Tommy Dreamer recently wrote an article at http://www.thewhig.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=3426777, discussing the typical travel wrestlers go through on a weekly basis. He also names off his travel partners through the years, some of which make me wish they could start giving the guys cameras on the road and filming them for some sort of reality show on the new Network.
n In Extreme Championship Wrestling, it was Paul Heyman, Beulah McGillicutty, Little Guido, Devon Dudley, Sign Guy Dudley, Danny Doring, Francine and Chris Chetti.
n In WWE, I rode with Bubba Ray, Devon and Spike Dudley, Christian, Edge, Shane McMahon, Rhyno, Sandman, Balls Mahoney, Stevie Richards, Test, Kelly Kelly, John Cena, Candice Michelle, Victoria, Kevin Thorn, Hornswoggle, Great Khali, Scott Armstrong, Justin Roberts, Dolph Ziggler, CM Punk and Zack Ryder.
n In Total Nonstop Action, it was Bully Ray, Rhino, Bobby Roode, Robbie E, Tara and Angelina Love.
I would watch 'On the Road with Dreamer, Khali, and Hornswoggle'
--
0-12 you are peathice
Board 8 > All-Purpose Wrestling Topic 162: YEAH! COME ON! YEAH YEAH YEAH!
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bryans7 01/07/12 3:32:00 PM #151: |
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JaKyL25 01/07/12 3:38:00 PM #152: |
WWE put out a "Road Stories" sort of book awhile ago but I doubt there was anything TOO good in it.
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WarThaNemesis2 01/07/12 3:56:00 PM #153: |
I find it funny that Tommy rode with Bubba Ray in WWE and TNA, but not in ECW.
-- http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh293/zukiraphaera/war-sig-1.png http://i.imgur.com/597oi.png ... Copied to Clipboard!
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ExThaNemesis 01/07/12 4:51:00 PM #154: |
So in my Japanese class this week, the professor was teaching us the basics of greetings and everything like that. And he was teaching us to say goodnight, and he was like "you say this when you are about to GO 2 SLEEP" and all I could think of was KENTA
-- http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v712/ExTha/10and14.jpg "What about the lion from Lion King?" - SuperNiceDog ... Copied to Clipboard!
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TimJab 01/07/12 5:26:00 PM #155: |
From: bryans7 | #151 WTF Shane travels with the guys? -- http://img.imgcake.com/baronvontoast/1304312287012jpgen.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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ScareChan 01/07/12 6:10:00 PM #156: |
Guys I figured it out
they turn Bryan heel so that when Cole confronts him on being lame, Bryan flips out and kicks Cole's ass Cole becomes face! It all makes sense! The turn is for cole! -- Circle gets the Scare! Imagine if Jesus knew kung fu. That's what everyone is dealing with ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Viktor Vaughn 01/07/12 6:19:00 PM #157: |
From: TimJab | #155 i've heard that he tried hard to be "one of the boys" for a while so i wouldn't be surprised but dreamer's worked office jobs and stuff in wwe too and i wouldn't shocked to hear that he traveled with the mcmahons and writers at some point -- bad advice http://www.last.fm/user/snowcampsoldier ... Copied to Clipboard!
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the icon ownz all 01/07/12 6:29:00 PM #158: |
-- ICON: When there's nothing left to burn, you have to set Bidoof on fire. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Panthera 01/07/12 7:57:00 PM #159: |
So you know how Cena for a few years now has always claimed that he's all about being himself and won't be something he's not and all that? I'm wondering, has he ever given an on-air explanation for how he reconciles being himself with the change to "rise above hate" from his old "be hateful to everyone" rapper phase?
-- Mistake you're making - overlooking the fact that we might not want to be saved. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 01/07/12 7:59:00 PM #160: |
No, but I'm willing to accept "I grew up" as an explanation.
7 years of character consistency is still pretty damn good. -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://bryandanielson.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/photo3.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 01/07/12 8:00:00 PM #161: |
Scratch that, eight years.
-- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://bryandanielson.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/photo3.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Panthera 01/07/12 8:01:00 PM #162: |
I'd prefer it if he actually acknowledged that he grew up. I mean, sure, that *would* be an acceptable explanation, I just find it kind of weird that he never mentions it when he's saying how he's "always been himself" as if his personality has been static his whole career.
-- We clasped our hands, our hands in praise of a conquerors right to tyranny ... Copied to Clipboard!
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TimJab 01/07/12 8:03:00 PM #163: |
Cena takes a "The Raven 2" esque approach to wrestling.
They're like "Hey Cena, we thought up a great gimmick for you, you should do this" And he's like "**** THAT IMMA BE MYSELF" Can you imagine Cena in the Attitude Era and before? "Cena, we want you to be an evil friar that hits people with wine bottles behind the refs back" "But I'm not a friar and I don't like wine" -- http://i.imgur.com/5vOFJ.gif ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Panthera 01/07/12 8:04:00 PM #164: |
Although I wouldn't say he's been completely consistent with his character over that time. The degree to which he emphasizes being champion has definitely changed between giving up a shot at the title to help Zack Ryder and his mini-feud with JBL during the whole JBL/HBK storyline in 2008/2009. Really Cena still has had some weird fluctuations over the years where he'll spend a week or two acting like a hateful, selfish bastard before returning to his usual routine.
-- Mistake you're making - overlooking the fact that we might not want to be saved. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 01/07/12 8:17:00 PM #165: |
Antonio Cesaro is also touring with the main roster now, teaming with McGillicutty against Riley and Mason Ryan at house shows.
And losing. Because Mason Ryan is very European I guess it's okay. -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://bryandanielson.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/photo3.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Haguile 01/07/12 8:21:00 PM #166: |
This has nothing to do with wrestling but I just watched cirque du soleil. This has now made me convinced that absolutely anything live looks way better than on tv and I need to watch a wrestling show as soon as possible.
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TimJab 01/07/12 8:24:00 PM #167: |
From: JaKyL25 | #165  -- http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/6782/timj1.png ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 01/07/12 8:26:00 PM #168: |
Well, maybe if Hero didn't fail a damn drug test he could have been there too!
-- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://bryandanielson.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/photo3.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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voltch 01/07/12 8:39:00 PM #169: |
Chris Hero, what a loser.
-- Vote for this guy in every contest, our Guru champion: SuperNiceDog ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Panthera 01/07/12 8:41:00 PM #170: |
He should change his name to Christopher Villain
-- Mistake you're making - overlooking the fact that we might not want to be saved. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 01/07/12 9:06:00 PM #171: |
Interesting mini-debate I'm on on the Other Feds board:
Who has the best library of quality matches: HBK or Eddie Guerrero. Not just WWE, career-wide. I'm arguing HBK, this other dude is arguing Eddie. I admit it's close, but HBK's head start plus active career post-'05 put him ahead in my eyes. -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://bryandanielson.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/photo3.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Lopen 01/07/12 9:10:00 PM #172: |
I think HBK wins that pretty easily. But I weigh crowd and "match significance" higher than a lot of wrestling fans do probably when it comes to how good a match is.
-- I tried to have a fierce rivalry with SuperNiceDog, but he made me look worse than a GameFAQs Contest! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 01/07/12 9:12:00 PM #173: |
Well to be fair, it's not like Eddie wrestled in front of dead crowds much. His innate charisma is what set him apart from his Radicalz brethren. He could MAKE a crowd care.
That said, HBK has that exact same ability. -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://bryandanielson.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/photo3.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Wanglicious 01/07/12 9:15:00 PM #174: |
i'm honestly not too interested in a lot of hbk's older stuff. his return is what i really liked out of him.
eddie meanwhile i've felt has been a more consistent career. still gotta give the nod to hbk though, if for no other reason, i enjoy the different characters he played over the years, despite preferring eddie's last one more than either of 'em. -- The King Wang. Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 01/07/12 9:17:00 PM #175: |
But to your point, where match significance does come into play is the amount of time and attention a match is given. Obviously if Eddie is only getting 3-5 minute matches for a large chunk of his career, that hurts him. I doubt many HBK matches exist that are sub-7 minutes.
I'd rather watch any "good" worker wrestle for 7 minutes than I would watch an all-time great wrestle for 3, given the same opponent. It's like trying to get Beethoven to write a commercial jingle. -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://bryandanielson.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/photo3.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Lopen 01/07/12 9:25:00 PM #176: |
Yeah I'm not saying Eddie wrestled in front of dead crowds, but there's a difference between a good match with a crowd that's into it, and a good match with a practically deafening crowd. Also the "match importance" thing as I said I tend to care-- I'd think a significantly smaller amount of Shawn's great matches are drawn from stuff like "random battle with Rey Mysterio on Nitro in 1997" or what have you. Not to be down on random good matches on free TV but good matches that actually have the build and setting to match are preferable and I think HBK crushes Eddie in that category-- I mean he's had more opportunities to deliver in those kind of matches so it's not really fair, but yeah. And it's not really fair doubly because "deafening crowds" kinda require those builds, but what can you do.
I also feel Shawn does better with guys that aren't on his level than Eddie does. Like Shawn's had pretty good matches with average big men like Crush in the past. Can't recall many times where I feel like Eddie's really had to carry people and done pretty well with it. Again, this may just be another case of "Shawn's had more opportunities" but yeah. -- I tried to have a fierce rivalry with SuperNiceDog, but he made me look worse than a GameFAQs Contest! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 01/07/12 9:34:00 PM #177: |
Right. This is purely a battle of match libraries. Debating which one is more talented is another matter entirely (and a debate in which I think Eddie probably wins).
Shawn got more of an opportunity to showcase his skills in lengthier matches, started doing so years before Eddie debuted in AAA, and kept doing so years after Eddie died. That gives him a huge edge. Sure, Shawn just skipped 4 years entirely there in the middle, but oddly enough that same timeframe is pretty much the low point in Eddie's career too. HBK may have 0 great matches between WM 14 and SS '02, but Eddie doesn't have more than a handful worth mentioning between New Year's Day '99 and ROH's debut show in Feb. '02. Like HBK, Eddie peaked in the mid-'90s and made an improbable 2002 comeback to add more peak years to his career no one thought he could achieve. -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://bryandanielson.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/photo3.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Tom Bombadil 01/07/12 9:34:00 PM #178: |
Random thought on the Jericho thing: Maybe it has to do with Cena somehow. We've had a lot of story of Cena and the dark/heel side, with people trying to corrupt him or get him to tap into that and LET HIS HEEL PERSONA SHINE THROUGH and stuff. And then Jericho who's been heel for a while shows up and does the opposite- goes completely overboard being a face. I doubt that is actually gonna have story significance, but it's an interesting mirror if nothing else.
-- KrahenProphet didn't teach me how to make random sigs. Meanie. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Panthera 01/07/12 9:36:00 PM #179: |
From: JaKyL25 | #177 This is exactly what I was thinking while reading over your discussion, Eddie is better overall but Michaels had more opportunities overall to show off his talents, and the gap between the two of them is small enough that such an edge will pretty much guarantee the win for whoever has it. -- Mistake you're making - overlooking the fact that we might not want to be saved. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Tom Bombadil 01/07/12 9:48:00 PM #180: |
and then the Hogan match
-- Jesus is spiffy! KrahenProphet is as well! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Lopen 01/07/12 9:48:00 PM #181: |
Yeah. In a perfect world I'm not so sure HBK is better in the ring, but dude's just had a lot more opportunities to deliver in big match environments and more opportunities to carry guys and he's been pretty good at delivering on those, so it's hard to argue that Eddie wins a battle of "who's has a better good match library." The only possible argument I can see for Eddie is if you vacuum out context of matches as if it didn't exist and only consider the great matches not the ones that are just "unexpectedly good" (although Shawn may beat him there still just on quantity/variety)
As for just talent in the ring I still think Shawn wins that (though it's actually debatable) just because I think Shawn performs better with guys that aren't particularly good than Eddie does, but again, he's had more chances to work with em in non-squash/filler match context, so that's not necessarily decisive. -- I tried to have a fierce rivalry with SuperNiceDog, but he made me look worse than a GameFAQs Contest! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 01/07/12 9:48:00 PM #182: |
From: Lopen | #176 Just to belabor this point, I think this is in large part due to the one area of talent where HBK outshines every other wrestler that ever lived: selling. Whether as a cocky heel who's finally getting the asskicking coming to him, or as the underdog babyface who has to survive the monster heel's brutality, no one was ever more entertaining receiving punishment than Shawn Michaels. EDIT: I should clarify. It's not JUST selling. I'm not saying that HBK's true calling in life should have been getting squashed on Wrestling Challenge every week. I mean selling as a storytelling device. -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://bryandanielson.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/photo3.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Lopen 01/07/12 9:52:00 PM #183: |
From: JaKyL25 | #180 Yeah that's probably a big reason if not the only reason, for sure. I'd rather watch Shawn vs Khali than Eddie vs Scott Norton, probably, just for seeing Shawn suffer ~THE BRAIN CHOP~ Then again I'm kind of a Khali fanboy if such things exist so that's not exactly fair. I would say Shawn vs Giant Gonzalez but uhhh I'm not sure I can say that in good conscience. -- I tried to have a fierce rivalry with SuperNiceDog, but he made me look worse than a GameFAQs Contest! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 01/07/12 9:54:00 PM #184: |
As far as more talented, I would vote for Eddie based on versatility.
I think he has more range as far as roles he excels at (cocky heel, cowardly heel, pure babyface, comedy face, and the "lie cheat and steal" babyface role that he more or less invented) than HBK does (underdog face, cocky heel...that's about it). I also think he adapts better to more styles. Eddie could do lucha, Japanese juniors, the WWE style, tag team, and the '90s American Indy style all perfectly. We only ever really got to see HBK work tag team and the WWE style, but even so I don't think he would translate well to some of those others. I think he found the perfect fit in WWE. -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://bryandanielson.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/photo3.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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voltch 01/07/12 10:00:00 PM #185: |
Who is this Eddie Guerrero you speak of?
-- Vote for this guy in every contest, our Guru champion: SuperNiceDog ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 01/07/12 10:01:00 PM #186: |
voltch, you will see him come into play in your topic soon as Chyna's new boyfriend.
-- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://bryandanielson.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/photo3.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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voltch 01/07/12 10:03:00 PM #187: |
What a loser then, shoulda gone after Miss Kitty.
-- Vote for this guy in every contest, our Guru champion: SuperNiceDog ... Copied to Clipboard!
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TheRock1525 01/07/12 10:04:00 PM #188: |
MAMACITA!
-- TheRock ~ Slow dramatic zoom-pan. Doesn't phase the hooded man. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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XIII_rocks 01/07/12 10:12:00 PM #189: |
Eddie's prom is coming up
-- XIII_rocks, the cream of XIII fanboyism. The guru champ isn't such a SuperNiceDog, he made me change my sig! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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SmartMuffin 01/07/12 10:13:00 PM #190: |
From: JaKyL25 | #186 Ugh, don't bother. That whole thing was like, cringingly bad. I'm p sure Shawn has never been a part of something so terrible! -- SmartMuffin - Because anything less would be uncivilized - http://img.imgcake.com/smartmuffin/barkleyjpgde.jpg http://dudewheresmyfreedom.com/ ... Copied to Clipboard!
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SmartMuffin 01/07/12 10:15:00 PM #191: |
From: JaKyL25 | #191 Hey, he was the only thing SAVING that from being really awful. Remember the commercial for the elimination chamber playset? -- SmartMuffin - Because anything less would be uncivilized - http://img.imgcake.com/smartmuffin/barkleyjpgde.jpg http://dudewheresmyfreedom.com/ ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 01/07/12 10:15:00 PM #192: |
From: SmartMuffin | #190 PG DX More specifically, Little People's Court -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://bryandanielson.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/photo3.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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voltch 01/07/12 10:15:00 PM #193: |
Funny how the WWF product got better once Shawn was no longer wrestling.
It's weird, but it worked. -- Vote for this guy in every contest, our Guru champion: SuperNiceDog ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 01/07/12 10:16:00 PM #194: |
From: voltch | #193 It didn't work so well the second time! -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://bryandanielson.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/photo3.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Lopen 01/07/12 10:26:00 PM #195: |
Yeah Eddie might be able to play more characters and more styles, but just like Shawn's talents might show through better cause he has more opportunities, I think Eddie has the edge there as far as opportunity goes. And I will say I'm more skeptical of Eddie's ability to carry big men like Shawn can than I am Shawn to play a cowardly heel (he's sorta done this as arrogant heel against the right opponents) or a comedy face (I'd argue he's already succeeded at this given how bad his material was with PG-DX and him making it almost work sometimes!)
-- I tried to have a fierce rivalry with SuperNiceDog, but he made me look worse than a GameFAQs Contest! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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voltch 01/07/12 10:29:00 PM #196: |
HBK doesn't impress me, like Bret Hart impressed me. Oh well he's out of the company now, can't wait to see what Stephanie's swerve leads to.
-- Vote for this guy in every contest, our Guru champion: SuperNiceDog ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Lopen 01/07/12 10:34:00 PM #197: |
I think the true goodness of Shawn's stuff shows better if you're watching more than just PPVs.
Like a lot of his "carry bad guys to watchable/good matches" stuff is from random Raws, and hype packages + what happened on the previous PPV can really only do so much for match builds. That's not to say even in that case it's typical that he wouldn't impress you without those things or anything... just saying, I think I'd like him a little less too, at least, if I came in after the fact. -- I tried to have a fierce rivalry with SuperNiceDog, but he made me look worse than a GameFAQs Contest! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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JaKyL25 01/07/12 10:43:00 PM #198: |
Well, voltch is also only just now getting to 2000. If you cut off Shawn's career at WM 14, never to return, Bret's resume beats Shawn's hands down.
Shawn became such a smarter worker post-comeback and really subtly re-invented his style to put on another 8 years of classics. Heck, I'd take 2002-2010 HBK over 1986-1998 HBK if they were two different people. -- Thank you, Eddie Guerrero. http://bryandanielson.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/photo3.jpg ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Lopen 01/07/12 10:56:00 PM #199: |
I think they were at least close but yeah I was in the Bret camp back then. Closer than "he doesn't impress me" anyway!
-- I tried to have a fierce rivalry with SuperNiceDog, but he made me look worse than a GameFAQs Contest! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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ScareChan 01/07/12 11:31:00 PM #200: |
So I was at my buddies place playing Heroscape for the first time and then he ended up going on reddit. There is a gif of Jericho's jacket which I'll try and find in a minute. They loved the gif and I explained what it was about. He said the only wrestler he has heard of is CM Punk because all his buddies mention him.
So Casuals definitely know about Punk -- Circle gets the Scare! Imagine if Jesus knew kung fu. That's what everyone is dealing with ... Copied to Clipboard!
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