Current Events > Persona 4 is better than 5

(+) Yeah! (+)

Respectfully disagree. I prefer P5s dungeon designs, OST, and story far more than P4s.

As for characters, I kinda lean a little towards 5s cast more because I like Joker way more than Yu and there are a couple characters in 5 that I really like over 4s cast as a whole (Akechi, Ryuji, Futaba, Yusuke, Sojiro and Kawakami if were including non playable characters, and again Joker); but P4s cast was still enjoyable nonetheless. Kanji was awesome. So was Dojima and Nanako.

Edit: I wanted to add that I love both games P4 will always hold a special place for being the first Persona game I ever finished.

Story: 3 > 5> 4
Gamplay: 5 > 4 > 3
Characters: 3 > 5 > 4

Story: 3 > 4 > 5
Gameplay: 5 > 4 > 3
Character: 3 > 4 > 5

Story: 4 > 5 > 3
Gameplay: 5 > 4 > 3
Character: 4 > 5 > 3

Overall: 4 > 5 > 3

SugarFlakes posted...

Respectfully disagree. I prefer P5s dungeon designs, OST, and story far more than P4s.

As for characters, I kinda lean a little towards 5s cast more because I like Joker way more than Yu and there are a couple characters in 5 that I really like over 4s cast as a whole (Akechi, Ryuji, Futaba, Yusuke, Sojiro and Kawakami if were including non playable characters, and again Joker); but P4s cast was still enjoyable nonetheless. Kanji was awesome. So was Dojima and Nanako.

Edit: I wanted to add that I love both games P4 will always hold a special place for being the first Persona game I ever finished.

Thats fair. Gameplay wise, I agree P5 is better, its just the starting and stopping and constant interruptions that start to irritate me after a while.

As for characters, there are definitely some I love in 5, Ryuji and sojiro especially, but 4s just feel very down to earth and relatable for me. I also like how 4s social links are mostly just running into random ass people and bonding with them over random stuff, compared to 5 where all social links revolve around the thieves eventually somehow

NoxObscuras posted...

Since we're talking about Chie... Chie was my favorite character in vanilla Persona 4. Tracey Rooney just had such a calm, soothing voice. Not a fan of the new VA in Golden, even if she fits the character more.

Dude, I loved Chies older VA so much more. Her current VA brings Chie down so much for me.

Gameplay and style wise, Persona 5 shits all over Persona 4. Setting, story, and characters all go to Persona 4.

I think its pretty hard to rank these games tbh. Id say they all do different things better in their own ways. For me, atmosphere is what tends to suck me into games more than anything else, and I think thats what specifically draws me into 4, as I LOVE the atmosphere it has.

I feel like it struck a perfect balance of wistfulness and melancholy. The times youre spending with the cast is fun, but theres always just a tinge of emotion that i love.

Agreed.

having played 3 fes, the only thing i liked about it was the music. i'm not into it's miserable vibe and cast, the uncontrollable party members is all time bad, and it has one fucking dungeon.

hopefully with the remake i can finally like it.

love both 4 and 5 and don't have a horse in the race in which is considered better.

Alucard188 posted...

Gameplay and style wise, Persona 5 shits all over Persona 4. Setting, story, and characters all go to Persona 4.

Persona 5s aesthetic is fantastic. Persona 4s is enjoyable, but 5 definitely knocked it out of the park.

pauIie posted...

having played 3 fes, the only thing i liked about it was the music. i'm not into it's miserable vibe and cast, the uncontrollable party members is all time bad, and it has one fucking dungeon.

hopefully with the remake i can finally like it.

love both 4 and 5 and don't have a horse in the race in which is considered better.

I only made it partway through 3 portable, and im also now waiting for the remake. Out of the modern trilogy, its definitely the hardest to go back to for me, which is understandable.

ssb_yunglink2 posted...

Thats fair. Gameplay wise, I agree P5 is better, its just the starting and stopping and constant interruptions that start to irritate me after a while.

As for characters, there are definitely some I love in 5, Ryuji and sojiro especially, but 4s just feel very down to earth and relatable for me. I also like how 4s social links are mostly just running into random ass people and bonding with them over random stuff, compared to 5 where all social links revolve around the thieves eventually somehow

Yeah I definitely agree that P4 feels more down to earth. That was what initially drew me into it. The cast also had better chemistry as a whole which makes sense because they lived in a small town together. Their relationship was already pre established for the most part; at least more so than P5s where if Im not mistaken, the only characters that kind of had history before the games events were Ryuji and Ann.

In contrast, P5 felt, I wanna say over the top, compared to P4s down to earth tone. Which I also enjoyed. I thought it was fun. It boils down to preference but Im not gonna lie, I like them both

SugarFlakes posted...

Yeah I definitely agree that P4 feels more down to earth. That was what initially drew me into it. The cast also had better chemistry as a whole which makes sense because they lived in a small town together. Their relationship was already pre established for the most part; at least more so than P5s where if Im not mistaken, the only characters that kind of had history before the games events were Ryuji and Ann.

In contrast, P5 felt, I wanna say over the top, compared to P4s down to earth tone. Which I also enjoyed. I thought it was fun. It boils down to preference but Im not gonna lie, I like them both

I think I like the beginning of 5 so much because at the start it WAS down to earth. It doesnt really get over the top crazy until further in

Alucard188 posted...

Gameplay and style wise, Persona 5 shits all over Persona 4. Setting, story, and characters all go to Persona 4.

I can see why people say this for style (even if I disagree), but I don't see the gameplay as being significantly different between the two.

PMarth2002 posted...

I can see why people say this for style (even if I disagree), but I don't see the gameplay as being significantly different between the two.

I take gameplay to also mean dungeons and general quality of life, which id generally agree are better in 5.

PMarth2002 posted...

I can see why people say this for style (even if I disagree), but I don't see the gameplay as being significantly different between the two.

When I say gameplay I usually include dungeons in that and I prefer P5s over P3 and P4s in every way. Its what makes it easier for me to replay P5 over them.

If I were to rank dungeons itd be P5 >>>>P4 >>>>>>>P3

Tarturas made me quit P3 along with the automatic AI party members. And that was my first Persona game.

SugarFlakes posted...

When I say gameplay I usually include dungeons in that and I prefer P5s over P3 and P4s in every way. Its what makes it easier for me to replay P5 over them.

If I were to rank dungeons itd be P5 >>>>P4 >>>>>>>P3

Tarturas made me quit P3 along with the automatic AI party members. And that was my first Persona game.

That's fair I guess. P4 hits all the right notes for me personally. At around 10 floors each, they don't overstay their welcome like Tartarus.

I don't really find P5's dungeons to be better than P4's. They're an upgrade visually, but the puzzles aren't particularly interesting (especially on a replay), and I actually find not being able to hide from shadows and guarantee an ambush to offer more tension sometimes.

I do find that Persona 5's places were mostly all more personal.

for Futaba it was dealing with her own mother, for Haku it was dealing with her abusive fiance and father even if you just met her, and Shido had a far more personal connection to Joker then the previous games central bad guy had, for sure more then 3. I don't know, I feel like the cast in 5 did a lot together to and felt more friendly then 4's group spending half the time trying to kill each other with bad cooking.

PMarth2002 posted...

That's fair I guess. P4 hits all the right notes for me personally. At around 10 floors each, they don't overstay their welcome like Tartarus.

I don't really find P5's dungeons to be better than P4's. They're an upgrade visually, but the puzzles aren't particularly interesting (especially on a replay), and I actually find not being able to hide from shadows and guarantee an ambush to offer more tension sometimes.

Oh yeah, I definitely agree with you here. It also helps that each dungeon has its own theme and setting that represents that particular character. Theyre a little more meaningful. It makes it feel less monotonous than Tarturas.

What I like about P5s dungeons is that theyre slightly more interactive and dynamic compared to the others. Hoping around places. Using the hook shot to find Will Seeds. And the puzzles themselves arent groundbreaking or anything by any means but theyre still fun to do (imo) on replays. I hope that P6 onwards builds on this dungeon style further.

But its to each their own though.

Necronmon posted...

I do find that Persona 5's places were mostly all more personal.

for Futaba it was dealing with her own mother, for Haku it was dealing with her abusive fiance and father even if you just met her, and Shido had a far more personal connection to Joker then the previous games central bad guy had, for sure more then 3. I don't know, I feel like the cast in 5 did a lot together too and felt more friendly than 4's group spending half the time trying to kill each other with bad cooking.

ehh, i disagree that the 5 cast felt more friendly. Sure theyre all YOUR friend, but the chemistry between members is definitely lacking at times for me. 4 did a great job making the characters interact with each other.

For instance, theres a moment early on where you go to Junes with Kou and Daisuke, and Kou mentions that he thinks Yosuke is pretty funny and should join the group to hang sometime. A bit later, theres a hangout with Kou and Daisuke and Yosuke tags along, which makes the characters feel like they actually do stuff together in their free time.

People saying Makoto ruins the chemistry, but Haru feels like an unnecessary addition to the party. Well combat wise she covers the psy element, but that element is also an unnecessary addition.

I think it also kind of helps p4s social links that a lot of them really dont have anything to do with the main story. I kind of got tired of anticipating when the link would eventually turn into revolving around the phantom thieves instead of just hanging out with people

Ricemills posted...

People saying Makoto ruins the chemistry, but Haru feels like an unnecessary addition to the party. Well combat wise she covers the psy element, but that element is also an unnecessary addition.

She definitely just kind of shows up and then doesnt really do anything noteworthy after her dungeon.

Based on the early teasers it feels like they designed a certain amount of characters and then didn't have enough days in the calendar to give them all spotlight, and the one with the short end of the stick happened to end up Haru.

I actually thought maybe Akechi would be a red herring and Haru was a traitor because the way what happens to her family rolls off her and doesn't effect her relationship with the others seemed unnatural. Instead she's at peace with it because she knew it was a possibility when they did the change of heart, but it felt like a plot thread that could've used more examination when it's a character's dad dying during the game partly due to their actions

Doe posted...

Based on the early teasers it feels like they designed a certain amount of characters and then didn't have enough days in the calendar to give them all spotlight, and the one with the short end of the stick happened to end up Haru.

And they even cut Hifumi from being a member of the troupe into becoming a confidant.

I actually thought maybe Akechi would be a red herring and Haru was a traitor because the way what happens to her family rolls off her and doesn't effect her relationship with the others seemed unnatural. Instead she's at peace with it because she knew it was a possibility when they did the change of heart, but it felt like a plot thread that could've used more examination when it's a character's dad dying during the game partly due to their actions

Wasn't the original idea is that the traitor is randomized, and everyone has their own reason to betray the team? But they ended up fixed it on a single character.

I also liked P4 more than P5. I dont really remember what P3 was like since I played it so long ago. Only that I like Elizabeth and Battle Hymn of the Soul in BBTAG :3

I think it also kind of helps p4s social links that a lot of them really dont have anything to do with the main story. I kind of got tired of anticipating when the link would eventually turn into revolving around the phantom thieves instead of just hanging out with people

I realized 5 had a lot less of the social links being fellow students...but I was glad it was not just random and liked that the social links were related to the overall mission instead of just randomness.

Haru was without a doubt the weakest link...wish we had Hifumi as a party member over here.

Ricemills posted...

And they even cut Hifumi from being a member of the troupe into becoming a confidant.

PMarth2002 posted...

That one was just a false rumor iirc

There's a grain of truth of that got blown up by the internet. Her concept art was imagined as a main character very early on. The personality of the Hifumi as known in the game was never considered as a protagonist though
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/6/7/7/AAcZIZAAE1P1.jpg

NoxObscuras posted...

but he's completely disconnected from the main narrative.

This just isn't true, but I get why he feels tacked on.

Yadlabaoth came about in response to humanity's ambivalence. The Thieves represent free will against order and control.

Dr. Maruki wanted to create a utopia by stripping away problems people might run into, without thinking about how overcoming those problems make you smarter and stronger. That other side of the Yaldabaoth coin, he also intended on taking away free will, just for the sake of good, not evil.

Also, outside of the antagonist plot threads, I'll say this:

They're both amazing, but P5/R is the definitive Persona experience. My first ever playthrough of 5 (vanilla) was one of the only times I never wanted a game to end. And, for those initiated, you know it basically doesn't lmao.

4 is amazing, and has it's own strengths, but it's older characterization means it's themes feel a little incongruous to me in today's day and age. Just a product of the time I guess. I love all these characters, but in terms of raw gameplay Royal is the better deal by a landslide.

Edit:

Yukiko > Rise > Naoto = Chie > the rest

Doe posted...

Based on the early teasers it feels like they designed a certain amount of characters and then didn't have enough days in the calendar to give them all spotlight, and the one with the short end of the stick happened to end up Haru.

I actually thought maybe Akechi would be a red herring and Haru was a traitor because the way what happens to her family rolls off her and doesn't affect her relationship with the others seemed unnatural. Instead she's at peace with it because she knew it was a possibility when they did the change of heart, but it felt like a plot thread that could've used more examination when it's a character's dad dying during the game partly due to their actions

I think itd be really interesting if your choices in the story and social links could actually change who the traitor was. Like maybe you say the wrong things to someone and it gives them reason to betray you

ssb_yunglink2 posted...

I think itd be really interesting if your choices in the story and social links could actually change who the traitor was. Like maybe you say the wrong things to someone and it gives them reason to betray you

The only problem I see is people would want a perfect playthrough where you don't give anybody reason to betray you or else people might say it feels forced

Doe posted...

The only problem I see is people would want a perfect playthrough where you don't give anybody reason to betray you or else people might say it feels forced

It would require some really strong writing to pull off for sure. Or maybe have a perfect playthrough only doable on ng+?

Necronmon posted...

I realized 5 had a lot less of the social links being fellow students...but I was glad it was not just random and liked that the social links were related to the overall mission instead of just randomness.

Haru was without a doubt the weakest link...wish we had Hifumi as a party member over here.

I can see preferring the social links to have more of a centered purpose than just being random. I just happen to like that all of Yus people really bond over things they do with each other, even if its totally random. It makes it convincing that these are people who would actually hang out in real life

Doe posted...

The only problem I see is people would want a perfect playthrough where you don't give anybody reason to betray you or else people might say it feels forced

ssb_yunglink2 posted...

I think itd be really interesting if your choices in the story and social links could actually change who the traitor was. Like maybe you say the wrong things to someone and it gives them reason to betray you

While interesting, this is likely too many branching paths for a game like persona. The social links already don't really affect the main plot for a reason.

ssb_yunglink2 posted...

I can see preferring the social links to have more of a centered purpose than just being random. I just happen to like that all of Yus people really bond over things they do with each other, even if its totally random. It makes it convincing that these are people who would actually hang out in real life

I think it's interesting how different the games' approach to the social links is. I don't have it in front of me now but in the P3 artbook Hashino and Soejima kind of discuss what they were thinking when designing social links, and in their answers you see a sort of belief they express that human relationships are often built on opportunistic grounds where both parties think they'll benefit from the other.

With that in mind, you see how all of P3MC's social links don't seem particularly genuine. Especially compared to P4 and P5's. P3MC kind of just follows people around, tells them everything they want to hear even when they're obviously making mistakes, and repeat until the social link person makes their way to the climax of their own story and learns their lesson. You have almost no active participation in their character growth - basically just letting people vent to you and agreeing with them. Like when Hidetoshi's freaking out about cigarettes and dress codes, the best answers in the beginning of the Slink is like "Yeah bro this is some serious shit we gotta crack down". Then after Hidetoshi realizes in the end that he was power-tripping you're like "Yeah bro this shit was never that serious. Don't beat yourself up too bad about being so psychotic and stuff". All the slinks are kinda like that. Personally I think it kind of gives the air that, just as the player knows that social links make your Personas stronger, MC himself also knows it'll be beneficial if he kind of manipulates people into liking him.

P4MC in comparison comes across as genuinely trying to help everyone with their problems and taking an active role in doing so. The way a lot of the links start is more natural and the dialogue answers and things the MC does with the person are more than just being a yes-man.

In P5 obviously all of the social links have secondary dungeon-crawling uses. And you get a vibe that P5MC is like "This person might be strategically useful. Maybe we can help each other out here." and then inevitably P5MC also ends up helping them by the changing the heart of someone close to them too. And maybe along the way P5MC also developed a real friendship with someone who was initially just a useful partner, but the beginning of the friendship was always opportunistic.

Persona 5 is too loud

yusuke sucks

ironman2009 posted...

yusuke sucks

morgana is worse teddie

ssb_yunglink2 posted...

morgana is worse teddie

that is definitely true. teddie clears morgana by miles.

Teddie is more grating than morgana.

Kloe_Rinz posted...

Teddie is more grating than morgana.

Teddie doesn't stop you from playing the game

Kloe_Rinz posted...

Teddie is more grating than morgana.

Teddie and Morgana have roughly the same arc, with wanting to be accepted as more than just some weird creature things and getting angsty about it, but morganas angst moment is probably the worst stretch of the entire game.

Morgana also acts like he knows everything while Teddie at least understands thats hes an idiot

I also lol at every time Yu is standing in the hall and all of the school social links march up to him one by one to ask him to hangout after school haha.

ssb_yunglink2 posted...

I also lol at every time Yu is standing in the hall and all of the school social links march up to him one by one to ask him to hangout after school haha.

Same with 3, isn't it?
Well 4 has the excuse that it was in the boons and people rarely have mobile phones.

Ricemills posted...

Same with 3, isn't it?
Well 4 has the excuse that it was in the boons and people rarely have mobile phones.

I only partially played 3 portable a while ago, so yeah it could be the same there. I just think its funny that like half the population of this school is fiending for this mans attention lmao

ssb_yunglink2 posted...

morgana is worse teddie

Teddies hits on a 4 year old, and tries to rip the swimsuits off teenagers

Teddie sucks

Same with 3, isn't it?
Well 4 has the excuse that it was in the boons and people rarely have mobile phones.

I kind of hope 3's remake makes it like 5 to directly get called for Social links so you don't have to go everywhere just to know if they are around or not.

my favorite girl is Ayane.