Lurker > KanzarisKelshen

And this is what Boko asked that I think he misconstrued.

boko - Today at 12:16 AM
okay
here's something i may have overlooked
will morrigan try to intercept discord parade on lightning? i'm asking to double check but i'm thinkin no since morrigan is already being targeted by the ability
like when ellie used ad lib

Kanzaris - Today at 12:19 AM
No
can't intercept if you're targeted

boko - Today at 12:19 AM
but Terra still can
because of weird woring, right
yeah cuz she intercpts anything to hit her team

Kanzaris - Today at 12:20 AM
yes

I was responding to the last line of his, and studiously avoided responding to the first. Boko has this habit of asking 'pilot the team for me' questions. That is not what my job as an admin is. My job is to answer rule questions, pure and simple, which I did right there. Literally the first thing said is 'you can't intercept if you're targeted'. The moral of this story is very simple: "Ask only what you need to ask, don't try to get greedy, make the fucking obvious plays because they fucking work, jesus christ". This was avoidable just by not targeting Terra.
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.

(I was asked one rules question about Interception effects, BTW - it was whether Morrigan would pop with her own ability if she targeted villains or neutrals and got redirected to Terra. My answer was 'yes'.)
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Gravy is correct. Terra can't intercept an ability that already targets her. Sorry boko.
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The actual issue isn't the one you're talking about. It's this.

The Olympic Charter indicates that in order to be accepted, a sport must be widely practiced by men in at least 75 countries and on four continents and by women in no fewer than 40 countries and on three continents.

I think only fighting games are played by women in no fewer than 40 countries, and even that one I wouldn't put money on...and fighting games kind of stumble due to the lack of a governing body (which other esports do meet - League of Legends is administered by Riot Games, which has international offices, for example). This is the true stumbling block for Esports entering the Olympics - the fact that they still are a young man's game, not a young woman's.
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Mobilezoid posted...

Yeah I played LoL a lot back in the day and I couldn't tell you what happened there

One guy's life bar went down, then the other guy died for some reason

I can only imagine what my grandmother watching the Olympics would think of it

It's a mirror match, one player is on the ropes (which is pretty easy to see) and then through a really, really fast sequence of smart decisions, manages to outplay an opponent that has a heavy advantage over him. Like the whole thing lasts what, 8-10 seconds? And in the process the other player is baited out of a safe position, attacked, the winning player manages to juke him into using his abilities wrong, and he moves with enough finesse to wait out the timer on one of his abilities to finish the job. This all comes at the very very end of a game, so after seeing how the mechanics work for about half an hour or so, you get to see someone put all the pieces together in breathtaking fashion, in exactly the same way lots of little outplays come together in something like Soccer to make a goal.

(In that particular match, if watched in full, the commentators explain pretty early that the character both players are using has an ability that causes a burst of delayed damage based on the damage dealt, so by the time you get there you realize what happened - by using clever movement, a clear-cut death was turned into a surprise kill, running down one timer after another very precisely. There wasn't any real room for error there, which makes it a play that in context is jump-out-of-your-seat-screaming good, hence the commentators absolutely losing their shit.)
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ViviffTheMobile posted...

Am eSports, do not want. Needs to get a bit more mainstream so we're not absolutely barbecued publicly for something like this. And I'm not sure I'd ever be ready to call someone playing LoL an "Olympic athlete".

If the level of play rises high enough that this becomes something that happens more than like, twice per year, I fully believe LoL will be ready for the olympics. This play is just as visually impressive as anything out of Soccer or Basketball, the problem is that it's too rare so it's hard to appreciate the amount of skill expression League can have.
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You missed Tetris TGM. I don't think LoL is necessarily timeless, and I'd have to watch some Rocket League to see if it stands up to the others, but the rest are pretty interesting choices.
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Gravy vs Boko is UNFROZEN.
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swordz9 posted...

KanzarisKelshen posted...

swordz9 posted...

KanzarisKelshen posted...

swordz9 posted...

Wha why? The Olympics should be for actual athletes....

How do you define athleticism without including mental exertion? It's kind of a big deal to know what move to make in every sport.

The video game part is almost nothing physical whatsoever. I think people would kind of feel the medals lost all value if they start awarding them to people sitting in a chair playing video games. The others at least have to intensely train their bodies. You can be 600 pounds and be a pro gamer

You actually kind of can't. Pro League of Legends and Starcraft players follow exercise regimens because you need to maintain your body in top condition to play, same for fighting games. Reflexes, rapid execution of motions, broad-spectrum vision...these are all needed characteristics to thrive in ESports. You know the term APM, Actions Per Minute, right? That's fundamentally not a mental metric. It's literally how many actions you can queue physically during any given minute of a match. There's a physical requirement to keep up the pace until the match is over or you just get rolled.

There's still a colossal difference between the guy aiming to be the best Olympic swimmer and the guy who can work the keyboard and mouse fastest. I don't care about the Olympics or esports, but I think they should stay divided. "I won an Olympic gold medal at age 16 playing League of Legends (will be something different by then)" is just all kinds of odd.

What is the colossal difference if both are practicing ten hours a day, following a regimented diet, doing tons of exercise, and studying their craft relentlessly in the pursuit of excellence? Particularly given both require physical proficiency and exertion? Is it purely the difference in swoleness?
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Gravy vs Boko is FROZEN. Again.
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swordz9 posted...

KanzarisKelshen posted...

swordz9 posted...

Wha why? The Olympics should be for actual athletes....

How do you define athleticism without including mental exertion? It's kind of a big deal to know what move to make in every sport.

The video game part is almost nothing physical whatsoever. I think people would kind of feel the medals lost all value if they start awarding them to people sitting in a chair playing video games. The others at least have to intensely train their bodies. You can be 600 pounds and be a pro gamer

You actually kind of can't. Pro League of Legends and Starcraft players follow exercise regimens because you need to maintain your body in top condition to play, same for fighting games. Reflexes, rapid execution of motions, broad-spectrum vision...these are all needed characteristics to thrive in ESports. You know the term APM, Actions Per Minute, right? That's fundamentally not a mental metric. It's literally how many actions you can queue physically during any given minute of a match. There's a physical requirement to keep up the pace until the match is over or you just get rolled.
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.

swordz9 posted...

Wha why? The Olympics should be for actual athletes....

How do you define athleticism without including mental exertion? It's kind of a big deal to know what move to make in every sport.
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Consequently, Smirk is the ability that Extends, not Mewtwo's clone army.
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Not stated earlier, but Ellie Smirks upon possessing Grigori.
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Gravy/Boko is UNFROZEN. Match continues as normal.
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Gravy vs Boko is FROZEN.
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Tira's dual personalities have a conflict before the battle starts, and Tira is distracted for the first 5 seconds of battle (Start of Battle).
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No Extend. Dark Samus isn't awesome enough :(
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Tira taunts one preselected enemy Merc at the start of the fight. Her screeching, annoying voice distracts them for the first 10 seconds of battle, and they will prioritize defeating her in battle. (Start of Battle).
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EXTEND! C'mon and join together!
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"One last performance...one last time!"

Grigori is possessed and brought over to Ellie's side!
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Tira may immediately use her Taken ability, even if it's on cooldown or hasn't been unlocked yet, without it going on recharge. If she chooses not to use the ability immediately, she may either up the upkeep limit on Taken by 2 this week or remove any remaining cooldown on Taken. (Pre-Battle).
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Wrex: Booker.

Booker: Wrex.
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https://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/8-gamefaqs-contests/75651723
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Lopen - Machina Maw (10-1, 138GP)
Low: Rikku (20/20 new, 15/15 char2), Kirby (UPGRADED), Tira (UPGRADED)
Mid: Yu Narukami (15/15 abil-v2), Liquid Snake (15/15 new), Bass.EXE (UPGRADED), Duke Nukem (10/10 new1, 15/15 new2)
High: KOS-MOS (20/20 new1, 7/13 new2), Urdnot Wrex (25/25 new), Donte (UPGRADED)
Supports: CATS (10/10 new1, 20/20 new2) (Link: Rikku), Taiga & Illya (20/20 new1, 20/20 new2) (Link: Yu Narukami)
Recharges: KOS-MOS (Calculation, 1 weeks), Rikku (Mix, 1 weeks, Steal, 2 weeks), Tira (J/G, 5 weeks), Kirby (J/G, 5 weeks), CATS (DESTRUCTION, 2 weeks), Wrex (Monsters, 3 weeks), Taiga & Illya (Install, 4 weeks)
Notes: Yu S-Links: Rikku (10), Tira (10), Bass.EXE (10), Kirby (10); Wrex: Booker (1), KOS-MOS is KO'd and Installed to Kirby

~ATTACKS (Low Tier)~

Tirofog - Ride The Lightning (5-6, 84GP)
Low: Sub-Zero (15/15 new3), Booker DeWitt (20/20 CAGE), Ryu3 (10/10 abil2), Nilin (UPGRADED)
Mid: Cloud Strife (20/20 new1), Terra Branford (10/10 abil2)
High: Archer (30/30 UBW), Lightning (15/15 abil1), Lilith (15/15 abil1, 10/15 new)
Supports: Professor Oak (15/15 abil, 15/15 new1) (Link: Nilin), Chrom (Link: Lightning), Yuffie Kisaragi (Link: Lightning)
Recharges: Archer (Drowning, 2 weeks), Cloud (..., 2 weeks), Lilith (Phase Strike, 2 weeks), Ryu3 (Accession, 2 weeks), Lightning (Pair Up, 2 weeks)
Notes: Cloud is Archer's master, Lilith is a Controller, Ryu3 genes: Pac-Man, Neptune, Thrall, Fetch, Armstrong, Grigori, Diablo, Damus, Geese, Crono, Kuja, Neclord, Kahn, Alice, Mega Man, Sorey, D.va, Knuckles; Memory Mix bans: Bass, Elma, Kain; Lilith is Cloud's waifu, Lightning has Master Emerald (1 week), Lightning pais up with Sub-Zero


=================


Gravy - Bossman Coolguy's Kingpins (11-0, 125GP)
Low: Eleonora Yumizuru (UPGRADED), Agnès Oblige (UPGRADED), Y'shtola (UPGRADED)
Mid: Sorey (UPGRADED), Kefka (UPGRADED), Flynn (UPGRADED), Mewtwo (UPGRADED), Terra (UPGRADED)
High: Shulk (UPGRADED), Dante (UPGRADED), The Agents (UPGRADED)
Supports: Dr. Light (Link: Dante) (UPGRADED)
Recharges: Y'shtola (Scion, 1 week), Kefka (Crown, 3 weeks), Agnes (...Unacceptable, 1 week), Ellie (Hour, 1 week), Shulk (Future, 5 weeks), Dante (Jackpot, 773 weeks)
Notes: Four Seraphim, Dante, Kefka and Terra are Sorey's Sub Lords, Agnès is a Black Mage, Agents Customs: Tank (1 week)

~ATTACKS (High Tier)~

Boko - Boko Reunited (10-1, 108GP)
Low: Nilin (10/10 abil2, 10/10 new), Tira (15/15 abil, 20/20 new1, 15/15 new2), Morrigan (5/5 abil, 10/10 char, 10/10 new), Poison (5/10 abil2)
Mid: Ansem (10/10 new1)
High: Lightning, Dark Samus (20/20 abil, 5/15 new), Grigori, Dizzy (20/20 abil2, 15/15 new), Kuja (20/20 abil, 20/20 new1)
Supports: Monokuma (Link: Lightning)
Recharges: Kuja (Invincible, 3 weeks), Damus (Corruption, 1 week), Ansem (Darkness, 8 weeks), Lightning (Servant, 1 week), Tira (Taken, 2 weeks)
Notes: Lightning has saved Serra's soul, Dizzy is Poison's client, Memory Remix has hit: The Agents, Flynn, Ellie; Damus seeds: None, Morrigan is Lightning's servant, Morrigan auto-has Enhancements and Hexes
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.

Nelson_Mandela posted...

Has there ever been a series that has been more irreparably damaged by its sequels?

Sonic
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The finger gun made me laugh though, that was great
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-1
-2
-3
-3

Not sure if the numbering scheme is a Rebels joke or just a goof. :P
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.

https://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/8-gamefaqs-contests/75648115
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.

Lopen - Machina Maw (10-1, 134GP)
Low: Rikku (20/20 new, 15/15 char2), Kirby (UPGRADED), Tira (UPGRADED)
Mid: Yu Narukami (15/15 abil-v2), Liquid Snake (15/15 new), Bass.EXE (UPGRADED), Duke Nukem (10/10 new1, 15/15 new2)
High: KOS-MOS (20/20 new1, 7/13 new2), Urdnot Wrex (25/25 new), Donte (UPGRADED)
Supports: CATS (10/10 new1, 20/20 new2) (Link: Rikku), Taiga & Illya (20/20 new1, 20/20 new2) (Link: Yu Narukami)
Recharges: KOS-MOS (Calculation, 1 weeks), Rikku (Mix, 1 weeks, Steal, 2 weeks), Tira (J/G, 5 weeks), Kirby (J/G, 5 weeks), CATS (DESTRUCTION, 2 weeks), Wrex (Monsters, 3 weeks)
Notes: Yu S-Links: Rikku (10), Tira (10), Bass.EXE (10), Kirby (10); Wrex: Booker (1)

~ATTACKS (Low Tier)~

Tirofog - Ride The Lightning (5-6, 84GP)
Low: Sub-Zero (15/15 new3), Booker DeWitt (20/20 CAGE), Ryu3 (10/10 abil2), Nilin (UPGRADED)
Mid: Cloud Strife (20/20 new1), Terra Branford (10/10 abil2)
High: Archer (30/30 UBW), Lightning (15/15 abil1), Lilith (15/15 abil1, 10/15 new)
Supports: Professor Oak (15/15 abil, 15/15 new1) (Link: Nilin), Chrom (Link: Lightning), Yuffie Kisaragi (Link: Lightning)
Recharges: Archer (Drowning, 2 weeks), Cloud (..., 2 weeks), Lilith (Phase Strike, 2 weeks), Ryu3 (Accession, 2 weeks)
Notes: Cloud is Archer's master, Lilith is a Controller, Ryu3 genes: Pac-Man, Neptune, Thrall, Fetch, Armstrong, Grigori, Diablo, Damus, Geese, Crono, Kuja, Neclord, Kahn, Alice, Mega Man, Sorey, D.va, Knuckles; Memory Mix bans: Bass, Elma, Kain; Lilith is Cloud's waifu, Lightning has Master Emerald (1 week)


=================


Gravy - Bossman Coolguy's Kingpins (11-0, 125GP)
Low: Eleonora Yumizuru (UPGRADED), Agnès Oblige (UPGRADED), Y'shtola (UPGRADED)
Mid: Sorey (UPGRADED), Kefka (UPGRADED), Flynn (UPGRADED), Mewtwo (UPGRADED), Terra (UPGRADED)
High: Shulk (UPGRADED), Dante (UPGRADED), The Agents (UPGRADED)
Supports: Dr. Light (Link: Dante) (UPGRADED)
Recharges: Y'shtola (Scion, 1 week), Kefka (Crown, 3 weeks), Agnes (...Unacceptable, 1 week), Ellie (Hour, 1 week), Shulk (Future, 5 weeks)
Notes: Four Seraphim, Dante, Kefka and Terra are Sorey's Sub Lords, Agnès is a Black Mage, Agents Customs: Tank (1 week)

~ATTACKS (High Tier)~

Boko - Boko Reunited (10-1, 108GP)
Low: Nilin (10/10 abil2, 10/10 new), Tira (15/15 abil, 20/20 new1, 15/15 new2), Morrigan (5/5 abil, 10/10 char, 10/10 new), Poison (5/10 abil2)
Mid: Ansem (10/10 new1)
High: Lightning, Dark Samus (20/20 abil, 5/15 new), Grigori, Dizzy (20/20 abil2, 15/15 new), Kuja (20/20 abil, 20/20 new1)
Supports: Monokuma (Link: Lightning)
Recharges: Kuja (Invincible, 3 weeks), Damus (Corruption, 1 week), Ansem (Darkness, 8 weeks), Lightning (Servant, 1 week), Tira (Taken, 2 weeks)
Notes: Lightning has saved Serra's soul, Dizzy is Poison's client, Memory Remix has hit: The Agents, Flynn, Ellie; Damus seeds: None, Morrigan is Lightning's servant, Morrigan auto-has Enhancements and Hexes
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.

Metal_DK posted...

KanzarisKelshen posted...

A) Western social biases say women are subservient, at the moment. It's actually not a fully realized thing, that whole 'equality' idea that people champion.

I wouldnt say that is just western social biases. Hell the west is less believing of this than anywhere else....

Maybe, but I don't know societies that aren't westernized very well, so I'd rather talk about what I know.
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no, but we've seen this across different societies and across different species.

Which does not imply causation. Every kind of animal establishes its own society, same as humanity. This doesn't make their decisions biologically rooted.

how does eradicating social biases achieve a better, more just one? it's our social bias that puts the value of happiness and of free will at the top of the list. it's our social bias that says we should treat women as equals, just as there are some societies out there who believe they should be subservient. the issue of parity is that it's in direct contradiction to free will and happiness: it's easy to achieve parity if everyone is assigned a job, it's easy to achieve parity if the only way to truly succeed is in very limited fields. when you expand both, parity decreases. that's what actually happens in real life. you can try to balance out any negative bias that may exist, you still end up with heavily skewed fields. what is it, Norway or Sweden that has the highest difference while also being among the most equal societies out there? and Norway is considered to be the happiest place on earth, where people have a tremendous amount of free will. balancing those two is the real issue, parity is the enemy of both.

A) Western social biases say women are subservient, at the moment. It's actually not a fully realized thing, that whole 'equality' idea that people champion.

B) Parity increasing with limitations on success is demonstrably false. Source: Free market in action. The more the opportunities of success are limited, the more parity decreases. This shouldn't need more elaboration, though I can go into more detail if you'd like.

C) Once again, correlation does not imply causation. Norway is the happiest place on earth. Does this mean it would be less happy with parity? No. We don't know that. Assuming the status quo is desirable is a trap you shouldn't fall into. You should question things more thoroughly.
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.

Wanglicious posted...

KanzarisKelshen posted...

Yes, but should that be the case? Like...the point isn't what is. The point is what should be, because that's what informs policy going forward.

i don't think we're talking about policy at all at this step.
this all seems to be philosophy and biology right now, not what a company should do. that's a different leap, the former helps us understand why men and women, when given freedom, choose the way they do. also this:

KanzarisKelshen posted...

If pursuing status is desirable then it should be desirable for women as well over being pretty or whatever else you think is their current paradigm. If it's undesirable for men then we should work to achieve parity on that as well.

is wrong.
parity is not the goal, happiness and free will is. parity should never be the goal.

i mean we seem to be in agreement that yes, men chase status. you can tie this to a biologic reference too, in most animals it's the male who needs to impress the female with their mating dance, song, etc. we haven't really figured a way around that but this is all the google guy's point when he says that right now, males are inflexible. nobody's making a big fuss asking for parity in any of those fields that are 55-92% female, why is it an issue when it's men?

the issue of status is likely one that isn't going to be easy to fix. it's a key aspect that still defines a man, made clear by it being a key aspect of what most women look for in a man. if they looked for different things, men would likely follow. to an extent we see that happening as more men take on traditionally female roles but this is really early still because money and power are the biggest driving forces.

The problem is that arguing 'biology' requires proving this. It's not proven. Can you think of a 'status' gene? Do we know of a coded specific brain response to seeing status? Do we have studies analyzing the response in women to increasing social status and seeing if it generates either arousal or desire? The answer is no. We actually don't know if status chasing isn't purely social yet.

And parity is a goal, Wang, because we're trying to eradicate social biases to achieve a better, more just society. Biases get in the way of maximizing happiness (obvious example: if everybody hates black people due to systemic racism, black people aren't gonna be happy). As for the answer to your question, the reason is that men face no difficulties in climbing in female-dominated areas. If you have any proof that say, male nurses are ridiculed, or even moreso that male teachers somehow do not thrive in academia, you're welcome to post sources. This is demonstrably not true in reverse. Society only has a finite amount of resources to allocate into correcting injustices. More systemic and deeply-embedded injustices like misogyny and racism get more attention than misandry because the latter has never really been enshrined into society, though corrective efforts on misandry do persist (abolishing the argument that single dads are worse than single moms, for example). This is just logical because you have to prioritize the issues that cause the most harm and solve them first. Lesser issues come second.
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.

pjbasis posted...

KanzarisKelshen posted...

pjbasis posted...

LapisLazuli posted...

How can discussion take place when you've got Vlado screaming that Liberals don't believe in gender and Seph saying being a Republican in New York deals with the same segregation as a black man in the 60s?

How do those things prevent discussion?

They're bad faith arguments. You can't talk to someone who refuses to be serious.

I guess I didn't read it as "how can you have a discussion with them." But that's even dumber then. Who cares about having arguments with people who aren't willing to argue? It shouldn't prevent discussion from happening.

You can't have arguments with a shitposter in the premises. It makes it hard to respond because it's like having a moron going 'OOGABOOGABOOGA' in your face IRL. Yes, you COULD have a serious conversation under such constraints, but not in practice.
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.

I never once said its not desirable for women. Its just more desirable for men.

Yes, but should that be the case? Like...the point isn't what is. The point is what should be, because that's what informs policy going forward.
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.

Metal_DK posted...

Everytime I bring it up I get yelled at, but I think the right acknowledges that a career is more important to a man's health than a career is for a woman's health. I have gotten in numerous arguments at holidays dinners/get togethers/etc about this. I argue that its because men pretty much get 2 options in this world: work or prison. Women, at least post WW2, get 3. Work, prison, stay at home mom/wife. There are very few women who will put up with a stay at home husband, and it has nothing to do with "once women have the "good" jobs they will!". As evidenced by (what i mentioned earlier that nobody read), that childless millennial women actually outearn men in just about every major city in the USA, and the same thing was the case for gen x women in their 20s/30s. Instead of women celebrating their new options of their success, left leaning sites write this:

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/3bj5yv/youre-single-because-there-arent-enough-men-253

This "manifesto" thing is honestly missing out the most key point. First off, plenty of women were coding (or doing the equivalent of) in the earliest days. It was only after it became the most profitable industry was when it became "male". Its because money was there. Men chase money. Why? Is it because we're greedy assholes? Maybe some of us sure. But a lot of it has to do with men have to define themselves through their work more than women have to.

Does it mean harass Leslie Jones on twitter? No. Does it mean vote for Trump? Nope. Defund planned parenthood? Another straw man. But i do think the left is lying to these men about this, and the one thing I agree with the manifesto on is that the male gender role is much less flexible, if at all. Its one of the only things I think the right understands more than the left.

And honestly, I think all those things (and gamergate too!) exist BECAUSE men are being lied to about this.

I actually hit upon this on page 1 bro. The problem is that this is the case but it doesn't necessarily have to be. If pursuing status is desirable then it should be desirable for women as well over being pretty or whatever else you think is their current paradigm. If it's undesirable for men then we should work to achieve parity on that as well. But you shouldn't just assume it's biotruths and roll with 'men work, women are pretty' and never waver from that.
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.

pjbasis posted...

LapisLazuli posted...

How can discussion take place when you've got Vlado screaming that Liberals don't believe in gender and Seph saying being a Republican in New York deals with the same segregation as a black man in the 60s?

How do those things prevent discussion?

They're bad faith arguments. You can't talk to someone who refuses to be serious.
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.

Gravy and Lopen, remember to pick Attacker or Defender too
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foolm0r0n posted...

I don't get why people are so eager to defend "the left" and "the right". I totally understand identifying with one or the other, but WHY is it so important that everyone agrees "your side" is right and just? They will often throw themselves under the bus just to defend "their team". It's so dumb.

Because tribalism
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Lopen (17 GP) > Tiro (NO BID)

Boko (16 GP) > Gravy (4 GP)

Boko selects LOW TIER.
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MenuWars posted...

Both sides are terrible at the feels thing, but the left is arguably based more upon feels than any other political party so I'm not entirely sure why Rock's taking this approach, other than to piss you off and make you feel like your enemy.

Feel.

Which is why you laugh at both parties and should seek their destruction, but y'know, this is a bit of a revolutionary concept to consider.
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.

Vlado posted...

lmao, are you serious? There have been countless sources disproving this myth now. You're way behind the times. Time to let go.
https://archive.fo/ndct5

It's funny to watch people who jumped on the "political correctness" train AFTER it became clear it was heading right off the edge of a cliff. :)

Moreover, even if the bulk of the BBC’s 9,000 female employees are not underpaid relative to their male colleagues, the list does suggest a problem among the broadcaster’s top brass. That pattern is fairly common. Pay gaps between men and women in the same roles at the same employers are narrow across Europe for 15 of the 16 job levels in Korn Ferry’s database—but the highest one is the exception. In Spain and Germany, top-ranking women make 15-20% less than similarly high-flying men.

(Graph above this quote in the article: shows off pay gaps, which steadily increase as you rise up the ranks and then go ultramassive at the executive level)

You should actually read what you quote, Vlado. Data means something and you should learn to interpret it.
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Vlado posted...

KanzarisKelshen posted...

This is dogwhistling for saying 'blacks and hispanics are dumber than whites and asians'. Source: I literally just had a conversation like four hours ago with a guy who I thought was my friend who revealed he was a Nazi, who used exactly this fucking argument in favor of why every ethnicity except european whites and northeast asians should be sterilized and stopped from breeding. So, y'know, this kinda stuff should always be questioned, thoroughly explored, sourced, and if debunked, people who champion it should be laughed out of the room. It's not super healthy to let these kinds of statements go unchallenged.

lmao, using a probably fabricated anecdote to justify anything.

Nobody sane believes group statistics apply to every single individual in the group. Least of all, the author of the original article.

Feels nice when I get to bury your face in the dirt by using quotes from the piece you like so much just preemptively. You're so predictable I crafted a response incidentally just by wanting to make sure better people than you who didn't look at this piece more closely didn't get suckered by it.
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.

And one more for the road before I go to sleep:

Yes, in a national aggregate, women have lower salaries than men for a variety of reasons. For the same work though, women get paid just as much as men. Considering women spend more money than men and that salary represents how much the employees sacrifices (e.g. more hours, stress, and danger), we really need to rethink our stereotypes around power.

Read this bit. Like, actually, properly read it. It's saying 'women make less money than men. In spite of this, women get paid just as much as men for the same jobs'. The subtle implication here is that women aren't doing the same jobs as men and that is why they're making less money. This is demonstrably false. The wage gap exists and women do, in fact make less money than men for the same jobs. Took me five minutes of googling to find an example in exactly google's area, tech:

https://www.glassdoor.com/research/studies/gender-pay-gap/

You see why this piece is a bunch of nonsense? It doesn't stand up to scientific scrutiny, and it makes tons of false assumptions conforming to the writer's biases. Dude is stuck in his own personal lalaland instead of reality.
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.

Oh, fun fact BTW, picking out a line because it stands out to me:

the Left tends to deny science concerning biological differences between people (e.g., IQ[8] and sex differences).

This is dogwhistling for saying 'blacks and hispanics are dumber than whites and asians'. Source: I literally just had a conversation like four hours ago with a guy who I thought was my friend who revealed he was a Nazi, who used exactly this fucking argument in favor of why every ethnicity except european whites and northeast asians should be sterilized and stopped from breeding. So, y'know, this kinda stuff should always be questioned, thoroughly explored, sourced, and if debunked, people who champion it should be laughed out of the room. It's not super healthy to let these kinds of statements go unchallenged.
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.

WhoopsyDaisy posted...

Sure but this article didn't have any factual inaccuracies or anything so it's not really "debunkable" in the way that it might otherwise be.

Actually, it does. It has a severe case of opinion-as-facts. Example:

Men’s higher drive for status

We always ask why we don’t see women in top leadership positions, but we never ask why we see so many men in these jobs. These positions often require long, stressful hours that may not be worth it if you want a balanced and fulfilling life. Status is the primary metric that men are judged on[4], pushing many men into these higher paying, less satisfying jobs for the status that they entail. Note, the same forces that lead men into high pay/high stress jobs in tech and leadership cause men to take undesirable and dangerous jobs like coal mining, garbage collection, and firefighting, and suffer 93% of work-related deaths.

Just a quick set of notes from reading this over:

-Unstated assumption that the percentage of women with capacity to bear the burden of leadership is severely inferior to men, as a primary cause for a lack of women leaders (note the absence of any sources indicating that the number of leadership-capable women is sensibly inferior to the number of men, as opposed to any amount of societal biases).
-Unstated assumption that status not being the primary metric that women are judged on is a desirable thing, and that we should not work to change that.
-Unstated assumption leadership is hard, unrewarding and unsatisfactory. I have to sleep now but ping me in like 8-10 hours if you can and I'll look for studies debunking this. Generally speaking, people who climb to leadership positions don't despise their jobs, because you need a certain temperament that relishes in organizing people to be noticed as leader material in the first place. Nobody assigns leadership by seeing who gets the shortest straw, leaders are a self-selecting population for the most part.

Three unstated assumptions indicating the writer's biases, which he takes as gospel, in just a single paragraph. You see the problem here? It's one thing to act like your opinion is correct but invite challenges (this is in fact a common method of inciting serious debate in learned circles, with a longstanding history in academia). It's another to act like your opinion is correct and want the world to change to suit it without properly justifying it. This is more the latter than the former. The whole memo is like that.
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.

MariaTaylor posted...

interesting read. just finished it.

also it's an opinion piece. how can it be debunked? are you saying someone went through and proved that he doesn't actually believe all of the statements he typed out there? each of them? one by one? must have taken a lot of work.

Opinions can be wrong. It's always cute to say they can't be, but also mistaken because fundamentally, an opinion is a personal appraisal of a given fact or set of facts. If the facts you're opining on do not exist (ie they aren't true) or your opinion contradicts reality (every instance of assuming correlation implies causation, for example), your opinion is in fact wrong (or if you'd prefer, invalid and unworthy of being heard because it's as valuable to other people as a delusion). Opinions aren't voiced just to hear the sound of your own voice, they are voiced to advance a discussion with worthwhile observation, and from a more selfish point of view to acquire respect off of their perceived value to listeners. Thus if you cannot in fact provide something valuable to the discussion, your opinion is wrong.
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.

Pre-bids standings. No EXP assigned yet. As always, check for errors.



Lopen - Machina Maw (10-1, 151GP)
Low: Rikku (20/20 new, 15/15 char2), Kirby (UPGRADED), Tira (UPGRADED)
Mid: Yu Narukami (15/15 abil-v2), Liquid Snake (15/15 new), Bass.EXE (UPGRADED), Duke Nukem (8/10 new1, 10/15 new2)
High: KOS-MOS (20/20 new1), Urdnot Wrex (25/25 new), Donte (UPGRADED)
Supports: CATS (10/10 new1, 20/20 new2) (Link: Rikku), Taiga & Illya (20/20 new1, 20/20 new2) (Link: Yu Narukami)
Recharges: KOS-MOS (Calculation, 1 weeks), Rikku (Mix, 1 weeks, Steal, 2 weeks), Tira (J/G, 5 weeks), Kirby (J/G, 5 weeks), CATS (DESTRUCTION, 2 weeks), Wrex (Monsters, 3 weeks)
Notes: Yu S-Links: Rikku (10), Tira (10), Bass.EXE (10), Kirby (10); Wrex: Booker (1)

~VS~

Tirofog - Ride The Lightning (5-6, 84GP)
Low: Sub-Zero (5/15 new3), Booker DeWitt (20/20 CAGE), Ryu3 (10/10 abil2), Nilin (UPGRADED)
Mid: Cloud Strife (20/20 new1), Terra Branford (10/10 abil2)
High: Archer (30/30 UBW), Lightning (15/15 abil1), Lilith (15/15 abil1, 10/15 new)
Supports: Professor Oak (15/15 abil, 15/15 new1) (Link: Nilin), Chrom (Link: Lightning), Yuffie Kisaragi (Link: Lightning)
Recharges: Archer (Drowning, 2 weeks), Cloud (..., 2 weeks), Lilith (Phase Strike, 2 weeks), Ryu3 (Accession, 2 weeks)
Notes: Cloud is Archer's master, Lilith is a Controller, Ryu3 genes: Pac-Man, Neptune, Thrall, Fetch, Armstrong, Grigori, Diablo, Damus, Geese, Crono, Kuja, Neclord, Kahn, Alice, Mega Man, Sorey, D.va, Knuckles; Memory Mix bans: Bass, Elma, Kain; Lilith is Cloud's waifu, Lightning has Master Emerald (1 week)


=================


Gravy - Bossman Coolguy's Kingpins (11-0, 125GP)
Low: Eleonora Yumizuru (UPGRADED), Agnès Oblige (UPGRADED), Y'shtola (UPGRADED)
Mid: Sorey (UPGRADED), Kefka (UPGRADED), Flynn (UPGRADED), Mewtwo (UPGRADED), Terra (UPGRADED)
High: Shulk (UPGRADED), Dante (UPGRADED), The Agents (UPGRADED)
Supports: Dr. Light (Link: Dante)
Recharges: Y'shtola (Scion, 1 week), Kefka (Crown, 3 weeks), Agnes (...Unacceptable, 1 week), Ellie (Hour, 1 week)
Notes: Four Seraphim, Dante, Kefka and Terra are Sorey's Sub Lords, Agnès is a Black Mage, Agents Customs: Tank (1 week)

~VS~

Boko - Boko Reunited (10-1, 124GP)
Low: Nilin (10/10 abil2, 10/10 new), Tira (15/15 abil, 20/20 new1, 15/15 new2), Morrigan (5/5 abil, 10/10 char), Poison (5/10 abil2)
Mid: Ansem (10/10 new1)
High: Lightning, Dark Samus (20/20 abil, 5/15 new), Grigori, Dizzy (20/20 abil2, 15/15 new), Kuja (20/20 abil, 20/20 new1)
Supports: Monokuma (Link: Lightning)
Recharges: Kuja (Invincible, 3 weeks), Damus (Corruption, 1 week), Ansem (Darkness, 8 weeks), Lightning (Servant, 1 week)
Notes: Lightning has saved Serra's soul, Dizzy is Poison's client, Memory Remix has hit: The Agents, Flynn, Ellie; Damus seeds: None, Morrigan is Lightning's servant, Morrigan auto-has Enhancements and Hexes
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.

No matches were held this week.

Welcome back, everyone. Let's bring this game home.

Bids for tier are due 12 hours from now. In case you forgot, the matches are Lopen/Tirofog and Gravy/Boko for each pool's finals. Assign EXP here, too.
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Shine on, you crazy diamond.