I'm not entirely sure why this is. But when I think about games, I find that even in games I quite enjoy, the final boss is usually kind of lackluster, whether it's due to not being a fun battle, or not really fitting the overall mood, or seeming kind of lame/dull/whatever in an otherwise excellent segment. I think the ultimate example of that last point is Mass Effect, where the entire last third of the game is amazing as hell and then the final battle is just kind of there for the sake of having a final boss and would have been better off not existing.
Am I alone on this one? What are some games that delivered final bosses that were the appropriate finales they were meant to be?
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We clasped our hands, our hands in praise of a conquerors right to tyranny
The thing with final bosses is that... they're the final boss. They are by definition your last encounter during the ending of the game.
So the developers have to make a choice, to either have an interesting and challenging final boss that the player will likely repeat 2-3 times, ruining the momentum and buildup of the ending sequence, or just have a simple and standard boss that will be beaten on the first try so that the momentum is maintained.
Then you have those games that are not designed to have bosses at all, but somehow felt the need to have a final boss, so it's just some clunky mess. Like Mass Effect, Uncharted 2, Deus Ex 3, etc.
-- _foolmo_ 'so I can potentially win the guru without getting the final right?' - BlAcK TuRtLe
From: foolmor0n | #003 The thing with final bosses is that... they're the final boss. They are by definition your last encounter during the ending of the game.
So the developers have to make a choice, to either have an interesting and challenging final boss that the player will likely repeat 2-3 times, ruining the momentum and buildup of the ending sequence, or just have a simple and standard boss that will be beaten on the first try so that the momentum is maintained.
Yeah, I'm sure it's that balance that leads to so many developers screwing it up in the process of trying to get it right. It really depends on the game here - something like a Mega Man/X/Zero/etc game can obviously have a hard final boss since the gameplay is what you're there for, while more story based games probably want the easy but "epic" finale. Unfortunately it ends up feeling like too many of the former mistake "fitting challenge" and "tedium" - Mega Man X and X2 being textbook examples. And the latter often end up feeling underwhelming.
From: LeonhartFour | #004 A game where the final boss really delivered?
Final Fantasy VIII, of course.
Developer 1: I'm not sure how this battle will feel to the player Developer 2: I've got this decent idea Dev 1: Yeah? Dev 2: Let's just make a bunch of pointless multiple forms so we can throw all our ideas together. Dev 1: Brilliant!
The number of final bosses that really reach "good" status in the FF series is...Exdeath and Kefka. Maybe <FFXIII spoilers>, but that's a bit of a stretch. It's not a series where the final battles tend to feel very awesome to me.
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We clasped our hands, our hands in praise of a conquerors right to tyranny
Panthera posted... The number of final bosses that really reach "good" status in the FF series is...Exdeath and Kefka. Maybe <FFXIII spoilers>, but that's a bit of a stretch. It's not a series where the final battles tend to feel very awesome to me.
FF7's final boss was perfectly fine, excepting the six minute cutscene of that one ability he has. And if you count FFX's second-to-final boss as the final boss because the final boss fight is special, its final boss is also fine.
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From: Panthera | #006 The number of final bosses that really reach "good" status in the FF series is...Exdeath and Kefka.
FFX has one of the best ending sequences ever.
It has the very challenging and satisfying REAL final boss, but then after that, there's that whole unlosable segment where they can build up the massive emotional momentum for the ending.
Beat Gears 3. The boss fights in the trilogy are over the place *Spoilers*
Gears 1: Sastifying final boss fight, but hardest chapter in the game on Insane Gears 2: LOL interactive cutscene for a final boss Gears 3: HOLY F*** WHY WON'T IT DIE ARRRRRRRGH
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I suppose in RPGs specifically it becomes a lot harder to balance the game once your characters start becoming walking demi-gods. Final bosses tend to be lucky that they stand a chance.
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From: Anagram | #005 Really delivered a ton of uprovable theories about her relation to a certain main character, certainly.
Hey Anagram, I think you embarrassed yourself enough with your lack of FFVIII knowledge the other day, don't you?
From: Panthera | #006 Developer 1: I'm not sure how this battle will feel to the player Developer 2: I've got this decent idea Dev 1: Yeah? Dev 2: Let's just make a bunch of pointless multiple forms so we can throw all our ideas together. Dev 1: Brilliant!
Multiple form boss fights with multiple epic boss themes
Not sure where the problem is here
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LeonhartFour posted... Hey Anagram, I think you embarrassed yourself enough with your lack of FFVIII knowledge the other day, don't you?
I didn't make those theories up, and I remember the final disc of that game well enough. I may not remember every single facet of Rinoa's dialogue in discs 1 and 2, but the final boss fight I do believe I recall fine.
-- Not changing this sig until I decide to change this sig. Started: July 6, 2005
From: Anagram | #017 I may not remember every single facet of Rinoa's dialogue in discs 1 and 2
Or any facet.
But the point is Square officially debunked R=U a long time ago.
And I figured the point of this topic was to talk about actual good fights, not "I didn't like the villain so I'm not even going to consider this a good fight."
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Eh, not all final bosses are let downs. A lot of it has to do with what the most enjoyable thing about the game is up to that point. If it's plot, then the final boss really can't avoid being a let down.
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From: Anagram | #012 FF7's final boss was perfectly fine, excepting the six minute cutscene of that one ability he has. And if you count FFX's second-to-final boss as the final boss because the final boss fight is special, its final boss is also fine.
Eh, FF7 falls too much into an overload of forms. In case it's not becoming apparent yet, I generally feel final bosses and their lead up sequence should be one or two battles, and only very rarely more.
From: foolmor0n | #013 FFX has one of the best ending sequences ever.
It has the very challenging and satisfying REAL final boss, but then after that, there's that whole unlosable segment where they can build up the massive emotional momentum for the ending.
I love the ending of FFX and the Tidus/Jecht thing, I really do, but then it gets form overdosed when you have really aimless busy work against the Aeons and <spoiler guy> and it all just stretches out beyond its welcome, dragging on beyond how long the appeal lasts.
From: LeonhartFour | #016 Multiple form boss fights with multiple epic boss themes
Not sure where the problem is here
Too many forms that don't feel at all necessary, that don't provide any real interesting gameplay. Just tediously dragging out the lifespan of a boss that doesn't have the emotional connection to make it worthwhile (and even if she did, it would still drag, it would just be a bit easier to accept).
From: outsider920 | #020 EarthBound
Now there's an awesome final boss that really delivers something special and distinct. You go through the whole game having the knowledge you'll fight Giygas in the end but not knowing anything about him really and then you meet him and it's just awesome and crazy.
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We clasped our hands, our hands in praise of a conquerors right to tyranny
From: LeonhartFour | #024 I'm not seeing why it matters if it's necessary! There are lots of good boss fights that do unnecessary but awesome things!
"Unnecessary" means that it didn't feel like it really added anything. If something actually enhances the experience, it's not unnecessary, because making the fight be awesome is the whole point and anything that furthers that goal is a good thing.
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We clasped our hands, our hands in praise of a conquerors right to tyranny
Yeah it's kinda rare for the final boss to be good. Good to see someone said Devil May Cry 3 cause yeah that may be my favorite final boss fight ever. Final Fantasy VI and Final Fantasy VIII are both great. Chrono Trigger is decent I guess. Oh Dragon Age Origins is one of the better ones too. MGS3 is also good. Yeah. Mostly RPGs that deliver here, but a lot of those are duds too.
Er actually if you're okay with cheap difficulty fighting games are often pretty good on this front too.
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From: Lopen | #032 Er actually if you're okay with cheap difficulty fighting games are often pretty good on this front too.
The King of Fighters XI had what gets my vote for the cheapest boss ever as its final boss, but between the art design of the battle and the music it somehow managed to be really awesome to me.
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No, I'm talking about the actual final boss of MGS3. The part you're talking about is like considering the stuff that comes after BFA to be the final boss of FFX!
Nier's final boss is pretty great, too.
Mario games go from one extreme to the other with this. When they hit, they really hit, but when they miss, they really miss.
Hits: Super Mario World Super Mario 64 Super Mario Galaxy PAPER MARIO (Man, I love this fight so much, didn't think a fight with Bowser could be so epic) Yoshi's Island Bowser's Inside Story Super Mario RPG Heck, most of the Mario RPGs have really good final boss fights
Misses: Super Mario Bros. 3 Super Mario Sunshine - Worst final boss ever
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I find Mario final bosses usually kind of lame. Galaxy 2 had a good one because it had that cool (albeit very easy and simple) little bit at the end of it, but otherwise the 64/Galaxy set suffered the issues of it being almost identical to the fights you had twice before. Now Donkey Kong Country, there's a cool final boss, what with the great music and the fake out on the credits.
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Donkey Kong Country 2's final boss fight is amazing. Heck, both fights with K. Rool in that game are crazy good.
I like Mario Galaxy and Mario 64's final boss fights because they do add a little bit more to it to make it extra epic (like you can't cheese Bowser into a bomb by grabbing him right next to it anymore for the last hit, you actually have to launch him), or the awesome final battle music for Galaxy. Atmosphere, atmosphere, atmosphere.
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Speaking of atmosphere, I'll give an example of a truly great final boss fight, which is found in freeware game Iji. The music kicks ass, the whole thing has been built up quite well, the characters involved are interesting, the overall setting is just amazing for atmosphere, and the fight itself is actually fun with the boss having a variety of cool attacks to avoid, and an optional setting where he cranks the challenge up like crazy.
SPOILERS FOR IJI
Got to love that battlefield. The top of a ruined weapons research laboratory with a ruined city skyline in the distance (that the boss occasionally jumps onto to shoot at you) and the sky itself being red and filled with alien ships charging their weapons in preparation of completely destroying an already almost entirely dead Earth. Damn cool.
SPOILERS OVER
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Mistake you're making - overlooking the fact that we might not want to be saved.
And on the bad final boss note, what the **** was that...thing...in Castlevania: Aria of Sorrow? Ugly, visually confusing, completely uninteresting. Especially when the boss before the final one was the best fight in the game, it felt so incredibly pathetic by comparison.
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We clasped our hands, our hands in praise of a conquerors right to tyranny
I often think final bosses are easy, but I usually enjoy them nonetheless. RE4's final boss is incredibly easy but I enjoy the setting, the boss' design, etc.
No, no boss will ever be worse than that b****...though now I come to think of it, Bayonetta's last boss sucked as well. Apart from the end of it. Man that game was disappointing
From: Panthera | #041 And on the bad final boss note, what the **** was that...thing...in Castlevania: Aria of Sorrow? Ugly, visually confusing, completely uninteresting. Especially when the boss before the final one was the best fight in the game, it felt so incredibly pathetic by comparison.
AoS's second to last boss is one of the best in the series.
Some Games that Deliver on Their Final Bosses Chrono Trigger Super Metroid Final Fantasy VI Super Mario Galaxy 2 Super Mario Galaxy The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past Super Mario 64 Metroid Prime Super Mario World Super Smash Bros. Melee (assuming event #51 is the final boss)
Some Games that Fall Flat with their Final Bosses Super Mario Bros. 3 Resident Evil 4 The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess Metroid: Other M (actually, my biggest issue with this game was that the ending seemed like it came too soon)
Off the top of my head, MGS3, Persona 3, and DMC3 probably had the best final bosses in terms of delivering the epic finale one would expect, on top of being the most challenging fight in the game.
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