Board 8 > Board 8 Ranks: Westerns! The Official Results Topic

(+) Yeah! (+)

Inviso posted...

Only one movie left really doesn't deserve to have made it this far.

I agree, but we're probably not talking about the same film.

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Pokewars posted...

I agree, but we're probably not talking about the same film.

Well yours is probably Django Unchained, so yeah...not talking about the same film.

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No, it probably should be top 10. But there's one lower.

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There are two that made the top ten that I don't think deserved the placement.

Interestingly, none of us are talking about the same movie(s) lol
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There's a movie I'm surprised made it to top 10 too! I really respect that it made it this far. I may not have liked it that much, but it does deserve it.

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Actually, that reminds me of a fun fact. There is only one movie in the top ten that we all collectively put in our own top tens. But it did not win.
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Pretty solid top 10 imo

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I'm a bit surprised a pre-dollars movie made the top 10 but it is otherwise exactly as I expected

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I'm really not a fan of Westerns (the only one I've seen that has already dropped is Magnificent Seven, although I have some prior knowledge on a few) so I'm glad I avoided doing any ratings or watchthroughs, but it's been interesting to see the rankings here. If True Grit 2010 made the top ten that doesn't bode well for how much I'd have liked the ones below it.

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Did someone say True Grit 2010?

#10. True Grit (2010) 87 points

CoolCly 8
KBM 9
Pokewars 10
Johnbobb 12
Karo 13
Inviso 15
Stifled 20

Very poor plot synopsis:
NAG NAG NAG NAG NAG NAG NAG NAG NAG THE REMIX

Why it was included:
As I mentioned before, comparisons are a major part of this list. My goal was to show all of you some of the past and some of the present. The Two Grits might be the most interesting comparison at all because, by all accounts, this is nearly a shot for shot remake of the original. No matter your opinion on remakes, reboots, and other such things, certain aspects of True Grit definitely benefitted from a remake. Was it necessary, however? Well, a lot of people certainly thought so. True Grit 2010 became the highest grossing Coen Bros movie and the second highest grossing western of all time behind Dances With Wolves. Yes, you read that right. Second highest grossing western. Not to mention it received high praise from critics and was nominated for TEN Academy Awards (it didnt win any of them, but still!). So suffice it to say, the second coming of the Rooster earned its spurs here.

What Stifled thinks:
True Grit? More like True Shit mirite?! lololol



Nah, Im just joking.

I certainly wasnt as fond of this as Im predicting the other rankers will be, but it was still worth a watch (twice, actually). As I mentioned before, the Two Grits are very interesting to compare with each other. While I normally detest remakes and reboots, the action sequences of True Grit 69 needed a fresh coat of paint. There was some janky camera work, especially in that final charge near the end. True Grit 2010 was up to the task, and made those scenes infinitely more watchable. This is especially true of the cabin sequence, which felt a lot more focused than the clusterfuck of the original. LA BEEF getting his ass handed to him in a fight instead of being made to look like a moron by shooting a horse was much preferred. Speaking of, Matt Damon is worlds better in this role than Glen Campbell was. Granted, the character is still a fucking creep at first, but Damons performance gives the viewer a much better transition from creep to decent dude. Additionally, the Coens decided to stick to the novel and keep LA BEEF alive at the end. I think I prefer it that way.

But how about Mattie and the Rooster? Well, I think it depends on what you want from these characters. I actually preferred the original Mattie to the new one because she came off as more of an intelligent threat, at least in my opinion. Additionally, Mattie 69 showed more vulnerability and let her characters age shine through to remind the viewer she truly wasnt an adult. Mattie 2010 remained stiff throughout and lacked any vulnerability, which I found odd. And Rooster? I think Rooster 69 gets my vote. Rooster 2010 is great for a more grizzled version of the character, but I found Bridges attempt at a southern accent to be far too cotton-mouthed to understand at times. Wayne, on the other hand, was a nice mixture of grizzled and humorous. I wasnt sure at first if I wanted the character to crack so many jokes, but it strangely worked for me. The one thing Bridges DOES have, however, is more vulnerability. John Wayne tends to want to be mister badass the whole time and not get shown up by anyone. As a result, LA BEEF was portrayed as a joke to be shown up by Rooster. Yet in the remake, Roosters inadequacies are highlighted far more, where LA BEEFs are toned down. I think I actually liked that balance more. Wayne wins by a hair, but if Bridges took the marbles out of his mouth, he may have clinched it.

One thing I absolutely did not like about the remake, however, was the narration. I am a huge believer of show, dont tell. The beginning scenes impact was lessened because of it and the endings emotional blow would have been more effective without it. So while I still prefer this version overall due to the nice quality of life fixes for the action scenes, its not a big win. The two are very close to each other.
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CoolCly: I made a big mistake watching the original True Grit. I accidentally started watching this version instead and got to when they ford the river. I thought the original was good and deserves a lot of credit, but it was tough to see it with fresh eyes when I felt like Id watched better versions of those scenes in the remake!

It would be alright. The undertaker is pretty memorable, a good extension of a pretty normal line from the original.

Hailee Steinfeld is purposeful and mesmerizing as Mattie. The original Mattie demonstrated true grit and did a really good job, especially for the era it was filmed in and how women were normally portrayed, but Steinfeld really took this to a higher level. The scene where she negotiates over the horses demonstrates this excellently. Matties sharp wit is on full display, as well her stubbornness that leads her into saying too much at times.

Rooster and the Texan Ranger constantly being at odds, so late in the movie, felt a bit too repetitive. But an improvement over the original is Mattie and the ranger mending their relationship and gaining respect for eachother before the final encounter.

Im not sure if I like John Wayne or Jeff Bridges better as Rooster. They are both very good, though Bridges I think benefits from just better modern film making around him.

Tom Chaney and the gang of bad guys were nice for the brief moment they were on screen.

I liked the hectinc ness of the original a bit better in how Mattie ended up in the cave and the snakes, and Rooster and the rangers parts in rescuing her. The ranger pulling through to save them but then dying was a poignant moment. It seems they just wanted him to survive in the remake to make this feel better, but it just makes it feel less.

I strongly disliked the change to the ending I really liked in the original how Rooster visited the farm and Mattie pushes to recognize him as family, and he genuinely accepts. I also think it harms the movie to replace Mattie with this older woman who I dont really feel captured the fire of Mattie at all.

Overall, I respect the original, but I like the remake better for Hailee Steinfelds stellar performance its just a straight up improvement. Its a shame that I feel like they fumbled the ending compared to the original so badly

8/10

KBM: See, these are the kinds of movies that should be remade. The original was a middling movie at best, with an okay story, indifferent acting, and a straightforward, old-timey Western tone. But put the Coen Bros in charge, with their razor-sharp sense of off-kilter humor, and better actors all around in the lead roles, and suddenly you turn something merely decent into a minor Revisionist classic. Hailee Steinfeld in particular shines in her breakout role, but Bridges and Damon are both far better actors than John Wayne or Glen Campbell, with Josh Brolin and Barry Pepper also giving great performances. It's doubly amazing because of how many scenes are taken more or less directly from the previous film, and yet with those alterations in tone and performance, it all just plays so much better humorous and self-aware when it needs to be, but still with a surprising amount of dramatic oomph in its third act. I will say that one of my favorite scenes in this version, though, is one that was nowhere to be found in the previous iteration: the scene with the man in the bear suit is one of my favorite all-time moments of oddball Coen Bros humor. Something about the way Jeff Bridges delivers You are not LaBeouf after that loooong buildup just gets me every goddamn time.

Poke: This I saw before the original and maybe just because of some updated pacing and the more familiar modern actors I like; I prefer this to the original. Both are great though.

Johnbobb: So I was a little disappointed to the remake bring back some of the original's weaker moments (like LaBeef being an abusive creep toward Mattie) but pretty much every other aspect of the film was improved. Much better performances, much better directing and cinematography, and better characterization of pretty much every character. It turned what was a mid-tier film by Western standards and made into something really solid.

Karo: Remember that old western? Well here it is remade almost scene for scene and sometimes even line for line, much like those soulless live action disney remakes. Though this movie isn't THAT bad, it still begs the question of why the hell did it need to exist when all it does is slap a new coat of paint on a classic and make it considerably less fun.
The humorous lines from the original seem weird and out of place in this new movie and its hyper serious tone, but that doesn't stop the characters from reciting them verbatim regardless of how awkward it is in the new scene.
The soundtrack consists of mainly just playing the same public domain church hymn over and over again at different speeds. So yeah, I hope you really like 'everlasting arms' because you are going to be hearing it a LOT.
As far as I am concerned there is only one True Grit and it isnt this one. This is Fake Grit. This is Ditto with imposter Grit. If you are going to adapt an old movie, fucking adapt it. Dont just shove it into a new mold that it doesnt really fit.

Inviso: Ive been trying not to compare movies in these write-ups, for spoiler reasons, and even in the two trilogies Ive watched, Ive managed to keep write-ups separate. But in this one, its literally a remake of a movie on this list, and the remake is MUCH better in my opinion. For starters, the main character feels less like an obnoxious brat, and more like a young teen whos in way over her head, but still has a basic understanding of how the law works. Her robotic personality at times goes a long way in terms of carrying the movie, because shes amusing in how much more seriously shes taking things compared to Rooster and LeBeoufs pissing contest. The plot is mostly the same, but it feels a lot tighter. We dont need to see the whole scene with her father getting killed. Thats a time when telling, rather than showing allows the plot to kick off faster. Really though, I think its just a solid film overall. Not spectacular, because its still a bit slow at times. But its good enough, and even the ending feels more satisfying because its bittersweet, rather than nothingness.
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OUTLIER

Poke 151
CoolCly 143
Inviso 122
Johnbobb 111
Stifled 103
Karo 97
KBM 92

If you all werent so unattractive, Poke might have snuck a kiss. But now hes gonna give you a few lashes of his belt.
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Not enough Hailee Steinfeld mentions, I'd say she has one of my favorite performances in any film here.

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Snake5555555555 posted...

Not enough Hailee Steinfeld mentions, I'd say she has one of my favorite performances in any film here.

I will second this; had no idea who she was prior to this coming out in 2010 and it absolutely put her on the map for me (which was driven in even harder by Edge of Seventeen later on)

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also I meant to post this before #10 dropped but

1. ???
2. ???
3. ???
4. ???
5. Django
6. ???
7. ???
8. ???
9. Cat Ballou
10. The Great Silence
11. ???
12. ??? [True Grit 2010]
13. Bone Tomahawk
14. Once Upon a Time in the West
15. ???
16. Shanghai Noon
17. The Searchers
18. High Noon
19. El Mariachi
20. True Grit 1969
21. Desperado
22. The Magnificent Seven
23. Stagecoach
24. Tombstone
25. Shane
26. My Darling Clementine
27. Wild Wild West
28. Young Guns
29. Two Mules for Sister Sara
30. McLintock!

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The original True Grit wasn't an action film, at least not in THAT sense. I really enjoyed it for what it was.

That said I find it interesting that Roger Ebert gave both movies 4 stars. Not saying I think that highly of the original though.

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Any of you El Mariachi trilogy fans who haven't already seen From Dusk Till Dawn should IMO!

...Conversely, it seems I should watch said trilogy myself.

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I think everyone here participated in my 90s horror project so they should've seen it!

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I'd take From Dusk Till Dawn over the Mariachi trilogy. I definitely think that was largely him capitalizing on some of the ideas you see start to appear in the triology

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I think I like the Mariachi Trilogy a bit more than From Dusk Till Dawn, but all four are great.
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#9. Prospect 87 points (won tiebreaker over True Grit 2010)

Stifled 3
CoolCly 6
Karo 7
Pokewars 13
Johnbobb 15
KBM 18
Inviso 25

Very poor plot synopsis:
After getting his face crushed by The Mountain, Oberyn Martell found himself stranded on a strange planet.

Why it was included:
Ive often heard Star Wars referred to as a space western. And this makes sense, as westerns and Star Wars both drew heavy inspiration from samurai movies. But the fact is, Star Wars is not officially classified as a western. But you know what is? Prospect! And do you know who stars in Prospect? The Mandalorian! It all comes full circle! I was so thrilled to be able to add a sci-fi western to this list. Its actually kind of a miracle I stumbled upon this lovely little film because it had a very low-key release. It hit the film festival scene first, and was then exclusive to Regal Cinemas. Around four months later, it was already available for purchase to watch at home. With a tiny budget and tiny box office numbers, it was basically word of mouth and high praise from critics that helped circulate it upon home release. Perhaps like many of the others on the list, time will build a stronger reputation for Prospect. But for now, its a nice indie flick we found.

What Stifled thinks:
Since I was a teenager, I loved the anime Trigun. If you arent familiar with Trigun, its a sci-fi western and its amazing. But as it happens, unless you want to cheat and classify things in the Star Wars universe as space westerns, there really isnt much to work with. But then I found Prospect. And let me tell you, I absolutely love this movie. Its kind of hard to describe, but Prospect manages to blend the sci-fi and western genres together so well that neither side of the coin feels forced or out of place. I constantly felt the western aesthetic while all of the sci-fi tech was being used. Quite frankly, thats amazing for anyone to pull off, much less a director with a budget of four million dollars.

The acting is great too, despite focusing mostly on two characters. The film makes you think the father/daughter duo are going to be the focus, but the father gets taken out fairly early, leaving the daughter to be stuck with one of his killers. Two people reluctantly working together to survive is nothing new, but having to do so on a weird planet with weird primitive rapey people and weird fauna is something unique. The daughter finds herself going from despising ol Pedro Pascal to eventually accepting him as a new father figure of sorts. Coming of age? Family is who you choose? Giving up a life of crime and finding your heart? Prospect gives us all of that and more. It was even more than I was expecting and my expectations were HIGH going in. What a wonderful movie.
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CoolCly: This was a fun imaginative movie that captured the western feel despite all the sci fi trappings.
The dads greed and short sightedness really screwed them over. The ship was damaged and they had a limited window of time to get home - and he really brushes past those issues to chase fortune.

I wonder why bandit #2 was carrying around such a large gun.. Is there danger that would call for such a large weapon?

The daughter on the ship after her father dies feels less like someone grieving and more like kid who got to stay home alone from school cheetohs and watching TV

I thought the people they meet were going to be "natives", but it seems these are humans who've adapted to living on the planet, and gone a little crazy. It'd be neat if there was a more primitive society of humanoids living here.

I find this alien world to be beautiful - just familiar enough to feel normal enough for these humans to be walking around in, but strange enough to remind you that this isn't earth. I'm curious what's going on with the atmosphere that they need to wear the suits and filter, but they seem to be okay living in tents.

The growing relationship between the girl and Pedro Pascal is good. It's interesting that so much of their activity is driven by trying to treat his arm wound that was caused by her earlier when he entered her ship. I was glad Pedro Pascal might have made it in the end. Even though he killed her dad, I found myself hoping their uneasy partnership would last.

The pods they are prospecting for gold has me wondering what those are. They come out of little pods and have to cut an umbilical cord of some time. I kind of expected this to be a problem later, like thse are little baby aliens or something. Facehuggers are gonna come flying out, or maybe the Queen of the Queens Lair will emerge. I think they indicate the hole you pull them out of can tear your arm off, but we dont actually see it.

Anyways, I really enjoyed this movie, and I got really invested in the survival and partnership of Cee and and Pedro Pascal. It would have been nicer if there were a couple more characters though.

8.5/10

Karo: So a young orphan girl as thrown together with a rough-hewn ne're-do-well who was partially responsible for her father's death and she hates him at first but eventually she grows to trust him.
You may think this sounds a lot like Arya and the Hound, and well, yeah, it is basically Arya and the Hound. But now it's in space!
The world is well built considering how little we see of it (and I wanted to see more of it), even considering they quite clearly did not have the budget to construct a whole alien planet.
Nothing about the scenario is particularly original, and things go way off kilter when we reach the merc camp, but whenever it is just the two of them it is great.

Poke: Interesting film that grabbed my attention. Wasnt expecting the killer of the girls dad to form an unsteady alliance that snowballs into them trying to get a ticket off the planet. Very imaginative.

Johnbobb: I fell asleep the first time I watched it but once I could stay awake for it it was pretty decent.

KBM: Tough one to rank. On the one hand, its strong performances and chemistry from Sophie Thatcher and Pedro Pascal kept me really invested in the moment, and there's definitely some interesting world-building going on here. On the other hand, its ingenuity-by-limitations approach is maybe a bit TOO limited as a Washingtonian, I never could quite get past the fact that this was pretty clearly filmed right in my backyard. Beautiful use of color, though, and I've always felt more movies should be filmed around here. So yeah, it's an enjoyable flick that doesn't quite stand out above a crowded field of strong movies.

Inviso: This was a disappointing end to the list. The past couple lists have all ended strong, in my opinion; what with Far From Home, The Half of It, and Weathering with You all landing in my top three for their respective lists. But Prospect just felt like a good concept that spun its wheels for a long time, trying to make it work. On paper, a space western is interesting, as is the concept of a girl and her father being set upon by bandits, only for the father to die, one bandit to die, and both the girl and the remaining bandit forced to work together to survive. Having this set in space gives the movie an inherent danger element, as you have the ticking clock of lift-off being necessary to escape a dying planet. But the film itself often feels like its just having scenes to have scenes that youd expect to find in this kind of movie. They go to a camp with Native American allegories, and when money is offer to buy Cee, she runs off and escapes with ease. Nothing really comes of that, other than Ezra losing his arm, which was in the works regardless. And then they get to the Queens Lair and completely fail at every aspect of their task, only to kill a group of trained mercs and escape in an EXTREMELY unsatisfying ending. It just had its moments, but it was really dull, and the cinematography was pretty terrible too.
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OUTLIER

Poke 155
CoolCly 146
Inviso 138
Johnbobb 117
Stifled 109
KBM 101
Karo 99

The Mandalorian killed Pokes dad and so they went on adventures together. The end?
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#8. A Fistful of Dollars 79 points

Inviso - 3
Johnbobb 3
CoolCly 7
Pokewars 9
Karo 15
KBM 21
Stifled 21

Very poor plot synopsis:
Clint Eastwood defeats a whole crew of baddies despite getting his ass handed to him in a beating that felt like it lasted for a half hour.

Why it was included:
I probably dont need to tell you why Sergio Leones legendary Dollars Trilogy belongs on this list. What I will tell you is a nifty little fun fact involving lawsuits. Do you remember how The Magnificent Seven was essentially a western remake of The Seven Samurai? And do you also remember how I mentioned Akira Kurosawa, the director of The Seven Samurai, loved The Magnificent Seven? Well A Fistful of Dollars is essentially a remake of Kurosawas film Yojimbo. Well Kurosawa described Dollars as a fine movie. UnfortunatelyLeone didnt bother to get that shit properly licensed. So a lawsuit ensued, with Kurosawa saying it was a fine movie, but it was my movie. Leone tried to get out of it, but ended up settling out of court for 15% of Dollars worldwide revenue and $100k in damages. Lotsa spaghetti indeed!

What Stifled thinks:
Im rather frustrated to report this because my expectations for this one were super high, butI wasnt overly fond of the fisting of the dollars. It was far too slow and plodding for what it was trying to build itself up to. The baddies were not memorable on an individual level. I only remember them as a big group. And even The Man with No Name kind of fell flat for me in this entry. He wasnt nearly as cool and badass as I expected him to be. Honestly, he was kind of a pushover for most of the movie. Granted, anyone would be a pushover if an entire group of dudes beat the shit out of them for like an hour or whatever. But still, I was a little put off because I expect more from western protagonists. And sure, he takes care of business in the end, but I was left feeling decidedly meh.

Not everything was bad, however. I WILL give Clint a bajillion respect points for watching out for the kids. Thats an A+ for moral fiber. And the metal plate bit was fantastic, reminded me of when Bret Hart used a metal plate under his shirt to knock out Goldberg when he tried to spear him. And while the baddies were no name losers, the coffin maker and inn keeper were both great characters. I rather enjoyed the final third of the movie, so its a shame the first two thirds couldnt match up. The other two entries in the trilogy were more than worth getting through this one, but I dont like that I had to even think that way in the end.
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Inviso: This was an extremely enjoyable film. For starters, Clint Eastwood is surprisingly charming in this. Im coming off multiple movies where John Wayne is supposed to be this charming, lovable rogue, yet Clint Eastwood manages to pull off that role effortlessly. The first half to two thirds of the movie involve him riding into town and discovering that two crime families are at war and trying to one-up one another. So, what does he do? He stokes the fire and makes a little money for his troubles. He plays both sides against one another and makes them both look foolish in the process. However, his fatal flaw is that he gets sentimental, and cant stand seeing a little boy cry over his captive mother. He rescues her and thinks hes in the clear, only to get found out for his double dealing. The last act of the film involves him thinking quick on his feet to improvise and escape captivity, and then returning to town after hes fully healed to outsmart the bad guys one last time. This is how you tell the story of a one-man army, and its really great to watch, especially since everything set-up throughout the film comes full circle perfectly.

Johnbobb: I watched TGTBATU before this, and had heard that was the best Leone had put out, but similarly to how I preferred Rashomon to Seven Samurai, I prefer Fistful of Dollars to Leone's later, bigger scale films. Almost every character in this feels surprisingly developed given it's not-overlong runtime. The pace is constant, and Eastwood's character, standoffish dickhead that he can be sometimes, is easy to root for, especially after you see him beaten within an inch of his life. The Rojo family, meanwhile, all feel distinct from each other, with Ramon's commanding presence dominating every scene he's in and Esteban's sadistic stares haunting the film's most brutal moments. The film is fantastic in its smallest moments.

CoolCly: I had never seen the dollars movies before this project, and Im very glad they were included. This was a great movie.

The quickdraw on the three guys at the beginning of this film feels like the first of any of the movies in this project to actually create good tension in the moments leading up to the firing of a showdown and having it feel relieved

In the other movies up until this point, the draw in the climax is usually instantaneous and doesnt really have a lot of tension. The main character just beats the enemy and then its over.

Ramone wasnt just defeated. He was systematically taken apart and destroyed.

The heart, Ramone. Dont forget the heart. Aim for the heart or youll never stop me.

When a man with a .45 meets a man with a rifle, you said the man with the pistols a deadman. Lets see if thats true. Go ahead, load up and shoot.

Ive never seen a man so thoroughly defeated.

8.5/10

Poke: The first of the Dollars Trilogy which put Clint Eastwood on the map and etched him onto the Mount Rushmore of Western leads. And its a damn good start to the trilogy.

Karo: The adventures of an anonymous wild west mercenary who plays two groups of mexican bandits off each other in order to make a quick buck and everyone just immediately trusts this suspicious gringo for no reason.
The story takes place in a lawless town just across the border where ketchup is spilled on a regular basis and everyone seems to sweat so much it looks like their faces are covered in a thin film of oil.
Our protagonist is an interesting character, though at times it seems he is just a bit too blessed in his luck and the sheer stupidity of the people in the world around him. Of special note is the scene where The Nameless One escapes the bandit compound due to his pursuers failing at a game of hide and seek that a six-year-old could accomplish. Oh man our prisoner has broken down the door of his cell! I'm sure he's still in there for some reason so we should all immediately rush inside! This is saturday morning cartoon villain levels of competence.
It's just feels really old, and the fistful of dollars in question here was apparently the movie's budget because wow these special effects. Probably a movie that is more impactful than actually good.

KBM: This just didn't click with me on the same level as the other Dollars trilogy movies did. The story didn't engage me I didn't care about the conflict occurring in the town between the two smuggler families, and the Stranger's part in it didn't really interest me that much either. He just rolls into town, fucks shit up on all sides, and leaves. I can't deny its influence in the development of the Spaghetti Western, but I definitely found the others on the list more engaging. It probably has to do with the fact that so much of the draw of the subgenre comes from the idiosyncratic visuals and soundtrack, and those aspects, though still in the capable hands of Sergio Leone and Ennio Morricone, just haven't really been nailed down yet Leone's direction is amateurish compared to his later work, and the soundtrack is repetitive and a lot blander than Morricone's later stuff. It's certainly not a bad movie, just one I found kind of uninteresting.
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OUTLIER

Poke 156
CoolCly 147
Inviso 143
Johnbobb 122
Stifled 122
KBM 114
Karo 106

The Poke with no Name ends up with a fistful of outlier dollars, but only after the rival ranker gang beats the living crap out of him for 23 movies.
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StifledSilence posted...

The Poke with no Name

Aww yeah. Fun fact: my uncle and his friend said I looked like young Clint Eastwood.

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aw what the hell that should've been top 5 easy

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I had a tough time connecting with the rival gangs storyline. I don't think I even really kept track on who was against who. Clint Eastwood is playing both sides against eachother but I had no idea why anybody was even talking to him. That kinda hurt the movie a bit.

There was a lot of really great scenes though. Any shootout was good, and the burning of the rival gang scene was great. And the coffinmaker and barkeep guy were nice side characters.

Ramone was a pretty decent villain, though I think Ramone 2.0 was better.

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Darn, I was hoping the one member of the Dollars trilogy I'm still truly fond of wouldn't go out first.

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Fistful was always the weakest IMO, but its largely because the others were more original while this was just a carbon copy of Yojimbo

Theres one movie Im surprised but also not surprised is still in (largely cause its my least favorite Tarantino by a good margin)

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Just want to ask if anyone in this topic has seen the Bruce Willis film Last Man Standing, an actual OFFICIAL remake of Yojimbo.

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LinkMarioSamus posted...

Just want to ask if anyone in this topic has seen the Bruce Willis film Last Man Standing, an actual OFFICIAL remake of Yojimbo.

Sure have. Its one of my favorite Bruce flicks. In fact, I considered putting it on the list because of the setting and aesthetic, but it isnt classified as a western anywhere.
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Heh, first thing I think of when it comes to the movie's reception is its trashing from Siskel & Ebert, who even named it one of the worst movies of 1996. Then again they also named Happy Gilmore there, though they didn't hate it as much it seemed.

Considering Last Man Standing has an RT score above 30% I guess it probably has its fans. I dunno.

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Thats to be expected I suppose. Movies chocked full of violence tend to skew lower with critics overall. There are exceptions of course, but Last Man Standing wasnt one of them.

ALSO random thought I just remembered that I think I forgot to put in my Tombstone write up, but Kilmers performance as Doc reminded me of Dave Chapelles imitation of a white dude on Chapelle Show. Dude had a weird voice for that role.
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#7. Blazing Saddles 71 points

KBM 2
Stifled 2
Johnbobb 6
Karo 8
Inviso 13
CoolCly 15
Pokewars 25

Very poor plot synopsis:
Land: see snatch

Why it was included:
A musical western comedy with a black protagonist? Yes please! Also, DID YOU KNOW that motherfucking Darth Vader (James Earl Jones) was the original choice to play Bart? And that Gene Wilder was originally considered for the role of Hedley Lamar, but he turned it down? And that John Wayne was originally considered for the role of the Waco Kid, but he turned it down because it wasnt a family friendly movie that fit his image? And the original actor playing Waco Kid (ironically) collapsed on set due to alcohol withdrawl and Gene Wilder was chosen to replace him? Well now you know!

What Stifled thinks:
Scene for scene, this might be the funniest movie Ive ever seen. Its that perfect blend of biting social satire and shock value that keeps me enthralled every single time. The acting is great, down to even the side characters. The music is catchy and funny. The comic timing is perfect. The blurred line between it being really happening and being a movie within a movie is wonderful. I have absolutely nothing bad to say about Blazing Saddles. It has been one of my favorite movies since middle school and nothing has changed since then.
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KBM: How the fuck do you fairly, equitably rank Blazing Saddles alongside a bunch of serious westerns, both classic and modern? Obviously you really can't. Mel Brooks' iconic send-up of Westerns is bound to be a controversial one among our little band of regulars, just as it was when it was released, although I'm certainly hoping more of y'all end up on the positive side than the negative one. And don't give me any of that you couldn't make Blazing Saddles today shit it's technically true, yes, but only because this was made to send up a very specific kind of film that doesn't get made any more (because, well, Blazing Saddles basically killed the genre for a couple decades, after which the whole concept of Westerns was reinvented). Nothing in this movie crosses any lines that aren't contextually appropriate to cross. But enough about this movie's place in the zeitgeist the main thing is, it's just really, really funny. And it's a hell of a lot funnier to me now, too, after having seen so many more of the old Westerns it's spoofing than I'd previously seen for this list. It really would take forever to list my favorite bits, as I'd basically just end up summarizing most of the movie. However, I will give a special shoutout to the chemistry between Cleavon Little and Gene Wilder in the leading roles Little cracking up when Wilder says You know... morons gets me every time I see it. The Count Basie cameo is also fantastically random, one of many gags in this movie that you'd likely only see from Mel Brooks.

(PS: I consider this part of the Holy Trinity of Brooks: The Producers and Young Frankenstein being the other two where his brand of wacky, zany humor is just *mwah* pitch perfect. Spaceballs gets an honorable mention, as not quite as many of the jokes in that one land, but it still has that unmistakable Brooksian energy and enough of the gags are great to cement it as a minor classic.)

Johnbobb: Some of this movie REALLY doesn't age well. Like, REALLY doesn't. But every fart joke, racist joke, and sexist joke is mostly made up for by Gene Wilder and Cleavon Little at their best. It's pretty easily the funniest movie on this list. All of this leads up to one of the best endings ever put to film.

Karo: So the governor appoints a black sheriff to this town of inbred racists and hilarity ensues.
This film is a work of brilliant satire that lampoons every stupid bigoted element and overused trope of old westerns in a dark comedy that is severely unstructured but still very funny.
Unfortunately, midway through it starts to fall off a little bit and we get scenes like the chorus of excessively flatulent cowboys. Did someone turn over the production reins to their five year old son?
The forces of good win the day in a ploy that involves building an entire replica of the town in a single day and beating the fourth wall savagely within an inch of its life.
It is dumb and proud of it, which is good because it is really really dumb. Whether that is a good or bad thing varies wildly throughout the movie but lets just say for now its better to be dumb than boring.

Inviso: A reviewer Ive watched once said that comedy is the fastest form of entertainment to age poorly, and from that perspective, yes, Blazing Saddles hasnt aged the best. However, Im willing to take into account the era in which it was made (immediately after the civil rights movement of the late 1960s), and realize that despite the copious amounts of racial slurs, theyre all in service of painting the majority-white cast as idiots, while Bart runs circles around them in a Bugs Bunny-esque fashion. In that regard, its somewhat amusing. And honestly, some of the jokes still land really well. When Bart takes himself hostage in order to avoid an angry mob, I laughed out loud. Plus, there are multiple instances of one character or another (I know Gene Wilder was one) going on a long soliloquy about the pride of people, only to completely undercut that flowery language by insisting that everything they just said is descriptive of idiots and rubes. Overall, I think Mel Brooks crafted a quality comedy, but its hard to hold up in modern times.

CoolCly: The way the black guys working on the railroad are treated as lesser does a great job at showing how casual racism can be, despite being played for comedy.
The executioner is great.

I didn't care for the musical number at all. I couldn't understand the actress half of the time.
A lot of fun, and I don't think the use of slurs and depictions of racism harm the film. They're always done to portray the bigots as ignorant and cruel, which I think is exactly the right way to combat racism.

Overall, very fun comedy that I enjoyed and I think is worth watching today

6.1/10

Poke: I love Mel Brooks films, and I was anticipating liking this one, but for some reason, I was underwhelmed. Some jokes landed, but only mild chuckles for the most part.
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OUTLIER

Poke 174
CoolCly 155
Inviso 149
Stifled 127
Johnbobb 123
KBM 119
Karo 107

Lets face it. Everything below the Poke is kaput!
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Wonder what would win in a Mel Brooks film ranking.

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Blazing Saddles > Young Frankenstein >>>>>> Space Balls > Robin Hood

imo

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Seen Blazing Saddles only once, remember finding it a hoot.

I remember once Siskel & Ebert discussed the issue of colorization, and then ended the episode by flipping it around and showing a scene from Blazing Saddles in black-and-white. They thought it made the movie even funnier.

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Hey friends. Ive had a migraine the past two days that wont go away. Im hoping to continue this and do a double drop tomorrow.
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I tried doing a ranking of the movies I've seen from this list, and they would be:

13) Django Unchained
12) Shane
11) The Magnificent Seven
10) A Fistful of Dollars
9) Two Mules for Sister Sara
8) The Treasure of the Sierra Madre
7) The Searchers
6) Stagecoach
5) For a Few Dollars More
4) The Good, the Bad and the Ugly
3) Blazing Saddles (although it's been a long time)
2) True Grit (2010)
1) High Noon

I've mainly seen the classic westerns, not that many of the 80s-2010s ones

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Dr_Football posted...

Minus 5 stars

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#6. The Treasure of the Sierra Madre 64 points

KBM 1
Inviso 5
Johnbobb 7
Pokewars 7
Stifled 9
Karo 14
CoolCly 21

Very poor plot synopsis:
I like gold and you like gold and we like gold and you like murder andwait what?

Why it was included:
I could simply say Humphrey Bogart is in a western and call it a day. Dude is a legend. In fact, because he was a fan of the source material, Bogart went out of his way to pester the director to get a part. He ended up landing the lead role and fucking nailed it. But interestingly enough, he was NOT nominated by the scumlord Academy for best actor. The film did, however, take home awards for best director, best supporting actor (Walter Huston as Howard), and best adapted screenplay. It was nominated for best picture as well, but lost toHamlet? According to Rotten Tomatoes, Sierra Madre has a 100% and Hamlet has a 95%. Got em!

What Stifled thinks:
Due to my love for Humphrey Bogart, I went into this one with super high expectations. Sometimes that isnt always a good idea, but in this case? It exceeded expectations. The feeling of tension and paranoia is presented so incredibly well that it even made me feel uneasy at times. The acting is superb, of course (motherfucking Bogart). Its refreshing sometimes to have a protagonist that isnt squeaky clean. Bogarts character is all over that spectrum in Sierra Madre. Early on, despite his actions being firmly in a grey area, his intentions were usually in the interest of fairness. Then as time progresses, he slowly descends into madness, eventually turning on his once trusted friends. Its hard to think of many other characters in media treated with such detailed development. Its an incredible movie, and I plan on watching it again very soon.
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KBM: Goddamn am I glad this list finally got me to go watch The Treasure of the Sierra Madre. This has to be one of the best movies of the 1940s. A shockingly timeless portrait (especially considering the very specific time period in which it's set) of a man's descent into the madness of greed, it is a travesty that Bogart wasn't nominated for an Oscar for his performance in this. And what's more: this movie is genuinely really funny, in a pitch-black kind of way. One of those rare films of the Hays Code era that doesn't lose any of its potency due to the Codes stringent restrictions, this is a movie I could recommend to anyone, and one that I'm sure I'll be watching again several times in the future. I loved, loved, loved this. Screw John Ford, give me a John Huston movie over him any day.

Inviso: Throughout my watching of this movie, I kept thinking that it reminded me of a Twilight Zone episode (The Rip Van Winkel Caper, to be precise). It just had that interesting, psychological aspect to differentiate it from a standard old west story. Humphrey Bogarts chararacter is a complete bastard throughout, easily a craven coward despite his masculine persona. But really, the whole set-up is great. Dobbs (Bogart) and Curtin (some other guy) hear tale of prospecting and getting rich quick, so they put in the money to do exactly that. But its not long before paranoia and greed start to well within them both, seemingly egged on by their partys third member, Howard. Now, if Howard was scamming them both, the whole time, that wouldve been great. But sadly, he just stirs the pot and turns out to be good in the end. Still, it works. Its fascinating to see the descent of Dobbs over the course of the film, until karmic retribution costs him everything. His more virtuous partners get screwed in that their labors are for naught, but they still get happy endings. As a result, the movie just tells a very strong story from start to finish.

Johnbobb: Saw this for the first time in a film studies class in college (as I did with a small handful from this list), and it was one of my favorites from that class, mostly because it was the first western I think I can remember actually enjoying. Humphrey Bogart is top notch here, and he plays the poor man losing his mind to greed on the mountain that it's hard to believe this is the same suave sweet-talker from Casablanca. This is what I tend to think of in terms of a true classic Western deserving of the title.

Poke: Three players in the game of trust. It is a triumph of films revolving around the concept of game theory. My only gripe is the pacing/editing towards the end with Bogart basically dying off-screen. But the middle of the film is just so spectacular.

Karo: So some gringo bums in mexico team up with a crazy old prospector to find all that gold in them hills and so the three of them head off into the wilderness masquerading as big game hunters tracking mexico's famous lions and tigers.
What begins as a simple partnership quickly turns into cowboy game of thrones as everyone begins to suspect everyone else of running off with their share of the gold, all while paranoia and goofy dancing intensify.
The intense scenes around the midsection of the story are the strongest part of the movie, as they contemplate of the murder of a lone cowboy so they wont have to share the loot drops with him.
But that is as high of a peak as the film gets, as it immediately degrades into dated racial depictions and everyone doing incredibly stupid things simply for the sake of getting the story where the writers wanted it to be.
For such an old movie the characterization is unusually good, but I would have liked it to have not go so overboard with all the winking and nudging that our would-be prospectors would eventually turn on each other. Similarly I would have liked it to not have been so absurdly obvious who the betrayer would be. I would have liked for the most tense scene in the movie not to be randomly defused by an attack from some culturally insensitive 'banditos'.
Though it remains interesting throughout, it still is a little half-baked due to its age and it pulls a lot of punches in places where it definitely needed a little more to leave a real impact.

CoolCly: I dont care for the two main guys

This was an interesting story about the effect of greed on a man. Dobbs was rather pathetic from the beginning, but he didnt believe himself to be a bad guy. But he truly falls to pathetic depths throughout the film

Howards scene where he had the opportunity to leave Dobbs to die in the mine and have one less split of the gold but chose to save Dobbs anyways was nice, and cemented his choice to resist that kind of temptation.

But he old timer that knows all there is to know about prospecting was the star of the show. Hes just dripping with both wisdom and practical knowledge about everything, and he has the vitality and determination to back it up. Its almost silly how the two guys mock him and think hes crazy when hes prepared them for the hardships ahead as much as he could

The scene of the old timer and the other guy talking about how theyd like to make a life for themselves running a store or growing peaches contrasted with the main character just talking about the material wealth uses he would do the moment hes back in civilization was really the whole theme of the movie.

A bit sad Howard and the old timer ended up empty handed, but they never really needed the gold to live a fulfilling life anyways.

My review of this movie is rather positive, but honestly, I didnt actually enjoy watching it, and I dont think I could recommend this movie to anybody unless they were doing just to experience what older movies and/or westerns could be like. Theres definitely substance behind this though for those who choose to go looking for it

4.5/10
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OUTLIER

Poke 175
CoolCly 170
Inviso 150
Stifled 130
Johnbobb 124
KBM 124
Karo 115

CoolCly thought he would be able to strike it rich prospecting for gold, but Poke went berserk and tried to murder him. As it happens, a gang of outlier bandits took out Poke instead.
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Oh shit, really thought that was going to hit top 5

310 to Yuma really landed higher than I expected

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