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TopicShould feelings play any role in governmental decisions and policy?
averagejoel
02/20/18 8:39:14 PM
#24
LordRazziel posted...
Asherlee10 posted...
LordRazziel posted...
Asherlee10 posted...
LordRazziel posted...
Asherlee10 posted...
averagejoel posted...
it's weird when people separate feelings from logic as though they're actually separable and aren't heavily informed by each other


I'm not sure I follow this.

Logic is meant to be separated from emotions. Logic is based on objectivity and soundness.

True, but it's imposble for any human to be completely logical. Our brains just don't work that way.
That's a big reason for science. Through the tools of science, we can remove our bias and illogical brains from the matter.


That's basically what logic also does. You can take a statement, any statement, and run it through a 'logic test' if you will. This is essentially what truth tables are.

Logic with emotions is like trying to mix oil and water, they will always separate.

That's what logic is supposed to be. Logic is perfect, all humans are imperfect.


I know, that's what I essentially said.

AverageJoel referenced logic and not "making a decision" which are two different things.

Gotcha.
I think he was prolly speaking of human logic. When it comes to human logic, what he said is correct.

correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems to me that Asherlee was talking about the theoretical side of things, while I was talking about actually putting things into practice
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TopicShould feelings play any role in governmental decisions and policy?
averagejoel
02/20/18 7:39:06 PM
#15
Asherlee10 posted...
averagejoel posted...
it's weird when people separate feelings from logic as though they're actually separable and aren't heavily informed by each other


I'm not sure I follow this.

Logic is meant to be separated from emotions. Logic is based on objectivity and soundness.

it's meant to be separated from emotions, but it never really can be
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TopicShould feelings play any role in governmental decisions and policy?
averagejoel
02/20/18 7:20:35 PM
#3
it's weird when people separate feelings from logic as though they're actually separable and aren't heavily informed by each other
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TopicMinimum wage largely unenforced in US
averagejoel
02/20/18 7:05:30 PM
#49
I already named Greece.


which does not fit the category "socialist states that weren't undermined by the US, Britain, or France"

Either way, you've yet to prove that other countries are somehow entirely responsible for the collapse of these countries.


I also never claimed that other countries were somehow entirely responsible for their collapse.

So some actual economists who support capitalism vs. some random on the internet who supports socialism.


https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Argument_from_authority

Argument from authority (Latin: argumentum ad verecundiam), also called the appeal to authority, is a common form of argument which leads to a logical fallacy. The appeal to authority relies on an argument of the form:

A is an authority on a particular topic
A says something about that topic
A is probably correct

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TopicNoted intellectual heavyweight Jordan Peterson argues with a bot on Twitter
averagejoel
02/20/18 2:53:10 PM
#166
nicklebro posted...
I don't see any actual relevant liberal parties in the US that aren't on the left. Can you point me towards any? Cuz I'm referring to parties that actually exist, not just parties that exist solely as ideas.

the Democratic Party is not on the left, and if you think they are, then you are objectively incorrect
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TopicWho are the most political posters on CE?
averagejoel
02/20/18 10:19:50 AM
#25
Romulox28 posted...
was proudclad the guy who said that there is infinite wealth in the world because we can all send drones to the moon to mine moon rocks lmao

the very same
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TopicWho are the most political posters on CE?
averagejoel
02/20/18 9:06:35 AM
#14
Darkman124 posted...
proudclad (fluffygerm) is more 'far right with a conscience' than 'centrist'

that's contradictory

i keep talking to him because he is the one conservative i am 100% convinced is not a russian troll farm. although i am 99.9% convinced questionmarkitarus is also not a russian troll farm, i also think he'd be offended if i applied the 'conservative' label to him.

questionmarktarius literally values money over people. if he gets offended by someone applying an accurate label to him, that's his problem
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TopicIt's really hard to take seriously people who say 'narrative' or 'agenda'
averagejoel
02/20/18 1:15:31 AM
#10
I don't think I've ever actually used those words in that context before
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TopicMinimum wage largely unenforced in US
averagejoel
02/19/18 8:38:49 PM
#46
Mike_Stanton posted...
So Greece was turned inside-out by the US? How about you name some examples of socialism working instead of excusing all the times that it didn't work.

first give some examples of socialist states that weren't undermined by the US, Britain, or France. I'll wait

I'm sure a socialist on the internet has a balanced, trustworthy take on productivity under socialism...

the trustworthiness of one source is independent of the trustworthiness of any other source. there's no need to attack me just because I point out that information might not be accurate if it's from a school in the stronghold of capitalism
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TopicDo you have a price?
averagejoel
02/19/18 7:33:12 PM
#7
byrone posted...
Why is she a widow

... because her husband died
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TopicMinimum wage largely unenforced in US
averagejoel
02/19/18 7:27:30 PM
#42
Mike_Stanton posted...
True. Examples from Greece, Venezuela, and Cuba help to support that conclusion as well.

yes, three perfectly random countries that just happened to have been turned inside-out by the US, but obviously socialism is to blame for their shortcomings

Mike_Stanton posted...
Possibly, but...

There were many economic problems for the Soviet Stalinist system. One very general problem was the lack of incentives for productivity. As anonymous Soviet citizen said
They pretend to pay us and we pretend to work.
The Russian economist, Grigory Yavlinsky, who ultimately became an important advisor to Mikhail Gorbachev, became convinced to the need for reform when he investigated the low productivity in the Soviet mines. He found the miners were not working because they had no incentives to work. Said Yavlinsky
The Soviet system is not working because the workers are not working.

But there were more immediate causes for the collapse. In the middle 1980's about seventy percent of the industrial output of the Soviet Union was going to the military. Oleg Gordievsky, a KGB official who defected to Britain, asserted that at least one third of the total output was going to the military. British intelligence could not believe such a high figure but later Western intelligence sources estimated that it was at least fifty percent. One can only imagine what severe shortages of industrial goods there were for the rest of the economy.

www.sjsu.edu/faculty/watkins/sovietcollapse.htm

Socialism reduces worker incentives? What a novel concept!

I'm sure an essay on a site from a university in the middle of Silicon Valley has a balanced, trustworthy take on productivity under socialism
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TopicMinimum wage largely unenforced in US
averagejoel
02/19/18 7:09:02 PM
#40
Mike_Stanton posted...
The fact that France and Italy have more socialist elements with less success shows that socialist policies lead to worse results.


that conclusion does not follow from that premise

And then they collapsed under their own weight due to the failures of central planning.

so the massive arms race due to the threat of nuclear war from the US, coupled with the economic burdens of supporting their allies (who were placed under brutal sanctions by the US), had nothing to do with their collapse?
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TopicCanadian NDP seeking to make menstrual products free, among other stuff
averagejoel
02/19/18 4:10:33 PM
#23
Kaname_Madoka posted...
averagejoel posted...
peaceful model minority

:/

he got popular by making a point of not punching a woman who said he had ties to the Muslim Brotherhood

I just want someone who's radical
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TopicFergie performs the national anthem at the NBA all star game
averagejoel
02/19/18 3:44:23 PM
#32
she sang like she hates America, and I respect that
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TopicCanadian NDP seeking to make menstrual products free, among other stuff
averagejoel
02/19/18 3:41:55 PM
#10
Singh is a bit centrist and "peaceful model minority" for my liking, but he'll probably get my vote too unless the Green candidate is really fucking good
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TopicNoted intellectual heavyweight Jordan Peterson argues with a bot on Twitter
averagejoel
02/19/18 3:38:57 PM
#164
NinjaBreakfast posted...
nicklebro posted...
All forms of Liberalism are quite clearly on the left side of the political spectrum.

Still laughing at this lol

"Trudeau? Macron? the Democratic Party in the US? yeah, they're all left"
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TopicPolitical scientists have made a stunning breakthrough
averagejoel
02/19/18 10:49:00 AM
#10
the real meaning of horseshoe theory
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TopicMinimum wage largely unenforced in US
averagejoel
02/19/18 12:33:24 AM
#37
Read up on the history of Sweden. Capitalist reforms were made in the late 19th century, which caused it to go from being one of the poorest countries in Europe to being one of the richest. Ever since they've implemented more elements of socialism they've had less GDP growth.


ok

France and Italy have more elements of socialism than Sweden.


ok. none of them are actually socialist, so this is meaningless

Uh huh...and then what happened?


uh

they won the space race without absolving nazis of crimes against humanity?
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Topic"Parents should never spank their kids."
averagejoel
02/19/18 12:22:29 AM
#115
darkprince45 posted...
I was spanked, smacked, hit with a belt when I was a kid. Never got in trouble.

My younger brother never hit or anything and he's a fucking terror of a teenager. Literally one of those kids the tide pod generation exemplifies

And literally the same with my girlfriend. Her younger brother is 22 and still lives at home with no drivers license, friends, or job

cool anecdotal evidence bro
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TopicWhat exactly do people think they'll be able to do with the Ring?*LotR spoilers*
averagejoel
02/18/18 3:01:14 PM
#30
there's a really interesting theory about Tom Bombadil here. some cool stuff about Gandalf too.

http://www.cas.unt.edu/~hargrove/bombadil.html
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Topic"Parents should never spank their kids."
averagejoel
02/18/18 2:32:23 PM
#29
hockeybub89 posted...
averagejoel posted...
https://news.utexas.edu/2016/04/25/risks-of-harm-from-spanking-confirmed-by-researchers

AUSTIN, Texas The more children are spanked, the more likely they are to defy their parents and to experience increased anti-social behavior, aggression, mental health problems and cognitive difficulties, according to a new meta-analysis of 50 years of research on spanking by experts at The University of Texas at Austin and the University of Michigan.

The study, published in this months Journal of Family Psychology, looks at five decades of research involving over 160,000 children. The researchers say it is the most complete analysis to date of the outcomes associated with spanking, and more specific to the effects of spanking alone than previous papers, which included other types of physical punishment in their analyses.

"But I was spanked and turned out fine"
"Beating =/= spanking. They are probably confusing the two"
"Spanking done right is done with love"
"Hell, I was beaten, my childhood sucked, and I hate my father, but at least I learned how to be an adult"
"Because science has never been wrong before"
"Because scientists have never been paid off before"
"Statistics don't truly reflect reality"
"*farting noises*"

one time I got into an argument with someone who linked me to the study from a few years ago that said most scientific studies were inaccurate, and literally none of the criteria for finding information to be spurious applied to the spanking study
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Topic"Parents should never spank their kids."
averagejoel
02/18/18 2:13:53 PM
#16
https://news.utexas.edu/2016/04/25/risks-of-harm-from-spanking-confirmed-by-researchers

AUSTIN, Texas The more children are spanked, the more likely they are to defy their parents and to experience increased anti-social behavior, aggression, mental health problems and cognitive difficulties, according to a new meta-analysis of 50 years of research on spanking by experts at The University of Texas at Austin and the University of Michigan.

The study, published in this months Journal of Family Psychology, looks at five decades of research involving over 160,000 children. The researchers say it is the most complete analysis to date of the outcomes associated with spanking, and more specific to the effects of spanking alone than previous papers, which included other types of physical punishment in their analyses.

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TopicN64 vs. Gamecube
averagejoel
02/18/18 1:38:43 PM
#6
N64 had one of the worst controllers ever. gamecube had one of the best.

games-wise, it's possible to make an argument for either system, though I still prefer Gamecube - Pikmin 1 and 2, Pokemon Colosseum and XD, Melee, Double Dash, Sunshine, Paper Mario TTYD off the top of my head.
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Topicwhy do alt righters act like Nazi is like the n word for white people
averagejoel
02/18/18 1:14:30 PM
#9
PartyStarter18 posted...
Kaname_Madoka posted...
PartyStarter18 posted...
Well the left made it one

no

Yes. Nazism died in 1944.

no it didn't

Operation Paperclip was a secret program of the Joint Intelligence Objectives Agency (JIOA) in which more than 1,600 German scientists, engineers, and technicians, such as Wernher von Braun and his V-2 rocket team, were recruited in post-Nazi Germany and taken to the U.S. for government employment, primarily between 1945 and 1959; many were former members and some were former leaders of the Nazi Party.

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TopicMinimum wage largely unenforced in US
averagejoel
02/18/18 12:54:48 PM
#33
Mike_Stanton posted...
ScazarMeltex posted...
averagejoel posted...
Mike_Stanton posted...
justaguy3492 posted...
Romes187 posted...
If employers aren't paying their employees what was promised, then they should be heavily fined

Capitalism works because consent exists and contracts are executed fairly. You are willing to pay X, I am willing to work for X.

If I am willing to work for X, and you decide to pay me X-Y, that's no good, especially if we agreed beforehand on the terms.


Ehhhhhhh.

Oh right. I forgot about how Venezuela, Italy, Greece, France, Soviet Russia, India, and Cuba proved that socialism is the proven system that works.

Italy and France aren't socialist, and have never been

the shitshow in the rest of those countries was caused by interference from the US and Britain, not by their own internal politics


Italy and France are far more socialist than the US. There are far less socialist than Norway, Sweden, Finland, Denmark, Belgium, The Netherlands, and Iceland. Which by the way are all awesome countries to live in and regularly rank in the top 10 countries in the world for things like life expectancy and happiness.

Sweden and Denmark originally became prosperous under capitalism and have actually had less growth since making socialist reforms.

prosperity in Europe predates capitalism bud

and again, they're not actually socialist

also keep in mind that Russia went from Feudalism in 1917 to World Superpower in 1945
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TopicMinimum wage largely unenforced in US
averagejoel
02/18/18 12:20:41 PM
#27
Romes187 posted...
averagejoel posted...
Romes187 posted...
averagejoel posted...
Mike_Stanton posted...
justaguy3492 posted...
Romes187 posted...
If employers aren't paying their employees what was promised, then they should be heavily fined

Capitalism works because consent exists and contracts are executed fairly. You are willing to pay X, I am willing to work for X.

If I am willing to work for X, and you decide to pay me X-Y, that's no good, especially if we agreed beforehand on the terms.


Ehhhhhhh.

Oh right. I forgot about how Venezuela, Italy, Greece, France, Soviet Russia, India, and Cuba proved that socialism is the proven system that works.

Italy and France aren't socialist, and have never been

the shitshow in the rest of those countries was caused by interference from the US and Britain, not by their own internal politics


Yeah guys, socialism hasnt had it's fair shot yet

do you really think Cuba wouldn't have done better if the US didn't impose sanctions and try to assassinate their leader literally hundreds of times


Oh they would have done better for sure.

Same with Venezuela...I'd bet they'd only need to cook one of their pets to feed their starving children instead of both

and it's to the ignore list you go. bye!
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TopicMinimum wage largely unenforced in US
averagejoel
02/18/18 12:12:14 PM
#22
ScazarMeltex posted...
averagejoel posted...
Mike_Stanton posted...
justaguy3492 posted...
Romes187 posted...
If employers aren't paying their employees what was promised, then they should be heavily fined

Capitalism works because consent exists and contracts are executed fairly. You are willing to pay X, I am willing to work for X.

If I am willing to work for X, and you decide to pay me X-Y, that's no good, especially if we agreed beforehand on the terms.


Ehhhhhhh.

Oh right. I forgot about how Venezuela, Italy, Greece, France, Soviet Russia, India, and Cuba proved that socialism is the proven system that works.

Italy and France aren't socialist, and have never been

the shitshow in the rest of those countries was caused by interference from the US and Britain, not by their own internal politics


Italy and France are far more socialist than the US. There are far less socialist than Norway, Sweden, Finland, Denmark, Belgium, The Netherlands, and Iceland. Which by the way are all awesome countries to live in and regularly rank in the top 10 countries in the world for things like life expectancy and happiness.

wnat do you mean "more socialist"?

the US isn't socialist. neither are France and Italy. neither are any of the other countries you listed.
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TopicMinimum wage largely unenforced in US
averagejoel
02/18/18 12:10:28 PM
#21
Romes187 posted...
averagejoel posted...
Mike_Stanton posted...
justaguy3492 posted...
Romes187 posted...
If employers aren't paying their employees what was promised, then they should be heavily fined

Capitalism works because consent exists and contracts are executed fairly. You are willing to pay X, I am willing to work for X.

If I am willing to work for X, and you decide to pay me X-Y, that's no good, especially if we agreed beforehand on the terms.


Ehhhhhhh.

Oh right. I forgot about how Venezuela, Italy, Greece, France, Soviet Russia, India, and Cuba proved that socialism is the proven system that works.

Italy and France aren't socialist, and have never been

the shitshow in the rest of those countries was caused by interference from the US and Britain, not by their own internal politics


Yeah guys, socialism hasnt had it's fair shot yet

do you really think Cuba wouldn't have done better if the US didn't impose sanctions and try to assassinate their leader literally hundreds of times
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TopicMinimum wage largely unenforced in US
averagejoel
02/18/18 12:01:14 PM
#18
Mike_Stanton posted...
justaguy3492 posted...
Romes187 posted...
If employers aren't paying their employees what was promised, then they should be heavily fined

Capitalism works because consent exists and contracts are executed fairly. You are willing to pay X, I am willing to work for X.

If I am willing to work for X, and you decide to pay me X-Y, that's no good, especially if we agreed beforehand on the terms.


Ehhhhhhh.

Oh right. I forgot about how Venezuela, Italy, Greece, France, Soviet Russia, India, and Cuba proved that socialism is the proven system that works.

Italy and France aren't socialist, and have never been

the shitshow in the rest of those countries was caused by interference from the US and Britain, not by their own internal politics
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peanut butter and dick
TopicMinimum wage largely unenforced in US
averagejoel
02/18/18 11:10:08 AM
#10
Romes187 posted...
If employers aren't paying their employees what was promised, then they should be heavily fined

yeah. something along the lines of a significant amount of time in prison, state seizure of their business, and their dominant hand
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TopicWhy does America convict 10x more people than any first world country...
averagejoel
02/18/18 11:06:06 AM
#5
private prisons
the war on drugs
institutional racism (a lot of countries have this, but not many were actually founded on it)
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TopicScenario: 20 antifa/blm members surround you in the streets for being white
averagejoel
02/18/18 11:02:51 AM
#57
flick a light switch, realize I'm dreaming, have some fun lucid dreaming
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TopicMinimum wage largely unenforced in US
averagejoel
02/18/18 10:36:31 AM
#2
actually, it's extremely good that these companies have complete control over their employees' lives and can also easily get away with anything they want to
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Topicwhen will racism go away?
averagejoel
02/18/18 1:15:17 AM
#34
Rika_Furude posted...
massive progress will be made when sjws/blm etc pretty much stop existing
but racism will never be truly eradicated

"I'm all in favour of marginalized groups being treated better, i'm just staunchly opposed to anyone who tries to make that a reality"
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TopicHow long do you think it would take for the mods to notice porn in your sig?
averagejoel
02/18/18 1:10:41 AM
#8
Big_Nabendu posted...
Not only would you get modded, but if you post alot of posts with it, all those will get modded. And all the modded posts will stack up against you for a suspended/banned account

not sure how it would work with the current mod system, but sig wipes definitely did not used to accumulate in severity with the number of posts - I once had a sig wipe and had like 120 moderated messages. that was on this account.
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TopicHow long do you think it would take for the mods to notice porn in your sig?
averagejoel
02/18/18 1:07:08 AM
#4
I remember a suicide topic where that was done. it definitely wasn't up more than a few minutes
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TopicShould I teach Shadow Ball to Jolteon or Vaporeon?
averagejoel
02/17/18 9:59:37 PM
#6
I would be more inclined to give it to Espeon or Sylveon
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TopicAww yeah, got Les Misérables tickets for my birthday
averagejoel
02/17/18 7:53:12 PM
#12
asagi_mode_gone posted...
Musical or more play oriented format? And is it a wandering production or local?

in retrospect, this is probably the type of question that I should have asked
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TopicAww yeah, got Les Misérables tickets for my birthday
averagejoel
02/17/18 7:33:25 PM
#10
tickets for where?
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TopicEx-CIA director: US meddles in foreign elections for a 'very good cause'
averagejoel
02/17/18 7:29:04 PM
#4
a very good cause in the interests of Western Imperialism and large American corporations

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Topicwhy do people deny the holocaust?
averagejoel
02/17/18 6:28:53 PM
#17
halomonkey1_3_5 posted...
the shit that makes less sense to me is when they try to argue the numbers

"actually it wasnt 6mil it was maybe 1.5mil at worst" like ok my dude in what world does that make any difference at all

the thing is, the 6 million figure doesn't even take into account the fact that Jews were not the only group targeted by Nazis. if I recall correctly, the American Holocaust Museum puts the total at around 15 million
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TopicCan anyone upset with the name of BLM reconcile this for me?
averagejoel
02/17/18 12:31:20 PM
#84
LordRazziel posted...
NINExATExSEVEN posted...
LordRazziel posted...
@NINExATExSEVEN
So that whole event was seeping with bias from left wing sources. Did that event have neo Nazis? Yea it did. Do you know what the event was at it's core?

Why can't the same be said for BLM?


It is actually. Also refer to post 73.

Not by you. I was asking you about yourself, not others.

Why is BLM a hate group and not an activist group with a racist minority?

even calling it a "racist minority" is a smear tactic by white supremacists. it's still giving them too much ground. don't concede on this

also: holy shit @ all the invisible posts itt
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TopicWait, California's economy is bigger than India and all of Africa?
averagejoel
02/17/18 12:28:47 PM
#9
Skiggie posted...
I guess it's because it has a collection of the richest companies in the world...but I figured the huge populations of India and Africa would be enough to make up for that

"who has more wealth: a continent of severely exploited people, or a state with a high concentration of people doing the exploiting? hmmmm, i wonder"
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Topicif liberal college professors don't discriminate against conservatives, then...
averagejoel
02/17/18 10:06:50 AM
#1
why do conservatives have lower grades?

checkmate, liberals
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TopicNoted intellectual heavyweight Jordan Peterson argues with a bot on Twitter
averagejoel
02/16/18 11:24:50 PM
#159
no need to be rude now
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TopicNoted intellectual heavyweight Jordan Peterson argues with a bot on Twitter
averagejoel
02/16/18 11:08:24 PM
#157
nicklebro posted...
Why do you hate people who listen to him?

because they dismiss any evidence that their leader might not be all he makes himself out to be
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TopicNoted intellectual heavyweight Jordan Peterson argues with a bot on Twitter
averagejoel
02/16/18 10:07:55 PM
#144
lderivedx posted...
It's really, really weird how people feel the need to defend everything about a rambling professor who likes to talk outside his expertise, has an unhealthy obsession with the USSR, blames women for being sexually harassed, and cries at the thought of "Western civilization" tumbling down.

Really weird.

I think it's extremely normal that this doddering old man tells edgy libertarians and alt-righters to stand up straight and clean their rooms and they still follow him like he's the leader of their cult. extremely. normal.
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TopicNoted intellectual heavyweight Jordan Peterson argues with a bot on Twitter
averagejoel
02/16/18 9:59:49 PM
#140
nicklebro posted...
averagejoel posted...
nicklebro posted...
anything of actual substance that I can see?

well there's plenty in post 120, but you dismissed the entire thing

There's literally no substance whatsoever in that post. Seriously, even if what you were saying was actually true, you didn't actually include any substance. Saying "Jordan Peterson was wrong" isn't substance, even if he was in fact wrong. You have to actually show what he was lying about, y'know actual substance.

I never claimed he was lying. I claimed he was not left-leaning. the fact that you bring this up to me is evidence that you either didn't read or didn't understand my post. read it again (or for the first time) and address something in it, or I will assume that you concede everything in the post
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