Board 8 > *high fives ~34% of gamefaqs*

(+) Yeah! (+)

If only companies were as smart as over a third of gamers...

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If you like Blitzball, try Captain Tsubasa II (in English) for NES!
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Yep.

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Oh, I am one yet many.

The best part is that all the answers on the poll are wrong

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_foolmo_
'Most people at least try to say something funny. See foolmo's post as an example.' - The Real Truth

what they should do is plant self destructs in consoles and computers so when someone is confirmed to pirate they hit a switch and the console explodes.

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Chrono1219

Yeah, that people will exercise their freedom no matter how corporations try to restrict them suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuure is wrong.

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If you like Blitzball, try Captain Tsubasa II (in English) for NES!
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I see nothing wrong with the demos option!

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thelefty for analysis crew 2008 imo -tranny
I have a third degree burn in flame-o-nomics -Sir Chris

If only I believed you had the capacity to have an intelligent discussion, Vlado, cuz I like talking about this stuff

oh well

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_foolmo_
'and out of the blue and completely unprovoked came foolmo and his insult' - Anagram

It's bad for business. You want a consumer's money before you let them play the game.

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It's F-Zero. F-ZEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEERO!
http://img.imgcake.com/RedShifter/trisisofasscendsjpguv.jpg

I don't even understand this one

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~LtM
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr345/Rakaputra/Kim.png

I say look at Valve. They offer great prices, even greater sales all the time, and treat their legit paying fans really well. Fans love them for it and are happy to support them. It's a win-win. If you treat people well and give them a good value, they will reciprocate and support you. Otherwise, the internet PWNS J00.

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Yoblazer: http://i32.tinypic.com/zlf1w7.gif
Watch and you'll see... someday I'll be... part of your world!

Yeah, that people will exercise their freedom no matter how corporations try to restrict them suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuure is wrong.

Sig'd.

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"All video games being free is a human right." -Vlado [Evil Republican]
Play Der Langrisser.

The best part is that all the answers on the poll are wrong

What do you suggest?

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"God Hand is the ultimate expression of the joy of humanity, specifically the punching part of the joy of humanity."-Shigeru Miyamoto

Stop making games for systems where it's easy to pirate.

Wait, they already did that. PC had Steam to "fix" it, but Wii is pretty much screwed.

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It's F-Zero. F-ZEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEERO!
http://img.imgcake.com/RedShifter/trisisofasscendsjpguv.jpg

What's DRM?

Red Shifter posted...
Stop making games for systems where it's easy to pirate.

Wait, they already did that. PC had Steam to "fix" it, but Wii is pretty much screwed.


...How did Steam "fix" PC piracy?

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SEP Nash, Smelling Like the Vault since 1996
Step FOUR! Get Paid! http://img.imgcake.com/stevenashgifpu.gif

From: rammtay | #014
What's DRM?

Digital rights management.

For games, you are required authentication with an online server. So, basically you need to be online at all times. Otherwise you can't play the game.

Sure someone else could probably expand a bit more on than what I can.

From: StealThisSheen | #015
...How did Steam "fix" PC piracy?

I think it just presented an alternative legitimate option much more appealing than what gamers had been used to. Seriously, there are times on Steam where you can get 10-15 games for the price of one. Steam fans seem less like fans and more like worshipers. I'm pretty sure at least some of those guys are former pirates who mended ways.

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Yoblazer: http://i33.tinypic.com/ml36gl_th.gif
Watch and you'll see... someday I'll be... part of your world!

Yeah, if by "some" you mean 1 or 2.

People pirate those Indy packs where they can literally pay a penny. That says all you need to know about pirates.

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SEP Nash, Smelling Like the Vault since 1996
Step FOUR! Get Paid! http://img.imgcake.com/stevenashgifpu.gif

I bet you can find more than one or two on this board alone. I used to play via emulators every once in a while and completely stopped now that Steam and even the consoles have started to offer tons of games at great prices. Like, I've paid for almost a dozen old Nintendo games on Virtual Console when I had nearly all of them on emulators in the past. You give people a great value, and they'll usually support you.

Also, isn't the state of PC gaming much healthier now than before Steam blew up (say, five years ago)? Yeah, pirates will always exist, but at least it's not a "dying" format anymore.

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Yoblazer: http://i32.tinypic.com/zlf1w7.gif
Watch and you'll see... someday I'll be... part of your world!

foolm0ron posted...
If only I believed you had the capacity to have an intelligent discussion, Vlado, cuz I like talking about this stuff

oh well

"I'm gonna insult someone because I know I'll lose an argument if I tried, wee! I'm such an internet tough guy!"

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If you like Blitzball, try Captain Tsubasa II (in English) for NES!
Top games: http://unikgamer.com/users/vlado-309.html

PartOfYourWorld posted...
I bet you can find more than one or two on this board alone. I used to play via emulators every once in a while and completely stopped now that Steam and even the consoles have started to offer tons of games at great prices. Like, I've paid for almost a dozen old Nintendo games on Virtual Console when I had nearly all of them on emulators in the past. You give people a great value, and they'll usually support you.

Also, isn't the state of PC gaming much healthier now than before Steam blew up (say, five years ago)? Yeah, pirates will always exist, but at least it's not a "dying" format anymore.

This P much. You can see the juxtaposition pretty clearly comparing Valve and Nintendo, the PC is experiencing a revival while Xenoblade is getting pirated in record numbers. It's all about how you treat your customers.

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I haven't played The Wind Waker-LinkMarioSamus

From: Vlado | #005
Yeah, that people will exercise their freedom no matter how corporations try to restrict them suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuure is wrong.

Haha wow. Well that's one way to put it, I guess.

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No problem!
This is a cute and pop genocide of love!

PC gaming was never dead, it's not a "revival". Though the boost Steam provides sure is nice.

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If you like Blitzball, try Captain Tsubasa II (in English) for NES!
Top games: http://unikgamer.com/users/vlado-309.html

PC gaming may not have been dead, but it was on a hospital bed gasping for breath and bleeding profusely before Steam came along.

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I haven't played The Wind Waker-LinkMarioSamus

Not at all, but console (read as: anti-PC) fanatics like to make people believe that, lol. If you're really interested in this issue, I recommend doing some homework.

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If you like Blitzball, try Captain Tsubasa II (in English) for NES!
Top games: http://unikgamer.com/users/vlado-309.html

I don't see a single thing wrong with more demos.

You high fived the wrong people Vlado.

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Brawl is like ZSS' breasts. Well rounded for casual players.
http://i52.tinypic.com/2llhfrc.jpg

Hey, everything but "more DRMs" in the poll is right. I'm just high fiving those who chose the most correct option.

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If you like Blitzball, try Captain Tsubasa II (in English) for NES!
Top games: http://unikgamer.com/users/vlado-309.html

Blulum posted...
PartOfYourWorld posted...
I bet you can find more than one or two on this board alone. I used to play via emulators every once in a while and completely stopped now that Steam and even the consoles have started to offer tons of games at great prices. Like, I've paid for almost a dozen old Nintendo games on Virtual Console when I had nearly all of them on emulators in the past. You give people a great value, and they'll usually support you.

Also, isn't the state of PC gaming much healthier now than before Steam blew up (say, five years ago)? Yeah, pirates will always exist, but at least it's not a "dying" format anymore.

This P much. You can see the juxtaposition pretty clearly comparing Valve and Nintendo, the PC is experiencing a revival while Xenoblade is getting pirated in record numbers. It's all about how you treat your customers.


Yeah, exactly. It's not like Punch-Out Wii got pirated more than it actually sold back when the Wii was actually getting a ton of support or anything. Nope, not at all.

Oh, wait.

People pirated games they could have literally paid a penny for from the site's own servers.

People pirated Wii games at an almost 2:1 ratio back when people actually liked Wii and it was getting support.

Being "nice" doesn't mean jack s*** to the vast majority of pirates. You may turn a very, very small minority, but most of them couldn't care less and just want s*** for free.

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SEP Nash, Smelling Like the Vault since 1996
Step FOUR! Get Paid! http://img.imgcake.com/stevenashgifpu.gif

Well, Steam is what made me into an avid PC gamer, and before that I pirated the few PC games I actually wanted to play. So there's my anecdotal evidence, I guess.

trolling as usual

oh vlado

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*~Swift~*

StealThisSheen posted...
Blulum posted...
PartOfYourWorld posted...
I bet you can find more than one or two on this board alone. I used to play via emulators every once in a while and completely stopped now that Steam and even the consoles have started to offer tons of games at great prices. Like, I've paid for almost a dozen old Nintendo games on Virtual Console when I had nearly all of them on emulators in the past. You give people a great value, and they'll usually support you.

Also, isn't the state of PC gaming much healthier now than before Steam blew up (say, five years ago)? Yeah, pirates will always exist, but at least it's not a "dying" format anymore.

This P much. You can see the juxtaposition pretty clearly comparing Valve and Nintendo, the PC is experiencing a revival while Xenoblade is getting pirated in record numbers. It's all about how you treat your customers.


Yeah, exactly. It's not like Punch-Out Wii got pirated more than it actually sold back when the Wii was actually getting a ton of support or anything. Nope, not at all.

Oh, wait.

People pirated games they could have literally paid a penny for from the site's own servers.

People pirated Wii games at an almost 2:1 ratio back when people actually liked Wii and it was getting support.

Being "nice" doesn't mean jack s*** to the vast majority of pirates. You may turn a very, very small minority, but most of them couldn't care less and just want s*** for free.

Oh, wait, someone claiming pirates are evil and corporations are good again. lol

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If you like Blitzball, try Captain Tsubasa II (in English) for NES!
Top games: http://unikgamer.com/users/vlado-309.html

Hey, Vlado. Where did I say that? Seriously, tell me where.

I'm debating with people like Yo on Steam's actual impact on piracy, and whether it's negligible or not. Nowhere did I actually give a stance on piracy itself.

But you only see what you want to, right?

Some journalist you are.

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SEP Nash, Smelling Like the Vault since 1996
Step FOUR! Get Paid! http://img.imgcake.com/stevenashgifpu.gif

foolm0ron posted...
The best part is that all the answers on the poll are wrong

This pretty much. There are "less wrong" answers, but all of them are wrong.

Those who said "Just let the pirates do what they want" are pretty much excusing crime.


Anyway Vlado, how have you been?

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Congratulations, LMS. In a topic where Liquid Wind said that women shouldn't be allowed to vote, you are still the worst poster in this topic. - kevwaffles

From: foolm0ron | #003
The best part is that all the answers on the poll are wrong

From: Dark Young Link | #033
This pretty much. There are "less wrong" answers, but all of them are wrong.

I'm curious to know what you guys think would be the right answer

I'd say there's truth in every option, even the "More DRM" one. Constant online checks will likely be the future, unfortunately.

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My fingers -- ALIVE! And threatening me with -- DEATH!

Vlado posted...

Oh, wait, someone claiming pirates are evil and corporations are good again. lol

Who, SEP? He's saying that corporations acting nicely doesn't matter to pirate because they're taking their s*** for free regardless. He never said anything about the pirates being evil.

Unless you believe that the pirates are evil because they want to take things for free.

In which case, you just shut down every argument you've ever made on the subject.

Boom.

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I like how each new topic you make reveals such varied facets of your idiocy. - foolmo
Now this is entertainment!

Vlado posted...
PC gaming was never dead, it's not a "revival". Though the boost Steam provides sure is nice.
Vlado posted...
Not at all, but console (read as: anti-PC) fanatics like to make people believe that, lol. If you're really interested in this issue, I recommend doing some homework.

Seeing as I was working in the game industry at the time...PC gaming was in a really rough spot. For instance, Call of Duty 4 had a 90% piracy rate. If you looked at NPD data from the time for PC, literally nothing put up remotely interesting numbers except World of Warcraft and the occasional Sims expansion; other games almost never broke 100k in a month, and certainly wouldn't come close to breaking the million mark (which console games did on a pretty regular basis). All of the old WRPG makers died out or moved primarily to console. Shooters, even if they were released on PC, usually had a console version too.

Nowadays the shoe is on the other foot. Activision and EA have closed down the majority of their console development because they feel it's not profitable. Most of the job growth is in MMOs and Facebook Games (both PC focused), with a few showing up in iPhone. There have been a lot of indie developer success stories on PC too.

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Cats land on their feet. Toast lands peanut butter side down. A cat with toast strapped to its back will hover above the ground in a state of quantum indecision

...see uh, pirating things that cost a penny honestly makes sense to me because it's simply easier for the one providing it. giving a penny is making them pay. if all i'm willing to do is afford a penny, or even 50 cents, i'd rather pirate it. they don't lose bandwich, don't have to pay transaction fees, and it's a near worthless amount given. now sure, they did say afterwards 'hey we'd be fine with paying that if you'd just buy it,' but personally i'm not. either i'm going to give you some money or not. i'm not gonna make you pay.

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The future must protect the clone's past.
"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

_Harmonica_ posted...
I'm curious to know what you guys think would be the right answer

I'd say there's truth in every option, even the "More DRM" one. Constant online checks will likely be the future, unfortunately.

Currently the most consistent monetization model is free to play with microtransactions. I've definitely seen GDC talks where developers had found this was the only way to consistently make money with iPhone games, for instance (because it's hard to make money with a $0.99 sale price). If an MMO is dieing, they can usually save themselves by going F2P, (and often actually increase their subscription rate by doing so, which is weird).

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Cats land on their feet. Toast lands peanut butter side down. A cat with toast strapped to its back will hover above the ground in a state of quantum indecision

The thing I find interesting is how we're high-fiving "a third of gamers" as if this poll represents the entire gaming community

Then suddenly when Link or a Zelda game wins a poll we're NintendoFAQs and we don't represent gamers as a whole.

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the winning option today is also the correct one. piracy is a much more attractive option when games are $60 and game consoles are still $300 7 years after their release. gaming is the most expensive form of mainstream media so it's no wonder people look outside legitimate means more often.

Don't most games drop in price fairly quickly?

Halo Reach for example came out less than a year ago, and it's already down to $40, which I assume is a reasonable price if you feel that $60 is too expensive.

Essentially what I'm saying is that the first poll option basically is in effect, just not for brand new releases. If you're patient you can get any game you want legally and new at a solid discount.

Nintendo games are an obvious exception.

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Halo Reach being $40 is way too high a year in and it's the same thing as Nintendo. Halo doesn't drop much either. and handhelds are a bit weird, but sticking with just consoles, a year in the price should be $20-$30 tops unless you're a major series that sells with good legs (aka, the big names Nintendo has and Halo). PC games forget about that - you can already get the latest Deus Ex for $35.

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The future must protect the clone's past.
"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

lol nintendo

still charging $50 for amazing games like NSMBWii and Mario Kart Wii

going to be hilarious watching the U fall flat on its face even worse than the 3DS did

StealThisSheen posted...
Hey, Vlado. Where did I say that? Seriously, tell me where.

I'm debating with people like Yo on Steam's actual impact on piracy, and whether it's negligible or not. Nowhere did I actually give a stance on piracy itself.

But you only see what you want to, right?

Some journalist you are.

If someone can't see you're HEAVILY anti-piracy from your comments so far... Well...

This pretty much. There are "less wrong" answers, but all of them are wrong.

Those who said "Just let the pirates do what they want" are pretty much excusing crime.

xfd, please do explain how they're all wrong. Major XFD at the last sentence, as one, piracy isn't a crime any more than jaywalking is and two, voting that is not excusing piracy in any way.

Who, SEP? He's saying that corporations acting nicely doesn't matter to pirate because they're taking their s*** for free regardless. He never said anything about the pirates being evil.

Unless you believe that the pirates are evil because they want to take things for free.

In which case, you just shut down every argument you've ever made on the subject.

Boom.

Except I just laughed at that belief. But sure, "boom".

Seeing as I was working in the game industry at the time...PC gaming was in a really rough spot. For instance, Call of Duty 4 had a 90% piracy rate. If you looked at NPD data from the time for PC, literally nothing put up remotely interesting numbers except World of Warcraft and the occasional Sims expansion; other games almost never broke 100k in a month, and certainly wouldn't come close to breaking the million mark (which console games did on a pretty regular basis). All of the old WRPG makers died out or moved primarily to console. Shooters, even if they were released on PC, usually had a console version too.

Hmm... Let's look at PSP numbers, for instance. And that thing is FAR from dead.

lol nintendo

still charging $50 for amazing games like NSMBWii and Mario Kart Wii

going to be hilarious watching the U fall flat on its face even worse than the 3DS did

^_^

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If you like Blitzball, try Captain Tsubasa II (in English) for NES!
Top games: http://unikgamer.com/users/vlado-309.html

Hey, Mario Kart Wii comes with a plastic wheel. That drives the manufacturing costs up! <_<

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Thank you, Eddie Guerrero.
http://img.imgcake.com/Icon/Punkjpguh.jpg

Liquid Wind posted...
the winning option today is also the correct one. piracy is a much more attractive option when games are $60 and game consoles are still $300 7 years after their release. gaming is the most expensive form of mainstream media so it's no wonder people look outside legitimate means more often.

Gaming is expensive by necessity. Piracy doesn't ream other media because they have other sources of income. (Theatrical releases for movies, concerts for musicians, etc.) Subscription services and F2P games are the exceptions.

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I like how each new topic you make reveals such varied facets of your idiocy. - foolmo
Now this is entertainment!

Yeah, I have never really understood the whole "gaming is too expensive nowadays" argument.

It's as cheap (or even cheaper!) as it's ever been.

If your argument is that it has ALWAYS been way too expensive then okay, but I disagree.

I do wish that direct downloads were cheaper than retail releases, though. No third-party retailer, no physical manufacturing costs, even with the costs of maintaining the servers I feel like games SHOULD be somewhat cheaper than they cost at retail if you buy them off of XBL or PSN instead.

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Thank you, Eddie Guerrero.
http://img.imgcake.com/Icon/Punkjpguh.jpg

Man, I disagree with Vlado often, but at least he used to be a "journalist" and actually backed up his views with some facts. Now he just says 'lol" at people who try to have debates with him. What the hell happened?

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http://www.backloggery.com/myimmortal

xfd, please do explain how they're all wrong. Major XFD at the last sentence, as one, piracy isn't a crime any more than jaywalking is and two, voting that is not excusing piracy in any way.


I've got nothing to do so why not?

Dropping prices won't work because, as someone already mentioned, even the very cheap games get pirated. It's not about money, at least not about money alone.

Less DRM won't work because pirates have been doing it in the past where there was less DRM in the first place. Lowering it won't do anything, pirates don't need an excuse.

More DRM won't work because they'll just find new ways to pirate. That or the DRM will be taken waaaay too far. (I'd personally have a 2 year jail sentence, but I'm crazy like that)

More demos... well do games WITH demos not get pirated? I just don't see it working out. Give people something and they'll just want more and more. I totally support more demos, just not for a way to combat piracy.

Giving up won't work because ignoring problems doesn't make them go away for the most part.

And Vlado your idea of law is already...odd as it is, so I imagine it would be difficult to have a discussion with you on that subject.

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Alternate answer: None of the answers involve ninjas.

to counter all that, most have something right about them.

dropping prices does help remove those who aren't getting games because they're too expensive. there's a reason steam has been a success, and price is for an overwhelming amount of people the biggest issue. convinience is the other, which is part of why steam's such a success as it gets both done. if you fix both those problems, the excuses shrink dramatically. that also means that less drm is an answer to help the problem because the end user utterly hates that kind of stuff and it's a hassle. if pirated copies are straight 'here you go have fun' and the others are 'here you go, jump through these hoops that have timers on them' then you make the former simply better than the latter. it's not an individual solution, but increasing causes more problems. the only truth in that is that for some reason companies insist on it. ...and more demos works out if they don't just give you a crappy part or something not too in it, but the actual game. demos have to evolve more and some anti-piracy measures actually do it. creative stuff like Batman AA was pretty slick, basically games where sure you can go through part of it, but you're never gonna complete even half are a pretty cool idea. that kind of stuff has legs on it.

if you achieve all 3 main points there - keep things easy for the user, keep the price low, and let people play to see if they want to pay - then you'll have an all around solution. and giving up is the only thing they can do in terms of fighting against piracy, because that's not what you need to do anymore. piracy, gamefly, and the used game market all have too much overlap and too much in common. the answer is you need to compete against it, like a business. that's what the 3 main goals all hit upon, and that's the only thing that'll help. you accept that it's a legitimate choice and convince people that you are the overall better one.

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The future must protect the clone's past.
"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.