Board 8 > I'm gonna play Undertale for the first time (spoilers)

(+) Yeah! (+)

Ehhh

Flowey convinced me not to bother

Also, what's the evidence for Sans = Ness? Because other than both of them being short, I saw none.
---

The genocide run is great. It has some amazing boss battles.

sans=ness is more of a meme originating from a Game Theory episode. If you do some specific sequence of events, you get to go into Sans' room. Inside there's a medal and a photograph of 3 people. Text only, you don't really see either. Toby Fox did Earthbound romhacks and the game is somewhat inspired by EB.

Pretty flimsy. I never actually watched the GT video, but it's funny as a meme

Although now it's looking likely that stuff is a reference to Deltarune, which Toby has been brainstorming since before undertale
---

Sans being designed to have similar proportions and posture to Ness was also a bit of "evidence" of Ness = Sans.

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/earthbound/images/5/53/Ness_clay.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/310?cb=20140219060122

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/vsbattles/images/3/35/Sans_render.png/revision/latest?cb=20160203070904

This is probably of an homage than anything else.
---

Genocide run is what makes this game untouchable by anything else. But you probably don't want to do it. It's not enjoyable. It's not just "more content'.

Pacifist run is very much the full ending of the game and an amazing conclusion.
---

Plus the music in the Sans genocide fight is probably the most popular track in the game.
---

yeah but it's probably better out of context than in context

the undyne theme though...
---

I'll probably never do this genocide route

But I will say that foolmo is correct about Undyne's music being the best that I heard.
---

Anagram posted...

I'll probably never do this genocide route

But I will say that foolmo is correct about Undyne's music being the best that I heard.

It's not something I can really recommend or not recommend because it's disrespectful in a strange way to the game to do so

it's kinda up to you

If you don't do Genocide (which is understandable), I would highly recommend watching these videos because Genocide has a ton of content that's worth seeing:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v= uuL3OvQwwvQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v= EWrAIWvYUXU

EDIT: Broke apart the links because the thumbnails might be considered spoilers.
---

Personally I never did Genocide. Flowey's parting words really hit home.

I did however use a save editor to make a separate file so I could skip to the Undyne and Sans fights, because Sans was right when he said I was a bit of a freak. I Quit before dealing the final blows though!!
---

the video thumbnails kinda spoil it

Oh, should I play Deltarune? I'm not even clear on its relation to Undertale.
---

I would, but only after watching the Genocide videos.
---

Anagram posted...

Oh, should I play Deltarune? I'm not even clear on its relation to Undertale.

Yes.
It's...best to see for yourself first. It does share some...elements with Undertale.
---

Paratroopa1 posted...

it's disrespectful in a strange way to the game to do so

It's a game. Games are toys you're meant to fuck around with.
---

DeepsPraw posted...

Paratroopa1 posted...

it's disrespectful in a strange way to the game to do so

It's a game. Games are toys you're meant to fuck around with.

Okay, Flowey
---

this was a fun topic. I was also on team "only killed Toriel in first playthrough"
---

DeepsPraw posted...

Paratroopa1 posted...

it's disrespectful in a strange way to the game to do so

It's a game. Games are toys you're meant to fuck around with.

I am very much "fucking around" with the game here, just on a different level from what you're expecting

KamikazePotato posted...

Personally I never did Genocide. Flowey's parting words really hit home.

I did however use a save editor to make a separate file so I could skip to the Undyne and Sans fights, because Sans was right when he said I was a bit of a freak. I Quit before dealing the final blows though!!

Theres no point quitting before finishing off Undyne the Undying. Contrary to her name, she is very much dying as I recall, only holding on through determination. Also her death on a neutral route is a lot sadder, you should go see it if you havent
---

The pacifist route was cool even after doing exactly what Anagram did by having to play through the game a second time to actually complete it. Doing the genocide run with everything that was put into it made Undertale pretty much a top 3 game of all time to me. Everything about it was so gooooooood, it legit made you feel like the villain because you actually are.
---

KamikazePotato posted...

Personally I never did Genocide. Flowey's parting words really hit home.

I did however use a save editor to make a separate file so I could skip to the Undyne and Sans fights, because Sans was right when he said I was a bit of a freak. I Quit before dealing the final blows though!!

Arguably more disrespectful to the game than normal Genocide tbqh
---

KamikazePotato posted...

DeepsPraw posted...

Paratroopa1 posted...

it's disrespectful in a strange way to the game to do so

It's a game. Games are toys you're meant to fuck around with.

Okay, Flowey

He's right tho

When UT first came out people were making all sorts of weird as fuck posts about the game as if it's anything other than just that, a videogame. An odd, off-putting overprotectiveness. The last post is also an example of that.

Bend the game to your will if you want, and if you can. It's your toy.
---

XIII_rocks posted...

KamikazePotato posted...

DeepsPraw posted...

Paratroopa1 posted...

it's disrespectful in a strange way to the game to do so

It's a game. Games are toys you're meant to fuck around with.

Okay, Flowey

He's right tho

When UT first came out people were making all sorts of weird as fuck posts about the game as if it's anything other than just that, a videogame. An odd, off-putting overprotectiveness. The last post is also an example of that.

Bend the game to your will if you want, and if you can. It's your toy.

Yeah its important to remember that they arent real and no one is hurt by a genocide run
---

XIII_rocks posted...

When UT first came out people were making all sorts of weird as fuck posts about the game as if it's anything other than just that, a videogame. An odd, off-putting overprotectiveness. The last post is also an example of that

Not being overprotective. Just pointing out the weird discrepancy in people wanting to play the Genocide route but also wanting the "moral victory" (for lack of a better term) of not doing so. In particular around release a lot of people were getting rid of the flag that your save files get marked with after you complete a Genocide route.

I basically agree with you, but trying to "win" the moral high ground against the game feels like it's missing the point the narrative makes. Or maybe it isn't weird and is just an interesting emergent property of the story.
---

HeroDelTiempo17 posted...

Arguably more disrespectful to the game than normal Genocide tbqh

It's more evil but not disrespectful at all. The brilliant thing about genocide is no matter how you interact with it, playing it, not playing it, watching it, cheating it, it's all built in to the narrative and makes sense.

Everyone refusing to see the game as more than a toy is small minded af too. You know games are more powerful than that. But even that is built in to genocide.
---

I remember a lot of people treating the game and its characters like living things and wanting them "to live on in happiness" or whatever.

That's so schmaltzy it makes me sick
---

At least you feel something
---

Hey I love undertale. I'm not saying it doesn't have great emotional moments.

I just don't think Sans and Toriel are living inside my computer like some sort of digital ant farm
---

HeroDelTiempo17 posted...

Not being overprotective. Just pointing out the weird discrepancy in people wanting to play the Genocide route but also wanting the "moral victory" (for lack of a better term) of not doing so. In particular around release a lot of people were getting rid of the flag that your save files get marked with after you complete a Genocide route.

I basically agree with you, but trying to "win" the moral high ground against the game feels like it's missing the point the narrative makes. Or maybe it isn't weird and is just an interesting emergent property of the story.

OK yeah, I can agree with this thing about people wanting to have their cake and eat it too. But I understand skipping to the two big boss fights as a time saving measure. That's fine.
---

DeepsPraw posted...

Hey I love undertale. I'm not saying it doesn't have great emotional moments.

I just don't think Sans and Toriel are living inside my computer like some sort of digital ant farm

Basically sums up where I am. Good game but people get weird and culty about it.
---

That's just a rudimentary way to interpret it. Of course they are fiction but they represent real emotions and real things IRL (like Flowey is the "it's just a toy" mindset, and therefore a standin for you). Realizing that the way you interact with the game is a very real reflection of yourself and life is not weird or crazy. That's what art is for.
---

I think foolmo is on the money here. Undertale is in many ways a takedown of obsessive fandom (very ironically) and the kind of attitude it takes to do things like genocide (or do genocide but remove the flags from your game) that are expressly designed to give you a bad time and make you feel bad just to see everything. It's about that, not imagining that the characters are real.
---

you guys are super badly missing the point of my post

I'm deliberately attempting to engage the game's meta-narrative here which is to me a really important element of the game

the way someone is told or not told to do something in the game is, to me, part of playing the game itself

this isn't about being concerned about hurting some video game characters or whatever, it's about taking the game's narrative seriously

Lightning Strikes posted...

I think foolmo is on the money here. Undertale is in many ways a takedown of obsessive fandom (very ironically) and the kind of attitude it takes to do things like genocide (or do genocide but remove the flags from your game) that are expressly designed to give you a bad time and make you feel bad just to see everything. It's about that, not imagining that the characters are real.

That is a very kind interpretation of how people treat the game.
---

Lots of fans definitely have a shallow interpretation of the game, but your interpretation is even shallower...
---

Also, and feel free to crucify me for this, but as far as fourth wall breaking pseudo-horror games I've played in the last six months go, I liked DDLC more. Though again, I didn't play genocide mode.
---

Watch the Genocide videos!
---

KamikazePotato posted...

Watch the Genocide videos!

I read a synopsis of it because it was faster and now I regret it. I'll probably watch the videos.
---

Watched the genocide videos. They were interesting. Thinking about playing Deltarune.
---

Sans' fight in Genocide is one of my very bits in gaming, ever. The fight, the music, and the dialogue accompanying it are all A+.
---

I like Undertale a lot, but I don't think its meta narrative nor its creepypasta imitation hit for me much. I just like the humor and nice story. But that other stuff appeals more to other people and I still get the part I like.
---

Meh, if you were going to watch the videos you should have just played it instead, but whatever

Paratroopa1 posted...

Meh, if you were going to watch the videos you should have just played it instead, but whatever

Probably, but having watched it, I'm pretty sure I could not have beaten Sans anyway.
---

Not sure if you saw it but my favorite part of genocide is the papyrus stuff where you just keep no-selling all his comedy bits

Paratroopa1 posted...

Not sure if you saw it but my favorite part of genocide is the papyrus stuff where you just keep no-selling all his comedy bits

I watched it all. My favorite bit was Asgore not recognizing you as a human.
---

Check -> Monster Kid
"Looks like free EXP."

Also, Burgerpants with the single best line in the game

"Go to hell? Sorry, little buddy, I can't go to hell. I'm all out of vacation days."
---

Also I like the part where Sans thanks you for keeping pretending to be human since Papyrus wants to meet one.
---