Board 8 > I'm playing Final Fantasy IV (3D) for the first time *Spoilers as I go*

(+) Yeah! (+)

Hello everyone! In 2016 and 2017 I played through several Final Fantasy games for the first time, making playthrough topics for each of them. Now, over four years later, I'm back for at least one more! I apologize for my extended absence, I kind of fell out of playing video games for a long time. People seemed to like these back in the day, so hopefully some of you are still around. I hope I still have my old write-up skills, too.

Here's my current FF ranking, which I'm sure you'll all agree shows my impeccable taste:

XIII > X-2 > LR > VI > WoFF > IX > VIII > X > II > I >>> XIII-2

And a ranking of my current... let's say top fifteen Final Fantasy characters, just so we can see if any of the IV cast can break into it.

Lighting > Yuna > Dagger > Terra > Rinoa > Squall > Cyan > Eiko > Sazh > Lumina > Rikku > Reynn > Auron > Vanille > Vivi

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The recent release of the IV Pixel Remaster was what got me interested in playing it. However, I opted for the 3D Remake (Steam version, if it matters), mostly because it has voice acting. I'm going into this more or less blind. I know character names and a few plot points but nothing substantial.

FFIV starts with Cecil, our hero, having just murdered some defenseless people in a neighboring kingdom and stolen their crystal with his airship army, the Red Wings. He's at least conflicted about his actions, even raising an objection with the king of Baron, who has been acting suspicious lately while hunting these crystals. The king promptly demotes Cecil for insubordination and sends him to deliver a ring to the nearby village of Mist (Mist might be a kingdom, I don't remember. The full picture of political entities hasn't become clear to me yet). Joined by his friend Kain, leader of the dragoons, Cecil ventures through a cave, slays a mist dragon, and delivers the ring to Mist.

Only, the ring activates a trap as soon as they enter the village! What looks like sentient fireballs swarm the town and kill everyone, leaving only Rydia alive. As an aside, I'm unclear on how old Rydia is supposed to be. Her 3D chibi sprite and the way people talk about her make her seem the same age as Eiko from IX, maybe six or seven, but I saw her in the (awesome) opening video and let's just say Rydia looks like a teenager there. Google says she's sixteen and Cecil is only twenty, why is she a little girl sprite and treated like a kid. Oh well.

Cecil and Kain, who didn't know their arrival would cause such destruction, are aghast. Well, Cecil is, at least. At first Kain seems willing to murder Rydia if that's what the king wants, but he backs down when Cecil tells him not to. The cutscene framed it as Kain testing Cecil's resolve, but he sure had me fooled with his willingness to murder. I'm watching you, Kain! Not that it matters much right now, Rydia splits the earth with her summoner powers and Kain gets separated from the other two. Cecil brings Rydia to a nearby desert village, then earns her trust by defending her against Baron goons in the night.

The next morning, in addition to being hunted by seemingly the strongest army on the planet, they have another problem. Rosa, Cecil's... I'll say girlfriend even if I'm not sure if they're at that point yet, has tracked him down and contracted some sort of desert fever in the process. Seems a bit quick for her to learn what happened and get all the way here in one night, I mean how did she even know where Cecil would be, but who am I to argue with video game logic. She's sick and the antlion pearl that'll heal her is a long way away.

Cecil and Rydia meet an old sage named Tellah in some nearby waterways, and together they make their way through. Once outside, they're just in time to witness another kingdom get annihilated by the Red Wings, now led by someone named Golbez. Among the casualties is Anna, Tellah's daughter who he'd set out to save. She's also the lover of Edward, a spoony bard (lol) who is secretly the local prince. Tellah, understandably enraged at Golbez, sets out to get revenge. Cecil, meanwhile, refuses to let Edward mourn for even five minutes before slapping him and dragging him along to find the antlion pearl. Another dungeon later and the three have killed an antlion and cured Rosa. At least Edward gets some closure that night when Anna's spirit visits and implores him to be strong.

Now aware that Baron is on a warpath to gather all the crystals, heading to the next kingdom is the logical next step. The last thing I did before quitting was melt the ice wall leading there, which took some convincing as Rydia is understandably wary of fire after her whole village was destroyed by it. Still, she overcame her aversion and now the adventure can continue!

I'm enjoying FFIV3D so far. Combat isn't super complex, but there have been moments where I was caught off guard. Mostly they've been through enemies with counter powers, I had Kain jumping and Cecil set to darkness attack when the first dragon turned to mist and started countering attacks, that damn near killed me. Still, I'm not seeing any problems that grinding won't cure. Exploration feels good, there have been a few secret chests and whatnot so far, and I haven't felt lost on where to go.

The story and characters are nice so far too, though not the most complex. I'm sure they'll continue to grow on me. I thought Rydia and Edward got over their traumas too quickly, but then right when I was done playing there were two little moments that showed it was still on their minds, I appreciated that. Cecil's character is shaping up to be the crux of the story, and I like the dynamic for the most part. I just hope the story isn't done exploring the redemption angle, he was set up as a guy who did some bad stuff and I hope Rydia teaming up with him despite that isn't the end of him seeking forgiveness.

Back in the day I was known for my speedy playthroughs. I can't guarantee I'll get through IV quite that fast these days, but I'll try not to let too much time go by without updates.
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I tried the 3D version and I thought the voice acting was so awful I couldn't do it.

Different strokes I guess

edit: it was the DS version which im assuming is the same
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I really liked the DS version. Sadly I never finished it because I lost the game card somewhere.

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Oh I forgot two things

I'm really liking the little thought bubbles each character has on the menu screen. I make sure to check those each time the plot might've slightly progressed

And I've found two completely random dancers so far who did a little dance when I talked to them. I have no idea who these ladies are or what purpose they serve, but I hope there are more of them, ideally in less and less plausible locations as the game goes on (about to fight the final boss in an epic battle? Not before talking to this dancer at the final save point!)

As for the voice acting, I'm liking it. Maybe it'd be different if these were beloved characters from my childhood and the voices didn't match what I'd always imagined, but for new characters it's fine. There's only voice acting in the occasional cutscene anyway.
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Wow you are really charging through this! Back when I did my playthrough someone said one of the major strengths of this game is its pacing, and I'd have to agree. Things just keep changing and moving forward!

Robazoid posted...

Cecil, meanwhile, refuses to let Edward mourn for even five minutes before slapping him and dragging him along to find the antlion pearl.

Lol yes that bothered me. Poor Edward :(

I like that this game begins with you on Team Evil, it's immediately compelling that way. And a Dark Knight protagonist is such a cool idea, not one they've ever gone back to I think. I love the thought bubbles too (that's something you wouldn't get in the 2D versions), just fleshes out the characters a little bit. And I forget her exact age but Rydia is a child (this confused me too), and I'd be careful googling stuff given The After Years and all.

Glad you're enjoying yourself, cool thoughts so far!

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The protagonist of FFXIV is also canonically a Dark Knight in Shadowbringers...!

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andylt posted...

And I forget her exact age but Rydia is a child (this confused me too), and I'd be careful googling stuff given The After Years and all.

Ah, that makes sense. Surely she isn't sixteen in The After Years though, I know one character in that is Cecil's son and that kid would be like nine if Rydia only ages to sixteen in it.
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Rydia is seven.

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look man don't worry about rydia's age

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Rydia being seven makes sense. It's just odd she doesn't look seven in the opening movie, that's all!

In any case, I've played a bit more. The party crossed the mountains, meeting a monk named Yang along the way. From they we went to Fabul and assisted in the defense of the castle, though it was a losing battle. The last stand in the crystal room revealed that Kain is, indeed, a bad guy, or at the very least brainwashed into being a bad guy. Golbez also appears and kidnaps Rosa before taking the crystal and leaving.

The crew decides to head back to Baron on a boat to rescue her, but it isn't going to be quite that simple. Leviathan sinks the boat along the way, scattering the party and leaving Cecil to wash ashore near the town he ransacked at the beginning of the game. They're in no mood to trust him, and one guy even turns Cecil into a toad! I suppose that's fair, given what he did. What was less fair was that another sexy dancer was here, only this time watching her strip show turned Cecil into a pig. That isn't right.

In any case, Cecil needs to prove he's changed by becoming a paladin, so he teams up with Palom and Porom, two young mages. Together they make their way up a nearby mountain, meeting back up with Tellah along the way. I wasn't a huge fan of this party, too many mages, but they got me through. Together they beat a fiend sent by Golbez and Cecil renounced his darkness, becoming a paladin! He... also went back to level one? I don't care what it says about my soul, I want the overleveled dark knight back!

After this, the party could finally return to Baron and infiltrate the castle with the help of Yang, who'd been found and seemingly brainwashed by the bad guys before we knocked some sense into him. The castle was mostly deserted so it wasn't the toughest area, but the boss at the end of it had a tsunami power that nearly wiped my whole team. I somehow managed to beat him, allowing the party to rescue Cid. Unfortunately, a trap on the way out forced Palom and Porom to sacrifice themselves. I don't know why everyone seems to dislike these twins, they kinda grew on me. I'll miss them.

I stopped playing right after the next cutscene where evil Kain told Cecil to get the last crystal if he wants Rosa back, and Cecil seems ready to go along with it. They're going to ride their new airship, courtesy of Cid, to the next area.

I'm still enjoying the game, but I hope at some point the party solidifies. All these switches make it hard to build a consistent strategy, and Cecil + three mages is just too many mages for me. The story remains fine. Cecil renounced his darkness a bit too easily, if I have to nitpick, but it was good enough. Still, dark knight > paladin any day!
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Robazoid posted...

I wasn't a huge fan of this party, too many mages

Lol IV has so many mages, I kinda love it. Personally I like the party constantly switching around, it keeps things fresh and I don't have to think about who to bring and who to leave behind! But I can understand why you'd disagree on that.

Cecil coming back down the mountain at level 1 but being super effective against all the monsters there is so cool. It's such a great integration of gameplay and storytelling. Though yeah DK is cooler and imo they had the transformation happen too soon in the story, I still thought it was done well.

The twins are alright really, I just find Palom a bit annoying and there's not much to them. Their sacrifice was good though.

I'm jealous that you beat Cagnazzo first try, he took me several attempts! Silly Tsunami. You really are racing through this >_>

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The party switching is ff4's calling card. You won't get a party with 3 mages again at least.

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andylt posted...

Cecil coming back down the mountain at level 1 but being super effective against all the monsters there is so cool. It's such a great integration of gameplay and storytelling. Though yeah DK is cooler and imo they had the transformation happen too soon in the story, I still thought it was done well.

agree fully here!

this game killed me so many times haha
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andylt posted...

Cecil coming back down the mountain at level 1 but being super effective against all the monsters there is so cool. It's such a great integration of gameplay and storytelling.

Thinking about it this way, I suppose I agree. It's just that my Cecil was so overleveled he was one-shotting everything on his way up! Coming down couldnt help but feel weaker.

And yeah, I got lucky against that tsunami boss. Somehow it was my two healers who survived, which let me recover. I also lucked into learning that thunder could dispel tsunamis before the second one

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If you think Rydias age doesnt make sense wait until you find out how old Palom and Porom are

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I'd guess five or six, they seem younger than Rydia.

Children going on dangerous adventures was never the issue. I mean, Eiko is one of my favorites. It was just the discrepancy of Rydia looking like and being treated as a child when I thought she was a teenager going in, that's all.

I guess there could be a timeskip at some point, maybe that'll solve my problem.

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Tag.

The 3D version was the only version I played too, I really need to get to playing The After Years.

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I need to replay the 3D version to really play with the Augment system. I didn't realize how complicated it could be with the way you can carry them over to new games.

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I played a little bit more, but I made almost no plot progression. Since I ended last time right when I acquired the airship, this session was mostly exploration! I found a town where the people are supposedly descendants of dwarves, another strange town inhabited by pigs, toads, and tiny people, and I found a seemingly abandoned Eblan Castle. I figure this will be a dungeon inhabited by monsters later so I was happily clearing out all the free loot beforehand. Then, whoops, some of the chests cause ambush battles! I experienced my first defeat of the game here, as well as my next twenty defeats. I found two ambush chests and my party was usually dead within seconds of battle in either one of them. No one could even get a move off, it was a slaughter. Thankfully it turns out continuing is really forgiving, it just puts me back at the start of the room, but still! I'm going to need to grind a bit before I can conquer those chests.

I went back to a few old locations too, such as informing the elder of Palom/Porom's sacrifice. He gave me their Twincast augment, which means maybe I should finally figure out what the deal is with augments.

Lastly, I went to the next plot town to ask for their crystal, but it had already been stolen by a dark elf. I also found Edward, but he's too injured to join the party. Come on Edward, I have ambush chests I need your help to clear! Oh well, at least he survived, which leaves only Rydia missing. Now I have to go to a nearby cave, and at first I was confused on how to get there because the airship couldn't land in trees. The last thing I did was cleverly figure out the puzzle, I can fly there by nabbing a black chocobo in a nearby forest! But, first, I need to grind for a few hours and go back to Eblan and claim those chests because there's no way I'm letting some random chests get the better of me. Being way overpowered doesn't sound like a bad thing heading into this next cave, either. I can't wear weapons or armor in the magnetized cave? I don't like the sound of that.

The only other thing I want to mention is that the town near this castle has a legit brothel. That's pretty racy for a Final Fantasy game!
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Woo exploration! I remember Eblan Castle being striking, a silent place packed with treasure chests and who knows what happened there? Cool.

Robazoid posted...

maybe I should finally figure out what the deal is with augments.

There are guides on how to maximise them but it implicitly spoils some things, and technically you can't get all augments until at least the third playthrough I think. Twincast is great though so use that one!

Robazoid posted...

The only other thing I want to mention is that the town near this castle has a legit brothel. That's pretty racy for a Final Fantasy game!

Yeah I thought the same thing lol, they were more explicit about it than the typical 'teehee I'm a dancer ;)' that you usually get.

Good luck with the magnetised dungeon! I really like how IV is constantly switching things up on the player and keeping things fresh.

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Robazoid posted...

I can't wear weapons or armor in the magnetized cave?

Metallic ones anyway

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I apologize for the lack of progress these last few days. I'm on vacation from work this week, but I took the time off to help my family with things and that's taking more of my time than I'd planned! I'll try and manage my time better these next few days and get a real update in

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KingButz posted...

voice acting was so awful I couldn't do it.

the game has voice acting? it's a DS game why would you ever hear it

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anyway augments make this the only version of the game worth playing as you actually are able to customise your party beyond "these are the 5 characters you get for this part of game"

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I didn't think the voice acting was bad myself, especially for a DS game.

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Steiner posted...

anyway augments make this the only version of the game worth playing as you actually are able to customise your party beyond "these are the 5 characters you get for this part of game"

Hot take: I loved that FF4 locked you into keeping specific party members based on where you were in the plot. Not only did it make it easy for me to focus on the story, it also eliminated the "Why is the supporting cast's dialogue interchangeable?" factor that affects a ton of JRPGs.

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anyway augments make this the only version of the game worth playing as you actually are able to customise your party beyond "these are the 5 characters you get for this part of game"

In fairness, FF4 Advance lets you swap party members around for the final dungeon.
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MalcolmMasher posted...

anyway augments make this the only version of the game worth playing as you actually are able to customise your party beyond "these are the 5 characters you get for this part of game"

In fairness, FF4 Advance lets you swap party members around for the final dungeon.

Which is also carried over into the PSP version

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They also balanced characters out quite a bit, such as making Edward actually useful compared to his original incarnation and a dragon-murderer to put dragoons to shame.

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Okay, I finally played a bit more! As mentioned at the end of my last update, first I grinded a bit. I also looked up strategies on how to beat those stupid chest ambushes in the abandoned castle. Did you know SBAllen has made an FAQ for this game? That's pretty neat. It turns out the spell Break insta-kills the monsters in these chests, so once I was strong enough to survive the first ten seconds I was able to win all the ambush battles and claim my prizes.

Next came the magnetic cavern, and I'm not ashamed to admit I also used a guide to get optimal equipment loadouts. Yang's claws aren't made of metal, I guess? And a lucky thing, too, because he carried me through this dungeon. The Dark Elf boss began with an unwinnable battle, but then Edward played some music from afar to distract it. The boss wasn't so bad after that, no doubt helped by my earlier grinding, and the party recovered the Earth Crystal.

I returned to the castle to thank Edward, then Kain contacted us and brought us to the Tower of Zot. The team fought their way up that and found Kain and Golbez at the top. Golbez tried to go back on the deal, of course, but Tellah finally put his Meteor spell into action! It managed to hurt Golbez (note to self, 9999 damage is only barely enough to kinda hurt Golbez) but not enough to kill him. The spell, however, did kill Tellah. Noooo! At least he went out like a badass casting a spell that even shook Golbez. Still, Golbez seemed more alarmed by something to do with Cecil, though I'm not sure what yet. It was enough to get him to retreat. Kain was also freed of his mind control, and together they rescued Rosa from a trap in the next room. I finally have a party of five, and it isn't all mages! Not that having a huge party helped in the next boss battle against the tornado lady. I learned early on that attacking her provoked a counter, so Cid, Cecil, and (except for jumping) Kain mostly hung back while Yang focused up and did the real damage. Rosa was on healing duty, a job she excels at.

The Tower of Zot collapsed after, but Rosa thankfully teleported us out and Cid remote-controlled the airship away. That's a neat feature of the airship, Cid, but I have an idea for the next one. Make the thing able to land on trees so I don't need to bother with chocobos!

The party wasn't sure what to do next, since Golbez now has all the crystals, but luckily Kain remembered something from his time being brainwashed. There are four other crystals in the underworld, and Kain has the key. No one knows where to go, but Cid remembered some old legend pointing towards Aga... something. That was an easy hint, so I went to the town starting with Aga directly to the south. Throwing the stone into the mysterious well caused a massive eruption that opened an absolutely enormous hole in the earth, and that's a spot to save on if there ever was one.

I'm going to miss Tellah moving forward, he was super cool. Having a party of five is still nice. I was a bit sad that Rosa had no comment on Cecil becoming a Paladin, but what can you do. I also liked their thought bubbles after the massive eruption. Most people were awed by it. Cid, meanwhile, was just giddy to fly his airship into the massive chasm!

I also want to give praise to probably my favorite character, Namingway, aka a-bunch-of-other-names-Way. I'm really enjoying this random bunny creature and his adventures across the globe that include everything from camping with chocobos to dating two women at the same time to being some sort of pudding collector now? I'm almost as invested in where his journey will go next as I am in the crystal saga.
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I forget if the 3D game breaks the fourth wall about this or not but in the original you could talk to Namingway to change the names of party members. Voice acting in the 3D put an end to that, causing the mid-life crisis you now see him going through.

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And you've reached the end of what is basically Act 1! RIP Tellah, the OG. It was a badass way to go. Apparently that's what happens when you try to cast a spell you don't have enough MP for *shrug*. You see what happens when you complain about too many mages? Now they are dead!

SBAllen adores FFIV apparently. I think it was lefty who linked me to his augment guide when I was playing. I'd link you but it can be a bit spoilery (like it basically tells you when people are about to leave your party). It is fun reading your thoughts like a year after I played this myself, I too loved the thought bubbles.

Robazoid posted...

Namingway, aka a-bunch-of-other-names-Way. I'm really enjoying this random bunny creature and his adventures across the globe that include everything from camping with chocobos to dating two women at the same time to being some sort of pudding collector now? I'm almost as invested in where his journey will go next as I am in the crystal saga.

Ah, about that. You'll need the Rainbow Pudding to progress in that sidequest now, which is a super rare drop from Flans. The best spot to grind for them is in B2 of the Antlion's Den. It took me a couple hours myself, I've heard it takes some even longer. This is the one single bit of the game that really annoyed me lol, none of the other quests have anything like that. But if you want the Namingway quest to keep going, that's what you have to get!

Hmm... he could be a good nomination for SMFFFC. And we could save him with all of his other names!

WazzupGenius00 posted...

I forget if the 3D game breaks the fourth wall about this or not but in the original you could talk to Namingway to change the names of party members. Voice acting in the 3D put an end to that, causing the mid-life crisis you now see him going through.

It's really cool that they did this instead of just removing him entirely! I like all the effort they put into this game.

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MalcolmMasher posted...

anyway augments make this the only version of the game worth playing as you actually are able to customise your party beyond "these are the 5 characters you get for this part of game"

In fairness, FF4 Advance lets you swap party members around for the final dungeon.

i had forgotten that but i don't think it's as interesting as the augment system!

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Robazoid posted...

Did you know SBAllen has made an FAQ for this game? That's pretty neat.

it is his favourite game!

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Thanks for the pudding tip andy, I'll put in the time at some point because Namingway has me enthralled and I need to know where his journey ends. Speaking of journeys, I actually played a bunch more last night but it was too late to update

The team flew into the underworld, got caught in the crossfire between dwarven tanks and Golbez's forces, and crashed near the dwarven castle. The dwarves there were nice enough ("Lali-ho" indeed, I remember something similar from FFIX!) but their security was so lax that Golbez warped right into the crystal room. I remembered my earlier note-to-self, that 9999 damage only kind of hurt Golbez, and at first he lived up to his threat level by summoning a creature who almost wiped out the party. Thankfully, they were rescued by... Rydia! And she's all grown up, too, because time works differently where she was training. It all makes sense now. Together we defeat Golbez, but no one has the good sense to stab him a few more times when he's down so he warps out with the crystal anyway.

There's only one crystal left, but it's in a sealed cavern for now. The priority becomes stealing back the other seven crystals from Golbez's tower. Cid hangs back to repair the airship, so the party became Cecil, Rosa, Rydia, Kain, and Yang. And you know what, this party was alright. Three damage dealers plus Rydia with her paralyze whip were great, but the real star for me was Rosa. Not only is she an amazing healer, her prayer ability restored MP! I spent hours in that dungeon never needing to retreat or use a tent or worry about anything, Rosa kept everyone at full everything the entire time through and in every dungeon since.

Sadly, going in at full HP/MP didn't help me against the mad doctor boss of this section. His first phase was a joke, but that second phase where he reversed healing/damage and started healing my party was brutal. I lost three or four times after he reversed just in time to be healed by a Curaga instead of hurt by it. Hardest fight in the game so far. Still, eventually I made it through. Destroying his cannons came next, but they overloaded and Yang needed to kick everyone out and sacrifice himself to do it. Noooo, Yang! Then the party nearly fell off a collapsing bridge, only for Cid to swoop in and save them! Yaaay, Cid! Then Cid sacrificed himself during their escape to the surface to seal the entrance behind them. Noooo, Cid! All of the thought bubbles were really bummed out after this section. I took a bit of time to go around the world letting everyone know their loved ones were dead, but Cid's daughter had no unique dialogue and Yang's wife was just 'lol you're crazy, Yang can't die in such a lame way'. Rydia had a thought bubble too wondering if Edward was okay, but when I brought her to him Edward was just sad Yang died and had no reaction. Come on FFIV, program in more minor character interactions! If this was Trails in the Sky, every single NPC on the planet would have something new to say!

An upgrade to the airship let me recover my hovercar and finally enter a cave near the abandoned castle. It was filled with the remnants of a ninja clan, which gave me my fifth party member, Edge. He's arrogant and, based on the thought bubbles, no one seems to like him, including me. He's also a poor replacement for Yang damage-wise, which made the next fight against Rubicante a bit difficult. Still, Edge (or everyone except Edge but he was there too) defeated him. They were within a few steps of the crystals!... only to fall through a trap door. I missed out on completing the map of this small area because I didn't know going through a door would lock me into an airship cutscene, I'm angry about that.

Apparently there's no way back up or down the tower now to reclaim the crystals, so the team returns to the dwarven castle. They need to fly over magma to reach the sealed cavern before Golbez can break in, if only Cid was alive to upgrade our new airship. Only... a few random NPCs say that Cid is alive! What followed was an embarrassing fifteen minute journey to every room in the castle, several times, before I finally found the door to the infirmary. It wasn't even hidden, I just somehow missed it every time I ran that hallway. Despite having fallen ten miles earlier and nearly dying, Cid still hops out of bed and upgrades the airship before collapsing again. Then the team finds a letter he wrote in case he dies asking them to bash some enemies for him. You got it, buddy!

Next up, it was time for the sealed cavern! But the map also opened up and this is an RPG, so of course I first did everything but the sealed cavern. There was a poisonous Sylph cave that was my least favorite dungeon of the game so far, every enemy was annoying (special mention goes to the purple floating heads that cast all-silence and all-sleep over and over and over, solely to waste my time because neither mage could be silenced and none of my damage dealers needed magic). It was also confusing, forcing me to run through the thing several times to find every nook and cranny. The only upside is that my whole team is now comfortably over level 50, so hopefully there's no more grinding in my future. The other upside was finding Yang being looked after by some faeries, but if there's a way to heal him I haven't found it yet. Now I'm holding out hope that Tellah is chilling on a beach somewhere too, but something tells me he's gone for good. I also went through the fiery Eidolon passage and got Rydia two new summons I'll probably never use.

Not much else to say. Rosa + Pray is keeping my team at constant full health and I feel comfortably overleveled now, so bring on whatever you've got, sealed cave!
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Robazoid posted...

Thankfully, they were rescued by... Rydia! And she's all grown up, too, because time works differently where she was training. It all makes sense now. Together we defeat Golbez, but no one has the good sense to stab him a few more times when he's down so he warps out with the crystal anyway.

Yesss one of the most memorable scenes in the game! For me, I was spoiled on Rydia because the back of the box has her adult character model on it lol, I didn't pay attention in the intro cutscene. But yeah, she was an actual small child earlier.

Robazoid posted...

t the real star for me was Rosa. Not only is she an amazing healer, her prayer ability restored MP!

There's a reason I called her the MVP, she is maybe the most useful white mage in the series imo!

RIP Yang and Cid (for 10 minutes). This is definitely the brutal section of the game, both with the deaths and the bosses. And yeah, I did the exact same as you hoping there was more unique dialogue after the deaths but nope. The thought bubbles were new for this version so I guess that was their way of making up for the lack of actual dialogue. And it turns out Yang's Wife's instinct was correct, she knows her husband well!

Glad you went through the Eidolon passage too, there's a handful of meaty sidequests in this game.

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I have now beaten the game, so here's the final update

The party went through the sealed cave, and my one big comment about this area is that every single door was a trapped monster door. Every single one! They should've had some normal doors scattered throughout just to keep me on my toes. I guess it was preparation for the upcoming Demon Wall that attacked once they got the crystal, but I managed to destroy it before my team was crushed. Sadly, Kain was taken over by Golbez again on the way out, so now evil holds all the crystals. All hope seemed lost, at least until the dwarves remembered a mystical prophecy about to come to fruition. Cid upgraded the airship again to escape the underground, and off everyone went to claim an ancient spaceship hidden in the ocean. Special mention goes to Cid who, while upgrading, took the time to stop Edge from hitting on Rydia. Thank you, Cid, I think she deserves better too.

Jumping to the moon was neat, and the location had a real otherworldly feel in both appearance and music, I liked the area a lot. This felt like I was approaching the end of the game, though, so I looked up how to save Yang before continuing in the hopes that he might replace Kain in my party. Yang's Wife handed over a frying pan to smack him with, and it was funny reading the incredulous thought bubbles on the way back down the dungeon and the reaction of the sylphs when we smacked Yang with it. It worked, though! He wasn't strong enough to join the team, sadly, but I got some augments out of it.

Back on the moon, I found a cave filled with Hummingways, which I guess is what Namingway is. Speaking of Namingway, I didn't actually finish his quest. I realized my map mistake in Golbez's tower locked me out of getting the treasure hunter augment and I didn't want to spend all day hunting for some low-drop-rate pudding without it, so I just watched the rest of his story on youtube. That moon bunny really had himself a journey, but I'm glad he found his own path!

After traversing some moon caves, the team was joined by Fusoya, a Lunarian who gave all the details of the story. They came to the planet long ago but didn't want to disrupt evolution on the surface, so they've been hanging out here ever since. The only two exceptions to that were Zemus, who wanted to kill everyone and is the one controlling Golbez, and Cecil's father, who went down and banged a human woman, which I guess is okay? If you guys can breed with the locals I don't know why you need to hibernate on the moon, just come on down and get busy, but anyway. So, Cecil is half moon person, huh. There are bigger things at play though, because, now that he has all the crystals, Zemus is about to awaken a giant robot titan to wipe out all life on the planet below! With Fusoya, the team rushes back to Earth.

The giant robot awakening was cool, as was all the other characters I've met on this journey showing up to help distract it. The team jumped inside, fought their way to the robot's core, and fought it. Fusoya gave the spectacularly terrible advice of needing to kill the CPU's defense core first, but the one time I tried that I died super hard. The next time, I ignored its weak healing and killed everything else and the fight went a whole lot smoother.

There was some more exposition from Golbez after once his mind was freed. It turns out he's Cecil's brother, and after his Lunarian father was killed and their mother died in childbirth, Golbez had enough darkness in his heart to be taken over by Zemus. Now that he's freed, he wants revenge, so he and Fusoya head to the moon. The others, including Kain who is quickly forgiven, decide to follow, but first there's an odd scene where Cecil tries to force Rosa and Rydia to leave. They helped you destroy a giant robot, Cecil, they aren't delicate flowers! Thankfully they tell him he's being dumb and come along anyway because I couldn't get anywhere without Rosa's prayers.

Back on the moon, there was a truly gargantuan final dungeon that took me probably five hours, filled with dead ends and floors with a hundred doors and, at one point, an invisible bridge I had to check a guide to learn about. There were two kinds of battles in this dungeon. One was against gigantic creatures that could be hit with Stop and were easy EXP. The other kind were groups of mages who did huge damage and gave worthless EXP, so I ran from those and farmed the others for levels. A few of the Eidolon altar battles were tricky, but I played it carefully and cleared everything out on my way down.

I must say, it was neat following the thought bubbles on the way down. Cecil is understandably shocked Golbez is his brother, but the bubbles really traced his thought process towards finally... coming to understand him, at least, if not full forgiveness. Cecil forgave Kain, after all, and has done some pretty bad stuff himself. They added a lot to the game in prior sections too, but now I'm really glad I played this version to see his thoughts in this section.

The end battle was neat, beginning with Fusoya and Golbez twin meteoring Zemus' physical form only to awaken an indestructible evil spirit called Zeromus. Whoops. It nearly kills everyone, but prayers from the people on the planet below heal up the party, allowing Cecil to use a crystal from Golbez to at least make Zemus killable. I was so hilariously overleveled at this point that the final battle wasn't too bad, it was mostly a game of figuring out what made him counter and recovering when I made a misstep. Don't use summons, check. Don't use black magic, check... well that made Rydia useless in that final battle but oh well. Edge finally made himself useful using all those 9999 damage shurikens I'd been saving and the team took Zeromus out!

To conclude our epic tale, Fusoya and Golbez, who is happy to get at least a goodbye from Cecil, join the Lunarians in their slumber. Everyone else heads home to rebuild their various areas, and it's all topped off with Cecil and Rosa getting married and becoming King and Queen of Baron. Aww, how nice. The End... at least until The After Years, which I'm not sure I'll play anytime soon.
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So, that was FFIV 3D! I definitely enjoyed it, but not enough for it to join the upper echelons of my FF preferences. The story was a highlight even if it wasn't always as fleshed out as I would've liked. The underground and moon sections were nice touches to add variety to what could've otherwise been a fairly standard medieval fantasy setting. The Lunarian plot points were my favorite parts, I mean it had giant planet destroying titans and slumbering moon people, that's awesome! As for the gameplay, I think combat was the biggest failing. The final dungeon really highlighted that with Stop making 'hard' fights a joke, but at the same time I would have died super hard if I didn't abuse it. It just felt poorly balanced a lot of the time.

XIII > X-2 > LR > VI > WoFF > IX > VIII > X > IV(3D) > II > I >>> XIII-2

I'd say IV (3D) is a good bit above II and I, those were merely okay, and XIII-2 was of course mediocre. IV falls below X, but everything above X is in my top 100 games and X itself only barely misses that list, so it isn't as bad as it looks! I enjoyed IV quite a bit.

As for characters, I don't think any of them were strong enough to beat Vivi and join my top fifteen, but I enjoyed almost all of them. Edge was easily the worst, dragging down every scene he was in including the otherwise awesome final battle ones. I wasn't a fan of Kain either but that ties into the Cecil/Rosa romance that I'll talk about soon. Palom and Porom were fine but weren't huge parts of the plot, I ranked Porom ahead of her brother because I liked how she kept smacking the back of his head when he was being dumb.

Next comes Cecil and Rosa, who I went into this really wanting to like. I don't dislike them like I do Edge, but there just wasn't enough to their characters. I would have liked a lot more soul-searching and back-and-forth from Cecil, more like a bad guy who is struggling to be good after a lifetime of darkness rather than a good guy who did a bad thing once and is now all good no problem. Learning about his past was neat but didn't really add much to him, in my opinion (unlike Golbez, who benefitted a lot from his past). I ranked Rosa higher because she was the MVP of combat, but her entire character boiled down to loving Cecil. That's not necessarily bad, I have a soft spot for pure romance, but I guess I'm just not sure why she loves Cecil. He's an attractive enough guy I guess, and he's a good person, and for lots of relationships that would be enough. They added in the Kain dynamic, though, where his rejection by Rosa in favor of Cecil literally drove him to evil multiple times. There was one scene of them all as kids but that didn't solve anything. Kain is also an attractive dude who wants to do good. If Rosa picking Cecil over him is the core of two whole characters, I just wanted a little more of an explanation on why she's picking Cecil, that's all.

Above them is Yang, who was a solid monk guy and had some funny scenes in relation to his wife but was otherwise kind of flat. Next is Fusoya, who wasn't around much but he was the Lunarian side of the story that I really liked so he's cool. Edward had his few moments with Anna and Tellah, but he ultimately wasn't around enough to make more of an impact. Rydia had a good core arc, her life was destroyed by Cecil but she decides to forgive him and join his righteous cause. It was just all over way too quickly, that whole summary is the first hour of the game. Aside from a few cool moments after, she didn't do that much else within the plot.

Above Rydia, though, we finally reach the characters I liked a lot. Golbez's story was mostly told in that one flashback, but I felt for the kid who lost both his parents and was swayed to evil by an ethereal voice from the moon. Cid P was just an awesome dude, he lightened up every scene he was in with his attitude and sheer excitement about airships. I mean this is a scruffy gnome looking guy who should've been dead but hopped out of bed to upgrade airships before collapsing, twice! That's hard not to like. My favorite IV character, though, was Tellah. The poor guy lost his daughter and then dedicated himself to learning forbidden magic and literally destroyed his body to fuel the spell against the person who killed her. That's hardcore. My real favorite was Namingway, of course, but that goes without saying.

So, overall:

Namingway > Tellah > Cid P > Golbez > Rydia > Edward > Fusoya > Yang > Rosa > Cecil > Porom > Palom > Kain >>>>> Edge

And I suppose that's it. Thank you to the few of you who followed this short playthrough topic! There are still a handful of big-name Final Fantasies I haven't played, but I wouldn't hold out too much hope that I'll get to them anytime soon. If I ever do play one, though, I'll be sure to make another playthrough topic to keep this tradition alive!
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Fusoya gave the spectacularly terrible advice of needing to kill the CPU's defense core first, but the one time I tried that I died super hard. The next time, I ignored its weak healing and killed everything else and the fight went a whole lot smoother.

If I recall correctly, Fusoya's advice is fine for the SNES version, but didn't get updated to account for this remake's changes to the CPU fight.

The others, including Kain who is quickly forgiven, decide to follow, but first there's an odd scene where Cecil tries to force Rosa and Rydia to leave. They helped you destroy a giant robot, Cecil, they aren't delicate flowers! Thankfully they tell him he's being dumb and come along anyway because I couldn't get anywhere without Rosa's prayers.

Best justification I've seen for that scene is that it's a fake-out to make you think you'll get Fusoya and Golbez as your endgame casters.
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MalcolmMasher posted...

Best justification I've seen for that scene is that it's a fake-out to make you think you'll get Fusoya and Golbez as your endgame casters.

This actually makes a lot of sense, but the game didn't really frame it that way so I guess I didn't notice it. I'm still glad Rosa stuck around, I don't see Golbez as the praying sort!
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Glad you enjoyed it! It's definitely the product of a simpler time in a lot of ways, though I have heard the DS version helps with that a bit.

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An FFIV topic and a mention to SBAllen's guide.

Time for a summoning attempt.

@SBAllen have you played the FFIV pixel remaster yet?

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Now that I've thought about it, Tellah might actually break my top fifteen characters. Either right ahead of or right behind Rikku. Sorry Vivi, you're out!

I should've praised the soundtrack more, it was all great, but this is the song that's been sticking with me. Maybe not the most crowd-pleasing tune, but to me it really sells the idea of 'you just learned there are strange people on the moon and you don't know what they want with you yet'.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=diScz_IX32M
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Think about Vivi some more imo.

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Oh man, this topic makes me want to replay FFIV DS. It's one of the few games where I enjoy getting my butt kicked >_> Like, I should get all the secrets this time around while mostly avoiding grinding to ensure it's still difficult.

Tellah's an interesting favorite party member. But hey, old people need more love!

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I enjoy how fast your topics go. Good for my attention span

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Wow you're done already, that is a ridiculous pace lol. Glad you enjoyed it, and yeah I agree with some of the flaws you list. We have differing opinions on the cast though, I like Cecil and Rosa as a couple and I think Edge is decent. I get all the complaints people have about the plot (specifically the death fakeouts) but it's such a wild ride that hardly ever lets up, you can see where so many games since have taken inspiration. It really was the blueprint for a certain kind of fantasy story! And the constantly rotating party is something I really love. It is a really well paced game, particularly considering the era.

Robazoid posted...

Speaking of Namingway, I didn't actually finish his quest. I realized my map mistake in Golbez's tower locked me out of getting the treasure hunter augment and I didn't want to spend all day hunting for some low-drop-rate pudding without it, so I just watched the rest of his story on youtube. That moon bunny really had himself a journey, but I'm glad he found his own path!

Smh no dedication!! Nah it's understandable, his drop is the single most annoying thing in the game for a major quest. Glad you saw it anyway.

I take it from what you said that you did the bonus dungeon on the moon? The regular final dungeon is indeed a behemoth, I went through it without using Stop at all >_> Appropriately badass for a final area though, I like how the environment changed when you got to the true core. And the thought bubbles were so good.

Golbez is cool, someone correct me on this if I'm wrong here but I believe the playable flashback stuff was new for the 3D version? They definitely fleshed things out a lil more. Tellah is underrated as evidenced by his dismal performances in SMFFFC, glad you like him. Did you ever see Fusoya faint? It's a pretty hilarious animation.

I notice a lack of V on your list, this must be corrected!

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WhiteLens posted...

@SBAllen have you played the FFIV pixel remaster yet?

I have not, waiting for it to release on something that I'd actually want to play it on (PS4/5 or Switch, ideally). I guess whenever I can get the Steam Deck I'll play it on that if there's nothing else by then.

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Wow the summon worked, the power of FFIV!

I wonder how Allen's character rankings for IV would go.

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