Board 8 > Board 8 Comic Book Club #1

(+) Yeah! (+)

Also, I'll put this in spoiler tags...

I usually hate the use of epilogues in any medium where it gives a piece of narrative recap, but the emotional gut punch of knowing that this was inspired by a true story is really, really strong. There's no reason to believe it went down the way the end of the story suggests, but it definitely does its job and makes the story so much more moving.
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I found that really powerful. It made me think of in movies or TV when an important character dying is followed by a scene of dead silence.
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Oh, and I just realized, the bird from the beginning flying overhead at the end is also a great reminder of its role in the beginning and how, ultimately, it was right.

TotallyNotMI posted...

I found that really powerful. It made me think of in movies or TV when an important character dying is followed by a scene of dead silence.

One thing I absolutely love about comics is that there is no soundtrack, so your mind fills that role for you. And in a lot of great comic moments, completely silence really drives the moment into you. This is definitely one of those moments.
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A thought I just had

The pride refused to eat a dead human because of their respect for the humans for caring for them.

Then they are killed by humans

Probably an obvious point but it didn't immediately register to me.
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About to read the second and third issue of Red Son now, but I'll say that I agree with MI about the first issue being able to stand on its own as a one-shot.

I didn't know anything about Red Son going in so I was pretty surprised that the Superman/Luthor dynamic was still there and that the good versus "evil" between them still existed. I was expecting this to be some sort of incredibly dystopian Earth where Superman ruled with an iron fist, but it's interesting to see that essentially I got the exact opposite scenario.

Of course this could all change in the next two issues, and with the way the first one ended, I have a feeling it might get a little closer to my initial prediction.

I absolutely love this take on Luthor as well.
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davidponte posted...

I didn't know anything about Red Son going in so I was pretty surprised that the Superman/Luthor dynamic was still there and that the good versus "evil" between them still existed. I was expecting this to be some sort of incredibly dystopian Earth where Superman ruled with an iron fist, but it's interesting to see that essentially I got the exact opposite scenario.

I had this same thought going in! I thought his ideals would have been tarnished and he would be a different character. When he saved Metropolis I realized we were seeing that he is who he is, despite of his upbringing.
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Read the first two issues of Dues Ex. I like it so far, but I wouldn't say I love it. I liked the September 11 reveal at the end of the first issue and how much he still blames himself for not doing more. The N-word art debate was also interesting and is something I could see a political drama taking on, in a more edited form of course.

I think it the power choice for him was wise. Powerful, but can be turned off and he still feels like a relatable human.

I don't think I really have much more to say right now

I have been reading some of these comics out loud to my son when he is fussy since my voice calms him. This one has a lot of bleeps when I am reading!
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Oh one more thing

I love the police commissioner and when she pulled out the billy club on him to bypass his powers. She is cool!
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I love that you're indoctrinating the kiddo already.
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He is being indoctrinated to all kinds of nerdy stuff! My husband and I have been joking that when Jacob reaches his rebellious teenage years he is going to become a jock and I am going to cry and wonder where I went wrong.
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Wow, I was not expecting that ending. I smiled when I seen Jor-L and knew where it was going after that, which was pretty cool. Overall, I really enjoyed it. I haven't really read many elseworld stories, but they don't usually have a "happy ending" like this, do they?

A couple quick thoughts:

It was fun to see some of the cameos from big names thrown in here. I thought it worked better in some places than others.

One that I didn't really see the point of was Batman. I can understand needing a resistance and Batman logically fits that bill going against Superman, but I don't really think the origin makes sense. Superman landed in the Ukraine, and you can feasibly see how what happened made sense because of that, but just because a child had his parents murdered in front of him does not make him future Batman. It just seemed a little too convenient there.

I found it interesting how Superman continued to stick to his singular moral value of not killing anyone. There was that small piece inside of him that was still "good", and he used that to justify all of his other actions.

It was also interesting to see Luthor come out as the "good guy" by the end of it, and hilarious that it only really happened because of his hatred for Superman. Every problem in the world was easily solvable, but none of it actually mattered unless it hurt Superman in some way. That's completely on brand for the character and I love it.
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You conside a time loop that ends with Earth being destroyed a happy ending?
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TotallyNotMI posted...

You conside a time loop that ends with Earth being destroyed a happy ending?

The Earth being destroyed after how many million years is how it's always going to end. Most of the main characters of the story had a "happy" ending so I'd call it that.

If we want to look at any story ever and say "well this many million years in the future the sun is going to consume the Earth and everyone will die, so this isn't a happy ending" then I guess we can do that.
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Reading through Superman/Batman now. Another great story, and I will say that while all of these stories have proven to me that Superman can be an interesting character to read, I think Batman is still a much cooler, interesting character!

I should have some more thoughts when I finish it tomorrow.
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Just finished Pride of Bagdhad. My only real experience with Vaughn is with Saga and Paper Girls (both of which I'm way behind on), so I was excited to dive in to this week.

This isn't normally the type of thing I'd go for, but I enjoyed it. The dialogue is great and I enjoyed not only the charicterization of the pride, but how even the other minor characters felt immediately distinct. Overall, it reminded me a lot of We3, but a lot more grounded. I think its themes are better served that way. Particularly the ending. At first it was really jarring and I was convinced I had missed something. It really took me out of the story. But thinking about it, it's done in a purposeful way, as if to remind you that the grim but entertaining adventure of talking lions didn't actually happen, but all the rest of that bad shit did.
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Fallen really far behind but intend to catch up soon. Being on steady daylight is hurting.
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What's So Funny > World's Finest > Red Son

All 3 were good stories though. I really liked the dual narratice in Superman/Batman and how they played off of each other. Superman in this story was at his most interesting to me, and I think part of that is because of the dynamic between him and Batman.

I did have some questions throughout regarding how exactly we got in this position of Luthor as president with these task forces and so many metahumans under his control, but ultimately it didn't really matter. Always good to see the Bat-family as well.
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I can explain some of how Luthor became the President he is if you want.

Also, sorry for no responses later yesterday. Internet went down.
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It's less a question about that and more how he managed to have so many metahumans working for him. We got a little bit of a clarification with some of them being spies and with Captain Atom's small explanation at the end there, but it just seemed weird that it got to that point.

I don't think it makes the story worse, I was just genuinely questioning how it got to that point. Was it as simple as, "I'm Lex, come work for me", or was there a reason it got to that point?
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Black Lightning is the Secretary of Education for one. Also, America had just dealt with the Our Worlds at War crisis not long before, and most of these characters were involved in that.
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Was this Superman/Batman its own 6 issue limited series made to tell this story, or was it just one arc of a longer run?
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davidponte posted...

Was this Superman/Batman its own 6 issue limited series made to tell this story, or was it just one arc of a longer run?

There was a whole ongoing for it. This one is from the post-crisis series. There was also a New52 version that was pretty good and had some sick art.

Actually that didn't exactly answer your question. The writer did stay on to write a few more arcs after that one.
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He wrote 26 issues that comprised 4 story arcs and 2 one-shots. The last one shot is especially moving - his son had died of cancer, but started to write his own issue of Superman/Batman featuring Superboy and Robin. After the son's death, the writer was able to bring 20 of the top artists at the time together to finish the story. It's really great.
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Damn, that sounds like a pretty emotional read. I should definitely check it out.
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I'm legitimately angry after reading Pride of Baghdad. What the fuck, man.

I finished it 15 minutes ago and sat through the last 10 minutes of my commute stunned.
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Going back and reading others thoughts on it. I too was surprised at how well the characters were developed in so little time. I felt like I had been with them for longer than 100 pages by the end.

I wasn't expecting a happy ending, but I was not at all expecting what did happpen. I thought we'd get them looking over a war torn city and that it'd just end there as a kind of ambiguous "this is what freedom is" kind of thing. I didn't even fully realize that Zill had been shot until the other bullets came raining in. It was a legit "what the fuck" moment for me.
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Finished Pride of Baghdad. This was my first time hearing of it. It was certainly well above average, the character work was predictably great. I don't know that I would rank it as a must read, but it's certainly more accessible than most of Vaughn's work (given it's length) and so serves as an excellent choice for getting somebody into comics and/or Vaughn. Really happy that none of the characters seemed to do anything out of character and you could always understand their motivations, even though it's pretty short. The ending was less a gut punch for me than it seems for most, but primarily because I couldn't imagine it ending any other way. I also have a vague memory of the headline the story is based on. Doesn't necessarily make it any less frustrating, and the art made it way more effective than it would be otherwise.

Ex Machina is a series I purchased basically all of several months ago and haven't read much more than the first trade yet, so this is a great excuse to go ahead and push through. If it's any indication, I picked up Vol. 1 first and after finishing it decided I needed the rest so that should tell you.

I frickin' love superheroes. But this series is really great because despite being a mix of superheroism and politics, the West Wing aspects of it are more interesting to me than most of the super stuff. The guy trying to get him to go back to being The Great Machine is often a nuisance because instead of him I want that sweet, sweet political drama. I am sure this won't necessarily stay this way, but when you're book can tow the balance this well I think it's an excellent sign.
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I felt the exact same way about Ex Machina. I think that's a sign that the series is great; when you're dying to get back to the real hook of the story, you know Vaughan has roped you in well.
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This is actually my first time reading Pride of Baghdad. A first for comic book club for me. The first shot with the jetplanes is gorgeous, and really cinematic. I could physically feel the wind and hear sound eminating from them. Sort of interesting how all the lions look like Lion King expies, like it's a what if? story. The first bombing against the lions is raw and visceral, but holy fuck that poor giraffe. I think what I most like about this story is how it can feel child-like and whimsical at one point, but switches gears in an instant when any of the tools of warfare made their prescence known. Like the first sighting of the tanks, the section before that could be out of an animated animal movie for sure, but then you're brought back to reality. It's always shocking in this story. Overall, a real damn powerful story, the shock's are just non-stop. The ending definitely had me misty-eyed.
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Retagging this
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Snake5555555555 posted...

This is actually my first time reading Pride of Baghdad. A first for comic book club for me. The first shot with the jetplanes is gorgeous, and really cinematic. I could physically feel the wind and hear sound eminating from them. Sort of interesting how all the lions look like Lion King expies, like it's a what if? story. The first bombing against the lions is raw and visceral, but holy fuck that poor giraffe. I think what I most like about this story is how it can feel child-like and whimsical at one point, but switches gears in an instant when any of the tools of warfare made their prescence known. Like the first sighting of the tanks, the section before that could be out of an animated animal movie for sure, but then you're brought back to reality. It's always shocking in this story. Overall, a real damn powerful story, the shock's are just non-stop. The ending definitely had me misty-eyed.

I'm really surprised you've never read it before!
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Finished the Ex Machina issues last night.

The irony of a white writer making liberal use of the n-word to critique its frivolous use in artistic media is not lost on me. But is that itself an irresponsible use? Really makes you think.

I think the concept is interesting and well-interesting, but it doesn't do much for me as a standalone arc. It absolutely makes me want more, but unfortunately I already have 3 higher-priority Vaughn series in my backlog. Maybe one day!
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HeroDelTiempo17 posted...

I think the concept is interesting and well-interesting, but it doesn't do much for me as a standalone arc.

This kind of summed up my feelings too. I liked it, but it didn't feel concluded like everything else we have been reading. Granted that's because there are 45 other issues to read still!

Kremlin was my favorite character and I liked the idea that he was killing to try to force him into being a hero again. Was disappointed that the killer was... just some kid who wanted his name to be a legend.
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Yeah one thing with Vaughan is that I can't point to a lot of self-contained stories for him. But I also wanted to pitch some stories that are the starts of greater things with the hope that people will either follow up on their own or want the group to read more in future weeks.
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TotallyNotMI posted...

Kremlin was my favorite character and I liked the idea that he was killing to try to force him into being a hero again. Was disappointed that the killer was... just some kid who wanted his name to be a legend.

That villain motivation is kinda a trope for comics so I was actually pleasantly surprised Kremlin subverted it!
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I don't think I've ever seen that trope before
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Maybe not the exact trope, but it's very similar to the "I must become a villain to make the hero stronger!" thing. Zoom from Flash is the most notable that comes to mind.
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Zoom is also probably the pinnacle of that concept, too.

He even does the same thing to Damage!
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Anyone still reading, or are we all just waiting for Tuesday?
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The plan is to read Ex Machina tomorrow for me.
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I decided to read the first issue and then ended up binging through all of it. Enjoyed it a whole bunch, and while I agree that it doesn't really feel like an exceptional stand-alone arc, it's definitely one of my favourite books we've done so far. I never realized how much I wanted a political comic in my life until now!

Every week so far has had one story that I liked just a little bit less than the others, but both of the selections from this week were very strong, and it's probably my favourite week so far.

I was a little skeptical coming into it too, because up until now my comic reading was almost strictly rooted in the Marvel/DC superhero genre, but now I can't wait to get more stories like these.
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davidponte posted...

I was a little skeptical coming into it too, because up until now my comic reading was almost strictly rooted in the Marvel/DC superhero genre, but now I can't wait to get more stories like these.

Agreed.
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Tuesday!
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Today is the second week in our Creator Month, and that means it's Warren Ellis Week!

Who is Warren Ellis? Ellis is an extremely popular writer of primarily non-DC and Marvel titles, although he certainly shows up from time to time in both universes to great success. His real crowning achievements are his early 2000s titles for Wildstorm publications, where he created Planetary and the Authority (you saw a version of the Authority in What's So Funny?. So popular were the Authority almost immediately that the writers in DC decided to quickly take aim at their sister imprints top title). Ellis has also written a host of other great works. He reintroduced the Thunderbolts to the world in the most popular storyline featuring Marvel's Suicide Squad-a-likes, he created the Red comic book (which the movies were based off of - and one of the movies won a Golden Globe for Best Comedy!), he created Nextwave, and he wrote Transmetropolitan (which is a darling in comic book circles).

Oh and he wrote the Castlevania animated show, so you can add that to his resume.

We're reading none of those things, and instead reading a self-contained mini-series called Global Frequency. Each time I read this story, I like it more and more. It plays like the coolest, most intense procedural show ever, and it's a very cinematic comic book. The story features an organization called the Global Frequency: 1000 sleeper cells around the world that are activated when local and federal law enforcement can't figure out how to solve the sort of threats that would make the team from Fringe shit their pants. This comic was so successful that it almost spawned a TV show back in 2005 featuring Michelle Forbes and Aimee Garcia (who would both go on to make other awesome comic book TV shows).

This comic is much more intense than some of the others we've read, and it will be interesting to see if people enjoy it. I'm not even sure Snake of the 5s has ever picked this series up, so we'll have a lot of people flying blind on this one. As always, if you have trouble finding this one, hit me up on Discord and I can help you out.

This will certainly not be the only week of Warren Ellis comics, so be prepared for more of his stuff after this month is over.
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Oh, Ellis is usually a good time for me. I'll dig into this over the weekend when I'll have time to absorb 12 issues.
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I look forward to your thoughts!
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Warren Ellis week, great! I just have to find myself a copy.
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First issue read. I liked it. Didn't love it. I hope for more characterization moving forward since every member of the Global Frequency felt the same.

Art was great and I could imagine seeing events play out on the big screen.

Favorite part was the guy moving the gun, since the Frequency member was going to move and showing he knew and accepted he had to die.
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Oh and I didn't like the Frequency member in the helicopter dying. Felt like we were supposed to feel bad but there wasn't any kind of attachment or anything so her death was very meh
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I don't think you are supposed to necessarily be attached. It's more to show that people in this group are expendable and to give the concept of the series a starring role.
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