Lurker > joe40001

Heartomaton posted...

Cope all you want, my dude.

It's legitimately strange to me how you think being obnoxious, me trusting you were being sincere, and then you going "haha, I was being obnoxious" in your mind reflects well on your character, and badly on mine.

Heartomaton posted...

*Mic drop.*

It's not really a mic drop. People @'d me, I assumed they were genuine, they weren't. I guess I was mistaken for assuming people would be more genuine.

Heartomaton posted...

I tagged you facetiously. I do not care what you have to say on the topic.

I believe you were tagging on behalf of MabusIncarnate.

Why would anybody pretend to like something?

Just politely be like "eh, not for me", right?

COVxy posted...

People were wanting to tag you facetiously. Nobody cares what you have to say on the topic.

Others are capable of speaking for themselves and don't need you to speak for them, thanks.

MabusIncarnate posted...

Why can't I tag joe numbers

Did you have any specific questions or other elements you would like me to respond to? Or is what I posted what you were looking for?

I think my cleaning person does a lot of the time. They come every 2 weeks.

No

Unless it is the policy of the establishment I am currently in. Which rarely happens these days, that said regardless of what I think is the most accurate data of the utility of the masks I do think businesses are allowed to chose their own policy and I would respect that policy.

I also don't judge or disapprove of those who still chose to wear masks even if I think the evidence is not on their side particularly due to the recent cochrane review:
https://www.cochranelibrary.com/cdsr/doi/10.1002/14651858.CD006207.pub6/full

But there has been far too much "I'M RIGHT AND EVERYBODY WHO DISAGREES WITH ME IS DUMB/EVIL." In this whole thing, and I don't believe in that mindset personally.

I do think an individual gets to pick that kind of thing. Generally I'd say the same thing is true for businesses, though I do dislike when I see things on tv or other environments where "the talent" doesn't wear a mask, but all the "help" staff does. That to me, IMO, cannot be based on any good faith scientific conclusion and to me feels like just icky shitty classism for classism's sake.

I've seen similar things elsewhere, where cleaning staff has to wear masks but the white collar employees don't. I don't like things like that.

But aside from that, I'm pretty live and let live on an individual level about other's choices around mask wearing.

I was all ready to condemn him because this headline to me made it sound like he altered data. Which is completely unacceptable.

Reading the relevant source material (people can correct me if I'm wrong) it seems like his major alteration was appending to the conclusion statement on page 3 of 8:
https://www.politico.com/f/?id=00000187-b36b-d739-a797-f3ef41e30000

Unless I am mistaken, what it sounds like is that he appended to the conclusion statement which already acknowledged a "slight increased risk for cardiac related mortality in the 28 days following vaccination."

He added a line acknowledging increased risk when stratified for age. While the magnitude of this risk is disputed, and indeed if the risk is relevant when compared to the risk of covid itself is also disputed, I do not believe anybody disputes that there has been observed an increased risk in this age demographic. I believe (and people can correct me if I am at all inaccurate) that such a risk is behind moves in the UK and other countries away from recommending boosters in such age groups.

The question then becomes is it in his authority to make such alterations? I sincerely do not know. I do not think anybody should go beyond their authority, and so if such alterations are things not appropriate for him to do as SG of Florida, I do disapprove of his actions and he should retract them.

Him representing the truth as best as he understands it as a representative of public health is his duty to his state and his people, and if he (or any government official) is not functioning in that capacity then they are not fulfilling their duty.

I think some people still get the wrong idea about me. I am about truth and data, I wish everybody who wants to turn public health into tribal politics should just step out. Science is having an open mind, challenging hypothesis, and going where the evidence based results take you.

The truth is not political, there are lots of data points that will get tribal republicans mad, there are lots of data points that will get tribal democrats mad. The important thing is to be honest about data.

Neo posted...

That is literally not how our government works.

Why in the holy mother of fuck do we need an explanation of health by the Department of Energy?!

The DoE actually oversees a fair amount of the biological research the US does. It is a pretty relevant agency.

Here's a few links:
https://science.osti.gov/ber
https://www.energy.gov/science/ber/biological-and-environmental-research
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_Genome_Institute (Under DoE)

And the quote from the NYT above:
"But many of the Energy Departments insights come from its network of national laboratories, some of which conduct biological research, rather than more traditional forms of intelligence like spy networks or communications intercepts."

Lizards posted...

It looks like an individual senator published a low confidence report generated by a third party and the topic title and first post's conclusion are misinformation

The first post does not contain any statements from myself, only one from the report itself. Its research and conclusions seem to be in keeping with both the FBI's and DoE conclusions. And it explores the pros and cons of all the most likely origins. (Page 14 of the summary).

I believe such information is relevant to "Current Events". And while I acknowledge that the lab leak as truth is not something we know at this time, even Fauci has acknowledged it as a possibility, and other agencies have acknowledged is as their most likely possibility. So sharing a very detailed investigation into all the origins (that explores all possibilities) is something that I believe could not reasonably be called misinformation but part of the relevant public discourse.

Neo posted...

Why is Congress handling the report? This stuff is supposed to be handled by HHS (or one of its child agencies).

I believe multiple agencies and groups are doing and have done independent investigations. There was the recent one from the department of energy:
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/02/26/us/politics/china-lab-leak-coronavirus-pandemic.html

The department of energy isn't as odd a choice as it might seem considering that they apparently oversee a lot of research labs including biomedical ones.

From NYT:
"But many of the Energy Departments insights come from its network of national laboratories, some of which conduct biological research, rather than more traditional forms of intelligence like spy networks or communications intercepts."

Personally I'm happy to have as many people looking into it as possible and being as thorough as possible.

...even if the person they are calling right-wing has never voted for a republican president?
Or call somebody MAGA even if they've vocally said they don't like/support Trump?
Like, isn't that so overtly false that it doesn't make sense to even say? Or is it just trolling?

This is a genuine question because I'm confused by this. I don't intend to engage in any back-and-forth in this topic, I just wanted to hear people's thoughts on this phenomenon.

RLM

I'm not taking the bait anymore.

I'm in a much healthier place mentally and emotionally and will no longer do the thing were I dignify people who lie and troll by arguing with them. There are much more important things than indulging in petty internet arguing.

As I said before:
joe40001 posted...

Investigating the origins of COVID-19 has nothing to do with political tribalism. It is about ensuring this never happens again.

There are plenty of other times and places where people can engage in such arguments. But here it is irrelevant. Here, all that is important is finding out how it happened and doing whatever it takes to prevent it happening again.

I know it is fashionable to be nihilistic, particularly on the internet, but I hope in this goal we can agree via our shared humanity.

If via investigation it came out it did leak from a lab and that literally everybody I like politically was the most responsible for it, I would be infinitely more happy that the truth came out and that there were changes and consequences that will hopefully prevent anything like this from happening again than I would be disappointed that "my political team" lost points. Again that kind of thing is irrelevant when compared to the scope of human suffering that came out because of the pandemic.

Political team sports and score keeping is NOTHING compared against the lives of 15 million people. And honestly, in this I will not even humor a debate.

Investigating the origins of COVID-19 has nothing to do with political tribalism. It is about ensuring this never happens again.

There are plenty of other times and places where people can engage in such arguments. But here it is irrelevant. Here, all that is important is finding out how it happened and doing whatever it takes to prevent it happening again.

I know it is fashionable to be nihilistic, particularly on the internet, but I hope in this goal we can agree via our shared humanity.

If via investigation it came out it did leak from a lab and that literally everybody I like politically was the most responsible for it, I would be infinitely more happy that the truth came out and that there were changes and consequences that will hopefully prevent anything like this from happening again than I would be disappointed that "my political team" lost points. Again that kind of thing is irrelevant when compared to the scope of human suffering that came out because of the pandemic.

Political team sports and score keeping is NOTHING compared against the lives of 15 million people. And honestly, in this I will not even humor a debate.

Tyranthraxus posted...

You haven't actually said why it matters. Shouldn't you be striving for the highest level of precautions ANYWAY? Do you think a Canadian research facility can be given exemptions on policy (in this hypothetical example) because it came from a Chinese lab? What's the point? All high risk research needs to have policy and audits regardless of who (if anyone) is responsible for the pandemic.

You should, but they don't. The current narrative is current lab and research procedures everywhere are sufficient. And even on the moderate or more probability that this leaked from a lab, it would seem that those procedures are decidedly insufficient. If there are no consequences and reforms due to this horrible tragedy, then it can very easily happen again.

I'm not singling out China, literally anywhere who is doing the kind of research needs to be audited for risks and safety. What happened and every person and decision that allowed it to happen needs to be investigated and likely prosecuted. I don't want to be a "big meanie" here, but if your decisions even accidentally played a big part in causing the deaths of 15 million people, you should probably lose your job and go to prison. People go to prison over involuntary manslaughter and reckless endangerment for much less.

Understanding the exact truth of what happened, and shining a major spotlight on it is going to do so much more to help us in the future than just going "meh, whatever the true origin is doesn't really matter". And I believe you know that.

If you knew somebody who died from a mechanical failure in their car would you really go "meh, whatever, I'm sure car companies are doing their best to be safe"? Or would you want it investigated?

Now take that and multiply it by 15 million.

I'm sorry, but frankly I find it near asinine to act like the investigation, prosecution, and spotlighting of the true origins of COVID-19 would do nothing to prevent the risk of it happening again in the future. It absolutely would, and I have to believe you must know this.

Tyranthraxus posted...

The truth of the origin doesn't really matter.

Sorry, but this is wrong.

The World Health Organization (WHO) has estimated that 15 million people have died in the COVID-19 pandemic during the first two years

Knowing how it happened allows us to try to prevent it from happening again. If you were ever part of the crowd scolding people for not wearing masks, or not getting boosters or whatever because such people were "causing deaths" (which I believe you were), then I would certainly hope you are principled enough to also hold to account anybody potentially involved in accidentally/negligently causing this entire thing in the first place.

If it leaked from a lab, then IMO it is incumbent on us out of respect for the 15 million dead, to hold to account those who allowed such an accident to happen and do literally everything we can to ensure it never happens again.

So, yes, the truth of the origin incredibly matters. If there is even a 10% chance it was caused by preventable risks or negligence we need to investigate/prosecute that thoroughly and ensure that it never ever happens again.

I know that's just my opinion, but I'd hardly stay that's much of a "hot take".

Full document:
https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/23780776-mwg-fdr-document-04-16-23

23 Page Summary:
https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/23780771-mwg-executive-summary-april-16-2023

Final paragraph of the summary document:
The preponderance of information supports the plausibility of an unintentional research-related incident that likely resulted from failures of biosafety containment during SARS-CoV-2 vaccine-related research. The identified underlying biosafety issues increased the likelihood that such containment failures were not immediately recognized. The possibility of unrecognized biocontainment breaches combined with SARS-CoV-2s clinical characteristics of asymptomatic and mild clinical illness in the majority of infections, likely confounded early recognition and containment of the initial outbreak. Such initial unrecognized infections could serve as the nidus of the outbreak of COVID-19 in Wuhan and is a plausible proximate cause of the pandemic.

Every year some site makes a big list, but when I search for it all I'm finding is short articles from mainstream newspapers and no big list of like every online april fools joke. Anybody have the link to the big list? Or at least a link to a pretty comprehensive list?

Over/under 70%?
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/5/3/8/AACZqoAAEG06.jpg

Arcanine2009 posted...

Nah it's not dying soon.

I will say that the previous twitter CEO had his employees spoiled as fuck though.

https://www.businessinsider.com/elon-musk-ends-many-twitter-perks-expenses-due-to-financial-situation-2022-11

Yeah, it seems like the employees didn't do much, wielded a lot of power, and also felt entitled to insane freebies.

https://www.businessinsider.com/elon-musk-twitter-free-lunch-scaled-back-2022-11

Those costs per serving can't be right. In any case, I work in tech, and I'm very grateful to be offered free soda and small snacks like kind bars. Nobody needs free expensive lunches each day.

For those who are interested, it's free to watch (with ads) online on the roku channel:
https://therokuchannel.roku.com/details/066097da82ed5762966888a59b151058/weird-the-al-yankovic-story

You might also be able to sign up for the roku channel to see it without ads, idk.