Poll of the Day > Student loan forgiveness plan

(+) Yeah! (+)

We all know we have people who are up to their neck in student loans but they weren't the target but they got caught in the vacuum.

I support loan forgiveness and Olive Garden unlimited soup salad and breadsticks

Support.

Fuck student loans. Wipe them out and make education free as it should be. Higher education being readily available to all, as a more educated population leads to better society.

ZangsBeard posted...

Fuck student loans. Wipe them out and make education free as it should be. Higher education being readily available to all, as a more educated population leads to better society.

I don't know. We had actual doctors claim that vaccines cause autism.

Revelation34 posted...

I don't know. We had actual doctors claim that vaccines cause autism.

Citation needed.

Debt is really bad for the economy, so it's a good thing.

BUMPED2002 posted...

We all know we have people who are up to their neck in student loans but they weren't the target but they got caught in the vacuum.

What an odd sentence.

Gosh, I wonder what TC is trying to accomplish with that third poll option

Sarcasthma posted...

What an odd sentence.

but

I mean, it's good recognition of the problem and it throws a bone to some of those affected. But it does nothing to solve the problem.

No

It's a terrible policy, it's beyond what the president's powers should be (should be an act of Congress to make a major funding decision), and will reward a lot of wealthy people (a huge majority of loan debt is held by the top 50% of incomes) and those that made poor decisions on the backs of the poor and the responsible.

And for all the "it'll stimulate the economy!" BS I've heard, I've yet to hear a good reason why a blanket $5000 or whatever stimulus to every American below a certain income threshold wouldn't do even better. Since at least that would go to all the trades people and low wage people that never even went to college.

streamofthesky posted...

will reward a lot of wealthy people (a huge majority of loan debt is held by the top 50% of incomes) and those that made poor decisions on the backs of the poor and the responsible.

Those individuals are ineligible for this program.

streamofthesky posted...

And for all the "it'll stimulate the economy!" BS I've heard, I've yet to hear a good reason why a blanket $5000 or whatever stimulus to every American below a certain income threshold wouldn't do even better. Since at least that would go to all the trades people and low wage people that never even went to college.

Right. Giving the most vulnerable in society the funds to feed and house themselves reduces poverty and economic instability. Basic Income Guarantee

KodyKeir posted...

Those individuals are ineligible for this program.

It's up to $125K and $250K for married filing jointly.
$125K is triple the median income.

https://www.census.gov/library/publications/2021/demo/p60-273.html

It's not the 1%, but it definitely extends well into the upper middle class, while giving nothing to those w/ no college who generally get paid the least.

Right. Giving the most vulnerable in society the funds to feed and house themselves reduces poverty and economic instability. Basic Income Guarantee

Which this handout does not do.

streamofthesky posted...

t's not the 1%, but it definitely extends well into the upper middle class,

By what definition do you make that declaration?

streamofthesky posted...

while giving nothing to those w/ no college who generally get paid the least.

Ah, there's your problem, it's called carcinization; yeah he should eliminate the debt entirely and make public college free but to hate a plan because it helps people who are not you specifically, c'mon jack. A lot of households will be able to eat because they no longer have to shell out interest payments on their student loans, that's real money on the table and in their pockets.

streamofthesky posted...

handout

Doing the right thing means enacting socialist polices, get over it.

streamofthesky posted...

while giving nothing to those w/ no college who generally get paid the least.

Because it's not about supplementing income. It's about erasing debt from loans that were given irresponsibly by the government.

It's not a handout either. It's directly applied to the loan. They can't take the money and use it elsewhere.

Revelation34 posted...

I don't know. We had actual doctors claim that vaccines cause autism.

It was 1 doctor, and the dude was just a scam artist. He knew what he was pushing was stupid as fuck, but he was trying to make a buck out of it.

The government directly gave loans with insane interest rates to millions of americans and allowed colleges to jack up their tuition (even while students were still going to college) drastically increasing the cost within a 10 year period.

This has created many low to middle income college students that ended up graduating with 30k or more in debt, which wouldn't normally be a huge problem.

Except that the loans interest rate and fees are enough to double the actual amount of the loan within 5 years unless you at least pay enough to cover the interest, which it turns out many (maybe even a majority) of college graduates were not able to do, due to the increased cost of living/rent and general low wages and often lack of jobs in the fields the students graduated in (Teachers for example in CA are a great example as in the last 10 years not only have many schools closed and less jobs were available, but wages have not increased to even cover the base cost of living in CA let alone pay back loans).

So now you have people who graduated with a teaching degree in 2015 who have over 100k in debt that is just getting larger every year. The forgiveness programs didn't work in most cases as well (if you teach at low income schools etc), and the current "loan forgiveness" is a joke for most people who have students loans and actually got more than an AA degree (which is generally needed for anything worth going to college for).

So no, this loan forgiveness is a joke and totally not going to solve the problem, in fact, the loan forgiveness will probably not help a majority of people with student loans at all, and they will STILL end up owing money for the rest of their lives.

Again, remove all interest on the loans and reset it to a freaking non-insane amount per year and stop freaking capitalizing it every year as well. Student loans flat out should not be charging more than 7% interest (or more then 2% interest for that matter), and nobody who graduated with 40k in loans should have over 100k owed in less than a decade, that is just crazy and should be illegal.

Most importantly those issues should be dealt with first before any foregiveness of loans since you are actually not helping people with the foregiveness (or not many of them) but are angering many republicans etc by doing so.

You are basically still lining the governments pockets with tons of money through interest each year, while throwing crumbs to the peasants to placate them.

Don't accept crumbs.

Fight to ensure everyone can go to college and pay for it in a reasonable way over a reasonable amount of time.

Nobody should be in debt for life to become a teacher.

for it

I have loans I still owe that I got in 1997, I never completed college due to dealing with a lot going on and unknowingly at the time suffering from PTSD. I was told at the time when my payments lapsed if they lapsed you will owe the full amount and never be allowed to re-establish a payment plan. That was clearly a lie, but that is what I was told directly from our government at the time.

This forced me into default, and I couldn't pay 20k back at once so it was in default for years until 2006 when the IRS started garnishing my wages. I still owe about 11k and make under 40k a year so yeah..... I am all for having some of that removed. They are only clearing 10k from my understanding not your entire balance owed. Still though, this will finally let me get out from under this loan that i've owed for around 25 years.

They could probably just do away with college and replace it with classes on "people skills" for 99% of the jobs out there that claim they want them.

I mean, promotions and all the best perks... Even getting hired to begin with really... All come down to mostly being a people pleaser from what I've seen in the corporate world. Not something anyone should be racking up five or six digit debt for to be sure.

Entity13 posted...

Citation needed.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Wakefield

I said had.

Revelation34 posted...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Wakefield

I said had.

You also said doctors, plural. You listed one who was clearly dishonest in his research and was eventually removed from the UK medical register, thus barred from practicing medicine beyond that point. So feel free to argue whether or not to call him an "actual" doctor by that merit, even if he'd been on the register at the time.

ZangsBeard posted...

Fuck student loans. Wipe them out and make education free as it should be. Higher education being readily available to all, as a more educated population leads to better society.

I do think the government should subsidize some degrees/trades (at least until you start failing), like doctors, teachers, plumbers, etc. but not something like interior design or women's studies.

too bad I already paid off my loans, but it's good for people who still need it.

Does it do anything to address the increasing price? On that note, I place the blame on colleges for price gauging, I'd like to hear more solutions that clamp down on their ability to do that.

Same with medicine in general. The public spending is fine, I don't mind tax dollars going towards things that matter, but it would be great if the government didn't fork over whatever inflated price a college/hospital asks for.

Probably ignorant on this as I rarely look at the fine print of these things.

DrYuya posted...

They could probably just do away with college and replace it with classes on "people skills" for 99% of the jobs out there that claim they want them.

No one cares about degrees in the software field anymore. Seriously. Half of us just self-taught. I'm thankful that I skipped it myself, saved myself the debt. I think we collectively boycotted college, sick of paying for annually updated paper $2000 textbooks with one-time-use homework redeeming codes, or a $3000 online course where you're e-mailed one hour long 480p mp4 file with a guy in an echo-ey room droning on and on, with basically no communication with the professor. Oh, and don't forget that you have to take English, Calculus, and a life skills course from someone who might as well be a random PotDer telling me how to succeed in life.

I wonder how that would work out for a medical field.

Well, I don't get to benefit from Biden's handout but I do benefit from Sweet v Cardona. https://www.ppsl.org/news/judge-grants-preliminary-approval-of-borrower-defense-settlement-in-sweet-v-cardona

wipes out my debt, so it kicks ass

should be more tho

I think the money could've been used better to help people in need more than a general population handout but there's worse uses, so I said yes.

Not a fan, even though it will wipe out my own student loan. It's not the responsibility of the tax payer to pay of the the debts of entitled college kids. College costs are out of hand because demand is too high. Not everyone needs to go to college and if you made a bad investment, that's on you.

Entity13 posted...

You also said doctors, plural. You listed one who was clearly dishonest in his research and was eventually removed from the UK medical register, thus barred from practicing medicine beyond that point. So feel free to argue whether or not to call him an "actual" doctor by that merit, even if he'd been on the register at the time.

if I recall he lost his license to practice medicine and was found guilty of research misconduct. There were 11 other researachers on that study which eventually admitted to falsifying data. He was paid by trial lawyers to conduct the study in connection with a lawsuit attempting to sue for damages they falsely claimed were a result of vaccinations.

I dont know how it works in the uk but if your license to practice medicine in America is revoked your doctorate degree (which makes you a doctor) is Not taken away. You earned the degree but you lose your license to practice medicine or consult. I woild imagine its the same in the uk cause I cant imagine they would revoke a diploma you earned.

it might be a technicality but the title or degree is not lost even if they can no longer do anything with the degree other than use it as a suffix or prefix.
Depending on the country or state he might not be permitted to use the term physician or something similar as well.

What does this old fraud have to do with loan forgiveness?

im curious

hungrymike posted...

Not a fan, even though it will wipe out my own student loan. It's not the responsibility of the tax payer to pay of the the debts of entitled college kids. College costs are out of hand because demand is too high. Not everyone needs to go to college and if you made a bad investment, that's on you.

Its not the responsibility of the tax payer to for peoples fuckin kids, but the refundable portion of the Child Tax Credit was something like $1400 before the COVID Relief Package, and people gladly snatch that up every year.

But I dont have student loan debt

.. wait a minute, I do now

JixHedgehog posted...

But I dont have student loan debt

.. wait a minute, I do now

You also blame 2008 events on Obamas presidency, so student loan debt mightve actually helped you.

hungrymike posted...

College costs are out of hand because demand is too high. Not everyone needs to go to college

Something about 83% of well paying jobs needing a college education to be considered for, not 1956 anymore...

KodyKeir posted...

Something about 83% of well paying jobs needing a college education to be considered for, not 1956 anymore...

Though, to be fair, that's at least partially a consequence of how many people go to college. If there were fewer college-educated applicants, there would be fewer jobs demanding college educations when they don't actually need them.

KodyKeir posted...

Something about 83% of well paying jobs needing a college education to be considered for, not 1956 anymore...

I see you majored in pulling statistics out of thin air. There are certificate programs, military service, on the job training and trade schools that open up well paying jobs without a 4 year degree. Sure some jobs require college, particularly in the stem fields, but if college was such a sure fire way into a well paying job, these students wouldn't need their fellow citizens to foot the bill, would they?

Yeah. I subscribe to trickle-up economics.

I think student loans should be interest free. Public universities in the US need more respect and attention.

In Canada, very few universities are private, and generally they're the worst ones. There's one in BC called Trinity Western that has such a bad reputation that I wouldn't be surprised if a degree from there made you LESS likely to get a job.

Entity13 posted...

You also said doctors, plural. You listed one who was clearly dishonest in his research and was eventually removed from the UK medical register, thus barred from practicing medicine beyond that point. So feel free to argue whether or not to call him an "actual" doctor by that merit, even if he'd been on the register at the time.

And just like that, Rev was gone. Typical.

faramir77 posted...

I think student loans should be interest free. Public universities in the US need more respect and attention.

In Canada, very few universities are private, and generally they're the worst ones. There's one in BC called Trinity Western that has such a bad reputation that I wouldn't be surprised if a degree from there made you LESS likely to get a job.

While the extreme costs of a degree are a problem, and rediculous (people make billions a year off our education system), it's the interest that is the real crime. Almost everyone could eventually pay off their student loans in a reasonable (20 years or less) time frame even with the extreme costs, but if you add 7% interest and fees etc that pump that over 10%, you end up with people in perpetual debt. Many decide to just leave the country all together eventually to avoid it.

Absolutely yes

Revelation34 posted...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Wakefield

I said had.

Dear @Revelation34,

Please respond to post 41.