Current Events > Loki singlehandedly destroyed the MCU's worldbuilding *episode 1 spoilers*

(+) Yeah! (+)

archedsoul posted...

The TVA saw that the Time Heist leaves open very little, so it was allowed to happen for the timeline to proceed.

The TVA was deployed to clean up 2012 with Loki, and 2014 with Thanos. Since Tony snapped Thanos and his gang, they just erased that entire branch.

This leave Gamora and Steve Rogers as variants. It's still not fully confirmed whether Steve created a branch or it was a closed time loop. The writers of Endgame theorize that it was a closed time loop. The Russo brothers however state it was a branch and he crossed back over into the main timeline to give Sam the shield.

TVA already showed there wasnt a branch from it as Steve coming back was what was supposed to happen for their timeline. Theres one timeline. Period. Any others get nuked. So the timeline where Steve gets old IS the only timeline. People are only variants if they do something against the sacred timeline. As Steve and Gamora did what they were supposed to, they arent variants.

008Zulu posted...

Iron Man and Captain America removing Pym Particles from the past

This one is actually addressed in the first Ant-Man. Hank Pym hates the Starks because he says Howard stole his particles back then. Howard denies it, so Pym considers him a liar and a thief. Then in Endgame we see it was actually Tony and Steve that stole the particles.

Hank was right that a Stark took them, he was just wrong about which one.

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Again, I dont think the time masters created the timeline, I just think they enforce it.

daynlokki posted...

TVA already showed there wasnt a branch from it as Steve coming back was what was supposed to happen for their timeline. Theres one timeline. Period. Any others get nuked. So the timeline where Steve gets old IS the only timeline. People are only variants if they do something against the sacred timeline. As Steve and Gamora did what they were supposed to, they arent variants.

Ehhh, I see what you're saying, but you can't have Gamora in 2023 and still be consistent with everything she did since 2014 and their method of ensuring a single timeline.

Even if it's part of the plan, when 2014 was fixed and became part of the main timeline again, Gamora kept doing everything as she did since 2014, while a second version of her, a variant by their definition, still exists doing something totally different. Gamora's removal would most definitely be a Nexus event, otherwise GotG doesn't happen and it's not the main timeline anymore.

It's the same thing with Loki. The variant is chilling with the TVA while the actual Loki was taken to Asgard after the reset.

As I said with the Steve thing, it's still unclear on the closed loop theory since even the people who made Endgame don't agree. Plus Loki's writer was asked this a few days ago and he said to just keep watching till the end.

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Whiny entitled nerds go on my ignore list, bye.

archedsoul posted...

The TVA saw that the Time Heist leaves open very little, so it was allowed to happen for the timeline to proceed.

The TVA was deployed to clean up 2012 with Loki, and 2014 with Thanos. Since Tony snapped Thanos and his gang, they just erased that entire branch.

This leave Gamora and Steve Rogers as variants. It's still not fully confirmed whether Steve created a branch or it was a closed time loop. The writers of Endgame theorize that it was a closed time loop. The Russo brothers however state it was a branch and he crossed back over into the main timeline to give Sam the shield.

lol the guys making this dont even know

They're just making it up as they go along

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JoelMiller95 posted...

Whiny entitled nerds go on my ignore list, bye.

You are on a dying Video game message board talking about the comic TV show. You are nerd too.

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archedsoul posted...

Ehhh, I see what you're saying, but you can't have Gamora in 2023 and still be consistent with everything she did since 2014 and their method of ensuring a single timeline.

Even if it's part of the plan, when 2014 was fixed and became part of the main timeline again, Gamora kept doing everything as she did since 2014, while a second version of her, a variant by their definition, still exists doing something totally different. Gamora's removal would most definitely be a Nexus event, otherwise GotG doesn't happen and it's not the main timeline anymore.

It's the same thing with Loki. The variant is chilling with the TVA while the actual Loki was taken to Asgard after the reset.

As I said with the Steve thing, it's still unclear on the closed loop theory since even the people who made Endgame don't agree. Plus Loki's writer was asked this a few days ago and he said to just keep watching till the end.

Its only a variant if they are doing something against the sacred timeline. Shes not a variant. She was expected. In fact, the sacred timeline NEEDED her to do EXACTLY what she did for it to continue to be the sacred timeline. Timeline she was from was most likely already nuked by the TVA anyways.

The people managing the timeline are essentially doing the same thing Dr Strange did in Infinity War. Just constantly. Dr Strange ALSO would have known about the 2nd Gamora. He knew the choices everyone needed to make to beat Thanos and lightly pushed everyone into their choices.

daynlokki posted...

Its only a variant if they are doing something against the sacred timeline. Shes not a variant. She was expected. In fact, the sacred timeline NEEDED her to do EXACTLY what she did for it to continue to be the sacred timeline. Timeline she was from was most likely already nuked by the TVA anyways.

The people managing the timeline are essentially doing the same thing Dr Strange did in Infinity War. Just constantly. Dr Strange ALSO would have known about the 2nd Gamora. He knew the choices everyone needed to make to beat Thanos and lightly pushed everyone into their choices.

You're confusing the plan with what the show says. Which is that once a timeline is fixed or reset, you're outside of time and have no timeline to go to. Gamora is that by their very definition. It otherwise creates a paradox if it's to be reconciled with a single timeline. A variant aided in completing the plan.

Everything Loki is about to do for Mobius is according to their plan, but it doesn't negate his status as a variant.

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archedsoul posted...

You're confusing the plan with what the show says. Which is that once a timeline is fixed or reset, you're outside of time and have no timeline to go to. Gamora is that by their very definition. It otherwise creates a paradox if it's to be reconciled with a single timeline. A variant aided in completing the plan.

Everything Loki is about to do for Mobius is according to their plan, but it doesn't negate his status as a variant.

Yes because Loki escaping wasnt a part of their plan. Once youre a variant, youre always one. Since 2nd Gamora IS a part of their plan she isnt a variant. A variant is just someone who varies from their place in the sacred timeline. If someone is planned for, they are NOT a variant. Easy enough. Now, if 2nd Gamora did something that wasnt planned for, she would then become a variant and the branching timeline would be nuked. The variant Loki is outside of the sacred timeline right now. The REAL Loki still went to Asgard and is imprisoned on the sacred timeline. Once he made the choice to escape, the timeline he was on became a variant and was destroyed. Was literally shown being destroyed.

Think of it like the movies. What we have SEEN is the sacred timeline. Everything is supposed to happen prior to Loki escaping. The writers CHOSE what they all did without any room for movement. Now, instead of Thor defeating the dark elves he goes on a drinking binge on set. Thats variant behavior as its not what was written by the writers. Thing is, once you make a choice thats where the timeline diverges. They just have to nuke the new aberrant timeline. The sacred timeline endures with the correct choice taken regardless.

archedsoul posted...

You're confusing the plan with what the show says. Which is that once a timeline is fixed or reset, you're outside of time and have no timeline to go to. Gamora is that by their very definition. It otherwise creates a paradox if it's to be reconciled with a single timeline. A variant aided in completing the plan.

Everything Loki is about to do for Mobius is according to their plan, but it doesn't negate his status as a variant.

The thing about 2nd Gamora, is that she is not a paradox because og Gamora is dead so they can never cross paths.

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daynlokki posted...

Yes because Loki escaping wasnt a part of their plan. Once youre a variant, youre always one. Since 2nd Gamora IS a part of their plan she isnt a variant. A variant is just someone who varies from their place in the sacred timeline. If someone is planned for, they are NOT a variant. Easy enough. Now, if 2nd Gamora did something that wasnt planned for, she would then become a variant and the branching timeline would be nuked. The variant Loki is outside of the sacred timeline right now. The REAL Loki still went to Asgard and is imprisoned on the sacred timeline. Once he made the choice to escape, the timeline he was on became a variant and was destroyed. Was literally shown being destroyed.

Again, you're confusing the "plan" with what the TVA really deal with, branches. Gamora went to Xander and met Quill in the main timeline. That has to happen. By her going to 2023, a branch was created, thus making her a variant. This isn't complicated.

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IfGodCouldDie posted...

The thing about 2nd Gamora, is that she is not a paradox because og Gamora is dead so they can never cross paths.

That's not the reason a paradox would form. If there's one final timeline, she has to go to Xandar to meet Quill to set off GotG. The 2nd Gamora is displaced from time, which the show states is a variant.

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archedsoul posted...

Again, you're confusing the "plan" with what the TVA really deal with, branches. Gamora went to Xander and met Quill in the main timeline. That has to happen. By her going to 2023, a branch was created, thus making her a variant. This isn't complicated.

Its only a variant if it wasnt planned. Thats what you arent understanding. They planned for her to come to 2023. It wasnt a surprise that caused a branch from the sacred timeline.
archedsoul posted...

That's not the reason a paradox would form. If there's one final timeline, she has to go to Xandar to meet Quill to set off GotG. The 2nd Gamora is displaced from time, which the show states is a variant.

No, the show says anyone who breaks the sacred timeline is a variant. Thats the definition. If their actions are in line with the sacred timeline, they wouldnt be a variant.

daynlokki posted...

No, the show says anyone who breaks the sacred timeline is a variant. Thats the definition. If their actions are in line with the sacred timeline, they wouldnt be a variant.

aka, shit writing

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UnfairRepresent posted...

aka, shit writing

Aka how it works when you have a timeline you worship with 3 fascists making sure everyone steps in line. Idk how else youd expect it to work in that case.

Its literally a metaphor for the writers of Marvel. The characters dont make choices, the writers do.

daynlokki posted...

Aka how it works when you have a timeline you worship with 3 fascists making sure everyone steps in line. Idk how else youd expect it to work in that case.

Its literally a metaphor for the writers of Marvel. The characters dont make choices, the writers do.

aka shit writing

"We don't need to put effort in or be consistent or avoid plot holes or plan things out. We just write any old shit without thought and it doesn't matter!"

That's crap writing. Its just lazy

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@UnfairRepresent how would you change it? Theres only been one timeline until now. Its all weve seen. How would you introduce a multiverse when all thats been given is a singular timeline? Since, logically, the multiverse would have been around previously? How do you explain the lack of it until now if not beings controlling said timeline making sure nobody strays?

daynlokki posted...

How would you introduce a multiverse

I wouldn't


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UnfairRepresent posted...

I wouldn't

But you need to otherwise you cant introduce X-men, Inhumans, Deadpool, or anything else to the MCU. So how are you adding in all these things without a multiverse? I mean X-men have been around since the Cuban missile crisis. Magneto threatened the president. Yet in the sacred timeline, there ARE NO MUTANTS.

A multiverse (which has been a thing for comic books for pretty much ever) is the only way to fold all this together. All the events that have happened so far can actually just slide back in. Different timelines have differing results. Also- the reason they used the X-men version of Pietro in Wandavision.

daynlokki posted...

Its only a variant if it wasnt planned. Thats what you arent understanding. They planned for her to come to 2023. It wasnt a surprise that caused a branch from the sacred timeline.

No, the show says anyone who breaks the sacred timeline is a variant. Thats the definition. If their actions are in line with the sacred timeline, they wouldnt be a variant.

I guess I'm repeating myself at this point. The plan and maintaining a single timeline are not mutually exclusive. A branch occured in 2014 with the removal of her. The cartoon clearly shows that play out while they're literally talking about what a variant is.

No point in arguing further if you disagree with that since nobody has anything concrete.


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archedsoul posted...

I guess I'm repeating myself at this point. The plan and maintaining a single timeline are not mutually exclusive. A branch occured in 2014 with the removal of her. The cartoon clearly shows that play out while they're literally talking about what a variant is.

No point in arguing further if you disagree with that since nobody has anything concrete.

Yup and they pruned the BRANCH. Shes a part of the sacred timeline now as a main player. She was expected to do literally what she did. Thats what they WANTED to steer the timeline where they wanted it to go. Shes not a variant. A variant doesnt follow the sacred timelines plan. Shes literally following it. How is that a variant to you?

About the bolded part. The plan IS about maintaining a singular timeline. The sacred timeline which they literally worship. There ARE NO OTHER TIMELINES. Every single other one gets nuked before it hits a point where it can branch further. They showed what happens when they allow one singular branch.

archedsoul posted...

That's not the reason a paradox would form. If there's one final timeline, she has to go to Xandar to meet Quill to set off GotG. The 2nd Gamora is displaced from time, which the show states is a variant.

They obviously nuked the timeline Thanos comes to the future from, which doesn't stop Gamora from meeting Quill because Quill has already met Gamora in the sacred timeline.

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This really isnt difficult. Anyone still around and not arrested cannot be a variant. They made the correct choices for the sacred timeline. The only way to BECOME a variant is to make a choice that goes against where the sacred timeline wants to go. That causes a branch. Those branches are all nuked almost immediately. You think the snap was bad? These guys kill EVERYONE from EVERY PLANET each time a branch is made.

Now, can you make the correct choices for the sacred timeline and still create a branch? Yup. Every choice literally would make a branch regardless. They just get pruned immediately. You wouldnt even notice it in your sacred timeline.

UnfairRepresent posted...

I wouldn't

Then why would anybody care what you think?

IfGodCouldDie posted...

They obviously nuked the timeline Thanos comes to the future from, which doesn't stop Gamora from meeting Quill because Quill has already met Gamora in the sacred timeline.

By removing Gamora from 2014, a branch was created. The TVA reset it, which means Gamora went to Xander. The branch is eliminated. Gamora is displaced, which is what the shows says is a variant. The actual word variant itself means different version of the same, which she is. That's all I was kind of saying.

As for daynlokki, I am not gonna waste my time repeating myself for the 5th time. I've been pretty clear and you're welcome to your understanding.

Especially since we have no idea what Gamora is currently up to nor how big of a part the TVA plays in the future of the MCU. For all we know, they do show up to talk to her in GotG 3 or some shit.

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archedsoul posted...

By removing Gamora from 2014, a branch was created. The TVA reset it, which means Gamora went to Xander. The branch is eliminated. Gamora is displaced, which is what the shows says is a variant. The actual word variant itself means different version of the same, which she is. That's all I was kind of saying.

As for daynlokki, I am not gonna waste my time repeating myself for the 5th time. I've been pretty clear and you're welcome to your understanding.

Especially since we have no idea what Gamora is currently up to nor how big of a part the TVA plays in the future of the MCU. For all we know, they do show up to talk to her in GotG 3 or some shit.

I mean the show literally says the definition is someone making a choice the sacred timeline doesnt want lol. Gamora made a choice that was a part of the timeline. How is that a variant to you again? You dont seem to understand this very, very basic concept. To be a variant you must do something that isnt a part of the sacred timeline. She did not. What she did was literally a major part OF the sacred timeline. Therefore, she cannot be a variant.

Variants allowed to roam create constant branches as seen by Loki 3.

Also, would point out they know everything that is supposed to happen. To the TVA, its all happening at the same time. Past and future are one. Ergo why time is different here is a thing. They showed Loki the future as to that version none of that had occurred. They can travel to any point in the timeline for branches.

Yeah, it's really not that complicated. Gamora isn't a variant. How do we know? Because the TVA obliterates them. Mobius saving Loki is said to put him way out on a limb, indicating it's *not* something they typically do.

The TVA doesn't care about paradoxes, time doubles, or anything else. They only care that you follow the rules.
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IfGodCouldDie posted...

You understand that every single thing has happened has happened because that's the way they were written, yea?

Of course I understand that. The difference is that the writers aren't a functioning part of the universe. We could imagine before that Loki's character was so well-cemented that he would only ever use the Tesseract to escape to the Gobi desert. But we know that's not the case now, as there must be a non-variant Loki that stole the Tesseract, otherwise the TVA would surely deem the Avengers's time heist as "off-script".

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daynlokki posted...

I mean the show literally says the definition is someone making a choice the sacred timeline doesnt want lol. Gamora made a choice that was a part of the timeline. How is that a variant to you again? You dont seem to understand this very, very basic concept. To be a variant you must do something that isnt a part of the sacred timeline. She did not. What she did was literally a major part OF the sacred timeline. Therefore, she cannot be a variant.

Variants allowed to roam create constant branches as seen by Loki 3.

Also, would point out they know everything that is supposed to happen. To the TVA, its all happening at the same time. Past and future are one. Ergo why time is different here is a thing. They showed Loki the future as to that version none of that had occurred. They can travel to any point in the timeline for branches.

The reason I am agreeing to disagree is because we see the fundamentals differently and there's no proof that there's branches that just happen and are not Nexus events. Every branch has to close. Every branch is a Nexus event because a Nexus event is the split itself. All splits are unnatural to a single timeline. Whether they temporarily allow you to proceed to achieve a goal farther in the timeline is a different story.

The Avengers were sanctioned. Even if they were to break any rules, they were allowed to and almost everything was returned to how it was except for Loki, Gamora and possibly Cap. Just like how Loki has been sanctioned now to meddle in the affairs of the main timeline.

So with that out of the way, what I'm saying is that anybody displaced from their timeline is a variant because splits only happen when a different choice is made from the original. And that's called a Nexus event. All per the cartoon. If you disagree with all this, that's fine.


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i think a major issue here is that we're working with unreliable narrators for the first time in the mcu. nebula and hulk explained time travel in endgame, but did it actually work the way they thought it did? miss minutes explained the purpose of the tva, but is it truth or propaganda?

these kind of discussions are awesome, but everyone needs to keep in mind there aren't always correct answers. sometimes they come eventually, sometimes all we'll ever get is speculation.

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Medussa posted...

i think a major issue here is that we're working with unreliable narrators for the first time in the mcu. nebula and hulk explained time travel in endgame, but did it actually work the way they thought it did? miss minutes explained the purpose of the tva, but is it truth or propaganda?

these kind of discussions are awesome, but everyone needs to keep in mind there aren't always correct answers. sometimes they come eventually, sometimes all we'll ever get is speculation.

Yes, I'm enjoying the discussion as well, even though I obviously don't care for the show.

Unfortunately, it seems like all of the Disney+ MCU shows were written by people who had cool ideas and gave no further thought to the way that they fit into the MCU itself. "What if everything was a sitcom? What if Sam and Bucky fought crime? What if time cops?"

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JoelMiller95 posted...

Whiny entitled nerds go on my ignore list, bye.

Well, it's too bad we can't have genuine discussions about media without people calling each other names.

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Medussa posted...

i think a major issue here is that we're working with unreliable narrators for the first time in the mcu. nebula and hulk explained time travel in endgame, but did it actually work the way they thought it did? miss minutes explained the purpose of the tva, but is it truth or propaganda?

these kind of discussions are awesome, but everyone needs to keep in mind there aren't always correct answers. sometimes they come eventually, sometimes all we'll ever get is speculation.

On point. I agree, which is why I started moving away myself. I think we're too early with this and they could throw us all sorts of curve balls and whatnot.

Still, it's a lot of fun to discuss these pointless things lol. We just had a 2 year break from the MCU.

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archedsoul posted...

The reason I am agreeing to disagree is because we see the fundamentals differently and there's no proof that there's branches that just happen and are not Nexus events. Every branch has to close. Every branch is a Nexus event because a Nexus event is the split itself. All splits are unnatural to a single timeline. Whether they temporarily allow you to proceed to achieve a goal farther in the timeline is a different story.

The Avengers were sanctioned. Even if they were to break any rules, they were allowed to and almost everything was returned to how it was except for Loki, Gamora and possibly Cap. Just like how Loki has been sanctioned now to meddle in the affairs of the main timeline.

So with that out of the way, what I'm saying is that anybody displaced from their timeline is a variant because splits only happen when a different choice is made from the original. And that's called a Nexus event. All per the cartoon. If you disagree with all this, that's fine.

Yup and the timeline they chose as the sacred timeline is the one in which Gamora 2 does exactly as she did. They snipped the other timeline bud. They literally show the one timeline and explain any branch allowed to keep going creates more and more branches. Theres one timeline. Anything in that timeline cannot be a variant. Every action Gamora 2 has taken and will take (until the multiverse begins) is a part of the sacred timeline. If she were a variant out there, shed be creating more and more branches with literally every choice she made. You arent getting that portion of being a variant.

Cheese_Crackers posted...

Yes, I'm enjoying the discussion as well, even though I obviously don't care for the show.

Unfortunately, it seems like all of the Disney+ MCU shows were written by people who had cool ideas and gave no further thought to the way that they fit into the MCU itself. "What if everything was a sitcom? What if Sam and Bucky fought crime? What if time cops?"

This is based in the comics well before Disney even touched the MCU.

Dude, you're repeating yourself like a broken record and it's getting tiring af. I explained well where I'm coming from and it's pretty damn sound. If you see it differently, that's on you, especially when you take into consideration what Medussa said.

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daynlokki posted...

Yup and the timeline they chose as the sacred timeline is the one in which Gamora 2 does exactly as she did. They snipped the other timeline bud. They literally show the one timeline and explain any branch allowed to keep going creates more and more branches. Theres one timeline. Anything in that timeline cannot be a variant. Every action Gamora 2 has taken and will take (until the multiverse begins) is a part of the sacred timeline. If she were a variant out there, shed be creating more and more branches with literally every choice she made. You arent getting that portion of being a variant.

It actually says that they took a bunch of timelines and mushed them into one, and are just snipping off new branches as they grow. It's entirely possible that they accounted for some duplicates to replace themselves if they are important to keeping a future event in line.

If they're just choosing whichever favorable outcome from the possible ones of the combined timelines, allowing a person to migrate from one to another in order to keep a more favorable one is probably acceptable. Also explains how Strange saw millions of outcomes, if only one was possible.

I think the TVA is much more lenient than than they appear and are just using propaganda and snipping timelines for a reason other than protecting the sacred one. Guess we'll see, but if events like endgame and Gamora replacing herself are allowed, it looks like the timekeepers arent as iron fisted over time shenanigans as long as they sort themselves out. It Loki's removal of the stone that branched him out of the sacred timeline, and I doubt he'd be willing to go back and do things the "right" way after.

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KogaSteelfang posted...

It actually says that they took a bunch of timelines and mushed them into one, and are just snipping off new branches as they grow. It's entirely possible that they accounted for some duplicates to replace themselves if they are important to keeping a future event in line.

If they're just choosing whichever favorable outcome from the possible ones of the combined timelines, allowing a person to migrate from one to another in order to keep a more favorable one is probably acceptable. Also explains how Strange saw millions of outcomes, if only one was possible.

I think the TVA is much more lenient than than they appear and are just using propaganda and snipping timelines for a reason other than protecting the sacred one. Guess we'll see, but if events like endgame and Gamora replacing herself are allowed, it looks like the timekeepers arent as iron fisted over time shenanigans as long as they sort themselves out. It Loki's removal of the stone that branched him out of the sacred timeline, and I doubt he'd be willing to go back and do things the "right" way after.

They arent hamfisted because as they said, the Avengers did what they wanted. Just like everything Gamora did is exactly what they wanted. Theres only one timeline right now. They explain that and how if they allow even one variation itll branch out into another multiverse war. As there has already been one based on their stuff, this timeline won and isnt allowing another to possibly dethrone them.

KogaSteelfang posted...

It Loki's removal of the stone that branched him out of the sacred timeline, and I doubt he'd be willing to go back and do things the "right" way after.

i think this touches on how things get fixed. the tva took 2012b loki back to the sacred timeline and then did <something> to prune the branch. my theory is, that it burns it back to the moment the branch is formed, thus 2012a loki is still captured as we saw in Avengers. if the tva didn't take 2012b loki, he would have burned with the branch, but the tva rules give him a trial (sham though it may be), and burn him afterward. mobius stopped that last part, for reasons, so there are still 2 lokis out there, when normally the tva just undoes what the variant fucked up and nobody else notices any of their shenanigans, because they only ever operate in the branches they burn.

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Medussa posted...

i think this touches on how things get fixed. the tva took 2012b loki back to the sacred timeline and then did <something> to prune the branch. my theory is, that it burns it back to the moment the branch is formed, thus 2012a loki is still captured as we saw in Avengers. if the tva didn't take 2012b loki, he would have burned with the branch, but the tva rules give him a trial (sham though it may be), and burn him afterward. mobius stopped that last part, for reasons, so there are still 2 lokis out there, when normally the tva just undoes what the variant fucked up and nobody else notices any of their shenanigans, because they only ever operate in the branches they burn.

3 Lokis but yes. Where the TVA is located is outside of the timeline somehow so variants cant cause further branching. Loki is being used to hunt himself and as hes only going to be going to already branched timelines, his actions wont effect the sacred timeline as he does so. They always clip the branches anyways after Loki3

i wasn't going to speculate on the third loki, since there's basically zero known yet.

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daynlokki posted...

They arent hamfisted because as they said, the Avengers did what they wanted. Just like everything Gamora did is exactly what they wanted. Theres only one timeline right now. They explain that and how if they allow even one variation itll branch out into another multiverse war. As there has already been one based on their stuff, this timeline won and isnt allowing another to possibly dethrone them.

It literally shows and states that they took multiple timelines and created a single one out of them. So, I'd assume using a spare part from one timeline to fix the main one wouldn't be as big of an issue if it results in the favorable outcome. It'd explain why Gamora and 2014 Thanos and Nebula arent variants get pruned, despite time shenanigans, they resolved themselves and ended up with all the important parts where they belonged, aside from Loki. Which is what we're seeing in his show.

I just think it's lame to say it was all predestined to play out exactly as we saw when the groundwork is there to still allow for what we saw to have happened and make sense with free will. Of course we'll learn more as the story continues, but allowing just a little bit of wiggle room goes a long way in explaining how it might work.

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Medussa posted...

i wasn't going to speculate on the third loki, since there's basically zero known yet.

Well they did say he was hunting himself. Doesnt sound like speculation.
KogaSteelfang posted...

It literally shows and states that they took multiple timelines and created a single one out of them. So, I'd assume using a spare part from one timeline to fix the main one wouldn't be as big of an issue if it results in the favorable outcome. It'd explain why Gamora and 2014 Thanos and Nebula arent variants get pruned, despite time shenanigans, they resolved themselves and ended up with all the important parts where they belonged, aside from Loki. Which is what we're seeing in his show.

I just think it's lame to say it was all predestined to play out exactly as we saw when the groundwork is there to still allow for what we saw to have happened and make sense with free will. Of course we'll learn more as the story continues, but allowing just a little bit of wiggle room goes a long way in explaining how it might work.

Technically there is free will. Just whenever they make a choice that wasnt part of the sacred timeline (notice the singular in the name, not plural), that timeline gets pruned. The people still made every single choice. Its just that any version that made a differing choice was nuked to oblivion along with everyone else on that timeline. They say in the cartoon they cannot allow any branches. ANY.

crap, i just realized i messed up my theory post and it's too late to edit. i'm going to delete it and fix it here, plus some updates. sorry for the thread discontinuity, tva.

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KogaSteelfang posted...

It Loki's removal of the stone that branched him out of the sacred timeline, and I doubt he'd be willing to go back and do things the "right" way after.

i think this touches on how things get fixed. the tva took 2012b loki back to tva hq and then did <something> to prune the branch he created. my theory is, that <something> burns it back to the moment the branch is formed, thus 2012a loki is still captured as we saw in Avengers. if the tva didn't take 2012b loki, he would have burned with the branch, but the tva rules give him a trial (sham though it may be), and burn him afterward. mobius stopped that last part, for reasons, so there are still 2 lokis out there (and apparently at least a third, whom we're not yet aware from when he was taken), when normally the tva just undoes what the variant fucked up and nobody else notices any of their shenanigans, because they only ever operate in the branches they burn.

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daynlokki posted...

This is based in the comics well before Disney even touched the MCU.

That has nothing to do with it. They're writing properties for the MCU, not the comics. And if the same thing happened in the comics then it was bad writing there, too.

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Cheese_Crackers posted...

That has nothing to do with it. They're writing properties for the MCU, not the comics. And if the same thing happened in the comics then it was bad writing there, too.

Are you under the assumption that comics and the movies are the pinnacle of writing or something?

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IfGodCouldDie posted...

Are you under the assumption that comics and the movies are the pinnacle of writing or something?

No? I'm not sure what would give you that impression. The point of my previous post is that the "it comes from the comics" defense isn't a valid defense at all.

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Cheese_Crackers posted...

That has nothing to do with it. They're writing properties for the MCU, not the comics. And if the same thing happened in the comics then it was bad writing there, too.

Yes and those comics were before Disney. This was always the direction it had to go to get everything in the same universe.

Its strange time travel meant nothing

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