Board 8 > Hearthstone Discussion Topic - July 2018 Edition

(+) Yeah! (+)

UItimaterializer posted...

What was so wrong with it dude?

And anything unanswered loses the game. I dont get that argument.

Undertaker happened on turn 1
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To understand why Undertaker was a problem, imagine if Mana Wyrm gained health as well when you cast a spell.
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Undertaker was also helped by extremely OP 2 drop DRs like Mad Scientist and Haunted Creeper.
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KokoroAkechi posted...

UItimaterializer posted...

What was so wrong with it dude?

And anything unanswered loses the game. I dont get that argument.

Undertaker happened on turn 1

Camden posted...

To understand why Undertaker was a problem, imagine if Mana Wyrm gained health as well when you cast a spell.

KokoroAkechi posted...

Undertaker was also helped by extremely OP 2 drop DRs like Mad Scientist and Haunted Creeper.

All of this is true and pre-nerf undertaker would destroy ladder with any decent deathrattles.

A common UT Hunter start would be UT+Coin+UT on turn one. Then Leper Gnome+Leper Gnome on turn two, making 10/10 of stats on the board on T2, 6 of which was hitting face and at least 4 more unavoidable on the board in deathrattles. So you were at 20 health on Turn 2 and zero way to reclaim the board.
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So in Europe I made it to rank 17 (or 18) forget. I made like a budgetish version of heal zoo and just played that. I don't have prince 2 yet or voidripper (but I do have Leeroy which I crafted). I think I lost 4 games in total, all to actual meta decks (Odd Paladin, Taunt Druid, Heal Lock Mirror, and to something else I can't remember). There were very few of them pre rank 20 and even then sometimes I can tell there are some budget includes in them too.
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I played the deck a little. I don't see the issue with a good aggro deck.
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FFDragon posted...

A common UT Hunter start would be UT+Coin+UT on turn one. Then Leper Gnome+Leper Gnome on turn two, making 10/10 of stats on the board on T2, 6 of which was hitting face and at least 4 more unavoidable on the board in deathrattles. So you were at 20 health on Turn 2 and zero way to reclaim the board.

Stuff like this is what made it really broken. Leper was also very strong as well. Undertaker got silenced very often just because it was so terrifyingly overpowered.

Camden posted...

To understand why Undertaker was a problem, imagine if Mana Wyrm gained health as well when you cast a spell.

Except Mana Wyrm starts with 3. Yes, I'm aware of what Undertaker was and why it was irritating. I just never saw the sorts of dramatic starts people bill as commonplace:

FFDragon posted...

A common UT Hunter start would be UT+Coin+UT on turn one. Then Leper Gnome+Leper Gnome on turn two, making 10/10 of stats on the board on T2, 6 of which was hitting face and at least 4 more unavoidable on the board in deathrattles. So you were at 20 health on Turn 2 and zero way to reclaim the board.

I'm sure they drew all 4 of those cards by turn 2 so often.
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azuarc posted...

Camden posted...

To understand why Undertaker was a problem, imagine if Mana Wyrm gained health as well when you cast a spell.

Except Mana Wyrm starts with 3. Yes, I'm aware of what Undertaker was and why it was irritating. I just never saw the sorts of dramatic starts people bill as commonplace:

FFDragon posted...

A common UT Hunter start would be UT+Coin+UT on turn one. Then Leper Gnome+Leper Gnome on turn two, making 10/10 of stats on the board on T2, 6 of which was hitting face and at least 4 more unavoidable on the board in deathrattles. So you were at 20 health on Turn 2 and zero way to reclaim the board.

I'm sure they drew all 4 of those cards by turn 2 so often.

Being coy doesnt make an argument. The chance of them getting one undertaker and a deathrattle was decent enough, and the train got going.

Are people trying to make an argument that Undertaker wasnt broken or something?

No. It was. And I'm the only one who's arguing unless Ulti is. I just didn't get run over by Undertaker nearly as often as people seemed to cry about it.
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I miss Patron Warrior

The LOE era one, not the Warsong Commander one
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azuarc posted...

No. It was. And I'm the only one who's arguing unless Ulti is. I just didn't get run over by Undertaker nearly as often as people seemed to cry about it.

Didnt realize Ulti had been posting

That surprises me tbh, post Naxx I couldnt go 5 games without seeing it once.

ColZach posted...

That surprises me tbh, post Naxx I couldnt go 5 games without seeing it once.

I didn't say I didn't see it. I said I didn't get run over. At least not more by that than anything else.

Then again, in those days, I considered it an accomplishment to hit rank 15, so...
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LiquidOshawott posted...

I miss Patron Warrior

The LOE era one, not the Warsong Commander one

I unironically miss Warsong Commander Patron. That's probably a Top 3 Hearthstone deck for me in terms of how fun it was to play.
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I hit rank 10 on eu. Im still using heal zoo. My win rate is still very high (its above 85%) but matches are getting harder.

The most common decks Im seeing are even warlock, odd rogue, and odd paladin. But as Im climbing up paladin is becoming less common And even warlock and odd rogue are getting more frequent.
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so is the expansion dropping already or is this just a huge download for funsies
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Expansion will likely be August 16th.
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Did they specify when the reveal season will actually start proper?
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Expansion release: August 7
Puzzle lab (single player content) release: August 21
Reveal season starts July 23, 10 AM pacific with a stream, though Id guess we get another few cards revealed through blizzard before then.
https://playhearthstone.com/en-us/blog/21906557
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August 7th? When was the last time an expansion didn't release on a Thursday?
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Wild is a strange place. Just from today...

- A Priest who fatigued himself when I still had 14 cards left in my deck. And no, it wasn't from Northshire.
- A Dragon Priest who was running Holy Nova over Dragonfire Potion. Everything else seemed completely normal.
- A Secret Paladin, I forgot that deck existed, that also went to fatigue before I realized he wasn't running Mysterious Challenger.
- A Mage that pinged his one health Acolyte when the only other minion in play for either of us was my 1/1 dude.
- A Druid two games in a row that conceded before I could even see my pre-mulligan draw. He apparently really didn't want to play against Paladin.

Thanks to these games, my first month actually playing in wild in a really long time has seen me go from 25 to 19 with just a single loss so far. I'm not sure when the strangeness is going to thin out and the broken decks are going to start kicking my face in, but it sure feels nice winning until then.
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I never said Undertaker wasn't broken.

Trying to play a Stormwind Knight OTK without owning a single copy of Shadow Visions is difficult.
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*logs on to try tavern brawl a couple times*
https://gyazo.com/0177046ae3fd38e701f1b3947af9757a
ok
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Oh what the?!

Nice pack!
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i have never gotten more than one in a pack
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turbopuns2 posted...

I took the glyph. Not a bad draft. Got Alexstrasza and Pyroblast. Plus an Arcanologist and Kirin Tor Mage with Counterspell, Frozen Clone, and Explosive Runes. Raging Worgen and Gurubashi. Cinderstorm and Arcane Intellect as well, and Dragon's Fury.

Never saw a Fireball, Frostbolt, or Flamestrike. I somehow ended up passing on Blizzard twice and Polymorph at least three times.

This deck took a very unsurprising route.

From 6-0 to 6-3

I am now rank 5 on Eu but the environment is very bad for zoo right now as the most common decks Im seeing are all favored against me.

As for NA. I still only play a handful of games and my win rate would is just slightly over 500 in legend.
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What are some good, fast decks right now? I haven't played in a while so I'm like rank 21 and would like to get fast matches in.
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GANON1025 posted...

What are some good, fast decks right now? I haven't played in a while so I'm like rank 21 and would like to get fast matches in.

Odd Paladin
Odd Rogue
Zoo
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Right now Id say odd rogue, followed by zoo. I dont think paladin is a good pick right now.
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I guess maybe I should make Baku, then.
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GANON1025 posted...

I guess maybe I should make Baku, then.

If you gotta go fast, then yes that would be a good idea.
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Also I want to talk about how annnoying Druid is.

Druid has consistently had multiple decks in tier 1 across different metas and its because of how busted their basic/classic set and the class cards they get are. Wild growth needs to be HoFed and nourish needs to stop giving full mana crystals.

But like now when I queue into Druid its like I dont know what Im paying against until turn 4 at the earliest or 5 or 6 at times.

Like say Im zoo. If I want to play against maly or token I want to know to play around plague and try to fish for something like void ripper for it. But if Im playing against taunt I dont care about that and just want to build a board that can win before oakheart. But until they use plague. Oaken, twig, etc I dont know what Im facing. Ive 100% lost games because the early core of all Druid decks now are basically the same and it makes it really hard for opposing decks to make suitable game plans beause of that.
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I mean if you have Leroy I took heal zoo (with out prince 2 or void rippers) to rank 5 Eu. I think I lost 5 total games going from 25 to 15
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KokoroAkechi posted...

Druid has consistently had multiple decks in tier 1 across different metas

Has there ever been a time where Druid didn't have access to a top meta deck?
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Heal Zoo huh? Maybe I'll try that out first.
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Removing Druid's ability to ramp ruins the class identity.

They can print other ramp cards that ramp like darnasus aspirant or greedy sprite. But having wild growth in the game is going to cause most Druid decks to follow similar early game patterns which I think is bad for the game.
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Camden posted...

KokoroAkechi posted...

Druid has consistently had multiple decks in tier 1 across different metas

Has there ever been a time where Druid didn't have access to a top meta deck?

I want to say after the Yogg nerf it was no longer T1 but was still played. I don't remember how good Jade typically was outside of being a control counter until KotFT happened and it became T1 for sure. Oh, but I think aggro druid was T1 with Ungoro and Living Mana, so there's that.

KokoroAkechi posted...

Like say Im zoo. If I want to play against maly or token I want to know to play around plague and try to fish for something like void ripper for it. But if Im playing against taunt I dont care about that and just want to build a board that can win before oakheart. But until they use plague. Oaken, twig, etc I dont know what Im facing. Ive 100% lost games because the early core of all Druid decks now are basically the same and it makes it really hard for opposing decks to make suitable game plans beause of that.

I think this is just going to be an inherent flaw of the BO1 format no matter what. You see this happen whenever one class has two highly viable decks where you just have to guess during mulligans and stand a much worse chance if you picked wrong. Remember that time right after Old Gods where Warrior had like 5 decks between T1 and T2? That was fun.

I don't think Wild Growth and Nourish are causing that problem here, though. There's certainly an argument to be made they've been part of Standard too long, but if you remove them you just put in Bio Experiment and Greedy Sprite as your auto-includes instead, and early ramp is still samey.
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You have different ways to play against greedy sprite. Bio experiment is just a busted card.

The problem with Druid is different than say warlock or shaman because those decks run different early games (and also even if you muligan wrong you know which version of the deck you're facing by like turn 2 if not earlier due to odd/even indicators).
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I finally dwindled down all my gold that I built up from all the recent event quests. So i played some games on ladder. It'd been so long since I played that I was back down to rank 24.

I picked up the old Hemet deck I was playing before. I went about 8-3 or something. All I wanna say is Cave Hydra + Dire Frenzy = Destroyer of Worlds

True, but that applies to any class with multiple viable slow strategies build around a strong shell. Like how you wouldn't necessarily know if something was a Reno deck until they played their second copy of something or Kazakus on 4. Or more recently if a Warlock was Control or Cube until you saw a Cube or Rin or something.

It's more of a problem when a class is dominated like Druid apparently is, but for Druid I'd say the problem is the strong expansion cards it got last year. Based on Wild, yeah, WG, Nourish, and Swipe are all core, but half of the cards in the deck are from KnC and KotFT.
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Wild Growth was fine up until there were other ramp cards. Granted, there was Nourish, but until UI was printed, Nourish was needed for card draw.
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Wild growth into nourish for mana into pre nerf ancient of lore
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I miss 2 card draw from AoL :(
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Just now I was like I wonder how many ranks I dropped in 18 hours so I log on NA and saw I only fell like 15 or so. So its like Ill play one game

I queue up odd rogue into a guy named Batman playing a Druid (most likely malygos since he used howl). But do you know what he didnt do? Use wild growth on 2. He did use nourish but it was too late by then. He got absolutely destroyed but because of his armor gain and some defensive options he actually made it to 9 mana and if he was say big Druid or taunt and dropped oakheart I actually still would have won because I held for it but its like if I had a less than optimal hand there was a good chance hed follow with UI the next turn and Id just lose.

In any case the win gave me like 80 ranks which Is a significant jump around my ranking. Its also problematic because it means a lot of players are hovering around my mmr.
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Had a great game vs a maly Druid as control priest. Came down to a single point of hp.

My opening was really bad but like his was not much better on turn 9 he just dropped maly and I had cabal and acolyte ready for it and just took it. But he facelessed it etc and just started hitting me. So my next few turns were in paying Anduin after the ui and getting back board.

Finally after playing multiple hymns to keep me alive I almost threw the game by playing a cleric when I didnt need to because it stopped me from playing a final hymn (which would have sealed the game for me). But luckily a tech choice I made a couple of days ago to replace an acolyte or pain with a gluttonous ooze was the decider because the 1 armor it got me from killing twig let me live through his final burst of damage + my fatigue draw by 1.
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I'm pretty sure I got double gold for a quest I technically completed last night.

I satisfied the requirements of the quest in a game I played last night, but conceded and quickly quit before any of the post-match stuff came up. When I logged in just now, I got the Festival of Fire stuff and then the notification that I had completed the quest from last night, but the gold value was doubled.
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