Current Events > A person wrote racist comments with their company name on their profile

(+) Yeah! (+)

joe40001 posted...

Debate him by all means.

Honestly I love that kinda shit.

I hate when we go "I assume this is a trash person so I'm happy if they are never employed, become homeless and suffer indefinitely"

When somebody says dumb shit the first response should be "hey, you just said dumb shit, here is why what you said is dumb" and then they can either defend their statements or learn.

The idea that anybody thinks "you said something dumb, I'm not even going to talk to you but try to shut down your ability to have a roof over your head or pay for food because that's a good first step" is offensively moronic and evil.

What you're saying makes sense and we can't have that here

This board is supposedly full of adults but you'd never know it

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Smackems posted...

What you're saying makes sense and we can't have that here

yo this appears in every single thread on reddit. every single one. there's always like 20 goons who feel compelled to type this up and hit post

Lysandear posted...

yo this appears in every single thread on reddit. every single one. there's always like 20 goons who feel compelled to type this up and hit post

Idc

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Smackems posted...

Idc

pls tell me your intent in posting that statement i quoted

Conflict posted...

There's absolutely zero logic in the content of your posts and nothing but weird, infantile emotion. You look at a guy seeing someone post something indisputably racist, without debate, feeling uncomfortable and reporting it to their employer, and you're comparing it to jewish people being killed. You create these weird narratives in your head of sadism, that's backed up and supported by absolutely nothing. You see people not having sympathy for someone who says something racist and hateful about a group of people and your mind goes to complete extremes.

It's impossible to take anything you say seriously. You're in your thirties yet you sound less mature than the literal teenagers posting on this board.

And shut up already, Catboy. Stop obsessing over me. Stop talking about me. Stop inserting yourself in every discussion that involves me

"You are wrong because I super duper insist you are"

Ok great argument. You are infantile infinity +1 if you really want to play that game.

If you want to get grounded to adult conversation let's start here:

1. Is what they said 100% indisputably racist?
2. Does them having said that confirm they are 100% indisputably racist as a person?
3. How racist do we infer that they are? And does that matter so long as they qualify as racist?
4. If they are racist what is the appropriate punishment?
5. What means does a racist have to become better and rectify the situation?

Even though that is laid on crystal clear and academically I fully expect you to say "none of what you say is a real discussion". Please, if you are confident in your stance just answer those questions and we'll pick it apart. That's what good faith adults do.

If you want to say shit like "it's obviously racist (without interrogation) and any punishment to an obvious racist is justified (without limitation)" then it's pretty quick to figure out who is seeing things in a childish way.

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Lysandear posted...

pls tell me your intent in posting that statement i quoted

Not interested

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pls

respond

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Conflict posted...

Nobody said this.

Nobody even implied this.

You've been told this multiple times.

Stop acting like you're 5 years old.

Ok, so you aren't happy they become unemployed?

You wouldn't be happy if the become homeless?

You wouldn't be happy if they suffered?

They are "obviously a bigot" after all, so are you saying you don't want bigots to suffer?

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i think what the TC did is fine.

your dumbass actions have consequences. if you act racist, dont expect non-racists to employ you.

and if you're worried youll be hit, then you got problems

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Conflict posted...

Completely irrelevant

You've been spending a lot of time inserting completely irrelevant details, making irrelevant comparisons and asking irrelevant questions. I don't know if it's because you just enjoy typing mindlessly or what

You could be totally not racist at all and just be making an inappropriate joke. Guess what, you're still going to get reprimanded the same way a genuinely racist person gets reprimanded for typing something genuinely racist.

How can you even pretend this about any moral virtue when right here you admit you don't give a shit if it's a racist or not racist being punished?

Context doesn't matter, intent doesn't matter, if somebody found it offensive then the person who said it has any punishment coming to them that comes?

It is insane you can take this stance and not see the flaws with it.

Here's a crazy idea: What's in somebody's heart, and if they are actually hateful should matter when we decide how much suffering they deserve.

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joe40001 posted...

...they get off on punishing "bigots" not because they care about actual tolerance on the world, but because it's the one group of people you are allow to get off on hurting and nobody challenges you on it.

Man, you are too much. I imagine if we were actually speaking instead of typing, you would sound exactly like Ben Shapiro.

For the record, if the guy turned around on the very next post and said, "I'm not really like this. I shouldn't have said that", it would come off as disingenuous (like most apologies by racists after they've been caught and livelihood potentially threatened), but he wouldn't be fired, and no one would try to cancel him, as he's shown self-awareness and (fake) remorse.

bloodyarts posted...

For the record, if the guy turned around on the very next post and said, "I'm not really like this. I shouldn't have said that", it would come off as disingenuous (like most apologies by racists after they've been caught and livelihood potentially threatened), but he wouldn't be fired, and no one would try to cancel him, as he's shown self-awareness and (fake) remorse.

You can't seriously believe this.

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Smackems posted...

Idc

An adult response. On a "board full of adults"
Yeah no debate necessary with this one.

What if the company investigates the claim, reads the Fb post, sees evidence of repeated behavior and fires the guy?
Is the Company being too harsh?
You're defending the guy as if he's done nothing wrong, but his feelings and actions are right there in print.

Also, he's potentially harming future employment prospects that Company may have extended to the group he criticized. What's the proper discipline for that?

i didnt see anything racist in the OP.

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Prestoff posted...

This, I'm so sick of cancel culture.

How hard is it to not be a racist piece of shit? Lets talk about stopping that first.

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It seems that there is overwhelming support on reporting him. Thanks guys I was feeling very iffy

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EvolutionUber posted...

It seems that there is overwhelming support on reporting him. Thanks guys I was feeling very iffy

Dont be. You did the right thing.

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joe40001 posted...

But did the person say they don't care?

They had interactions that frustrated them about a certain group, they are not saying they don't want to help the group as much as possible.

If somebody is saying "I am going to be less effective at my job for X demographic" and they stand by that statement then yeah, firing them is fine.

I think much more likely here is somebody saying some bullshit online, and people out of context deciding it defines the person.

Here's my olive branch to the haters:
If somebody legitimately is worse at their job towards anybody because of their prejudices, the employers are in their right to fire them and replace them with a better employee, because intolerance is bad.

I simply don't think most twitter mobs and these type of people actually target intolerance but rather people who say something that is sufficient to punish.

The person said "why waste money on people who dont want to work - that definitely shows lack of care/passion, which is important in that person's specific job (being able to set aside preconceived notions and helping people from that group). While I agree that people often vent, there's two issues here - A) venting in public and B) making specific statements. If a therapist posted "being a therapist is tough", that doesn't reflect a specific bias/thought towards a certain demographic, while saying "what's the point of doing therapy with Hispanics, they are always so lazy" is a very different take.
To continue with the cardiac surgeon example - are you saying we should wait to see if more black people die under his/her operations than other races, and THEN investigate?

Ruvan22 posted...

The person said "why waste money on people who dont want to work - that definitely shows lack of care/passion, which is important in that person's specific job (being able to set aside preconceived notions and helping people from that group). While I agree that people often vent, there's two issues here - A) venting in public and B) making specific statements. If a therapist posted "being a therapist is tough", that doesn't reflect a specific bias/thought towards a certain demographic, while saying "what's the point of doing therapy with Hispanics, they are always so lazy" is a very different take.
To continue with the cardiac surgeon example - are you saying we should wait to see if more black people die under his/her operations than other races, and THEN investigate?

I'd be fine with an investigation. But I don't think that's the goal here, the goal is to get the company to think "oh, we should fire them straight out". I think the situation is somebody read something that upset them, and wanted the person to be punished for it.

If the actual goal is fairness and rooting out structural intolerance that's fine.

Are we trying to get him fired for what he said, or are we using what he said as something that legitimately raises concerns about his job efficacy?

Like if we take out the emotional angle and it's just a guy who works at a wind farm saying "wind turbines are pretty bullshit, you try to take care of them but they break down all the time, honestly coal is better". Would TC send the same message to the employer? Probably not. Because ultimately I don't think this is about making sure people who are bad at their job get fired. It's about punishing people who say things that upset us.

Don't get me wrong, if he happens to be intolerant in a way that negatively impacts his job, him getting fired wouldn't be a tragedy, but let's also not pretend what is and isn't going on here. What's going on is trying to punish those who upset us because having that power makes us feel good. If we have a morally sound or employer based logic to do it, that helps, but it's the means and not the end most of the time.

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Here's the thing, if someone is being a bigot, or any sort of dick really, and has their company attached, it's well within the company's rights to say "We don't want this piece of shit employed at our company" for any reason. Be it, "We don't want this attached to us" or "We don't know how this douchebag interacts with other employees/customers (be them White or a PoC)", or simply "We don't stand for this sort of disgusting thought and it's our right not to give someone money while they're spouting such bullshit". If you want to shame TC/the company but not the bigot, you're probably on the wrong side of it all for a specific reason or 2.

Isn't that what the usual defenders say when companies decide not to serve specific people anyway?

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StarReaper13 posted...

Here's the thing, if someone is being a bigot, or any sort of dick really, and has their company attached, it's well within the company's rights to say "We don't want this piece of shit employed at our company" for any reason. Be it, "We don't want this attached to us" or "We don't know how this douchebag interacts with other employees/customers (be them White or a PoC)", or simply "We don't stand for this sort of disgusting thought and it's our right not to give someone money while they're spouting such bullshit". If you want to shame TC/the company but not the bigot, you're probably on the wrong side of it all for a specific reason or 2.

Isn't that what the usual defenders say when companies decide not to serve specific people anyway?

When we talk about companies rights they basically have all the power. They can legally fire you for anything they don't like about you unless it's a protected class issue. Pretty sure Disney can fire people if those people say negative things about China. So "it's well within their rights" doesn't matter too much in the discussion of what is actually right and wrong.

In a world where you need a job to not be homeless, to have healthcare, to really survive in any meaningful way, I think the thing that is most fair is that you should not be fired for expressing a thought on your own time. You shouldn't be fired for anything non-illegal that you do outside of work, and within work you should generally only be fired if you cannot perform your job well.

Would this maybe be a different discussion if people's basic needs were provided for outside of work, like you wouldn't fail to get medicine if you got fired? Perhaps.

But as it stands people's survival basically depends on their employment, and also employers are "totally in their right" to fire a person for pretty much anything if they wanted to. And the main things getting people fired are not those on the hunt for justice but on the hunt to punish those who say things that upset them.

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joe40001 posted...

ou shouldn't be fired for anything non-illegal that you do outside of work, and within work you should generally only be fired if you cannot perform your job well.

lol shut up

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Conflict posted...

Idk why you guys are still responding to him, you're actually wasting your breath

Wow, you really gave up on discussion.

Look, I'll admit when this conversation started I was in a more emotional place, so I might have been less patient in my wording.

But all my arguments hold up. It's very dangerous to say "for a single thing you post online, I can label you as a bigot" and then also "I fundamentally don't care what happens negatively to bigots".

It's weird because before this topic I had you tagged as fair to discuss with, so I don't know what happened here that made you just give up.

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joe40001 posted...

It's very dangerous to say "for a single thing you post online, I can label you as a bigot" and then also "I fundamentally don't care what happens negatively to bigots".

How many examples of blatant bigotry are people supposed to observe before they're allowed to label somebody a bigot?

Nope, I got a racist banker fired 2 years ago.

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can't believe I got fired for standing outside of a school and yelling racial slurs at children that passed by when it's not my fault none of those kids were willing to prove I was a racist logically in a debate with me

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StarReaper13 posted...

lol shut up

What is wrong with what I said?

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


So you are saying you know he is worse at his job because he posted that?

You are saying 3 things at once and acting like all 3 are on their face true:

1. What he said, in context and intent was definitely racist
2. Because he said that, he is definitely a racist
3. Because he is definitely a racist he acts racistly at work, and thus is a worse employee.

Number 3 is the most probably true, though in theory, somebody could separate from their feelings entirely at their job.

But 1 and 2 are not obviously true like you act like they are. So let's put it another way, if he said exactly what he said, but then we had a "unfair at work thermometer" that we could put to his head, and it would read out whether he was unfair at work because of some bigotry, and the thermometer read "no" would you really be fine having him not get punished in any way for what he said? Because if it said yes, I'd totally be fine with him being fired.

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Conflict posted...

Your first mistake is you thinking your hyperbolic analogies to the Holocaust and melodramatic presumptions qualified as "discussion". You haven't brought a single ounce of logic to the table but all the emotion in the world

Do you deny there is a very long dangerous history to the practice of "othering"?

I'm not being at all emotional right now. And I think my breakdowns of points has been very logical.

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joe40001 posted...

But I don't think.......

And that's your problem, YOU DON'T THINK.

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Aw, joe specifically skipped my post. I guess he doesn't want to tell us how many instances we're supposed to observe before it starts counting as being a bigot. Strange.

Tenlaar posted...

Aw, joe specifically skipped my post. I guess he doesn't want to tell us how many instances we're supposed to observe before it starts counting as being a bigot. Strange.

I didn't see your post.

It depends on what you mean by "bigot", and what you think is ok to do to "bigots".

If we define a "bigot" as somebody who has said something that can easily be read as bigotted, then yes the guy is a bigot.

I think the definition would be a behavioral pattern of discrimination. Saying something on twitter could be cause to investigate such a thing, but it's far from proof.

Let's go with your rules, let's say one thing that to multiple people reads as "clearly bigoted" makes them a bigot. Then what? What is fair to happen to them? How do they lose that label?

If a bigot is fired is that fair?
If a bigot loses their health insurance because of being fired is that fair?
If a bigot loses their house because of being fired is that fair?
If a bigot suffers medical harm because of all these things is that fair?

I'm seriously asking, because I know the game that's being played, it's label someone as an other, than then it doesn't matter what happens to them. Or am I wrong? Is there something that would be unfair to happen to them? Or if their very next tweet was "my bad, I mispoke" is all forgiven? Did they lose their definite label of being a bigot?

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shockthemonkey posted...

Joe admits to watching beastiality porn,

What. The. Fuck?

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shockthemonkey posted...

Joe admits to watching beastiality porn, why the fuck is anyone engaging with him? Stop treating psychos like they matter

Shit. Trumpies really be doing the most, lmao. Get some help Joe, your future looks bleak.

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protip: Don't take shockthemonkey at face value

Not that my porn habits are anybody's business, but no I don't watch animal porn

We can see which people live in the ad homenim world as opposed to good faith discussion world.

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That's the thing, it's a power thing rather than a discussion thing.

I have a clear point, my point upsets some people, and so the goal is to not even engage on the point.

I don't have love for bigots, but I see how dangerous a game some people play. They say "one shitty thing you said defines you as bad, and after that, it doesn't matter what negative happens to you."

Many couch it in some kind of decency or virtue but it's about power dynamics. It's about tearing the person they don't like down. Regardless of the tactic.

I shouldn't even acknowledge people like shockthemonkey, because they are playing a game I have no interest in.

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joe40001 posted...

What is wrong with what I said?'

Because it's dumb as shit to say "You shouldn't be fired for anything non-illegal that you do outside of work" Because that is a pants on head stupid argument unless it's used in the context of protecting bigots like ones in TC's original post.

The dumbest shit you said today probably. Besides the whole "you shouldn't be allowed to call racists racist" argument of course.

So do us a favor and shut the fuck up lmao

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https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/400-current-events/78913881/943424196

What the fuck Joe.

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shockthemonkey posted...

You literally posted a topic about people who comment I wish I was her on videos of women fucking horses. Youre fucking sick.

Oh hentai?

Have you seen hentai? It's all full of that kinda crazy shit. Yeah I've seen that, though it's not all my jam.

I thought you meant actual people and animals.

And you all can clutch your pearls as much as you want if you really want to pretend I'm the first person on this forum who has seen tentacle porn and other weird hentai shit.

Can we now get back on topic? Because this kind of thing is like the definition of a bad faith argument.

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