Board 8 > All-Purpose Wrestling Topic 197: In which we pay our respects to Maxine

(+) Yeah! (+)

It is unlike you to engage in straw manning!

Your tagline is usually "fair and balanced."

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Ace Detective in Sir Chris' Police
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I don't know about Steen. I feel like he could easily get into TNA or maybe WWE.

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Whatever...

WWE doesn't usually seem to discriminate too much between "big" and "fat."

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Ace Detective in Sir Chris' Police
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Just to wash some of the bad Madden taste out of my mouth, I will say that the column is still trolling in its purest form: something meant to not be constructive but instead to merely draw the ire of people. It's not about the truthfulness of your words, it's the intent behind how you deliver your message that makes you a heel, and Mark Madden is certainly a real life heel.

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Thank you, Eddie Guerrero.
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From: Rad Link 5 | #353
WWE doesn't usually seem to discriminate too much between "big" and "fat."

With Triple H making the hiring decisions they will.

I believe I've said this before, but one of the major differences between Vince and Triple H is how they view size. They both cream themselves over a big buff guy like Batista, but as a second choice Trips prefers a small toned guy while Vince prefers a big fatso.

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Thank you, Eddie Guerrero.
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And Steen is indie for life unless he can find a role as a manager or in a tag team.

Even when he's in shape he doesn't have "the look."

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Thank you, Eddie Guerrero.
http://www.wwe.com/f/styles/photo_large/public/photo/image/2012/04/33_Moscow_04112012jg_02128.jpg

Something about the way Steen looks shirtless makes me slightly nauseous, that is true.

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Ace Detective in Sir Chris' Police
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He might make a good color commentator if he wanted to go that route.

Hell I'd pay to see him replace Taz.

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Thank you, Eddie Guerrero.
http://www.wwe.com/f/styles/photo_large/public/photo/image/2012/04/33_Moscow_04112012jg_02128.jpg

In ROH's defense, I think they're hoping they can draw people in by continuously reminding everyone that they had Punk, Dragon and Aries first (hello DVD compilations), and then try to keep those new fans just by being different from WWE and TNA and having an okay roster. I've seen more than a few ROH fans who didn't even really know ROH existed until Summer of Punk II, believe it or not.

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Ace Detective in Sir Chris' Police
I read your posts like you're a sourpuss because you often come across that way. - LeonhartFour

ROH being in financial problems is nothing new. If they weren't run by money marks they'd be either just another indy or out of business long ago. Heck, it's gotten so bad they stopped booking El Generico.

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yeah, ROH does have some notable talent still within it that's growing that you didn't mention (Cole, O'Reilly, Eddie, Elgin) but much of that will be picked up too.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

Oh, we're talking about Kevin Steen now? Let me contribute.



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Xbox GT: PrivateBiscuit1
Down with Zhang. Let there be Biscuit!

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

Steen hates you all.

Which is why we all love him.

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Dr voltchball - best in the world.

From: Jakyl25 | #350

I hate to side with Madden but I think he wins this one.

Talent beats Hard Work every time.

Madden can write halfway-decent articles, it's just that 95% of his articles show his never-ending grudge against DDP. And while DDP might have been a bit of a douche backstage, Madden is still grinding an axe over a wrestler who got him fired from a now-defunct company (11 years later, on top of that).

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http://zerosignal620.wordpress.com/
Dallas Cowboys: 8-8 --- Next Game: Next Year =(

ZeroSignal620 posted...

From: Jakyl25 | #350

I hate to side with Madden but I think he wins this one.

Talent beats Hard Work every time.

Madden can write halfway-decent articles, it's just that 95% of his articles show his never-ending grudge against DDP. And while DDP might have been a bit of a douche backstage, Madden is still grinding an axe over a wrestler who got him fired from a now-defunct company (11 years later, on top of that).

Madden does sports-based drive time where I live. Its...an experience hearing him troll his fanbase nonstop.

Madden is usually right, and you usually hate him for it.

I mean RoH has stopped booking Cabana and Generico. If youre the biggest indy and cant afford the big indy names I dont know how well you can be doing.

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~Edwardsdv~ Captain America
http://www.sethskim.com/Captain%20America%20is%20Back2.jpg

From: Wanglicious | #361
yeah, ROH does have some notable talent still within it that's growing that you didn't mention (Cole, O'Reilly, Eddie, Elgin) but much of that will be picked up too.

Adam Cole is a diamond in the rough to be sure.

The rest are pretty much "ROH guys" who pretty much have a ceiling in the X-Division. If Eddie worked really hard on his charisma I could see him as a borderline IC/US guy.

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Thank you, Eddie Guerrero.
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Jakyl25 posted...

From: Wanglicious | #361
yeah, ROH does have some notable talent still within it that's growing that you didn't mention (Cole, O'Reilly, Eddie, Elgin) but much of that will be picked up too.

Adam Cole is a diamond in the rough to be sure.

The rest are pretty much "ROH guys" who pretty much have a ceiling in the X-Division. If Eddie worked really hard on his charisma I could see him as a borderline IC/US guy.

And that, in essence, is what hurts ROH in regards to the future. They don't have anyone yet who can help grow the company further than what it already is.

As far as Colt goes I don't think it's so much that they can't afford him, it's more that he doesn't want to be tied down by them. Since they got bought by Sinclair they have made the effort to lock everyone up under contract to where THEY control their outside bookings. Colt is pretty much the one guy on the indies who can look at that and say "No, I can't agree to that" and be better off for it. WWE is the only company he would "sell out" for. He's doing better on his own than he would be doing in ROH, financially, and he can wrestle pretty much wherever he wants.

EDIT: Wow that sounds really contradictory, lol. I mean that they don't have plans for him as a main eventer so they won't pay him main event money. It's not that they CAN'T pay him main event money if they really wanted to though. I would guess he and Davey are both doing just as well as each other right now.

I'm not sure WHAT the deal with Generico is. They do book him from time to time but he also takes bookings in the Gabe feds which is really weird. I have to believe he's a big part of their future but not of their present, so he's got the leverage right now.

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Thank you, Eddie Guerrero.
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Generico might be in the same boat as Colt where he can take indy dates wherever he wants and he just doesn't want to be tied down to just one promotion.

Jakyl25 posted...

As far as Colt goes I don't think it's so much that they can't afford him, it's more that he doesn't want to be tied down by them. Since they got bought by Sinclair they have made the effort to lock everyone up under contract to where THEY control their outside bookings. Colt is pretty much the one guy on the indies who can look at that and say "No, I can't agree to that" and be better off for it. WWE is the only company he would "sell out" for. He's doing better on his own than he would be doing in ROH, financially, and he can wrestle pretty much wherever he wants.

EDIT: Wow that sounds really contradictory, lol. I mean that they don't have plans for him as a main eventer so they won't pay him main event money. It's not that they CAN'T pay him main event money if they really wanted to though. I would guess he and Davey are both doing just as well as each other right now.

I'm not sure WHAT the deal with Generico is. They do book him from time to time but he also takes bookings in the Gabe feds which is really weird. I have to believe he's a big part of their future but not of their present, so he's got the leverage right now.

Admit it though, the sudden insertion of Colt Cabana into THIS main event scene would be something to see. I am currently attempting to imagine the shape a Colt/Steen feud would take and its certainly bizarre.

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~Edwardsdv~ Captain America
http://www.sethskim.com/Captain%20America%20is%20Back2.jpg

Sure, but the fact that ROH still does book Generico sometimes, while they literally NEVER use Colt, says a lot to me about how they view Generico moving forward versus what role they would want Colt to play if they had him. They're willing to make concessions to keep Generico happy.

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Thank you, Eddie Guerrero.
http://www.wwe.com/f/styles/photo_large/public/photo/image/2012/04/33_Moscow_04112012jg_02128.jpg

Colt/Steen/Davey three way title feud.

I have no idea what it would be like but I think it would be amazing.

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(Maniac64 at work)
All the proteins, vitamins, and carbs of your grandma's best turkey dinner, plus 15% alcohol.

LOL just imagine that brutal match from last Sunday with Colt's goofy spots mixed in.

The rumor mill (and Steen in his worked shoots) says that this is pretty much WHY they don't give Colt the Generico treatment: Cornette doesn't like Colt's comedy spots and doesn't think they can work within ROH's WrestlingIsSerious image.

I mean, Generico is a goofy, goofy character but against every ounce of logic in the world he SOMEHOW does drama and grudge feuds very well.

I know Colt has as well in the past but I don't think Colt WANTS to anymore.

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Thank you, Eddie Guerrero.
http://www.wwe.com/f/styles/photo_large/public/photo/image/2012/04/33_Moscow_04112012jg_02128.jpg

Jakyl25 posted...

LOL just imagine that brutal match from last Sunday with Colt's goofy spots mixed in.

The rumor mill (and Steen in his worked shoots) says that this is pretty much WHY they don't give Colt the Generico treatment: Cornette doesn't like Colt's comedy spots and doesn't think they can work within ROH's WrestlingIsSerious image.

I mean, Generico is a goofy, goofy character but against every ounce of logic in the world he SOMEHOW does drama and grudge feuds very well.

I know Colt has as well in the past but I don't think Colt WANTS to anymore.

Considering his general attitude, he would need a sweet WWE-level contract to do something truly controversial. Otherwise, it could hurt his bottom line because hes a self-image propelled business.

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~Edwardsdv~ Captain America
http://www.sethskim.com/Captain%20America%20is%20Back2.jpg

so they're hyping Brock's response to HHH tonight, but no appearance by Brock himself

oh ya go my heyman and not brock prerecorded message

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According to a few sites...

Diamond Dallas Page is going to be the legend of the night.

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Push the button, Frank...

Chronic1000 posted...

According to a few sites...

Diamond Dallas Page is going to be the legend of the night.

Dang it, now I have to watch Raw.

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(Maniac64 at work)
All the proteins, vitamins, and carbs of your grandma's best turkey dinner, plus 15% alcohol.

Why. its not like theyre bringing back Sid or anything....

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~Edwardsdv~ Captain America
http://www.sethskim.com/Captain%20America%20is%20Back2.jpg

If that's true I have to watch RAW. I HAVE to, it just sucks it's only for one night rather than a full time thing.

Whoa now, that's dead wrong on that batch.
I mean keep in mind, you would, maybe were, saying the same for Aries and look at him. Dragon had this problem too due to size.

Eddie I'd say would be more upper mid card right now, not a if he works hard deal. His ceiling isn't close to met yet. Elgin though? He can legit be in wwe soon, no problem, and easily be in the main event scene.

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The King Wang.
Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert.

Kinglicious posted...

Whoa now, that's dead wrong on that batch.
I mean keep in mind, you would, maybe were, saying the same for Aries and look at him. Dragon had this problem too due to size.

Eddie I'd say would be more upper mid card right now, not a if he works hard deal. His ceiling isn't close to met yet. Elgin though? He can legit be in wwe soon, no problem, and easily be in the main event scene.

Eddie is like a "less charismatic than both by a few full measures" Ziggler and Bryans lovechild.

He has had his moments but I would struggle to rate him above even Titus O'neil in terms of ring presence and charisma. If he worked on it hard he could probably hang with Jack Swagger though.

Elgin COULD, but not while they have the Funkasaurus and Tensai and Ryback. Theres not really any room for him, especially not until he finds a better look.

Cole and O'Reilly. Maybe as like a tag team with Kevin Steen managing them theyd make it. Maybe.

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~Edwardsdv~ Captain America
http://www.sethskim.com/Captain%20America%20is%20Back2.jpg

I've been thinking about it and the only way I can see to make the MITB for the WWE Championship contract exciting is to have Brock enter and win it. He would be something a bit fresh as Mr. MITB because he can tease a cash-in even when the champ isn't vulnerable because he'll just demolish anybody.

The only reason it wouldn't work is because they're already booking the Triple H Summerslam match with Brock, so him suddenly showing up in MITB just feels a little weird. OH LOOK, POTENTIALLY INTERESTING ANGLES RUINED BY TRIPLE H INSERTING HIMSELF INTO EVERYTHING. WHO COULD HAVE IMAGINED.

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SuperNiceDog didn't have to reconcile his name...
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Well I agree right NOW it'd be terrible for them, but not in a couple years, tops, for the main shows. Elgin would work well down in fcw, go to nxt, and that gets you a year. Same for Eddie. Hell, they are doing Tyler that way, lord knows Eddie can do better.

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The King Wang.
Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert.

MrGreenonion posted...

I've been thinking about it and the only way I can see to make the MITB for the WWE Championship contract exciting is to have Brock enter and win it. He would be something a bit fresh as Mr. MITB because he can tease a cash-in even when the champ isn't vulnerable because he'll just demolish anybody.

The only reason it wouldn't work is because they're already booking the Triple H Summerslam match with Brock, so him suddenly showing up in MITB just feels a little weird. OH LOOK, POTENTIALLY INTERESTING ANGLES RUINED BY TRIPLE H INSERTING HIMSELF INTO EVERYTHING. WHO COULD HAVE IMAGINED.

Now now, to be fair, Triple H didnt ruin the LAST interesting angle. That was the Rock. Triple H just helped after it was already ruined.

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~Edwardsdv~ Captain America
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Kinglicious posted...

Well I agree right NOW it'd be terrible for them, but not in a couple years, tops, for the main shows. Elgin would work well down in fcw, go to nxt, and that gets you a year. Same for Eddie. Hell, they are doing Tyler that way, lord knows Eddie can do better.

Well THAT I agree with,

Eddie is like twice as talented and 4 times as charismatic as Seth Rollins(seriously he sucks at everything but workrate and even then there are better) and trust me I WOULD VASTLY PREFER Michael Elgin, Funkasaurus to Brodus Clay but thats just the way the chips have fallen.

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~Edwardsdv~ Captain America
http://www.sethskim.com/Captain%20America%20is%20Back2.jpg

...What angle has the Rock had anything to do with other than Rock/Cena since returning?

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Again, the problem is SIZE. Elgin is a BEAST in ROH, but take him to WWE and he's suddenly middle of the pack. He's intimidating to guys like Richards who are under 6'0" but stand him to next to Ryback and its a joke.

He would basically be to WWE what Mike Mondo is to ROH, gimmick wise.

Bryan is an exceptional, exceptional case, and if he wasn't literally THE best in-ring worker in the world it might not have happened for him.

Kyle O'Reilly could flourish in the X-Division by bringing a different style and standing out, but I really struggle to see him reaching any higher.

Adam Cole I fully admit could be a megastar. The literal babyface, the outgoing personality, the athleticism, the awesome attitude--IF ROH can hold onto him they might strike gold, but that's a big if.

--
Thank you, Eddie Guerrero.
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WarThaNemesis2 posted...

...What angle has the Rock had anything to do with other than Rock/Cena since returning?

By tying up Cena he prevented a slower-burn Punk/Cena, necessitating it blow off at Summerslam instead of extending it to mania.

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~Edwardsdv~ Captain America
http://www.sethskim.com/Captain%20America%20is%20Back2.jpg

They would have blown that off at Summerslam anyway.

Do you REALLY think WWE has that kind of patience? They're kinda forced into it with Rock and Brock and they suck at it.

Bringing Punk back for Summerslam was a minor problem in the grand scheme of things. The bigger issue was turning the Summer of Punk into the "Who texted Kevin Nash?" saga. If they had kept the focus on Punk and Cena and sweeping changes in WWE rippling from Punk's win, then it still works even with Punk only missing a week.

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Thank you, Eddie Guerrero.
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TheCapisBack posted...

WarThaNemesis2 posted...

...What angle has the Rock had anything to do with other than Rock/Cena since returning?

By tying up Cena he prevented a slower-burn Punk/Cena, necessitating it blow off at Summerslam instead of extending it to mania.

Given that the blow-off for Punk/Cena was a dirty finish that ended in Punk getting beat up by Kevin Nash and the WWE Title ending up on a heel anyways, it's clear that Rock had nothing to do with the angle being ruined.

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Too bad it was a text message and not social media.

Nash's "Fingerpoke of Doom" is historically the symbol of WCW's fall. He could have paired that with the "Facebook Poke of Doom" to kickstart WWE's downfall. <_<

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Thank you, Eddie Guerrero.
http://www.wwe.com/f/styles/photo_large/public/photo/image/2012/04/33_Moscow_04112012jg_02128.jpg

Youre boht PROBABLY right. But if I dont blame WWEs creative stupidity on the need to free up Cena for Rock, I'd pretty much have to face facts that WWE is gonna more or less suck indefinitely.

So....yeah.

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~Edwardsdv~ Captain America
http://www.sethskim.com/Captain%20America%20is%20Back2.jpg

Oh my god, this new Creative Has Nothing For You is freaking golden.



--
Xbox GT: PrivateBiscuit1
Down with Zhang. Let there be Biscuit!

Again, the problem is SIZE. Elgin is a BEAST in ROH, but take him to WWE and he's suddenly middle of the pack. He's intimidating to guys like Richards who are under 6'0" but stand him to next to Ryback and its a joke.

He would basically be to WWE what Mike Mondo is to ROH, gimmick wise.

I struggled with that quite a bit when I first started watching RoH. Seeing them hype the guy up like he's WSM Mark Henry just made me laugh since WWE has a dozen guys with more size and muscle then him.

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(Maniac64 at work)
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muddersmilk posted...

Again, the problem is SIZE. Elgin is a BEAST in ROH, but take him to WWE and he's suddenly middle of the pack. He's intimidating to guys like Richards who are under 6'0" but stand him to next to Ryback and its a joke.

He would basically be to WWE what Mike Mondo is to ROH, gimmick wise.

I struggled with that quite a bit when I first started watching RoH. Seeing them hype the guy up like he's WSM Mark Henry just made me laugh since WWE has a dozen guys with more size and muscle then him.

They dont really have anyone Elgin's size right now either ,but thats more because Trips likes tone fit guys like Ziggler, so guys like Elgin have had to either get jacked or get gone.

I mean he and Cabana have similar profiles bodywise and if a guy like Colt cant make it, what chance does Elgin have?

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~Edwardsdv~ Captain America
http://www.sethskim.com/Captain%20America%20is%20Back2.jpg

I always thought that if Eddie ever goes to the WWE, he'd just be another Evan Bourne.

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Boko United - Geriatric Titanium Mustache
Guru Taken Miraculously by SuperNiceDog

To be fair, 'another Evan Bourne' would be a lot higher if Bourne were, well, less high.

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They dont really have anyone Elgin's size right now either ,but thats more because Trips likes tone fit guys like Ziggler, so guys like Elgin have had to either get jacked or get gone.

It would be a stretch to sell Elgin in WWE as stronger than Tensai, Big Show, Henry, Ryback, Funk, Cena, Sheamus,or even like Titus O'neil.

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(Maniac64 at work)
All the proteins, vitamins, and carbs of your grandma's best turkey dinner, plus 15% alcohol.

Pretty sure they like Bourne but he can't stay clean.

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Whatever...