and body back thanks to 11 doing "unspecified magic powers" to kick Vecna out of her brain. Or something.

Again, overall I really liked this season and it is super close to season 1 for me in terms of quality. Huge step up over the past two, for sure. The quality of the Russian adventure makes me worry for how they'll eventually try to resolve this, though.

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#44
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skullbone
07/04/22 4:22:24 AM
#45:


My thought is that the duffer brothers probably feel like these child actors are part of their family after working with them for the better part of 10 years. Killing one of the kids in season 4 while all of their friends get to go film season 5 feels cruel to me.

I know these kids are 18 to 20 now but I'd have a hard time writing them off of the show too if I was making the scripts.

But I also don't think we need to kill characters to raise the stakes. The stakes are fine and the hype before part 2 clearly shows people are worried about characters dying. When they don't die you don't get to pretend you weren't concerned they were going to die.

Personally I'd prefer they keep around good characters so we get to spend more time with them but maybe that's just me.

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TotallyNotMI
07/04/22 7:15:55 AM
#46:


I think El just used telekinesis on Max's heart to start it again. Not any kind of crazy resurrection power.

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HanOfTheNekos
07/04/22 11:30:24 AM
#47:


Again, if Vecna killed Max in episode 4, then the quota has been filled, and in terms of risk to main characters, there no longer is any. Not to mention that her death early on doesn't do anything - it's killing off a character for the sake of just killing someone off. It doesn't serve a narrative purpose. Death for the sake of death is NOT a good literary tool.

When Game of Thrones killed off Ned Stark, it had a purpose. When they killed off Rickon Stark, it was pointless. And Rickon living would have been MORE pointless than Max living in ST, so, yeah.

(disclaimer: not talking about end of season, will hold judgment on that)

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#48
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Metal_DK
07/04/22 1:01:46 PM
#49:


season 4 was a lot of hit and miss. Also I still think they havent had this "meaningful death" yet since

Max is not going to die obviously
Eddie was just introduced

Yes, they need to kill Steve


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HanOfTheNekos
07/04/22 1:08:54 PM
#50:


UltimaterializerX posted...
Rickon had a purpose. Ramsey was trying to bait Jon Snow into making a mistake. It worked, and Ramsey would have won the battle had Deus Ex Sansa not happened.
That entire episode didn't have plot purpose, but no, it was killing character porn and they were using a bit character because as the showrunners clearly showed, they didn't know how to kill off characters.

Characters also don't need to be killed off. Just because GoT did it doesn't mean that other shows need to echo it. Stranger Things has a bloated cast. Hopper being in Russia is convenient, but if he was just dead you'd have had Joyce and Murray trying to find a place in a plot where they already weren't sure what to do with Jonathan/Will/Mike. The show is better because Hopper lived through the end of s3.


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