I'm not ENTIRELY sure how you blow this angle off in a wrestling match, but it's such a heavy subject matter with a lot of grey area and the potential to explore some genuinely thought-provoking stuff about radical freedom and accountability.
So basically I don't trust WWE to pull this off.
--
Thank you, Eddie Guerrero.
http://www.wwe.com/f/styles/photo_large/public/photo/image/2012/04/WM28_Photo_255.jpg
Board 8 > All-Purpose Wrestling Topic 184: Huge return
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JaKyL25 04/10/12 10:24:00 PM #252: |
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Rad Link 5 04/11/12 1:33:00 AM #253: |
From: Panthera | #234 This is the one that really gets me. The other ones aren't so glaring, but this one is just stupid. What's the point of a steel cage match if the heel can just tell the referee to open the cage door so he can waltz out? If someone tries climbing out, why doesn't the other person just walk out while he's climbing instead of trying to pull him down? Why don't they just ditch the cage and call it an inverted battle royal where the first person to leave the ring wins? From: SmartMuffin | #240 I said this, too. You really take the wind out of the sails of the Sheamus/D-Bry title match when you're already advertising the Sheamus/Del Rio title match that follows it. I guess really I should be glad they didn't just decide to blow Daniel Bryan's rematch on an eight minute TV match sometime before Extreme Rules just so Del Rio could get his match there, though. -- Ace Detective in Sir Chris' Police http://i55.tinypic.com/16ljqbl.png ... Copied to Clipboard!
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SmartMuffin 04/11/12 6:27:00 AM #254: |
Isn't Foley widely regarded as like, a really nice and decent guy? How exactly does someone get in an altercation with him backstage? He's like the last person I'd expect to hear that about...
-- SmartMuffin - Because anything less would be uncivilized - http://img.imgcake.com/smartmuffin/barkleyjpgde.jpg http://dudewheresmyfreedom.com/ ... Copied to Clipboard!
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PrivateBiscuit1 04/11/12 6:33:00 AM #255: |
You clearly know nothing about Dean Ambrose's character.
-- Xbox GT: PrivateBiscuit1 Down with Zhang. Let there be Biscuit! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 04/11/12 6:38:00 AM #256: |
From: SmartMuffin | #254 It's an angle. -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://www.wwe.com/f/styles/photo_large/public/photo/image/2012/04/WM28_Photo_255.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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PrivateBiscuit1 04/11/12 6:40:00 AM #257: |
Mr. Sandow was in D.C. yesterday. He did not have time to go to Congress and straighten them out. Don't fret, next time. Sincerely, Ignatius
-- Xbox GT: PrivateBiscuit1 Down with Zhang. Let there be Biscuit! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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SmartMuffin 04/11/12 6:46:00 AM #258: |
a twitter angle between mick foley and some fcw nobody?
why? -- SmartMuffin - Because anything less would be uncivilized - http://img.imgcake.com/smartmuffin/barkleyjpgde.jpg http://dudewheresmyfreedom.com/ ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 04/11/12 6:47:00 AM #259: |
Because REALITY ERA
And it's not just Twitter! There was a YouTube video of a confrontation during WM week too. <_< -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://www.wwe.com/f/styles/photo_large/public/photo/image/2012/04/WM28_Photo_255.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Kinglicious 04/11/12 7:39:00 AM #260: |
Because that fcw nobody is the best guy the wwe has in their current business model to represent the future.
-- The King Wang. Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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edwardsdv 04/11/12 7:47:00 AM #261: |
I dunno I agree with SMuffin here. This doesnt make me care about Dean Ambrose, it just makes me think hes a moron.
-- http://img.imgcake.com/nio/81edpngej.png The one and only Underdog Millionaire and UCA CORPORATE Champion ... Copied to Clipboard!
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muddersmilk 04/11/12 7:59:00 AM #262: |
SmartMuffin posted...
Remember when Chavo won an I Quit match against Rey completely clean? That was weird... And I loved it! I mean the crowd was begging Rey to say it. It got to the point of "Rey quits or he might never wrestle again". It was emotional, intense, and an amazing heel finish for Chavo. You've got a complete helpless Rey and a ruthless Chavo. It was the perfect finish to that match, especially since I doubt anyone expected Chavo to win it. -- (Maniac64 at work) All the proteins, vitamins, and carbs of your grandma's best turkey dinner, plus 15% alcohol. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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GTM 04/11/12 9:11:00 AM #263: |
From: edwardsdv | #261 That's what they want you to think, he's a heel! -- Boko United - Geriatric Titanium Mustache Guru Taken Miraculously by SuperNiceDog ... Copied to Clipboard!
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KJH 04/11/12 9:31:00 AM #264: |
So, I'm not the only one who thinks the way wwe's handling debuts now is kinda stupid, right?
Because it seems like complete overkill to more or less introduce two people in one month and have them exclusively squash jobbers... After the last guy you had debut do literally the same thing a few months ago. Lord Tensai's doing it best at least, taking on stronger people and winning unconventionally, but Ryback doing squash matches on local jobbers is just so much "I don't care" and oversaturation. -- I have no idea who you are, but I thank you for arousing me. - Beruga Brawl FC: 3823-8243-5663 ... Copied to Clipboard!
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XIII_rocks 04/11/12 9:37:00 AM #265: |
I agree. Honestly I think 2 at once, while trying to tease Sandow, is too much. At least Funkasaurus is seemingly done with the Squash Matches now.
And it doesn't even necessarily mean anything! Jinder Mahal squashed Yoshi. Would he even beat Yoshi now? -- XIII_rocks, the cream of XIII fanboyism. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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GTM 04/11/12 9:41:00 AM #266: |
Ryback's gimmick is weird to me. Is it supposed to represent "People are talking about Ryback" or something?
Don't get why they give the jobbers a mic either! -- Boko United - Geriatric Titanium Mustache Guru Taken Miraculously by SuperNiceDog ... Copied to Clipboard!
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GTM 04/11/12 9:41:00 AM #267: |
also lol NXT
-- Boko United - Geriatric Titanium Mustache Guru Taken Miraculously by SuperNiceDog ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Bidoof 04/11/12 9:49:00 AM #268: |
GTM posted...
Ryback's gimmick is weird to me. Is it supposed to represent "People are talking about Ryback" or something? Don't get why they give the jobbers a mic either! I think the point of giving the jobbers mic time is so that they can cut a promo to get people to cheer Ryback when he comes out to kill them. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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PrivateBiscuit1 04/11/12 10:07:00 AM #269: |
muddersmilk posted...
SmartMuffin posted... Remember when Chavo won an I Quit match against Rey completely clean? That was weird... And I loved it! I mean the crowd was begging Rey to say it. It got to the point of "Rey quits or he might never wrestle again". It was emotional, intense, and an amazing heel finish for Chavo. You've got a complete helpless Rey and a ruthless Chavo. It was the perfect finish to that match, especially since I doubt anyone expected Chavo to win it. Yeah, it's like you could believe he was a main eventer then. Theeeen they made him job to Hornswoggle for months. -- Xbox GT: PrivateBiscuit1 Down with Zhang. Let there be Biscuit! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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muddersmilk 04/11/12 10:16:00 AM #270: |
If only he'd strung Hornswoggle up on the set and smashed him with a chair repeatedly.
-- (Maniac64 at work) All the proteins, vitamins, and carbs of your grandma's best turkey dinner, plus 15% alcohol. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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PrivateBiscuit1 04/11/12 10:24:00 AM #271: |
KJH posted...
So, I'm not the only one who thinks the way wwe's handling debuts now is kinda stupid, right? Because it seems like complete overkill to more or less introduce two people in one month and have them exclusively squash jobbers... After the last guy you had debut do literally the same thing a few months ago. Lord Tensai's doing it best at least, taking on stronger people and winning unconventionally, but Ryback doing squash matches on local jobbers is just so much "I don't care" and oversaturation. Yeah, WWE has always been bad about debuts. They don't make anybody care about the characters. Oh look, Brodus Clay squashed some guy... again. How many times have we seen people dominantly squash other people? It doesn't tell me anything other than he's a dominant force. Give it one week and then move onto something at least a little bit interesting. Have a storyline. Even with Tensai, we get what he's all about after he squashed Riley. Seeing him squash Yoshi shows us nothing new. At least have a backstage segment of Yoshi challenging him or something. Ryback is another case. Why show the same thing a second time aside from old people cameo time? We get that Ryback is dominating. Have him promo with some guy. Have a heel call him out. ANYTHING. At least we're learning what kind of guy Damien Sandow is now. He touches upon different topics with these two weeks he's been around. We can understand his character better. We get who Damien Sandow is, but I'd probably say another backstage promo would be redundant and not worth it. (Even if it IS Sandow) If they come up with a very different topic, it would be good then. But yeah, monster debuts are boring. -- Xbox GT: PrivateBiscuit1 Down with Zhang. Let there be Biscuit! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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PrivateBiscuit1 04/11/12 10:26:00 AM #272: |
muddersmilk posted...
If only he'd strung Hornswoggle up on the set and smashed him with a chair repeatedly. Seriously. The fact that they never had Chavo kill Hornswoggle to bring him back to super heeldom was such a bad mistake. -- Xbox GT: PrivateBiscuit1 Down with Zhang. Let there be Biscuit! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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GTM 04/11/12 10:52:00 AM #273: |
From: PrivateBiscuit1 | #271 I assumed that they do that as an alternate to video packages, like an "in case you missed it" sorta thing or someone just tuning in gets to see it or something. But my friend who was watching with me for the first just reacted as "they're not even in the same weight class!" -- Boko United - Geriatric Titanium Mustache Guru Taken Miraculously by SuperNiceDog ... Copied to Clipboard!
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MrGreenonion 04/11/12 11:12:00 AM #274: |
There's really nothing inherently wrong with a jobber squash debut. It gives the audience a chance to find out who a guy is and what his big moves are. The problem is the writers use it lazily. Ideally the third, maybe fourth time the guy comes out, it should result in something beyond a basic squash, but a lot of the time the writers don't seem to bother planning out ahead of time what actual storyline they're gonna move a guy into, so they just sit around in squash match limbo and the audience gets bored. And it really doesn't work to have too many guys doing this all at once. At least Ryback and Tensai are on different shows, but it's still too much. At least they've only done two each so far, so they haven't fallen prey to this yet. But if in a week or two that's still all we've gotten, then it's a problem.
Brodus I think was particularly poorly handled in this regard. They had him do a few weeks of squashes which would be fine, except he did them on Raw AND Smackdown so you got twice as many as you should have. Then instead of transitioning to a real storyline he just disappeared for a while, and when he came back he started with the squashes all over again! I think having just seen that, we're more critical of Tensai and Ryback than we normally would be. -- SuperNiceDog didn't have to reconcile his name... But Dauntless Hunter is now MrGreenonion ... Copied to Clipboard!
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CoffeeNinjaB8 04/11/12 11:35:00 AM #275: |
....what is this? -- http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lt37rzo2Jk1r4d7qpo11_r2_400.gif ... Copied to Clipboard!
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sonten1 04/11/12 11:35:00 AM #276: |
Brodus could have been done very easily. Do two squashes, then do the segment they had last week with him helping out Santino.
They could have then thrown Brodus on Team Teddy to make us think there was a SLIGHT chance they could win the match, and he would have offset Henry in terms of big men. Problem was they probably didn't consider teaming up Brodus with Santino until the day of the show last week... -- HBJ - occupymyheart ~Project 1000~ ... Copied to Clipboard!
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GTM 04/11/12 11:36:00 AM #277: |
From: CoffeeNinjaB8 | #275 haha this was posted before, still epic -- Boko United - Geriatric Titanium Mustache Guru Taken Miraculously by SuperNiceDog ... Copied to Clipboard!
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XIII_rocks 04/11/12 11:37:00 AM #278: |
"Jumps the ropes, that was nice, this match was recorded twice" slays me every%uFEFF goddamn time.
Yes. -- http://i974.photobucket.com/albums/ae221/GenesisSaga/XIIIAndManny.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Rad Link 5 04/11/12 12:23:00 PM #279: |
From: CoffeeNinjaB8 | #275 I did not see this the first time. I love it. -- Ace Detective in Sir Chris' Police http://fast1.onesite.com/capcom-unity.com/user/jgonzo/large/4958fc9d9dfd6917713402cae21a3e0e.png ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Rad Link 5 04/11/12 12:39:00 PM #280: |
http://shiningwizado.bandcamp.com/track/yes-demo-feat-six-seconds-magic
That band is awesome. -- Ace Detective in Sir Chris' Police http://i40.tinypic.com/avgffm.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 04/11/12 2:37:00 PM #281: |
I'm a big believer in the Rule of Three when it comes to monster debuts.
1st time to inroduce the character. 2nd time to establish the pattern of expectations. 3rd time SOMETHING happens to alter the expectation, be it a post-match challenge, or the jobber actually winning, or a backstage encounter after the squash or really anything to change things up moving forward. I like what they're doing with Tensai more than Ryback, because Ryback is winning too quickly. He's not even out there long enough to implant himself in your mind, and he's not given any chance to establish a character. Tensai is memorable, has a gimmick, and he has the awesome Poison Claw afterwards. That being said, they've both hit 2 squashes with no advancement, so I'm fine with that, and now let's see something happen next week to give them direction. -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://www.wwe.com/f/styles/photo_large/public/photo/image/2012/04/WM28_Photo_255.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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DeathChicken 04/11/12 2:40:00 PM #282: |
Meanwhile, when did Husky Harris become amazing?
-- We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Lopen 04/11/12 2:42:00 PM #283: |
Yeah I think Tensai and Ryback debuting at the same time, with many squashes, and shortly after Brodus Clay did the same thing, really kinda magnifies any sort of problem they have with being repetitive and unimaginative. I imagine (hope?) people will start getting wise to this and develop some sort of chant to express their distaste for all the squashes.
-- No problem! This is a cute and pop genocide of love! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 04/11/12 2:44:00 PM #284: |
Well, it's post-WM which is the best time to debut people, and there are only so many ways to debut people and make them a big deal.
Even if, well, none of them are actually DEBUTING <_< -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://www.wwe.com/f/styles/photo_large/public/photo/image/2012/04/WM28_Photo_255.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Lopen 04/11/12 2:47:00 PM #285: |
I always liked the "shows up, interacts with established guy by interrupting and/or scoring an upset on him/pushing him to the limit" method if we're going with less bells and whistles.
Otherwise I've always been a fan of the Damien Sandow promo video method. -- No problem! This is a cute and pop genocide of love! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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GTM 04/11/12 2:49:00 PM #286: |
From: Jakyl25 | #284 NXT season 6 Rookie: Lord Tensai Pro: Yoshi Tatsu -- Boko United - Geriatric Titanium Mustache Guru Taken Miraculously by SuperNiceDog ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 04/11/12 2:51:00 PM #287: |
From: Lopen | #285 Right but Damien Sandow is using that right now, and Dean Ambrose is about to use the "shows up, interacts with established guy" method (although not in the same way you're suggesting). "shows up, interacts with established guy by interrupting and/or scoring an upset on him/pushing him to the limit" method if we're going with less bells and whistles. How odd that the first two examples I think of when I imagine this are John Cena and Garrett Bischoff. What a pair. -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://www.wwe.com/f/styles/photo_large/public/photo/image/2012/04/WM28_Photo_255.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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DeathChicken 04/11/12 2:54:00 PM #288: |
Husky Harris *should* debut doing promos with that Fat Waylon Mercy gimmick and become the best thing on TV
-- We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 04/11/12 2:57:00 PM #289: |
Lives are gonna be...in Husky Harris's hands.
-- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://www.wwe.com/f/styles/photo_large/public/photo/image/2012/04/WM28_Photo_255.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Lopen 04/11/12 3:00:00 PM #290: |
Garrett Bischoff actually had an amazing debut put together
The only problem is that it's Garrett Bischoff Anyway you could've easily had one of them show up to fight an established guy. I like the idea of having monster vs monster be the established guy-- because I like Tensai's squashes more that means you have Ryback debut against, I dunno, The Great Khali, and put it to a double count out or Ryback loses by DQ or something. -- No problem! This is a cute and pop genocide of love! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 04/11/12 3:01:00 PM #291: |
Maybe debut Ryback by having him pin Big Show in a non-title match?
But I guess it depends on HOW big of a deal you want him to be. -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://www.wwe.com/f/styles/photo_large/public/photo/image/2012/04/WM28_Photo_255.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Lopen 04/11/12 3:04:00 PM #292: |
Eh I don't like a straight out pin against a guy on Big Show's tier. I think it hurts Big Show more than makes Ryback look good if that happens, unless it's played off as a bit of a fluke-- but I don't think monster + fluke works out too well.
Could easily sub out Khali for Big Show in the original idea though. -- No problem! This is a cute and pop genocide of love! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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GTM 04/11/12 3:19:00 PM #293: |
From: Jakyl25 | #287 As someone who doesn't watch TNA, John Cena and Alberto Del Rio! -- Boko United - Geriatric Titanium Mustache Guru Taken Miraculously by SuperNiceDog ... Copied to Clipboard!
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GTM 04/11/12 3:21:00 PM #294: |
Debut match for both!
Lord Tensai vs Ryback in a 5* epic -- Boko United - Geriatric Titanium Mustache Guru Taken Miraculously by SuperNiceDog ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 04/11/12 3:22:00 PM #295: |
From: GTM | #293 Del Rio got the video packages first before going over Rey -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://www.wwe.com/f/styles/photo_large/public/photo/image/2012/04/WM28_Photo_255.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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GTM 04/11/12 3:24:00 PM #296: |
are we not including video packages? Lord Tensai had a couple.
-- Boko United - Geriatric Titanium Mustache Guru Taken Miraculously by SuperNiceDog ... Copied to Clipboard!
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GTM 04/11/12 3:25:00 PM #297: |
Dur, I guess if we are talking in theory, he didn't need the packages
-- Boko United - Geriatric Titanium Mustache Guru Taken Miraculously by SuperNiceDog ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 04/11/12 3:25:00 PM #298: |
That's true, he did!
Kinda in between though. They didn't tell us much about him, just that he "was coming." We knew exactly who Del Rio was before he ever showed up. -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://www.wwe.com/f/styles/photo_large/public/photo/image/2012/04/WM28_Photo_255.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 04/11/12 3:28:00 PM #299: |
Because I love AJ, I will repost her Twitter speech she just made about remembering where she came from and her outlook on life, because it's awesome.
A.J. @WWEAJLee In Newark Airport. I remember flying out of here 3 years ago headed to a tryout camp at FCW that I literally starved to afford to pay for. I just sat here praying I would come back with a contract so I could make my lifelong dream come true, and be able to take care of my family in the process. Now I'm in the same airport, headed overseas with the WWE. Moments like this and last night remind me of how lucky and blessed I am. I've gone from being homeless for years to being given the most amazing opportunities in the job of my dreams. Moral of the the story, anything on earth is possible. If it goes away tomorrow, I will be grateful for every second. But if I have it my way, I will do this until I am Mae Young. Just had a rare sincere moment in me I needed to get out. I will resume tweeting nonsensical jokes. -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://www.wwe.com/f/styles/photo_large/public/photo/image/2012/04/WM28_Photo_255.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 04/11/12 3:36:00 PM #300: |
On a less serious note...browsing the WWE.com "Superstars in Russia" photo gallery, and there's THIS:
 -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://www.wwe.com/f/styles/photo_large/public/photo/image/2012/04/WM28_Photo_255.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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GTM 04/11/12 4:00:00 PM #301: |
From: Jakyl25 | #300 Dammit that Sin Cara theme is in my head again -- Boko United - Geriatric Titanium Mustache Guru Taken Miraculously by SuperNiceDog ... Copied to Clipboard!
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