Board 8 > Yu Yu Hakusho Mafia Topic 4: Mafuuken!!!

(+) Yeah! (+)

Should I claim as well, Corrik?
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Hbthebattle posted...

Should I claim as well, Corrik?

Yes. Mzero before IGCD tho.

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Corrik7 posted...

Hbthebattle posted...

Should I claim as well, Corrik?

Yes. Mzero before IGCD tho.

Ok.

I'm Atsuko Urameshi, TOWN Vanilla
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1. Blade (Meow1000) / Scare (ScareChan) unclaimed
2. Corrik (Corrik7) BP town
3. FD (Forceful_Dragon) town vanilla
4. HB (Hbthebattle) town vanilla
5. IGCD (IfGodCouldDie) unclaimed
6. Lea (Leanansidhe) vanilla (but didn't claim TOWN vanilla, note in post 149 this thread)
7. Lopen (Lopen) a bullshit claim no one believes
8. MZero (MZero11) unclaimed
9. SBell (Obellisk) / Firebolt (fire_bolt) town vanilla

Deadlist:
KN2: Red - Asato Kido, TOWN Shadow Psychic (roleblocker)
LD1: Ulti - Yusuke Urameshi, TOWN Tracker
KN3: Brohan - Botan, TOWN Watcher
KN1: Han - Jorge the Ogre, TOWN Vanilla
LD4: Ben - Toya, TOWN Vanilla
KN4: Gravy - Shishiwakamaru, TOWN Vanilla

LD3: Chris - Ruka, MAFIA Roleblocker
LD2: Sultan - Shinobu Sensui, Untargetable Serial Killer
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scare claimed doctor Bolt
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Leanansidhe posted...

Are you fucking serious here Bolt

Scum slips are scum slips. I'm doing what I always do, collecting information. You'll note I'm not trying to lynch you right now, ay?
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If I wanted to insult you I would find a more direct way of doing it. Ask Blade about that sometime, if he even still remembers. I listed you directly as what came from your own mouth. You can hardly be mad at me for that, but feel free to do so anyway if it makes you feel better. Part of being a confirmed sociopath is giving literally zero fucks what anyone thinks about you, comes in handy
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It doesn't matter.

Lopen, do you intend to claim or pull what you accused red of which made him scum?

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I claim some flamboyant dude who thinks he's the greatest.

Seems like a pretty cool character

DEE-- TOWN Vanilla
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Mass claim was stupid btw. Anyone who isn't scum and backing Corrik up on this is bad.
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Lopen posted...

Anyone who isn't scum and backing Corrik up on this is bad.

Town scanners are dead. Anyone who thinks town wins without sharing information should probably just quit playing entirely
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It's unnecessary today. There are solid cases on a lot of people and it's not lynch or lose. Mass claim just removes any possible ace in the hole we may have. Tomorrow? Sure.
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DrPez posted...

Official Votals as of post 164

(3) Corrik: IGCD, Lopen, Lea
(3) Lopen: Corrik, (Lea), Firebolt, FD
(1) FD: (Corrik), MZero, (Lea)
(1) Lea: HB
(0) Scare: (Lea), (Lea)

@ me with any mistakes

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch

Also if we can stop the claims with me that would be cool. Like if FD and Fire_Bolt want to repent and say "you know what, I am a bad player. we can hold them off until tomorrow Lopen is right" I'm perfectly okay with letting the claims end here, myself.
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Lopen posted...

There are solid cases on a lot of people

No, there's really not. There's not a single solid case on anyone. You cannot factually say "Ok, this person is scum. We kill them we kill scum today". At best there's some gut reads on a couple of people and a couple of scum slips that may not mean anything. That's the issue with all the scanners being dead.

At this point you're literally just trying to throw darts at a board and hit scum. Meanwhile I'm trying to gather factual evidence so we can piece together SOMETHING. Right now I suspect town has maybe a 25% chance to win this, and that goes down to pretty fucking much 0% if we mislynch today. That's not to say I think the game is Mylo, but I do think we're rapidly approaching the region of town being unsalvagable.

Honestly, this is the main reason I quit playing here. The meta is so stagnant that people would rather push their pet theories and chase shadows as be honest and play the game smartly. Everyone wants to make the big dick "I'm better than you" plays, no one wants to work together. In back to back games we've seen town players make pointless fake claim gambits that did fuck all to help town and merely worked to muddy the waters, leading to stupid mislynches that might not have happened if they'd played as a team.
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Lopen posted...

Also if we can stop the claims with me that would be cool. Like if FD and Fire_Bolt want to repent and say "you know what, I am a bad player. we can hold them off until tomorrow Lopen is right" I'm perfectly okay with letting the claims end here, myself.

Holy shit, case in fucking point. So glad I left this place
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Keep in mind the guy you're backing up made one of those stupid fakeclaim gambits, so maybe you should consider that his town acumen is not great

(also that he's scum-- you're the dude who said that town BP doesn't exist with SK)
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Lopen posted...

Keep in mind the guy you're backing up made one of those stupid fakeclaim gambits

Keep in mind I get to lump you in with him, mister DEER triple vig doctor. And Corrik is playing leagues better than you right now. You've crawled so far up your own ass you should be able to taste your small intestine by now
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Yeah good call that fakeclaim gambit I made as DEER triple vig doctor was almost as bad as the fakeclaim you made when you claimed to be TOWN Good Player.
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Genkai Deer doctor

*waves at lopen*
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Lopen posted...

Yeah good call that fakeclaim gambit I made as DEER triple vig doctor was almost as bad as the fakeclaim you made when you claimed to be TOWN Good Player.

*rolls eyes*

If you want to act like a child I can certainly treat you like one. Continue your little tantrum though
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Don't worry Scare I'll use one of my vig shots on fire_bolt he'll pay for exposing our precious DEER doctor.
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fire_bolt posted...

Leanansidhe posted...

Do you really need a claim to have an opinion on Lopen? He's posted and done more than any other player.

Yes. I feel like I shouldn't have to explain this to anyone here but I will anyway.

In a game of Mafia, town overwhelming has the power advantage. Town has both numbers and typically more actual power roles. It takes DAYS of scum getting night kills to even that advantage out, even if they're also getting mislynches some during the day. Assuming a 12-4-1 split for this game, town outnumbered the scum team 3:1.

The reason town doesn't just auto-win games is because scum has the INFORMATION advantage. Every scum member knows EXACTLY who is on their team, exactly what their powers are, and exactly who they need to eliminate to win. Even for one-off scum "teams" like a solo SK this is true (since he knows his own stuff and needs to eliminate everyone). Town gets several roles usually to negate this information advantage.

However, it looks like our information gatherers are (at least mostly) dead. Which means town needs another method of eliminating that information advantage. The only way to do that at this point is to mass claim, sift thru the claims, and start lynching whoever doesn't fit or won't play with town. Let me make it clear. I WILL support the lynch of anyone who refuses to play with town from here on out. If you're a stubborn townie then you are throwing the game by not helping the rest of us sort it out (similar to how I was ready to lynch red last game). We can get your information off your flip if you will not provide it, full stop.

This is a really bad take. I feel confident that that town is at an advantage right now. Why would we want to throw that advantage out the window by giving scum more information.
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I like how what I'm doing is being called a tantrum btw.

I'm just saying you're bad at the game here. Being pretty calm about it. It's not like claiming matters in my case. I'm not in fact mad. I'm sorry if I offended you. Get better at the game and I'll offend you less. FD even admitted he's bad at the game, so there's a way to get better, not going for mass claim just because Corrik of all people says to. Ironically though FD going with it so easily makes me think, to quote Chris, his SCUM EQUITY goes up a bit if Corrik is scum, as that whole exchange between them seemed like a scripted way for Corrik to abandon his case on FD.

But yeah not claiming can be good, even if you're vanilla, even if there possibly no more scanners left. We don't have scans but we do have data right now, so there's a bit more to it than READZ. If you need claims to decide who to lynch right now, you're not digesting the game. You should be able to determine whether you want to lynch me if I'm DEER Deer King Triple Vig Doctor or some random vanilla guy I looked up on wikipedia for my fakeclaim research to conceal my very potent power role of DEER Deer King Triple Vig Doctor. They're just words. Neither role has altered the game state whatsoever.
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fire_bolt posted...

Meanwhile I'm trying to gather factual evidence

It's not factual evidence until you see a flip.
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IfGodCouldDie posted...

This is a really bad take. I feel confident that that town is at an advantage right now. Why would we want to throw that advantage out the window by giving scum more information.

I'd love to hear how town is at an advantage when most of our power roles are dead, we have no leads, and the only person dead on the scum team was someone who is useless to them once they kill our power roles.

I have trouble believing IGCD is this bad at reading setup meta. This reads like scum trying to hinder town cooperation more than anything
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We only don't have leads if you're not reading the game.
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fire_bolt posted...

IfGodCouldDie posted...

This is a really bad take. I feel confident that that town is at an advantage right now. Why would we want to throw that advantage out the window by giving scum more information.

I'd love to hear how town is at an advantage when most of our power roles are dead, we have no leads, and the only person dead on the scum team was someone who is useless to them once they kill our power roles.

I have trouble believing IGCD is this bad at reading setup meta. This reads like scum trying to hinder town cooperation more than anything

Read the entirety of the game and then tell me there aren't leads.
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Lopen posted...

We only don't have leads if you're not reading the game.

He has already admitted he is treating day 3 like it was day 1. So he hasn't and isnt going to read the game. So it's pointless to even try and interact with him. He is spouting off a bunch of bullshit about cooperating with town but won't read the game.
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Unfortunately it makes me feel like he is probably stubborn assholish town.
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When he claimed to have "caught up" I foolishly thought he meant he read the old topics, because why wouldn't you.
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Lopen posted...

When he claimed to have "caught up" I foolishly thought he meant he read the old topics, because why wouldn't you.

Because you have already admittedly said you dont give a shit. Like look at his reaction when people tried to convince him to read the whole game. He threatened to just quit because he didnt even want to play.
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IfGodCouldDie posted...

Lopen posted...

When he claimed to have "caught up" I foolishly thought he meant he read the old topics, because why wouldn't you.

Because you have already admittedly said you dont give a shit. Like look at his reaction when people tried to convince him to read the whole game. He threatened to just quit because he didnt even want to play.

That might come across wired. I was answering hypothetically then described his attitude.
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IfGodCouldDie posted...

IfGodCouldDie posted...

Lopen posted...

When he claimed to have "caught up" I foolishly thought he meant he read the old topics, because why wouldn't you.

Because you have already admittedly said you dont give a shit. Like look at his reaction when people tried to convince him to read the whole game. He threatened to just quit because he didnt even want to play.

That might come across weird. I was answering hypothetically then described his attitude.

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Yeah I don't think fire_bolt is scum. I mean Sultan revealing he scanned SBell town if for no other reason, but I also don't really think he's been playing in a scummy way per se. Just a bad way. He did this last game too though. There's a reason Corrik made a pretty compelling case on him when he went into crazy mode on day 3 in Godzilla mafia, and bolt was town and Corrik was town. I'll take lectures on b8 towns all day but not when bolt of all people is the messenger.
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Lopen posted...

I'll take lectures on b8 towns all day but not when bolt of all people is the messenger.

Cool story but, uh, 100% of my reads were right last game. At least the ones I backed with any conviction. If Corrik hadn't literally claimed my exact role he wouldn't have been mislynched
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fire_bolt posted...

Lopen posted...

I'll take lectures on b8 towns all day but not when bolt of all people is the messenger.

Cool story but, uh, 100% of my reads were right last game. At least the ones I backed with any conviction. If Corrik hadn't literally claimed my exact role he wouldn't have been mislynched

But you have no response to anything else?
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IfGodCouldDie posted...

But you have no response to anything else?

There's nothing meaningful to be gained from interacting with Lopen right now. When a fool is convinced they are right nothing will change their minds. He's convinced he's solved the game and nothing will change that except, y'know, when his reads start flipping incorrectly.
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I meant the fact that your reads are incomplete because you haven't read the whole game.
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Reads are a pretty small part of mafia all things considered. It's also funny you're saying I'm convinced I solved the game when I literally changed all my reads between yesterday and today.

Also it's easy to claim you had 100% correct reads when you disqualify misreads for a little thing like claiming your exact role. If someone else claimed Triple Vig Doctor I wouldn't automatically assume they're scum, for example. Thought Corrik seemed p town last game.
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IfGodCouldDie posted...

I meant the fact that your reads are incomplete because you haven't read the whole game.

*shrug*

It is what it is, and that's why I'm judging the situation based on what I'm seeing directly. If something seems scummy now why should what happened days ago stop it from seeming scummy? If something seems towny now, why should something that happened days ago stop it from seeming towny? This board puts far, far too much faith in ability to take what someone says and convict them with it. Its why the mislynch rate here is out of control. Everyone's too busy reading players and not actually reading the GAME. You guys keep doing that, I'm going to work on figuring out the hard data as best I can.
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fire_bolt posted...

Everyone's too busy reading players and not actually reading the GAME

Well spoken by the guy who has not read the game.
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Lopen posted...

Well spoken by the guy who has not read the game.

*rolls eyes*

Good job misunderstanding what I said. Going back and sifting thru the additional 1200 posts would be reading players, not the game. THIS is the game right now:

1. Blade (Meow1000) / Scare (ScareChan) doctor
2. Corrik (Corrik7) BP town
3. FD (Forceful_Dragon) town vanilla
4. HB (Hbthebattle) town vanilla
5. IGCD (IfGodCouldDie) unclaimed
6. Lea (Leanansidhe) vanilla (but didn't claim TOWN vanilla, note in post 149 this thread)
7. Lopen (Lopen) a bullshit claim no one believes and also vanilla
8. MZero (MZero11) unclaimed
9. SBell (Obellisk) / Firebolt (fire_bolt) town vanilla

Deadlist:
KN2: Red - Asato Kido, TOWN Shadow Psychic (roleblocker)
LD1: Ulti - Yusuke Urameshi, TOWN Tracker
KN3: Brohan - Botan, TOWN Watcher
KN1: Han - Jorge the Ogre, TOWN Vanilla
LD4: Ben - Toya, TOWN Vanilla
KN4: Gravy - Shishiwakamaru, TOWN Vanilla

LD3: Chris - Ruka, MAFIA Roleblocker
LD2: Sultan - Shinobu Sensui, Untargetable Serial Killer

Like I said, you folks busy yourself with WIFOM'ing into the abyss. I've got better uses for my time.
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Oh okay. So when you say you read the game you figure out the entire game from a list of roleclaims. No wonder you're so bad at this.
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My favorite part of this is how Lopen has completely abandoned any semblance of trying to scum hunt in order to pick on a guy who replaced in as a favor to the GM. Very classy
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The scum is Corrik but you're pursuing a stupid mass claim thing we don't actually need to do to figure out who the scum are, so I'm picking on you instead in hopes we won't waste the rest of the day trying to mass claim when we could just lynch Corrik or do literally anything else.

What further scum hunting would you like me to do based on the last few pages? I've built my case, and I think enough people believe in it that he'll likely be lynched.
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Thanks

##unvote:
##vote: IGCD

MZero won't be here for awhile I think so ur turn IGCD.

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Look. He moved off me and I didn't even claim. This is a guy who is just faking caring about a mass claim.
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