Poll of the Day > Would mandatory gun ownership prevent Mass SchoolShootings?

(+) Yeah! (+)

Think about it, if everyone owns a gun it would work like countries and nuclear weapons, as a deterrent because people will be afraid of being shoot back...and even if the shooter plans to suicide he will get killed faster and more innocents will survive
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Except that countries with nuclear weapons have a million systems in place to ensure they aren't used and all it takes is one idiot with a gun to shoot someone and then everyone in the place starts shooting each other in mass confusion.
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Zareth posted...

Except that countries with nuclear weapons have a million systems in place to ensure they aren't used and all it takes is one idiot with a gun to shoot someone and then everyone in the place starts shooting each other in mass confusion.

That. Also, mandatory gun ownership probably would mean they have to take it to school...
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There are school shootings but students still choose to go to school... so they must agree it's not a real problem.
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yourDaddie posted...

if everyone owns a gun it would work like countries and nuclear weapons, as a deterrent because people will be afraid of being shoot back.

So then why doesn't Trump let NK keep their nukes?

knivesX2004 posted...

yourDaddie posted...

if everyone owns a gun it would work like countries and nuclear weapons, as a deterrent because people will be afraid of being shoot back.

So then why doesn't Trump let NK keep their nukes?

The two situations aren't comparable. Nukes as a deterrent only works because of mutually assured destruction... school shooters typically already want to die so the deterrent is no longer relevant.
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I voted for the third option but I feel it'll be a combination of the second and third options. It won't prevent mass shootings but there are bound to be more gun related incidents if everyone is always walking around strapped.
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there will be way more shootings and way more students will die
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America: "We have more guns than anyone else and, in what I'm sure is a totally unrelated coincidence, we also have an enormous problem with school shootings that none of our contemporaries seem to be suffering from. I wonder what is causing it and what we can do to fix it..."
Rest of the World: "You know, the rest of us have kind of figured this out, but maybe - just maybe - the problem has something to do with-"
America: "I've got it!! More guns! That outta do the trick!"
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I think it would make no difference. The only way this decision would help is IF, when the mass shooting starts, someone shoots the aggressor before he/she makes more victims, and not that many people would be willing to do so even if they had a gun.

Mandatory gun ownership is just as stupid of an idea as gun control.
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I think mandatory gun ownership only works if we live in a future where we all wear glasses similar to google glass which will use AR to make anyone that is a bad guy have a red shine to them. Until then putting more guns into a situation that is usually quite chaotic could easily lead to more deaths where someone is thinking that he/she is shooting the bad guy but isn't.
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RedPixel posted...

Mandatory gun ownership is just as stupid of an idea as gun control.

How is gun control a stupid idea?

CaptainStrong posted...

RedPixel posted...

Mandatory gun ownership is just as stupid of an idea as gun control.

How is gun control a stupid idea?

maybe he thinks both are good ideas

RedPixel posted...

Mandatory gun ownership is just as stupid of an idea as gun control.

So why does it work so well in Israel? Everybody is part of the militia, everyone is trained, everyone has an issued submachinegun: minimal terrorism besides being a such a fat target, no school shootings.

Hmm... no school shootings in the US when grandma had a .32 on the nightstand, and grandpa had the Mauser he brought back from the Great War. And all the kids had .22s and Daisy BB guns, the little kids had cap pistols and cork guns and played cowboys, g-men, soldiers, etc. vs. bad guys.

Now snowflakes are protesting the political candidate that rode in a Memorial Day parade in a version of the old Rat Patrol jeep, with a fake machinegun on the rollbar. They complained that it "scared the children". Seriously? Memorial Day?
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It's not that American culture has a problem with guns. It's that America is every culture with guns.

This has got to be one of the stupidest things I've read in a long time. PotD never changes.
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IMO... No. And neither would banning guns result in a true decline in school violence. While the tool would be less effective there would still be people engaging in violent acts. Here is what I see as the primary cause.

1) Publicity. If you engage in school violence and shoot up a school you will hit the national news. Your name will be plastered everywhere. You may go down as a villain but you will go down as something. For someone who feels depressed, useless, and suicidal this is the 'jackpot' since you can make a mark on the world while, hopefully, also ending the lives of those who made your life hell.

2) Social media. No. I'm not going to go nuts on social media being evil. What I will say is that it allows massive amounts of negativity to reach a person while in the comfort of their own home while, at the same time, seeing the success and positivity of others. Can you imagine how devistating it must feel to find out that the girl you had a crush on is dating the kid who bullies you... and then have to be reminded of it every time you use facebook?

3) Terrible schools. The fact is that American schools are horrible. They're basically processing factories in which the product is, instead of packaged meat, students. Not even ones with 'good grades'; just graduates. There is little encouragement to engage with the students, teachers, classmates, or generally anyone if the only thing that really 'matters' is getting that A. Teachers only intercede when it can harm their career, students form cliques, and students have little reason to talk to teachers or staff even in dire need.

4) A lack of self-worth. This is probably the biggest one. Now-a-days so much of who we are and what we are worth is decided by external factors with little control. Are you a boy or girl? Not only is one going to be praised by the other but you'll find society actively chastising the other merely for existing. Are you gay, straight, or something else? You'll be favored or chastised. What music you like, what color your skin is, what your hobbies and desires are... they can so easily lead into a massive loss in self-worth. Once you have nothing left to lose, are reminded of it every day, merely going to school is a trial, and you will become famous if you do it as well as potentially kill those who made your life a living hell... Why not?
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^ And related to #4 would be an inability to see the worth of others. It's easy for number #4 to lead to a breakdown in the ability to see the worth of anyone at all, not just the self.
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It would, with utmost certainty, make the problem worse.
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Closing all schools will prevent all school shootings.

The reason you have so many shootings is because you have so many guns. If homeowners were less likely to have guns, criminals would be less likely to carry them, and vice versa.
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zebatov posted...

The reason you have so many shootings is because you have so many guns. If homeowners were less likely to have guns, criminals would be less likely to carry them, and vice versa.

That explains every country with guns (most) without school shootings.
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No way. If anything, mandatory ownership would make it worse.
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Presuming you're talking mandatory carry and not just ownership, mass shootings might go down, but smaller-scale shootings would go way, way up. People that are angry lash out with whatever they have. If that's fists, people get punched. If that's a gun, people get shot.
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Unbridled9 posted...

3) Terrible schools. The fact is that American schools are horrible. They're basically processing factories in which the product is, instead of packaged meat, students. Not even ones with 'good grades'; just graduates. There is little encouragement to engage with the students, teachers, classmates, or generally anyone if the only thing that really 'matters' is getting that A. Teachers only intercede when it can harm their career, students form cliques, and students have little reason to talk to teachers or staff even in dire need.

So much this. Therefore, I approve this statement:

EightySeven posted...

Closing all schools will prevent all school shootings.

That's it. Problem solved. Vote me for next election. XD
No, seriously, it's about time for the whole education system to change.

dancer62 posted...

So why does it work so well in Israel? Everybody is part of the militia, everyone is trained, everyone has an issued submachinegun: minimal terrorism besides being a such a fat target, no school shootings.

This is 100% wrong, as Israel itself has attempted to explain to the NRA nuts who attempted to make this same point. First off, the idea that everyone is issued a submachine gun is complete horseshit and is not even a little bit true. Israeli gun laws are significantly tighter than American gun laws. There is no guaranteed right to bear arms. Private ownership of weapons is restricted to those who can prove that their professions or places of residence put them in danger. Weapons ownership requires licensing that must be renewed every three years (and renewals can be denied - about 80% of all gun license applications in Israel are rejected). Licensing includes background checks, mandatory training (above and beyond their mandatory military service), and medical exams, including a mental health assessment, all of which must be repeated every three years to get the license renewed.

Consequently, there are only ~4.17 privately owned guns per 100 people in Israel, putting Israel at #81 in terms of levels of gun ownership worldwide (the US, by contrast, is #1 at 101.05 per 100, infamously being the only country in the world with more guns than people).

If you're going to argue this point, do yourself a favour and back up your arguments with facts rather than bullshit.

Kyuubi4269 posted...

That explains every country with guns (most) without school shootings.

I don't think you quite understand the scope of the problem.

The US has more guns than anyone. And not just by a little bit either - the next runners up are Serbia and Yemen (at 58.21 and 54.80 per 100 people) and those two countries are the only ones who have more than half of the US's gun ownership rate (#4 on the list is Cyprus, with "only" 36.4 guns per 100 people).

But perhaps more worryingly than raw numbers of guns is the laws surrounding those guns. Most countries in the world where guns are common have legal infrastructure in place to support gun ownership, including licensing, registration, background checks, medical exams, mandatory training, and mandatory wait times; US laws on the subject are almost comically threadbare, and America seems to be the only country that thinks it's a good idea to hand out guns to anyone who wants to plunk down the money to buy one without doing any more than the bare minimum to make sure those guns don't wind up in the wrong hands.
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And, of course, same same people saying "we shouldn't restrict guns, it's a mental health issue!" are the same people slashing funding for mental health services and refusing to do anything to extend those services to said mentally ill people.
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adjl posted...

And, of course, same same people saying "we shouldn't restrict guns, it's a mental health issue!" are the same people slashing funding for mental health services and refusing to do anything to extend those services to said mentally ill people.

It also conveniently ignores the fact that most shootings - both of the mass-killing and the everyday variety - are not committed by the mentally ill.
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Aside from the personal freedom issue inherent in forcing people to own a gun whether they want to or not, there are assloads of people who have no business owning a gun. Ever. Morons who can't be bothered with gun safety, people with anger issues, people who are practically blind, people with no coordination, people who are more likely to have their own gun used against them... The idea is laughable.
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