Poll of the Day > Jair Bolsonaro will allow POLICE to KILL ON SIGHT Without Fear of PROSECUTION!!!

(+) Yeah! (+)

Brazil's Far-Right President Jair Bolsonaro will sign a new legislation will give cops FREE WILL to SHOOT ANYBODY that is deemed a criminal without fear of PROSECUTION as he said criminals will now "die like cockroaches" under his rule!!

He spoke of his hopes that lawmakers would approve his ultra harsh criminal code to loosen the legal shackles on his police force

He said "These guys are going to die in the streets like cockroaches if the police cover is approved and that's how it should be"

He said there's an "unequal" battle against crime and his hindered by policemen being prosecuted for shooting gangsters rather than given medals

Campaigners said this proposed legal change will bring mass abuse of power and terror to the streets

Dubbed the "Trump of the Tropics", Bolsonaro rose to power on the back of the "tough on crime" campaignstance but critics says his latest comments are gravely concerning even by his own inflammatory standards

Ariel De Castro Alves, a lawyer in Sao Paolo said "We've had 414 killings committed by military force in San Paolo. that is the highest number since 2003. He is encouraging police violence and ends up servig as a kind of instigator of brutality"

The police force was responsible for one death every 5 hours in Rio but they claim their kills have helped bring homicide rates down to the lowest levels in decades as a record number of firearms had been seized from would be criminals,

No country has suffered more homicides in recent years and only 2 nations, USA and China have more people behind bars

Bolsonaro claims his concern is for the "good people" and said he'd rather a prison full of criminals than cemetery of innocents

Would you support a police force that kills without prosecution and trust their instinct on who the "bad guys" are?

Dictator -

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2019/08/06/15/16952558-7327313-image-a-14_1565101678933.jpg
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mrduckbear posted...

Would you support a police force that kills without prosecution and trust their instinct on who the "bad guys" are?

No but I'll give officers going into a favela free reign.
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I know that the crime rate in Brazil is insane and something more needs to be done, but giving cops this much discretionary power -- especially when some may be in the pockets of criminals -- seems like this could cause whole new sets of problems. I don't even trust Judge Dredd with that much power.
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Aaantlion posted...

I know that the crime rate in Brazil is insane and something more needs to be done, but giving cops this much discretionary power -- especially when some may be in the pockets of criminals -- seems like this could cause whole new sets of problems. I don't even trust Judge Dredd with that much power.

US cops shoot at suspected criminals freely, Brazil is just allowing actual criminals to be shot dead.
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

I don't even trust Judge Dredd with that much power.

I would. The in-universe vetting process for street judges is insane.
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Wow you thought Trump was bad.
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zebatov posted...

Wow you thought Trump was bad.

I think it has more to do with the country itself. A large majority of gore videos come from Brazil
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No. I wouldn't step foot in Brazil if that comes to be.
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*jaywalks* - gets shot by cops

Bolsonaro: "They had it coming!"
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

US cops shoot at suspected criminals freely, Brazil is just allowing actual criminals to be shot dead.

If they haven't been found guilty in court, then they're still just suspected criminals.
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Most of the police who kill citizens in the US never face prosecution.

Moreover, Trump has previously praised actions like this such as Duerte sanctioning the execution of drug dealers by police.

Basically what Im saying is given where we are as a country, Im not sure we have the ability to judge this without a pot-kettle situation.
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Bolsonaro is a despot, perhaps one of the most unstable leaders of a large nation currently. The man has been quite open with his admiration of the military dictatorship of old, and suggested that their practice of picking people off the street and torturing them didn't go far enough. Hew has repeatedly made it quite clear that he wants to seize all indigenous property and wipe native Brazilians off of the face of the Earth- that is not hyperbole, btw.
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adjl posted...

Kyuubi4269 posted...

US cops shoot at suspected criminals freely, Brazil is just allowing actual criminals to be shot dead.

If they haven't been found guilty in court, then they're still just suspected criminals.

This just in, you need a judge to determine if you can believe your own eyes.

If an officer sees a crime with their own eyes, they know who is a criminal.
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I can't stop sliding down the slope.
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

adjl posted...

Kyuubi4269 posted...

US cops shoot at suspected criminals freely, Brazil is just allowing actual criminals to be shot dead.

If they haven't been found guilty in court, then they're still just suspected criminals.

This just in, you need a judge to determine if you can believe your own eyes.

If an officer sees a crime with their own eyes, they know who is a criminal.

this is the level of naivete i have come to expect from the same guy who thinks racism against whites is a bigger problem currently than racism against blacks
imagine being so privileged as to think cops would always 100% be honest and truthful about the "crimes" they see
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

adjl posted...

Kyuubi4269 posted...

US cops shoot at suspected criminals freely, Brazil is just allowing actual criminals to be shot dead.

If they haven't been found guilty in court, then they're still just suspected criminals.

This just in, you need a judge to determine if you can believe your own eyes.

If an officer sees a crime with their own eyes, they know who is a criminal.

Correction: If an officer claims to have seen a crime with their own eyes, then the rest of us know who they claim is a criminal. You're imagining the situation from the position of an officer. Try imagining it from the position of a civilian (which shouldn't be hard, given that you are a civilian), and see if you can't come up with a few problems with the idea.
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TheSlinja posted...

this is the level of naivete i have come to expect from the same guy who thinks racism against whites is a bigger problem currently than racism against blacks

Because I don't live in a third world country, there's veeerry little racism to minorities. There's a metric shit tonne of blame-shifting, race-baiting and demands for handouts though.

TheSlinja posted...

imagine being so privileged as to think cops would always 100% be honest and truthful about the "crimes" they see

An officer shooting wildly in to a crowd is going to get a shot load of attention, if they act criminally then everybody's going to know about it, and under these rules, can get shot too.

Brazil is crime-infested, it needs to be treated like a state of emergency as anything else is going to fail to solve the problem. There will be a lot of collateral damage, but there will be a lot more if their problem is allowed to persist.
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adjl posted...

Try imagining it from the position of a civilian (which shouldn't be hard, given that you are a civilian), and see if you can't come up with a few problems with the idea.

Remember, this guy was voted in for being crazy brutal to drug dealers, he has massive public support. His regime is tough, but it seeks to solve a deeply-ingrained problem.
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

If an officer sees a crime with their own eyes, they know who is a criminal.

Absolutely. Cops are to be trusted 110%

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2019/07/11/florida-cop-meth-drugs-arrests-scandal/
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It seems to me that a lot of people here don't seem to know much about Brazil other than "drugs bad" and "man says kill people with drugs so man good."

But sure, make a sub-set of armed people immune to the law. That sounds like a great idea.
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

Remember, this guy was voted in for being crazy brutal to drug dealers, he has massive public support.

Your response to "this will absolutely result in corrupt cops murdering innocent people and/or working as hitmen for cartels" (the natural conclusion to thinking about this for more than half a second, if you ever get around to that) is "he's popular"? That's really the best you can come up with?
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imma be honest I was expecting you to retort the whole doesnt think racism against blacks is a problem thing
but you doubled down on it?
you a clown for real my guy
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Insane that they elected that man. Im glad Im not in Brazil.

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Mad_Max posted...

Kyuubi4269 posted...

If an officer sees a crime with their own eyes, they know who is a criminal.

Absolutely. Cops are to be trusted 110%

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2019/07/11/florida-cop-meth-drugs-arrests-scandal/

>Florida man
>Representative human

Pick one.

Gaawa_chan posted...

But sure, make a sub-set of armed people immune to the law. That sounds like a great idea.

Literally nobody has said that.

adjl posted...

Your response to "this will absolutely result in corrupt cops murdering innocent people and/or working as hitmen for cartels" (the natural conclusion to thinking about this for more than half a second, if you ever get around to that) is "he's popular"? That's really the best you can come up with?

My response to "but innocent people will be hurt!" is "innocent people voted in that risk, they consider his methods an acceptable risk".

TheSlinja posted...

you a clown for real my guy

You calling me a clown because I'm so white? You absolute racist, how dare you, I demand compensation.
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

>Florida man
>Representative human

Pick one.

he thinks this is only a florida problem? man you really are as sheltered from reality as it gets my guy

Kyuubi4269 posted...

I demand compensation

I only payout emojiis

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Im sure Brazil needs to be tougher on crime, but this is crazy territory.

Kyuubi4269 posted...

My response to "but innocent people will be hurt!" is "innocent people voted in that risk, they consider his methods an acceptable risk".

So... textbook argumentum ad populum. As I expected.
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Does that mean Brazilian police can kill corrupt government officials?
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TheSlinja posted...

he thinks this is only a florida problem? man you really are as sheltered from reality as it gets my guy

You cited Florida man, use a better example in future.

Also the US in general is pretty talented at militarizing its police and giving them a God complex.

adjl posted...

Kyuubi4269 posted...

My response to "but innocent people will be hurt!" is "innocent people voted in that risk, they consider his methods an acceptable risk".

So... textbook argumentum ad populum. As I expected.

If you don't accept the will of the populus, why even have democracy?

slacker03150 posted...

Does that mean Brazilian police can kill corrupt government officials?

Probably can kill eachother too.
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sounds like a stupid idea, but i dont exactly have a better one to deal with the absolutely absurd crime problem in brazil.
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So the US is becoming like the world in "Demolition Man" and Brazil is becoming "Judge Dredd". Both are terrible futures.
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Anyone who thinks this is a good idea is woefully ignorant.
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JCvgluvr posted...

Anyone who thinks this is a good idea is woefully ignorant.

They said that about murdering drug dealers, yet their rates dropped rapidly. I believe the appropriate meme is this:


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PKMNsony posted...

Im sure Brazil needs to be tougher on crime, but this is crazy territory.

Crime is such a problem there that people have become really vicious towards criminals of any kind.

A few years ago there was a case of a mob that caught a woman that tried to pickpocket, so they doused her in gas and burned her alive in the street. Middle Ages mentality its downright frightening.

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Mead posted...

people have become really viscous towards criminals of any kind.

I also get thicker and resist deformation in proximity of criminals.
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

If you don't accept the will of the populus, why even have democracy?

But we're not assessing whether or not he's acting in accordance with democratic principles. We're assessing whether or not this is a stupid idea. Why are you trying to win an argument nobody's having with you?

Kyuubi4269 posted...

I also get thicker and resist deformation in proximity of criminals.

And to think, I opted to show mercy and not call you out on your pseudo-Latin interpretation of "populace."
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

I also get thicker and resist deformation in proximity of criminals.

Well youd better quit it

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adjl posted...

But we're not assessing whether or not he's acting in accordance with democratic principles. We're assessing whether or not this is a stupid idea. Why are you trying to win an argument nobody's having with you?

It's not stupid to enact the will of the people, particularly since it's probably going to be effective, ethics aside.

adjl posted...

And to think, I opted to show mercy and not call you out on your pseudo-Latin interpretation of "populace."

As long as you can do it lightheartedly, go ahead.
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

It's not stupid to enact the will of the people

You just distilled argumentum ad populum down to its purest form. It's rare to see a logical fallacy displayed so transparently. Well done.

Kyuubi4269 posted...

particularly since it's probably going to be effective, ethics aside.

I cannot see removing legal oversight of the police ending particularly well. Not for the people, anyway. For Bolsonaro and his dreams of turning Brazil back into a military dictatorship, it'll be great.
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It's so weird to see right wing posters who whine about big government in almost any other case, often endorsing having a government officially sanction extrajudicial death squads.
The utter hypocrisy is so glaring, but they've mastered the art of cognitive dissonance.

I will at least give credit to Zeus for being ideologically consistent (this time) and voicing concerns about it.

streamofthesky posted...

It's so weird to see right wing posters who whine about big government in almost any other case, often endorsing having a government officially sanction extrajudicial death squads.
The utter hypocrisy is so glaring, but they've mastered the art of cognitive dissonance.

I will at least give credit to Zeus for being ideologically consistent (this time) and voicing concerns about it.

Most right wingers are only anti big government in the areas that benefit them in some way. Keeping down minorities, the most likely result of such measures in the U.S., would give them boners. I don't see the hypocrisy there.
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Brazil is one of the most crime-ridden and corrupt countries in the world. Going into one of the favelas is practically a death sentence, and parts of the country are controlled by drug cartel terrorists.

I have seen videos of people getting brutally murdered online, as well as police troops actively engaging in gun battles with cartel members. I would estimate that 75% of the videos I have seen, said it was from Brazil. Max Payne 3 was NOT an exaggeration.

Well that settles it guys, ICOYAR has seen some videos on line. No need for further discussion here. Tc, time to close the topic.
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streamofthesky posted...

It's so weird to see right wing posters who whine about big government in almost any other case, often endorsing having a government officially sanction extrajudicial death squads.
The utter hypocrisy is so glaring, but they've mastered the art of cognitive dissonance.

I will at least give credit to Zeus for being ideologically consistent (this time) and voicing concerns about it.

They only complain about big government and federal spending when a democrat is in power

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kangolcone posted...

Well that settles it guys, ICOYAR has seen some videos on line. No need for further discussion here. Tc, time to close the topic.

I mean...I'd like to know why ICOYAR is watching all these snuff films online.

Actually...no I wouldn't....

Fuck no that sounds crazy to me. But we're in a very different situation from Brazil - maybe this measure will improve public order and restore the social contract there. Though I have a hunch it won't accomplish that.
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

Aaantlion posted...

I know that the crime rate in Brazil is insane and something more needs to be done, but giving cops this much discretionary power -- especially when some may be in the pockets of criminals -- seems like this could cause whole new sets of problems. I don't even trust Judge Dredd with that much power.

US cops shoot at suspected criminals freely, Brazil is just allowing actual criminals to be shot dead.

...no, Brazil's policy would have the bar lower than the US's.

kangolcone posted...

Most of the police who kill citizens in the US never face prosecution.

And why would they? If they were determined to have acted within the responsibilities of their position, there's no reason why it should go to trial. And while headlines are devoted to the more ostentatiously egregious uses or abuses of power, the average incident usually doesn't resemble that. More importantly, EVERY lethal use of force is investigated and I *believe* even discharging a firearm carries an investigation. You have a process already.

kangolcone posted...

Moreover, Trump has previously praised actions like this such as Duerte sanctioning the execution of drug dealers by police.

Basically what Im saying is given where we are as a country, Im not sure we have the ability to judge this without a pot-kettle situation.

Pot-kettle is a weak argument when you're comparing a nation doing something to a nation where the leader praises somebody for doing something. And a lot of the Duterte stuff iirc goes beyond the cops.

As for whether or not we can judge, the only semi-defense would be that the Philippines is suffering more severe problems than the US. However, even that doesn't seem like a particularly good excuse because they could just not kill people.

Mead posted...

Insane that they elected that man. Im glad Im not in Brazil.

Well, Brazil has more problems than just an authoritarian leader. It also has the world's 13th highest murder rate; that rate is 30.5 per 100k people. It outranks nations like Colombia and Mexico (numbers 18 and 19 respectively, roughly 24 murders per 100k people). For all the shit people talk about the US, we're #89 with a rate of 5.3 per 100k.

streamofthesky posted...

It's so weird to see right wing posters who whine about big government in almost any other case, often endorsing having a government officially sanction extrajudicial death squads.
The utter hypocrisy is so glaring, but they've mastered the art of cognitive dissonance.

I will at least give credit to Zeus for being ideologically consistent (this time) and voicing concerns about it.

And I'll once again criticize you for your consistent rightwing ideology mischaracterization.
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These kinds of leaders are why Brazil is a great, civil, stable, and safe country.

sarc
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Do you want the start a boogaloo? Because that's how you start a boogaloo...
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Yellow posted...

These kinds of leaders are why Brazil is a great, civil, stable, and safe country.

sarc

Conversely, I'd argue that Brazil elects the kind of leaders it does because it's not a safe or stable country. And in particular when violent crime has been on the rise under previous administrations -- where many of the elected officials were also corrupt -- a strongarm thug who promises swift, brutal justice to criminals is going to sound appealing to the general public. Especially one who can relate with his own stories of having to hide under his parents' bed with his siblings when shootings broke out around his home.
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