Board 8 > Is Lugia a bird?

(+) Yeah! (+)

I had a debate last night on Discord. I maintain that Lugia is associated with the Legendary Birds and that its finger-wings are similar to Farfetch'd's, which is definitely a bird. Other people insisted that its lack of a beak, wings that are close to hands, and general lack of birdlike qualities make it not a bird.

This is in the context of whether or not to include Lugia in a ranking of pokebirds, which also included a debate about whether a picture of a duck counts as a duck (Porygon).
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I don't care if it's a damned Cardassian. All that concerns me is my opponents are dead.
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I never thought of him as a bird but I can't really argue against it either. I just think of him as Mythical Creature. But since he's the counterpart to Ho-Oh and Ho-Oh is certainly a bird, he pretty much is I guess.


Also one of my favorite pokemon
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Are they blind? What is that mouth if not a beak?
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lugia has feathers (Silver Feather), lugia is a bird
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Space Whale Bird
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what the fuck is wrong with all of you

You are validating my stance to never be on Discord if this is what you are arguing about
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no

imo it's most like a dragon even though it's not actually dragon-type. it's an anomaly like charizard
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LeonhartFour posted...

You are validating my stance to never be on Discord if this is what you are arguing about

Oh come on Leo. This is far from the dumbest thing B8ers have argued about.
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LeonhartFour posted...

You are validating my stance to never be on Discord if this is what you are arguing about

argument didn't take place on b8 discord

Even worse
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Leo3Four
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LeonhartFour posted...

Even worse

I mean, it was a private conversation

Drakeryn posted...

no

imo it's most like a dragon even though it's not actually dragon-type. it's an anomaly like charizard

Thank You - this was my position exactly, it goes on the Dragon list not the Bird List.
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I once had a stupid conversation on a telephone and now Leonhart4 has sworn off of them forever.
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But are dragons dinosaurs and thus could they maybe have feathers?
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Eddv posted...

I once had a stupid conversation on a telephone and now Leonhart4 has sworn off of them forever.

I have now that I've learned you've ruined it
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https://thoughtcatalog.files.wordpress.com/2014/06/dragons.gif?w=500&h=279
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Bane_Of_Despair posted...

Also one of my favorite pokemon

Yeah, I love Lugia as well, It was really great in the movie where it first appeared in.


Drakeryn posted...

imo it's most like a dragon even though it's not actually dragon-type. it's an anomaly like charizard

I don't think Lugia has the appearance of being a dragon, unlike Charizard which definitely looks like it should be Dragon type.
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Bane_Of_Despair posted...

But since he's the counterpart to Ho-Oh and Ho-Oh is certainly a bird, he pretty much is I guess.

Most of the box legends aren't the same type of animal though - gen 3, 6, and 7's pairings are all totally different. The only thing is that they do all have some sort of duality concept that give them parity so that they have a relationship to each other - as far as I know Lugia and Ho-oh don't really have anything like that

but there's no rule that says Lugia has to be a bird because Ho-oh is, and the fact that they look so different is evidence to me that Lugia isn't a bird

maybe a dinosaur, which is like sort of a proto-bird - we had this discussion about Archeops too where I fell on the side of "not a bird, by technicality of the fact that it wouldn't have been called a bird yet"

I don't think Lugia is dragonlike at all.
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It's a fish. Particularly this species:
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/content/dam/news/photos/000/208/20881.jpg
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If Lugia's a dragon, then Suicune, Raikou, and Entei are all dogs.
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Paratroopa1 posted...

Most of the box legends aren't the same type of animal though - gen 3, 6, and 7's pairings are all totally different. The only thing is that they do all have some sort of duality concept that give them parity so that they have a relationship to each other - as far as I know Lugia and Ho-oh don't really have anything like that"

From the box legends of Gen 3, 6, and 7, only Groudon seems to not be based on any kind of animal (that I know of). Kyogre is a whale, Xerneas is a deer, Yveltal is another bird, Solgaleo is a lion, and Lunala is a bat.
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LusterSoldier posted...

Paratroopa1 posted...

Most of the box legends aren't the same type of animal though - gen 3, 6, and 7's pairings are all totally different. The only thing is that they do all have some sort of duality concept that give them parity so that they have a relationship to each other - as far as I know Lugia and Ho-oh don't really have anything like that"

From the box legends of Gen 3, 6, and 7, only Groudon seems to not be based on any kind of animal (that I know of). Kyogre is a whale, Xerneas is a deer, Yveltal is another bird, Solgaleo is a lion, and Lunala is a bat.

No. Kyogre is a leviathan and Groudon is a behemoth.

Rayquaza was probably meant to be like Ziz but ended up as a generic sky serpent.
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The only pokebird is MISSINGNo.

That Bird/Normal typing
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Anagram posted...

I don't think Lugia is dragonlike at all.

The long neck, the legs/feet, and the tail all seem dragonlike (and un-birdlike).

But also, I'm more convinced of "not a bird" than "maybe a dragon." The overall shape and musculature just isn't like a bird.
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I mean, it has feathers.
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Yveltal is a good comparison by the way - pretty similar to Lugia, I had to spend a few minutes studying it, but Yveltal is definitely a bird -

- Visible feathers
- Bird-style wings
- Talons, bird legs
- Tailfeathers
- Overall body suggestive of a bird
- An actual beak

in my opinion, Lugia has none of these things, which is what doesn't make him look like a bird to my eye. When I look at it my brain sorts it into 'dragon or dragon-like creature', not 'bird'

He's flying type and not water, which rules out the fish thing for me (for the most part), and seems to be more a bird than anything else.
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Types are a joke though, I'm pretty sure they just made lugia a psychic type because psychic types are 'powerful'

(I don't think Lugia is a fish either though)

Paratroopa1 posted...

- Visible feathers
- Bird-style wings
- Talons, bird legs
- Tailfeathers
- Overall body suggestive of a bird
- An actual beak

Lugia has feathers (Silver Feather) and the same kind of wings as Farfetch'd. I'll grant that it doesn't have talons or bird legs, but it's still bird-shaped other than that. Also, the upper part of its jaw its beak-ish.
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It does have a sort of beak-ish mouth but it's not fully enough a beak for me to conclude it has to be a bird

The body structure is more the problem, really

https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Lugia_(Pok%C3%A9mon)

Lugia is a large Pokémon that resembles a dragon, a plesiosaur, and a bird.

Lugia leads the Legendary birds. When they fight over territory, Lugia is the only Pokémon that can quell their ceaseless fighting, as observed in the second Pokémon movie. Much like the birds, it possesses the ability to control the weather;

So the one thing that's a little bit weird is the plesiosaur reference. Plesiosaurs are biologically not dinosaurs and not birds. They're aquatic reptiles. (Lugia is admitedly master of the ocean; if they ever add triple typing I would assume it would get water type).
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Ok, my brother has weighed in with his expert opinion:

Lugia is a dragon bird!
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woodman posted...

Ok, my brother has weighed in with his expert opinion:

Lugia is a dragon bird!

There we go. Settled.
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Paratroopa1 posted...

It does have a sort of beak-ish mouth but it's not fully enough a beak for me to conclude it has to be a bird

If anything, the mouth most reminds me of turtle mouths, or maybe I've been playing too much Hearthstone lately

http://hearthstone.gamepedia.com/Tortollan
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This is what some B8ers actually believe.


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-hotdogturtle-- posted...

This is what some B8ers actually believe.

I don't know, Missingno's right side seems awfully beak-like to me.
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metroid composite posted...

https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Lugia_(Pok%C3%A9mon)

Lugia is a large Pokémon that resembles a dragon, a plesiosaur, and a bird.

Lugia leads the Legendary birds. When they fight over territory, Lugia is the only Pokémon that can quell their ceaseless fighting, as observed in the second Pokémon movie. Much like the birds, it possesses the ability to control the weather;

So the one thing that's a little bit weird is the plesiosaur reference. Plesiosaurs are biologically not dinosaurs and not birds. They're aquatic reptiles. (Lugia is admitedly master of the ocean; if they ever add triple typing I would assume it would get water type).

"Resembles" a bird I don't disagree with mind you - Golduck also "resembles" a bird, Porygon "resembles" a bird, but neither are birds

the "leading the legendary birds" thing is a) as far as I know, specifically some shit just the second Pokemon movie made up, which I couldn't care less about and b) completely irrelevant - if I took up falconry tomorrow and owned a pet falcon, that wouldn't make me a falcon

and believe me I wish it made me a falcon

metroid composite posted...

https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Lugia_(Pok%C3%A9mon)

Lugia is a large Pokémon that resembles a dragon, a plesiosaur, and a bird.

B-b-but wikis aren't reliable because anyone can edit them!
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Paratroopa1 posted...

if I took up falconry tomorrow and owned a pet falcon, that wouldn't make me a falcon

Well not with THAT attitude
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It's more likely to just turn me into a Saudi prince and I don't want that to happen

Paratroopa1 posted...

"Resembles" a bird I don't disagree with mind you - Golduck also "resembles" a bird, Porygon "resembles" a bird, but neither are birds

Golduck isn't a bird? It has duck in its name. I mean, Psyduck is definitely a bird. I guess Golduck resembes Kappas from Japanese folklore, so maybe it's not supposed to be a bird? I would kind of assume that something that evolves from a bird and still has "duck" in the name would still be a bird.

Porygon is obviously synthetic, though, sure.
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Golduck's a kappa - it was the choice of whoever named it in the translation to name it after a duck, but that doesn't make it a duck

IMO, Lugia is less a bird than the Legendary Beasts are dogs.

Considering it has grey skin and no feathers, and considering its status as "guardian of the seas," I'd say Lugia mostly resembles some sort of marine mammal, though with plesiosaur-like features (neck, tail, wings) and, uh, fingers.... for some reason.
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Altimadark posted...

Considering it has grey skin and no feathers

https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Silver_and_Rainbow_Wings
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