Board 8 > Do you believe the sexual misconduct claims against kavanaugh ?

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ExThaNemesis
09/27/18 9:13:43 PM
#101:


ShadowYosuke posted...
Do you do the same with Murder?


Do you think sexual assault is as bad as murder?

Also can you point me out a murder case where the victim made the accusation 30 years later?
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TheRock1525
09/27/18 9:13:51 PM
#102:


ExThaNemesis posted...
But again, I have to have a hardline stance.


Ok Gohan.
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TheRock1525
09/27/18 9:14:13 PM
#103:


ExThaNemesis posted...
Do you think sexual assault is as bad as murder?


Absolutely. Sometimes worse.
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CelesMyUserName
09/27/18 9:14:19 PM
#104:


guys someone who says they have a hardline stance not to ever believe any accusations isn't someone worth talking to about any accusations
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CelesMyUserName
09/27/18 9:15:13 PM
#105:


ExThaNemesis posted...
Also can you point me out a murder case where the victim made the accusation 30 years later?

... the... murder... victim......?
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Reg
09/27/18 9:15:25 PM
#106:


ExThaNemesis posted...
Also can you point me out a murder case where the victim made the accusation

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ExThaNemesis
09/27/18 9:16:09 PM
#107:


TheRock1525 posted...
Absolutely. Sometimes worse.


Woof.

Like ouch. Imagine believing this.

CelesMyUserName posted...
guys someone who says they have a hardline stance not to ever believe any accusations isn't someone worth talking to about any accusations


And woof as well. Thanks for misrepresenting my point. I'm talking about PUBLIC accusations. Ala, ones made deliberately to destroy someone's reputation with no legal action taken at the time or near the time of.
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TheRock1525
09/27/18 9:16:19 PM
#108:


Any day now Nicole Brown is gonna accuse the real murderer.
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ExThaNemesis
09/27/18 9:16:45 PM
#109:


CelesMyUserName posted...
... the... murder... victim......?


Uuuuuuhhhhhhh

Are ya'll really that dense that this point was going over your head?
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Wanglicious
09/27/18 9:16:57 PM
#110:


Drakeryn posted...
A lot of those are stranger identifications with minimal time to observe (e.g., a drive-by shooting where you see the guy's face in the car window for a couple seconds before he starts shooting). But she knew this guy; they were at a party together; there was plenty of time.


her knowing him, to what extent? to having seen him, sure. more than that... not really.

they were at a party together - probably true. though do bear in mind that she also claimed some people were at the party who have come out to say they weren't, so she's already gotten people at the place wrong. plural there: two people have denied any knowledge of the party or being there. not sure if there's a third but i don't think it makes much difference since you're already dealing with a faulty memory on this point alone.

there being plenty of time is part of the problem.
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ExThaNemesis
09/27/18 9:17:14 PM
#111:


Like I can't imagine being so thick in the head that you miss what I was saying there. It must be a tough life being that stupid.
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kevwaffles
09/27/18 9:17:33 PM
#112:


Hey Extha, does your hardline stance extend to Harvey Weinstein? Can't pick and choose, after all.
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Reg
09/27/18 9:17:45 PM
#113:


ExThaNemesis posted...
CelesMyUserName posted...
... the... murder... victim......?


Uuuuuuhhhhhhh

Are ya'll really that dense that this point was going over your head?

I mean, I really don't give a fuck either way

I just thought it was hilarious to see worded that way
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TheRock1525
09/27/18 9:18:05 PM
#114:


ExThaNemesis posted...
Woof.

Like ouch. Imagine believing this.


Uh, it's really easy.

Someone tortures me for an extend period of time, doing great bodily harm and psychological damage that will remain with me for the rest of my life.

Vs.

Guy putting a bullet in my head, killing me instantly.

I'd prefer the latter.
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ExThaNemesis
09/27/18 9:18:12 PM
#115:


Just to help you out, because I know you guys can't read and are actual morons:

I was making fun of him for comparing ANY murder case to the current allegations against Kavanaugh.
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ShadowYosuke
09/27/18 9:22:01 PM
#116:


CelesMyUserName posted...
guys someone who says they have a hardline stance not to ever believe any accusations isn't someone worth talking to about any accusations


Not worth talking to, no. But arguing against? Absolutely. That's how rape culture permeates. I wonder if he also disbelieves all the accusations against those priests in the Catholic CHurch because they waited to come out. Or Sandusky. Or Bill Cosby. Or Weinstein. "Let's just disbelieve all public accusations! But only in cases of Rape!" Almost makes me wonder why he's so concerned about it.
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Drakeryn
09/27/18 9:24:04 PM
#117:


ExThaNemesis posted...
But again, I have to have a hardline stance. I can't pick and choose which public accusations get through the filter because it does a disservice to those falsely accused.

If you commit to hardline skepticism, that's fair enough, but you have to be consistent about it. You should also not believe Kavanaugh's protestations of innocence because it does a disservice to those truthful accusers whose attackers were never brought to justice.

(Maybe that is your stance, I don't know.)
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ExThaNemesis
09/27/18 9:24:59 PM
#118:


ShadowYosuke posted...
Almost makes me wonder why he's so concerned about it.


Probably because I've seen people's lives be ruined over them. Brian Banks, Paul Nungesser, the fraternity members at UVA who had their lives permanently altered. I know you don't know or care about any of these men because you're a misandrist, but yeah.

Beyond that, false accusations do irreparable damage to the sexual assault victims you are pretending to care so much about.

And don't think your implication went over my head here.
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Drakeryn
09/27/18 9:28:55 PM
#119:


Wanglicious posted...
Drakeryn posted...
A lot of those are stranger identifications with minimal time to observe (e.g., a drive-by shooting where you see the guy's face in the car window for a couple seconds before he starts shooting). But she knew this guy; they were at a party together; there was plenty of time.


her knowing him, to what extent? to having seen him, sure. more than that... not really.

they were at a party together - probably true. though do bear in mind that she also claimed some people were at the party who have come out to say they weren't, so she's already gotten people at the place wrong. plural there: two people have denied any knowledge of the party or being there. not sure if there's a third but i don't think it makes much difference since you're already dealing with a faulty memory on this point alone.

there being plenty of time is part of the problem.

Under the circumstances, I trust her memory more than the others. I probably wouldn't remember some random party 30 years ago, but I would remember a party at which I was sexually assaulted.

Also one of the people who "doesn't remember" the party is Mark Judge, who has an incentive to claim not to remember.
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ShadowYosuke
09/27/18 9:29:09 PM
#120:


ExThaNemesis posted...
I know you don't know or care about any of these men because you're a misandrist, but yeah.


Yeah, I'm totally a misandrist because I think sexual assault victims should be believed. Totally. You got me there. I mean it's not like men are ever sexually assaulted, right? Never! And they certainly don't wait years to come out about it... oh wait. They do.
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Lolo_Guru
09/27/18 9:35:04 PM
#121:


ExThaNemesis posted...

Also can you point me out a murder case where the victim made the accusation 30 years later?

It'll probably happen by Ace Attorney 9.
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ExThaNemesis
09/27/18 9:36:38 PM
#122:


Lolo_Guru posted...
It'll probably happen by Ace Attorney 9.


didn't it happen in the first one?
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ExThaNemesis
09/27/18 9:38:54 PM
#123:


ShadowYosuke posted...
Yeah, I'm totally a misandrist because I think sexual assault victims should be believed. Totally. You got me there. I mean it's not like men are ever sexually assaulted, right? Never! And they certainly don't wait years to come out about it... oh wait. They do.


I said "these men" and whenever I throw misandry accusations around it's generally tongue in cheek to make you aware of how obnoxious it is when you throw misogyny around over and over and over
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Wanglicious
09/27/18 9:39:28 PM
#124:


Drakeryn posted...

Under the circumstances, I trust her memory more than the others. I probably wouldn't remember some random party 30 years ago, but I would remember a party at which I was sexually assaulted.

Also one of the people who "doesn't remember" the party is Mark Judge, who has an incentive to claim not to remember.


under these circumstances i don't trust anybody's memory. not a case of more than others, it just doesn't hit basic validity. facts are wrong, there's outside contamination of his name, and the amount of time allows for a lot of mind fuckery to piece together way too many different things and produce a jumbled mess.

also the other person who "doesn't remember" is also one of her friends who admitted that she wasn't there or had no recollection of being there. she does believe Ford's claim but she's not someone who was at the party. supposedly. nobody really knows and it doesn't seem like anybody can know.
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Lolo_Guru
09/27/18 9:40:20 PM
#125:


ExThaNemesis posted...
Lolo_Guru posted...
It'll probably happen by Ace Attorney 9.


didn't it happen in the first one?

... No, the accusation on Yanni Yogi by channeled Gregory Edgeworth happened back when the thing was being first tried.
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#126
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#127
Post #127 was unavailable or deleted.
Uglyface2
09/27/18 9:59:26 PM
#128:


It's pretty much along party lines, isn't it?
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StartTheMachine
09/27/18 10:05:11 PM
#129:


This woman has literally nothing to gain by doing any of this except put a target on her back to be hated by the right and to subject herself to the possibility of perjury...which she never had to subject herself to in the first place. The Republicans have plenty of time to force a new nominee through before the midterms too, so a politically partisan motive doesn't make any sense here either. I just can't fathom a single reason this specific accusation would be fabricated.

Add in the fact that everyone who knew Kavanaugh in high school and college basically called him a drunk, the fact that Ford submitted to a polygraph test but he wouldn't, and his opposition to having an actual FBI investigation done, and ol' 100 Kegs or Bust Kavy is shaping up to not only be a horrible SCOTUS candidate and Supreme Court Justice after tomorrow, but a real sleazy piece of shit.
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Corrik
09/27/18 10:09:08 PM
#130:


TotallyNotMI posted...
Yeah she sure played to her political advantage by mentioning this in therapy in 2012.

She did not name him in the therapy and there are inconsistencies, such as how many men were in the room, etc.
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Solioxrz362
09/27/18 10:15:40 PM
#131:


StartTheMachine posted...
the fact that Ford submitted to a polygraph test but he wouldn't

to be fair, I wouldn't submit to one either even if I was telling the truth because they're kinda bogus.
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TheRock1525
09/27/18 10:16:09 PM
#132:


Solioxrz362 posted...
StartTheMachine posted...
the fact that Ford submitted to a polygraph test but he wouldn't

to be fair, I wouldn't submit to one either even if I was telling the truth because they're kinda bogus.


Not according to Kavanaugh.
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Jakyl25
09/27/18 10:16:54 PM
#133:


ExTha, how did you feel about the Larry Nassar stuff

Or at least, how did your views evolve over time on that one?

Genuinely curious
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MariaTaylor
09/27/18 10:19:54 PM
#134:


Gatarix posted...

oh wow okay

that seems pretty conclusive it's not a recent fabrication


the linked document is dated septmember 25th, 2018

he's making claims about things which supposedly happened prior to this hearing but he's not providing any evidence. logically this fits into the same headspace as ford's own testimony so I have no idea why seeing this document should be conclusive one way or the other.
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Solioxrz362
09/27/18 10:21:01 PM
#135:


TheRock1525 posted...
Solioxrz362 posted...
StartTheMachine posted...
the fact that Ford submitted to a polygraph test but he wouldn't

to be fair, I wouldn't submit to one either even if I was telling the truth because they're kinda bogus.


Not according to Kavanaugh.

At this point, he's said both that they're good tools and that they're unreliable tools. Obviously a bit of hypocrisy there, but point is that they're bogus. Whether he was lying when he said he thinks they're unreliable or not, they really are unreliable.
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ExThaNemesis
09/27/18 10:24:47 PM
#136:


Jakyl25 posted...
ExTha, how did you feel about the Larry Nassar stuff

Or at least, how did your views evolve over time on that one?

Genuinely curious


Was this the coach who assaulted the Olympic athletes over a bunch of years?

Wasn't he taken to court and deemed guilty in trial?
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Jakyl25
09/27/18 10:32:45 PM
#137:


Yes, of over 250 athletes, publicly, many years after the fact

Which is why Im curious as to how your views evolved on his case over time

You seem well tuned into the major sexual assault allegation beat so I assumed youd be familiar
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StartTheMachine
09/27/18 10:52:52 PM
#138:


Solioxrz362 posted...
TheRock1525 posted...
Solioxrz362 posted...
StartTheMachine posted...
the fact that Ford submitted to a polygraph test but he wouldn't

to be fair, I wouldn't submit to one either even if I was telling the truth because they're kinda bogus.


Not according to Kavanaugh.

At this point, he's said both that they're good tools and that they're unreliable tools. Obviously a bit of hypocrisy there, but point is that they're bogus. Whether he was lying when he said he thinks they're unreliable or not, they really are unreliable.

I almost put "regardless of their efficacy" in that original post, but it made the sentence structure too wonky so I took it out. But yeah, regardless of their efficacy, I would think you'd be willing to submit to a polygraph test if you're actually telling the truth.

what are the odds that the person lying is literally the one who willingly took a lie detector test and the person telling the truth refused
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Jakyl25
09/27/18 10:57:14 PM
#139:


Is there any traction to the notion that Kavanaugh clearly and blatantly committed perjury today? Because he suuuure did
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banananor
09/27/18 11:02:00 PM
#140:


ExThaNemesis posted...
Also can you point me out a murder case where the victim made the accusation 30 years later?

Ahaha thank you for this extha. Brightened my day
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Shaduln
09/28/18 2:00:40 AM
#141:


Jakyl25 posted...
Is there any traction to the notion that Kavanaugh clearly and blatantly committed perjury today? Because he suuuure did

Does perjury apply to this situation? It wasn't a court.
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xp1337
09/28/18 2:04:35 AM
#142:


Shaduln posted...
Jakyl25 posted...
Is there any traction to the notion that Kavanaugh clearly and blatantly committed perjury today? Because he suuuure did

Does perjury apply to this situation? It wasn't a court.

A Congressional hearing counts, yes.
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ChaosTonyV4
09/28/18 2:18:26 AM
#143:


ExThaNemesis posted...
Like I can't imagine being so thick in the head that you miss what I was saying there. It must be a tough life being that stupid.


Imagine being so defensive and uncool that you cant just admit you worded something silly.
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metroid composite
09/28/18 2:59:46 AM
#144:


PrinceKaro posted...
i don't believe we should be judging someone's fitness to hold office on some dumb s*** they did 30 years ago when they were a horny teenager

Can we come back to this?

Cause like...yeah, everyone does stupid shit when they're teenagers.

But not like...allegedly placing their hands over a girl's mouth so that she can't scream and turning up the stereo so that nobody else in the house will hear, while they try to violently rip her clothes off.

Most kids don't do that.

We're not talking like "he did some underage drinking" or "oh, he did drugs" or "he did drinking and driving" or "he got into a lot of fist fights" or even "oh, he did some petty theft." It's not the fact that what he tried to do was illegal. Teenagers do a lot of illegal stuff...whatever, who cares about most of the illegal stuff most teenagers do?

But what he allegedly did crosses a line for me from "reckless teenager" to "Wow, that's just evil."

Rape--or in this case attempted premeditated rape, is just in a different category of morality similar to murder. The United States used to have the death penalty for rapists, before the Supreme Court struck that down. That's how seriously rape has been taken in the past, because you can't really make excuses for behaviour like this. You really need to want to do harm to another human being to even do such a thing.
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GuessMyUserName
09/28/18 3:04:32 AM
#145:


Jakyl25 posted...
Is there any traction to the notion that Kavanaugh clearly and blatantly committed perjury today? Because he suuuure did

He committed perjury during his last hearing. It doesn't matter.
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Vlado
09/28/18 3:07:50 AM
#146:


metroid composite posted...
PrinceKaro posted...
i don't believe we should be judging someone's fitness to hold office on some dumb s*** they did 30 years ago when they were a horny teenager

Can we come back to this?

Cause like...yeah, everyone does stupid shit when they're teenagers.

But not like...allegedly placing their hands over a girl's mouth so that she can't scream and turning up the stereo so that nobody else in the house will hear, while they try to violently rip her clothes off.

Most kids don't do that.

We're not talking like "he did some underage drinking" or "oh, he did drugs" or "he did drinking and driving" or "he got into a lot of fist fights" or even "oh, he did some petty theft." It's not the fact that what he tried to do was illegal. Teenagers do a lot of illegal stuff...whatever, who cares about most of the illegal stuff most teenagers do?

But what he allegedly did crosses a line for me from "reckless teenager" to "Wow, that's just evil."

Rape--or in this case attempted premeditated rape, is just in a different category of morality similar to murder. The United States used to have the death penalty for rapists, before the Supreme Court struck that down. That's how seriously rape has been taken in the past, because you can't really make excuses for behaviour like this. You really need to want to do harm to another human being to even do such a thing.

Except the accusations are fake. Oops, now that entire wall of text means nothing.
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Robazoid
09/28/18 3:11:04 AM
#147:


metroid composite posted...
PrinceKaro posted...
i don't believe we should be judging someone's fitness to hold office on some dumb s*** they did 30 years ago when they were a horny teenager

Can we come back to this?

Yeah I was surprised this wasn't pushed back against more. That was by far the most disgusting view presented in this topic. People like ExTha and Corrik are at least arguing that the attempted rape never happened, not arguing that rape doesn't matter like Karo did.
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ChaoticKnuckles
09/28/18 3:33:39 AM
#148:


Unsure. While I dont think she fabricated what happened to her I do think its possible that it wasnt him that did that to her.

And while the fact that two more women have come forward makes that less likely on its face, from what I understand both of those women arent positive that it was him that did it either. Perhaps he hung out with guys that did stuff like that but didnt do it himself.

At the end of the day theres no way to really know. And I dont know enough about either of them to make a character judgment about whether I think one of them is flat out lying. My gut tells me the truth is somewhere in the middle, for whatever thats worth.
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Vlado
09/28/18 3:50:54 AM
#149:


For fuck's sake, why is this coming up only when he was nominated? Why did the allegations against Roy Moore come when he was running for senate? Who has to gain from this? It is painfully obvious that these are politically motivated attacks. Absolutely transparent lies.
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Weakupedia
09/28/18 4:05:38 AM
#150:


i think that, at the bare minimum, there is enough corroboration that the fucking confirmation hearing shouldn't be moving forward less than 24 hours after the accuser testified

not to mention his tantrum and EXTREMELY partisan comments on a public stage

what the fuck is going on in this country

the moment he is confirmed, SCOTUS has lost severe amounts of credibility
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