Current Events > TLJ ruined my interest in Star Wars for quite some time *spoilers*

(+) Yeah! (+)

Slayer_22 posted...

Which Luke would never do. Nor has he ever shown he's even capable of such.

We never saw him take on the responsibility as a Jedi Master in the OT so moot point to bring up. Pretty much all Jedi are more idealistic when they're Padawans.

COVxy posted...

Damn, the original movies would have been an absolute snore fest if Luke's character was as perfect and saint like as you suggest.

Yeah that's the other thing too. Like okay sure being disappointed in the direction is one thing.

But having a righteous Jedi Master being correct about everything isn't exactly leading to much tension for the character dynamics. Even Yoda wasn't that and that guy has like a thousand years of wisdom on him compared to Luke.

Tyranthraxus posted...

Fucking off to mope isn't necessarily a problem. Yoda did it for like 20 years. JJ seemed like he wanted Luke in a Yoda type role.

Of course he did. Because he had no ideas other than recycling the OT.

Tyranthraxus posted...

And yeah Yoda would not have even thought about murdering Ben in his sleep either.

Nah he just ran off while kids he was supposed to take care of were being murdered and hunted down.

Muflaggin posted...

People still defending The Last Shit were never Star Wars fans to begin with.

It does feel like this.

Punished_Blinx posted...

Nah he just ran off while kids he was supposed to take care of were being murdered and hunted down.

He's not omniscient. By the time he knew shit went south it was already too late to save the kids. He did attack Palpatine in the Senate chambers.

Eh The Last Jedi felt like it channeled a bit more of KOTOR 2 compared to the other movies. Which I overall like when it comes to the interpretation of the Force. So the stuff with Luke doesn't bother me at all.

Resetting the board with the New Republic being wiped out almost immediately in TFA bothers me a lot more than anything with Luke. It's just an obvious and easy attempt to bring things back to how it was in the OT which overall is where most of the ST issues stem from.

Funnily enough that is also similar to how I feel a bit bothered about how the Jedi are randomly wiped out in KOTOR 2.

Tyranthraxus posted...

He's not omniscient. By the time he knew shit went south it was already too late to save the kids. He did attack Palpatine in the Senate chambers.

We know that plenty of Jedi spent their lives running, hiding and fighting. Yoda does nothing to help any of them.

Punished_Blinx posted...

We know that plenty of Jedi spent their lives running, hiding and fighting. Yoda does nothing to help any of them.

That's all fanfic Legends shit. With movies only, there were exactly two sith and two Jedi left alive at the end of RotS.

Punished_Blinx posted...

Eh The Last Jedi felt like it channeled a bit more of KOTOR 2 compared to the other movies.

The problem is that KOTOR 2 did it well, and TLJ did it like shit.

Tyranthraxus posted...

That's all fanfic Legends shit. With movies only, there were exactly two sith and two Jedi left alive at the end of RotS.

What? No.

Like we are literally getting a TV show about one of them later this year.

COVxy posted...

Damn, the original movies would have been an absolute snore fest if Luke's character was as perfect and saint like as you suggest.

He's not a perfect saint. But he had a specific character.

This is like Obi-Wan not going to the nearest brothel and smashing before getting drunk, me saying 'that's not what he'd do' and you saying the same stuff.

Tyranthraxus posted...

That's all fanfic Legends shit. With movies only, there were exactly two sith and two Jedi left alive at the end of RotS.

That's something that I never cared for. With all these secret Jedi running around it kinda takes away from how special the remaining ones were, especially Luke. The galaxy is big and all, so maybe a couple could work, but how many are there still alive now?

I don't like the rule of two though, but that also is sort of pushed aside with all the various Sith apprentices in stories.

Southernfatman posted...

That's something that I never cared for. With all these secret Jedi running around it kinda takes away from how special the remaining ones were, especially Luke. The galaxy is big and all, so maybe a couple could work, but how many are there still alive now?

Every new piece of shit they put out either has a new force user or brings back a formerly dead one. It's gotten so stupid and convoluted and I seriously doubt "somehow palpatine returned" is the peak.

Slayer_22 posted...

He's not a perfect saint. But he had a specific character.

This is like Obi-Wan not going to the nearest brothel and smashing before getting drunk, me saying 'that's not what he'd do' and you saying the same stuff.

Why do you think he lives near Mos Eisley

Punished_Blinx posted...

What? No.

Like we are literally getting a TV show about one of them later this year.

What movies was Ahsoka in?

Punished_Blinx posted...

Eh The Last Jedi felt like it channeled a bit more of KOTOR 2 compared to the other movies. Which I overall like when it comes to the interpretation of the Force. So the stuff with Luke doesn't bother me at all.

Resetting the board with the New Republic being wiped out almost immediately in TFA bothers me a lot more than anything with Luke. It's just an obvious and easy attempt to bring things back to how it was in the OT which overall is where most of the ST issues stem from.

Funnily enough that is also similar to how I feel a bit bothered about how the Jedi are randomly wiped out in KOTOR 2.

Funnily enough, one of the things I hated about TFA was the retreading they did. I wanted to see new ground broken and to me, The Last Jedi did that. It felt new and I think that was more exciting than the movie itself. I'm really tired of everything spending all its time during the Original Trilogy era.

Derwood posted...

What movies was Ahsoka in?

Is everything not in the movies legends fan fiction shit now?

Oh and to answer your question The Clone Wars.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wars:_The_Clone_Wars_(film)

Punished_Blinx posted...

Is everything not in the movies legends fan fiction shit now?

I mean, according to George Lucas, yes.

So much better than the trash fire prequels or the bullshit Abrams pulled with RoS

TLJ is the worst movie I've ever seen.

Everything about it is wrong. Every. Single. Thing.

WRONG.

Tyranthraxus posted...

That's all fanfic Legends shit. With movies only,, there were exactly two sith and two Jedi left alive at the end of RotS.

Punished_Blinx posted...

What? No.

Like we are literally getting a TV show about one of them later this year.

This was the post you responded to

Tyranthraxus posted...

I mean, according to George Lucas, yes.

Ahsoka was literally in a movie that exists because of George Lucas.

Like there's a reason The Clone Wars is the one thing Disney kept canon.

Derwood posted...

This was the post you responded to

And it's still wrong even if for some reason you are disregarding the entire first sentence.

Never seen ep 9 and I never will btw.

Kennedy universe is the nightmare timeline.

Like the hellscape timeline at the end of justice league and seen in bvs.

Punished_Blinx posted...

Is everything not in the movies legends fan fiction shit now?

Oh and to answer your question The Clone Wars.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wars:_The_Clone_Wars_(film)

She was a padawan, not a Jedi

Derwood posted...

She was a padawan, not a Jedi

All the more reason Yoda is an asshole for running away and not helping anyone.

BurmesePenguin posted...

I think Last Jedi is pretty bad, but it had some ideas and thoughts on the matter of Star Wars. I don't think Johnson had any idea where to take most of them, but whatever. Themes and concepts existed.

Ridging the Skywalker is not even a proper movie. It's a reaction to a backlash doing everything to make the upset fans happy again and in the effort sacrificing anything to make it appealing as a viewing experience except for those 12 year old man children who just want their swoshy neon sword fights NO POLITICS.

This.

I can respect TLJ as a film for at least trying to do something new.

TRoS is the equivalent of a 4 year old bashing his favorite Star Wars figures together, with a "plot" that loosely exists just to make nostalgia shit happen. Usually with no real explanation.

Slayer_22 posted...

He's not a perfect saint. But he had a specific character.

To be fair, Luke in RotJ was shown to be susceptible to angry, violent outbursts. His strength of character was how he overcame that internal struggle in the moment, not that he never would have such a struggle. >_>

So I can buy that an adeptly trained Luke experienced some super force Vision which made him feel so strongly that he had a reaction in the real world. And the fact that he was now so much more in control of himself meant that the reaction really *was* for a fraction of a second. It just so happened that Kylo coindentally woke up at the exact fraction of a second it happened.

...granted I feel the movie would've been stronger if we'd actually gotten to see more of Luke/Kylo in that time period besides the inciting incident so the thing would feel less contrived. Replace all that worthless casino bullshit with some flashbacks in the form of force visions so we can actually get a feel for how Luke had evolved up to that point and Kylo's state of mind back then rather than just have it exposited in some lame "two sides of history" metaphor >_>

DarkBuster22904 posted...

Dude, that fight is dogshit. Yeah, the prequel fights are silly and overchoreographed, but at least they're WELL overchoreographed. Rey and Kylo were fighting so badly in that scene that it boggles the mind how the director justifies their surviving.

No that shit was cool as fuck. Every fight in Star Wars is pretty fucking bad but gets a pass. This was a legitimately good fight and had great visuals.

Smashingpmkns posted...

No that shit was cool as fuck. Every fight in Star Wars is pretty fucking bad but gets a pass. This was a legitimately good fight and had great visuals.

So great that they had to digitally edit out Rey getting stabbed in the back so the dude is just making stabbing motions with an empty hand and then were like "yeah this is fine no one will notice probably"

RchHomieQuanChi posted...

This.

I can respect TLJ as a film for at least trying to do something new.

TRoS is the equivalent of a 4 year old bashing his favorite Star Wars figures together, with a "plot" that loosely exists just to make nostalgia shit happen. Usually with no real explanation.

I agree. I wasnt the biggest fan of TLJ but it clearly had some merit. RoS is legitimately one of the worst films I have ever seen.

Kim_Seong-a posted...

To be fair, Luke in RotJ was shown to be susceptible to angry, violent outbursts. His strength of character was how he overcame that internal struggle in the moment, not that he never would have such a struggle. >_>

So I can buy that an adeptly trained Luke experienced some super force Vision which made him feel so strongly that he had a reaction in the real world. And the fact that he was now so much more in control of himself meant that the reaction really *was* for a fraction of a second. It just so happened that Kylo coindentally woke up at the exact fraction of a second it happened.

...granted I feel the movie would've been stronger if we'd actually gotten to see more of Luke/Kylo in that time period besides the inciting incident so the thing would feel less contrived. Replace all that worthless casino bullshit with some flashbacks in the form of force visions so we can actually get a feel for how Luke had evolved up to that point and Kylo's state of mind back then rather than just have it exposited in some lame "two sides of history" metaphor >_>

Yeah the problem with TLJ is that it's crammed into the middle of a trilogy that outright isn't interested in exploring any of it.

Even the casino planet on paper introduces a fairly interesting dynamic. There are forces within the galaxy that profit over a constant war and it is within their interest to keep it going. But it's smack dab in the middle of "New Republic gave up its weapons and whoops now they're all blown up. Hey the Emperor is back!" so it has nowhere to go and it's crammed into a movie that makes it overall feel like filler.

The messages and overall goals of everything in TLJ could have been a lot more fun if they were the vision of an entire trilogy. Oh well.

Punished_Blinx posted...

Why do you think he lives near Mos Eisley

True. Ol Ben gets baddies 24/7 in that dank cave.
Kim_Seong-a posted...

To be fair, Luke in RotJ was shown to be susceptible to angry, violent outbursts. His strength of character was how he overcame that internal struggle in the moment, not that he never would have such a struggle. >_>

So I can buy that an adeptly trained Luke experienced some super force Vision which made him feel so strongly that he had a reaction in the real world. And the fact that he was now so much more in control of himself meant that the reaction really *was* for a fraction of a second. It just so happened that Kylo coindentally woke up at the exact fraction of a second it happened.

...granted I feel the movie would've been stronger if we'd actually gotten to see more of Luke/Kylo in that time period besides the inciting incident so the thing would feel less contrived. Replace all that worthless casino bullshit with some flashbacks in the form of force visions so we can actually get a feel for how Luke had evolved up to that point and Kylo's state of mind back then rather than just have it exposited in some lame "two sides of history" metaphor >_>

I just can't buy it. It's just not something he'd even do. Nor is anything he had done compared to it. Sure, if this was his weakest emotion, if it was preying on his anger under extreme duress, if Kylo had struck him while he was fighting someone or...something that would induce the anger he felt when he let his anger cosume him before falling to the dark side, sure. But this was a moment of fear. Luke has never, in practically the entire trilogy, shown fear or an impression of it causing a strong reaction. He KNOWINGLY WALKED INTO CERTAIN DEATH with the only thing that could save him was his father turning to the light. Kylo was said to already have turned dark at this time, yet...so was Vader. For years. Yet Kylo pushed such fear on him? A boy that hadn't even really fallen? It just doesn't add up imho.

Luke wouldn't do this. It makes absolutely no sense within the context of RotJ. Even ESB Luke.

Tyranthraxus posted...

So great that they had to digitally edit out Rey getting stabbed in the back so the dude is just making stabbing motions with an empty hand and then were like "yeah this is fine no one will notice probably"

I don't even know what you're talking about cuz if you nitpick every star wars fight you'd find some bullshit lol

Also what does "digitally edit out Rey getting stabbed" even mean? They have to edit in Rey getting stabbed lol

Smashingpmkns posted...

I don't even know what you're talking about cuz if you nitpick every star wars fight you'd find some bullshit lol

Also what does "digitally edit out Rey getting stabbed" even mean? They have to edit in Rey getting stabbed lol

Here I timestamped it for you:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tuk_ZZQWfEY&t=166

He literally stabs Rey with nothing because they edited it out in post lol.

Time stamps don't work on gamefaqs mobile for whatever reason. What's the time on it?

Smashingpmkns posted...

Time stamps don't work on gamefaqs mobile for whatever reason. What's the time on it?

2:48 - 2:51

Man that doesn't effect my enjoyment of the scene. Goofs happen all the time. It's a bad ass scene and probably one of the best fights, if not the best fight, in the franchise. It's not like Star Wars was ever known for well choreographed fight scenes.

Smashingpmkns posted...

Man that doesn't effect my enjoyment of the scene. Goofs happen all the time. It's a bad ass scene and probably one of the best fights, if not the best fight, in the franchise. It's not like Star Wars was ever known for well choreographed fight scenes.

Yeah it's a very minor detail but it's not the scene itself that bothers me, it just leaves me more with the impression that people didn't really care about the quality of the product. It's not like that was an accidentally overlooked mistake like the matrix camera. They had to have known what it would look like because they took the time to edit it out. They just didn't care. And when I realize that, I can see how that attitude affected other parts of the movie.

It's not edited out. It's just wasn't edited in. The lightsaber bladed is edited in. Could have easily been missed by the editor, or just been a late choice by the director to idk cut out a pretty fatal and unrealistic stab after the fact. Or even cut by the censors.

That's an issue with a lot of cgi heavy movies. Sometimes the idea plays right in camera but when you get to editing it completely falls apart. It's a half second thing though, not something I'd dismiss the whole bad ass fight over.

Tyranthraxus posted...

Yeah it's a very minor detail but it's not the scene itself that bothers me, it just leaves me more with the impression that people didn't really care about the quality of the product. It's not like that was an accidentally overlooked mistake like the matrix camera. They had to have known what it would look like because they took the time to edit it out. They just didn't care. And when I realize that, I can see how that attitude affected other parts of the movie.

How many people do you think noticed this before having it pointed out to them via youtube or otherwise?

Goofs like that are in the Nolan Batman movies as well. I remember one of them had a goon who falls over for no reason. When it's a fight scene with a lot of extras it's more likely to happen.

I don't think it indicates a lack of care. Just the reality of movies in the age where every single second can now easily be repeated online when before we wouldn't notice.

Tyranthraxus posted...

Yeah it's a very minor detail but it's not the scene itself that bothers me, it just leaves me more with the impression that people didn't really care about the quality of the product. It's not like that was an accidentally overlooked mistake like the matrix camera. They had to have known what it would look like because they took the time to edit it out. They just didn't care. And when I realize that, I can see how that attitude affected other parts of the movie.

I think this example is endemic of how the discourse has been about TLJ though. There are legitimate criticisms and complaints. But the backlash got so out of control that nitpicking every single frame of the movie to the point of denying anyone the right to enjoy scenes like this. Not saying thats what youre doing, but others definitely have.

COVxy posted...

How many people do you think noticed this before having it pointed out to them via youtube or otherwise?

I don't know and I have no way of knowing. You already knew that though so why did you ask the question?

Smashingpmkns posted...

It's not edited out. It's just wasn't edited in. The lightsaber bladed is edited in. Could have easily been missed by the editor, or just been a late choice by the director to idk cut out a pretty fatal and unrealistic stab after the fact. Or even cut by the censors.

That's an issue with a lot of cgi heavy movies. Sometimes the idea plays right in camera but when you get to editing it completely falls apart. It's a half second thing though, not something I'd dismiss the whole bad ass fight over.

I'm not dismissing the whole fight. The worst part about that fight was Snoke as I've already said earlier. I'm just saying tlj has weaker choreography compared to the other ST and PT.

It's not ANH bad but that's a low bar.

Punished_Blinx posted...

Goofs like that are in the Nolan Batman movies as well. I remember one of them had a goon who falls over for no reason. When it's a fight scene with a lot of extras it's more likely to happen.

I don't think it indicates a lack of care. Just the reality of movies in the age where every single second can now easily be repeated online when before we wouldn't notice.

Oh no that definitely bothers me especially in TDKR where Bane attacks the exchange during the day then when Batman is chasing them moments later it's already midnight.

Nolan in general has a really bad track record when it comes to time in his movies.

The memorable PT choreography is a bunch of CGI cartoons doing flips around a bunch of geriatric guys and the rest of the sequel trilogy is a bunch of .5 second cuts. Let's be real.

Smashingpmkns posted...

The memorable PT choreography is a bunch of CGI cartoons doing flips around a bunch of geriatric guys and the rest of the sequel trilogy is a bunch of .5 second cuts. Let's be real.

Some of the droideka fights and the order 66 scenes were really well done I thought.

I find myself regularly amazed that nothing but Star Wars seems to have this effect on people.

Tyranthraxus posted...

I don't know and I have no way of knowing. You already knew that though so why did you ask the question?

I was asking you to assess your impression of whether this is a detail is actually accessible to the normal viewing of the movie. Most people miss the bear walking through the basketball field. My guess is that next to no one noticed this, and is only accessible because, for some reason, people felt the need to fine tooth comb to find things to dislike.

Like others have said, do this in pretty much every single movie with any amount of action and you'll notice fuck ups.

CyricZ posted...

I find myself regularly amazed that nothing but Star Wars seems to have this effect on people.

It is a bit weird isn't it? Like you'd think Star Wars is the most ruined sci-fi franchise around.

I have my issues with the PT and ST but God damn it's nothing compared to what happened to the other sci-fi franchises I like. At least in every movie there's concepts and decisions worth talking about.

Luke became a psycho path and the only black lead was writen out for a white school shooter. And that whole love story. I will always hate Rian Johnson. Like with a passion.

Always remember, diehard Star Wars fans only like two or three of the twelve Star Wars movies.

COVxy posted...

Damn, the original movies would have been an absolute snore fest if Luke's character was as perfect and saint like as you suggest.

I agree. That's why the movies were about getting him there, instead of starting him there.