Board 8 > Politics Containment Topic 307: Tulsa Staggered

(+) Yeah! (+)

Corrik7 posted...

Kentucky is a state that lets you go to vote if you work that day.

Kentucky law is that it's unpaid voting leave, and your employer gets to decide when you take it, not you.

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StealThisSheen posted...

The solution being "Instead of having small crowds of people at multiple stations, let's have large crowds of people wait in line at one station" doesn't make sense to any logical person.

My previous voting place was a tiny, 12x12 waiting room at a nursing home.

My current location is a college football stadium.

Have you ever heard of the term social distancing?

Given the intense anger directed at turbopuns, I'm assuming that the closure of polling stations probably helps McGrath and hurt Booker.

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StealThisSheen posted...

Kentucky law is that it's unpaid voting leave, and your employer gets to decide when you take it, not you.

Well, obviously they will do it around their workforce staggered to not cause work issues. I would be kind of suspect if I tried to choose my own time to go do it.

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turbopuns3 posted...

My previous voting place was a tiny, 12x12 waiting room at a nursing home.

My current location is a college football stadium.

Have you ever heard of the term social distancing?

More locations = less people = easier to actually enforce social distancing during the entire process.

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StealThisSheen posted...

More locations = less people = easier to actually enforce social distancing during the entire process.

Not when they all rush at the deadline to vote in cramped spaces.

I mean, if you have an issue with the voting here, you should be blaming the Coronavirus. Not nefarious voter suppression to help whoever.

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I've heard that the reasoning for closing the polling stations actually relates to not having enough poll workers due to the pandemic

Which makes a lot of sense when you consider the typical demographic for poll workers is elderly retirees

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VintageGin posted...

I've heard that the reasoning for closing the polling stations actually relates to not having enough poll workers due to the pandemic

Which makes a lot of sense when you consider the typical demographic for poll workers is elderly retirees

This tracks with my experience working at a polling place. I expect there is a great deal of truth to it.

All the more reason why we absolutely, 100% need universal mail-in balloting during the pandemic. There is no other way to solve this problem, period.

If you've been going to the polls right after work for years, getting there at, say, 5:40, with no problems, and then this year that doesn't work because they've shut down 90% of the polling sites, that is not an instance of you being "irresponsible." A voter should not have to keep up with that, and assume that they won't be allowed to vote just because they weren't in the building in time.

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https://twitter.com/NationalistTV/status/1275588519235391490

I am all here for millennials kicking the shit out of Trump's handpicked losers

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VintageGin posted...

I've heard that the reasoning for closing the polling stations actually relates to not having enough poll workers due to the pandemic

Which makes a lot of sense when you consider the typical demographic for poll workers is elderly retirees

I heard that as well, but my step-father who lives in Kentucky was told he and many people he knows who typically worked the polls were outright turned down/told they weren't needed.

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Voters simply should not have to scramble to their polling place after work in the first place - the fact that we force people to do this sickens me

Jakyl25 posted...

Gonna ask a potentially ignorant question

These votes were primaries right? Who benefits from suppression in that instance

If I had to guess, I'd say long lines and inability to vote could lead to reduced turnout in the general election due to voters deciding not to bother after a bad experience. It could also hurt enthusiasm for the eventual candidate if the primary is close enough that the result could have been changed if voters weren't turned away. Either way, it only benefits groups that want to make democracy look bad.
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SmartMuffin posted...

https://twitter.com/NationalistTV/status/1275588519235391490

I am all here for millennials kicking the shit out of Trump's handpicked losers

That is quite the name
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LordoftheMorons posted...

If you've been going to the polls right after work for years, getting there at, say, 5:40, with no problems, and then this year that doesn't work because they've shut down 90% of the polling sites, that is not an instance of you being "irresponsible." A voter should not have to keep up with that, and assume that they won't be allowed to vote just because they weren't in the building in time.

Isn't that literally a perfect example of ignorance and irresponsibility?


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In 2016, only a quarter of polling stations served more than 2000 people.

Louisville has only one polling station serving more than 600000 people. That's a problem to say the least.

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Corrik7 posted...

Isn't that literally a perfect example of ignorance and irresponsibility?

The point that youre gonna get hit back with is that ignorant and irresponsible people still should get to vote
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For the record, as someone who doesnt care for democracy, my only care in this fight is whatever helps get Republicans out of office
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Corrik7 posted...

Isn't that literally a perfect example of ignorance and irresponsibility?

The after work vote is not a new thing. At all. The average voter should be able to assume that if the state is closing down so many polling places, then they are well equipped/have plans in place to deal with the after work rush properly, instead of finding out... No, no measures were put in place, if you couldn't get a parking space and get in the doors in time, you're just fucked.

EDIT: A voter should not be punished for arriving in time but missing the vote because it took 30 minutes for them to park and get inside the building due to improper planning by the station.

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Corrik7 posted...

Isn't that literally a perfect example of ignorance and irresponsibility?

It does not matter whether voters are ignorant, irresponsible, stupid, or what have you - it is purposeful voter suppression by the government put in place any rules that hinder people from voting. If they wanted everyone to vote, it would be easier for everyone to vote. They don't want everyone to vote.

I can't believe someone I saw in this topic series making up fifty excuses for how it is understandable that someone might have to drunk drive is now arguing "should have prepared ahead of time and known all possible information and prepared for all possibilities" but here we are

StealThisSheen posted...

The after work vote is not a new thing. At all. The average voter should be able to assume that if the state is closing down so many polling places, then they are well equipped/have plans in place to deal with the after work rush properly, instead of finding out... No, no measures were put in place, if you couldn't get a parking space and get in the doors in time, you're just fucked.

EDIT: A voter should not be punished for arriving in time but missing the vote because it took 30 minutes for them to park and get inside the building due to improper planning by the station.

So it sounds like you have an issue with how they tackled voting due to the Coronavirus, not nefarious voter suppression to help a candidate right?

The weird part is prior to the election, people were already crying voter suppression.

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GentlemanGamer posted...

It does not matter whether voters are ignorant, irresponsible, stupid, or what have you - it is purposeful voter suppression by the government put in place any rules that hinder people from voting. If they wanted everyone to vote, it would be easier for everyone to vote. They don't want everyone to vote.

I can't believe someone I saw in this topic series making up fifty excuses for how it is understandable that someone might have to drunk drive is now arguing "should have prepared ahead of time and known all possible information and prepared for all possibilities" but here we are

Who didn't see misdirection with made up arguments coming to in their mind claim moral high ground in a discussion.

Literally all yinz can ever do.

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Corrik7 posted...

The weird part is prior to the election, people were already crying voter suppression.

Would you like to know why?

JeffreyRaze posted...

In 2016, only a quarter of polling stations served more than 2000 people.

Louisville has only one polling station serving more than 600000 people. That's a problem to say the least.

Because that is ridiculous by any stretch

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StealThisSheen posted...

Would you like to know why?

Because that is ridiculous by any stretch

That sounds a bit ridiculous of an idea on paper at least.

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Corrik7 posted...

That sounds a bit ridiculous of an idea on paper at least.

So you can understand why people would see that and be like "Wait, hold up."

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Basically, when you have a change from "Only a quarter of polling stations served over 2000 people in 2016" to "One polling station for 600,000 people," the only real answers are either it's been done for nefarious reasons, or those that came up with it are so shockingly inept that it's not much better.

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StealThisSheen posted...

So you can understand why people would see that and be like "Wait, hold up."

It is a jarring number without any context to why, yes.

So then the thought should be to why was this decision made. (Assuming accurate information).

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I read in a very quick browse right now before leaving for work the 600k polling station in Louisville has 10 days to vote at it instead of the single day.

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Corrik7 posted...

I read in a very quick browse right now before leaving for work the 600k polling station in Louisville has 10 days to vote at it instead of the single day.

While that's true, I'm pretty sure Kentucky's voting leave law only applies to the specific election day/s. And those 10 days were all weekdays.

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Even assuming you could spread the voters out perfectly, that'd still be 60k people for that station.

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Basically, I'll leave it at this.

They took other measures to make voting easier. Those were good.

But can we agree that, no matter the reason, the idea to close polling stations to the point that you end up with a scenario like Louisville having one polling station for 600,000 people is, at the very best, incredibly misguided/inept, and is still a problem that needs to be answered instead of brushed aside and blamed on the voters?

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Oh right, I'm sorry for not getting back to you with the data Corrik, but I couldn't find consistent numbers (or any numbers in some cases) and got frustrated and stopped. My bad on that one.

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JeffreyRaze posted...

Oh right, I'm sorry for not getting back to you with the data Corrik, but I couldn't find consistent numbers (or any numbers in some cases) and got frustrated and stopped. My bad on that one.

All good, bud.

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Jakyl25 posted...

Gonna ask a potentially ignorant question

These votes were primaries right? Who benefits from suppression in that instance

There was a competitive progressive in the Democratic Senate candidate race so clearly this is all a ploy by the democratic establishment!

More serious answer is that while neither party may stand to gain a direct advantage over the other in the primary, a confusing primary voting process makes it more likely for the general to be bad as well. For example, how many of the closed locations are going to open back up for the general? This is really easy cover for the state to open up less than they shut down and pretend they solved it, so that's one thing I can think to look for.

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https://twitter.com/gravelinstitute/status/1275603153392721925?s=21

Truly this must be a sign
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nice

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for once reading the comments is a good thing

nice

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nice

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https://twitter.com/PpollingNumbers/status/1275606869529296898?s=20

all my homies support bowman

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changmas posted...

https://twitter.com/PpollingNumbers/status/1275606869529296898?s=20

all my homies support bowman

you love to see it

https://twitter.com/JordanUhl/status/1275609257849827330

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Jakyl25 posted...

Gonna ask a potentially ignorant question

These votes were primaries right? Who benefits from suppression in that instance

I don't think it applies in Kentucky but I suppose theoretically you could try to exploit this in a jungle primary (all candidates for a particular seat are in the primary with no division by party and the top two advance to the general.)

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turbopuns3 posted...

Like gosh dang you guys are being like college professors who hear "my dog ate my homework" and your reaction is to apologize to the student for your transgressions

MoogleKupo141 posted...

what

basically what I was getting at is, the poll hours have been 6am-6pm for years. that's never changed. so, when some people walked up to the door after 6pm and it was locked, it just shouldn't be that shocking or like "wow, suppression". it's the same rule that has been in place forever. in the videos that have surfaced of the people waiting outside and then getting let in eventually, you can see, by generous estimate a few hundred people. let's say that crowd had 500 people in it. 500 people who were late. out of 600,000. So that's what, about 0.08% of people in the precinct didn't get there on time. is this malicious, cruel, systemic racism with the aim of favoring a certain candidate over the other? the reactions on twitter to the people banging on locked doors, you'd think the country just got invaded by a foreign army and our troops just stood by and watched. do you think a random traffic jam never caused someone to miss an election before and they cried about it because it made them so sad they missed their chance? I get we are in tumultuous times and I get people are very passionate about wanting to vote, and the woman who is on video crying over her daughter being able to vote for the first time is touching and sad, but if you were not in that door before 6pm it's not the government's fault, holy shit!

now all that said it's still pretty stupid that the polls close at 6pm I have no idea why it's that early. and thank goodness they did reopen those doors so people could vote, because why shouldn't the deadline be later? but it's just so weird to me to suggest that this was specifically set up to screw over certain people or a certain candidate. anyone who wanted to vote had the ability to do so.

StealThisSheen posted...

But can we agree that, no matter the reason, the idea to close polling stations to the point that you end up with a scenario like Louisville having one polling station for 600,000 people is, at the very best, incredibly misguided/inept, and is still a problem that needs to be answered instead of brushed aside and blamed on the voters?

Let's not pretend that they tried to squeeze 600,000 people into a building. Over 200,000 absentee ballots were requested...and yeah I mean, *obviously* having more locations is better in general. But it's also better if McDonald's doesn't close for 2 months. Or the movie theater. Or the library. Or whatever. But we are in a pandemic so we are trying to adapt and adjust our expectations. We are treading in unfamiliar territory here. The eagerness of people to jump up and shout "corruption!" is just...a little trigger happy to me, when you realize more Kentuckians are possibly voting than ever.

turbopuns3 posted...

now all that said it's still pretty stupid that the polls close at 6pm I have no idea why it's that early.

Bruh people have been trying to tell you the reason

It's to make it harder to vote

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Well I think puns point is voting is way up overall and if their intention for this specific election was to make sure it was harder for people to vote, they wouldn't have introduced to excuse absentee voting to every single person in the state.

(Also results are early but both democratic candidates combined are way behind McConnell by himself. I really hope this isn't a race democrats are dumb enough to sink national resources into unless those numbers tighten a lot.)

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I know McGrath got a ton of contributions from people from people seeing her as an alternative to McConnell.

I don't think there's any real risk of the national party lighting their money on fire in Kentucky in a hopeless fight but regular people might keep sending barrels of cash that way.

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McGrath already lost a house seat in a non-presidential wave election year in a district that was more blue than Kentucky as a whole, so I have been very skeptical as this as a real race to watch. I at least like Booker way more policywise, but I don't think he'd perform any better than McGrath. The results so far confirm this as lost cause territory.

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Meanwhile, in Idaho...

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/idaho-reps-bogus-special-session-to-limit-guvs-covid-authority-ends-with-a-whimper

A group of far-right Idaho House reps tried to hold an unconstitutional special session to overturn the governor's COVID-19 measures. They were backed by, among others, Bundy - that guy involved with the armed standoffs with the government these past few years - who brought people for "crowd control" at the capitol.

I say unconstitutional because the Idaho Constitution states only the Governor can call a special session. They got some libertarian group to make up some bogus legal opinion to explain "nuh-uh actually we can" by declaring the pandemic an "enemy attack."

Ultimately it just turned into a whine-fest because they couldn't even get enough members for a quorum (and the Idaho Senate nope'd hard away from this) but they still had 15 out of 70 there and were saying some absolutely crazy and dangerous shit.

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StealThisSheen posted...

And that is not the fault of the voters, no matter how many times you want to call them "lazy" or "morons."

Let's be clear by the way I never used either of those words.

You're right, I shouldn't have used quotes, as you implied it without actually using those words.

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I never implied that either.

StealThisSheen posted...

You are so damn determined to make this "It's the voters' fault, blame the voters" and don't want to accept there's any blame at all on the other side.

You're twisting things on me here dude. I started this conversation by saying how people are unfairly criticizing the state of systemic racism and voter suppression. People here said "well those things are happening" and I said no they're not because the state is making every possible good faith effort to help everyone who wants to vote, vote. And let's be clear - everyone who wants to vote, could vote. Full stop.

So I'm not blaming anything on anyone. I'm saying people are crying out in an exaggerated way over something that is not even remotely on the scale of problems that would warrant the reactions. Like, where is the outcry coming from? It's not the people standing outside the doors in Louisville who were creating national news themselves. It was the whole country kneejerk reacting to contextless numbers and jumping to conclusions.

I'm just proud of my state and of my governor and the steps which have been taken to empower people to vote while being protected from covid.

I'm not here to blame anyone for anything but yes if you show up late it's certainly not anyone else's fault.