Board 8 > Politics Containment Topic 96: Completely Fucked

(+) Yeah! (+)

FFDragon posted...

There are higher odds of Trump nuking the blue parts of this election heatmap than there are of him resigning.

Particularly when his wife in NYC.

Probably not joking.
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I agree he won't just resign...without thinking he's making a great deal, anyway. Think South Park with the Writers Guild-episode where Canada wants some of that internet money and eventually gets almost nothing, but they get something to let them act like winners afterward.

Okay, I'm getting carried away now, but I don't know if the man best known for firing people (and pussy-grabbing) will want his final moment of fame be having the nation fire him.
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Nelson_Mandela posted...

Jakyl25 posted...

Nelson_Mandela posted...

LapisLazuli posted...

You can keep telling yourself that, doesn't help you! This thing is exploding right now.

I don't care. It's a win-win for me. Either the better person becomes President (Pence), or Trump barrels through all of this noise and you have to suffer for four years.

I'm just calling it as I see it objectively right now.

Be honest. In your heart of hearts, which option seems more likely, and why?

Trump ain't getting impeached. I think the Russia stuff is being pushed by the Dems because they can't offer a real alternative to him.

Do you believe, in your heart of hearts, that Trump is not guilty of all charges?

ASSUMING THE COMEY NOTES ARE REAL, the Obstruction of Justice charge can't be any clearer.

1.) "Can you let this Russia investigation go?"
2.) *Comey doesn't let investigation go*
3.) *Comey is fired by Trump*
4.) *Trump admits directly on national television that he decided to fire Comey because of the Russia investigation*


That's, like, open and shut. The only thing left is confirming Step 1.
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Or in other words, "it's not the crime that took him down, it was the cover-up."
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There's the Nixon defense. If the president does it, according to his judgment of what is best for the country, then it is legal.
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red sox 777 posted...

There's the Nixon defense. If the president does it, according to his judgment of what is best for the country, then it is legal.

Doesn't have to be illegal to be impeachable.

Otherwise you could never impeach someone
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blowjobs and extramarital sex aren't illegal either and republicans weren't happy with that at all
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Peace___Frog posted...

blowjobs and extramarital sex aren't illegal either and republicans weren't happy with that at all

No but perjury is
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oh right

I do often forget that part
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PS2_4Life posted...

I wish Australia had a leader like Trump we only have a leader who is fucking useless like the token black fella obama

wut
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PS2_4Life posted...

I wish Australia had a leader like Trump we only have a leader who is fucking useless like the token black fella obama

Trump hasn't accomplished anything either, so I suppose they're equal.
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trump also allowed a foreign leader's bodyguards to attack Americans with no retaliation, so Trump is simultaneously a cuck and a hypocrite - Turks over Americans, am I right?
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PS2_4Life posted...

I wish Australia had a leader like Trump we only have a leader who is fucking useless like the token black fella obama

This is what the contest brings us.
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http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/flynn-manafort-are-key-figures-russia-probe-mueller-will-lead-n761256

If you can look at everything about Flynn and Manafort and can't see their connections to Russia, you're blind. They're both going down. Proving Trump had knowledge that they were compromised is the tricky part, but we have a pretty strong paper trail he knew about Flynn and disregarded.
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Peace___Frog posted...

trump also allowed a foreign leader's bodyguards to attack Americans with no retaliation, so Trump is simultaneously a cuck and a hypocrite - Turks over Americans, am I right?

I really don't think you can pin that on Trump. There's plenty of fair ammunition.
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Let's be honest, Trump is probably the biggest cuck in America right now.

Melania hates him for the position he's put her in, and you know she's banging other dudes in Trump Tower.
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I strongly believe that that would not have happened if Erdogan didn't think that Trump gave no shits about the Kurdish protesters.
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I do think it's possible that Trump wasn't directly involved in any collusion with the Russians, but he's still making all the moves you would make if you were performing a coverup (and were very stupid).

He might end up being the first guy to go down for covering up something he didn't even do!
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LordoftheMorons posted...

I do think it's possible that Trump wasn't directly involved in any collusion with the Russians, but he's still making all the moves you would make if you were performing a coverup (and were very stupid).

He might end up being the first guy to go down for covering up something he didn't even do!

This is the comedy option.
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LordoftheMorons posted...

He might end up being the first guy to go down for covering up something he didn't even do!

I mean, Nixon wasn't actually involved in Watergate was he? <_<

Jakyl25 posted...

I really don't think you can pin that on Trump. There's plenty of fair ammunition.

You can blame him for not advocating at all for human rights and constantly praising strongmen. I think it's reasonably likely that Erdogan's goons wouldn't have dared do what they did if Obama was still president (I'm too lazy to look it up, but did Obama even invite any US allies who were as garbage of people to the White House as Erdogan or Duterte?).
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Reg posted...

I mean, Nixon wasn't actually involved in Watergate was he? <_<

Iirc he at least was employing the Plumbers and had tasked them with stopping leakers; I don't remember if he knew of the specific plot ahead of time or not.
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oh apparently Chelsea Manning got released today
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FFDragon posted...

oh apparently Chelsea Manning got released today

I'm hoping her pseudo-celebrity status will help her get back on her feet relatively easily.

Skyridge87 posted...

FFDragon posted...

oh apparently Chelsea Manning got released today

I'm hoping her pseudo-celebrity status will help her get back on her feet relatively easily.

This is kind of a weird thing to see after we just had a few days of hating on Trump for leaking stuff to Russia
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LordoftheMorons posted...

Jakyl25 posted...

I really don't think you can pin that on Trump. There's plenty of fair ammunition.

You can blame him for not advocating at all for human rights and constantly praising strongmen. I think it's reasonably likely that Erdogan's goons wouldn't have dared do what they did if Obama was still president (I'm too lazy to look it up, but did Obama even invite any US allies who were as garbage of people to the White House as Erdogan or Duterte?).

Hell no on Duterte.

But yes on Erdogan. He's a leader of a NATO ally; kinda hard to shut him out entirely without making a huge international move towards condemning him and demanding his removal.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ce6-LLiUsAAMHLx.jpg

I don't begrudge Trump for meeting with him either.
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Skyridge87 posted...

FFDragon posted...

oh apparently Chelsea Manning got released today

I'm hoping her pseudo-celebrity status will help her get back on her feet relatively easily.

She almost certainly has a book deal or three already.
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Have the z grade celebrities left hollywood for canada yet

Not_an_Owl posted...

Skyridge87 posted...

FFDragon posted...

oh apparently Chelsea Manning got released today

I'm hoping her pseudo-celebrity status will help her get back on her feet relatively easily.

She almost certainly has a book deal or three already.

her release gofundme fund was at like 137k so she is probably okay for right now.

Skyridge87 posted...

FFDragon posted...

oh apparently Chelsea Manning got released today

I'm hoping her pseudo-celebrity status will help her get back on her feet relatively easily.

I hope this is an OJ situation and she gets arrested agaij because shes a fucking disgrace
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bad take

Eddv posted...

Skyridge87 posted...

FFDragon posted...

oh apparently Chelsea Manning got released today

I'm hoping her pseudo-celebrity status will help her get back on her feet relatively easily.

I hope this is an OJ situation and she gets arrested agaij because shes a fucking disgrace

Agreed
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I just think it's a little hypocritical to go "Trump told the Russians stuff, impeach him!" and then turn around and go "I'm glad Chelsea Manning is free I hope they have a good life"
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I don't even think the first one, but surely you can see how those are not the same situation? like..one reported on what people in power in their own country were doing that was horrific. the other told a foreign power state secrets while under suspicion for possible collusion with said power (which, they honestly had the right to divulge as head of state...but not the same situation)

Unknown_voter posted...

I don't even think the first one, but surely you can see how those are not the same situation? like..one reported on what people in power in their own country were doing that was horrific. the other told a foreign power state secrets while under suspicion for possible collusion with said power (which, they honestly had the right to divulge as head of state...but not the same situation)

They seem like pretty close to the same situation to me. Leaking classified stuff is leaking classified stuff, whether you think there's a "noble" cause behind it or not.

The only difference is Manning leaked a hell of a lot more stuff
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Unknown_voter posted...

I don't even think the first one, but surely you can see how those are not the same situation? like..one reported on what people in power in their own country were doing that was horrific. the other told a foreign power state secrets while under suspicion for possible collusion with said power (which, they honestly had the right to divulge as head of state...but not the same situation)

You realize that reporting allows foreign powers to hear about these horrific things, right?
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I mean if you are Lawful aligned, yeah they both did a not lawful thing. In that way its the same.

if you are Chaotic aligned, the actions are very different. (and honestly, I don't think either action was wrong personally.)

lawful aligned people are dumb tho

SupremeZero posted...

Unknown_voter posted...

I don't even think the first one, but surely you can see how those are not the same situation? like..one reported on what people in power in their own country were doing that was horrific. the other told a foreign power state secrets while under suspicion for possible collusion with said power (which, they honestly had the right to divulge as head of state...but not the same situation)

You realize that reporting allows foreign powers to hear about these horrific things, right?

This. Like, yeah... Sure, it opened eyes to some of the horrific things that have happened.

And then some of those things were used in al-Qaida propaganda videos

Leaking them on a worldwide stage is absolutely not something you do in that situation.
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One did it as a protest against an abuse of power.

The other one did it as an act of abuse of power.

I know people like to try to boil motive out of things in order to try to make two different situations the same, but motive is absolutely important.

I mean after all, attacking someone with a baseball bat's context changes if you're doing it because you hate that person, or if you're doing it because they're attacking someone else.
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StealThisSheen posted...

They seem like pretty close to the same situation to me. Leaking classified stuff is leaking classified stuff, whether you think there's a "noble" cause behind it or not.

The only difference is Manning leaked a hell of a lot more stuff

I don't know that much about the Manning case so I won't comment on that specifically, but as far as this generalization goes, I disagree with it 100%. This attitude is why no one wants to become a whistleblower. Like 80% of the stuff we know about the Trump administration is from leaks. We need MORE people willing to expose dirty laundry, not less.

There's also an intrinsic difference between a whistleblower and a government official leaking information to another country, but even if you try to compare them, what Trump did is an entirely different scenario. He wasn't exposing dirty laundry. He was...actually I don't know what the hell he was doing. There really doesn't seem to be much point to it! He gave sensitive information - both belonging to the US and other countries - to a country which is currently acting questionable at best.
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BowserCuffs posted...

One did it as a protest against an abuse of power.

The other one did it as an act of abuse of power.

A protest that put people's lives in danger and strengthened the resolve of our enemies.

You can protest without doing it in the utterly idiotic way Manning did it.
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SupremeZero posted...

Unknown_voter posted...

I don't even think the first one, but surely you can see how those are not the same situation? like..one reported on what people in power in their own country were doing that was horrific. the other told a foreign power state secrets while under suspicion for possible collusion with said power (which, they honestly had the right to divulge as head of state...but not the same situation)

You realize that reporting allows foreign powers to hear about these horrific things, right?

And? Maybe if our army is doing things that are making us look bad, then maybe we should reconsider doing them?
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SupremeZero posted...

Unknown_voter posted...

I don't even think the first one, but surely you can see how those are not the same situation? like..one reported on what people in power in their own country were doing that was horrific. the other told a foreign power state secrets while under suspicion for possible collusion with said power (which, they honestly had the right to divulge as head of state...but not the same situation)

You realize that reporting allows foreign powers to hear about these horrific things, right?

again, I don't take issue with what trump did. I think it is overblown anger. However, letting the American public know their government is committing evil acts is unquestionably good, even if foreign govs also know now. attempting to share info with the Russians (but not the us press or people while under investigation for close ties to russia) to work together to fight isis, while potentially hurting our international standing due to leaked info from other govs we weren't supposed to, is far murkier.

KamikazePotato posted...

We need MORE people willing to expose dirty laundry, not less.

I'm not personally taking a stance on this one way or another

I'm simply saying it seems kinda dumb to "SHAME TRUMP SHAME" and "YAY MANNING YAY" because they both did basically the same stupid thing that could have caused a multitude of problems, regardless of motive.

I'm not saying Manning didn't have a good motive, or that there shouldn't be whistleblowers, etc.

I'm saying the way Manning chose to go about it was utterly idiotic and without any consideration for what it may cause, so it's tough for me to agree with people that call her a hero while calling Trump stupid
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Unknown_voter posted...

while potentially hurting our international standing due to leaked info from other govs we weren't supposed to

I mean, this literally happened with Manning, too, so
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StealThisSheen posted...

SupremeZero posted...

Unknown_voter posted...

I don't even think the first one, but surely you can see how those are not the same situation? like..one reported on what people in power in their own country were doing that was horrific. the other told a foreign power state secrets while under suspicion for possible collusion with said power (which, they honestly had the right to divulge as head of state...but not the same situation)

You realize that reporting allows foreign powers to hear about these horrific things, right?

This. Like, yeah... Sure, it opened eyes to some of the horrific things that have happened.

And then some of those things were used in al-Qaida propaganda videos

Leaking them on a worldwide stage is absolutely not something you do in that situation.

our government is currently funding al qaeda

it did so under obama as well.

https://mobile.twitter.com/BillCorbett/status/864973475517255681

"You had to apologize to yogurt today" directed to Alex Jones saying ".@POTUS is the target of coup d?état being undertaken by the Deep State & government-controlled MSM - (link: https://www.infowars.com/deep-state-mainstream-media-pushes-coup-detat-against-trump/) infowars.com/deep-state-mai? #usa"
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It doesnt matter. Lets not pretend this on the same level as people leaking the contents of memos or Trumps mood.

Manning wasnt leaking hot gossip, she leaked state secrets, some of it top secret.

She put real live people at risk and kingmade the king shithead Julian Assange. She took the entire process into her own hands and unilaterally made decisions that effected millions. All because she was selfish and couldnt be assed to go through proper channels to express her concerns. She is a traitor. In a less kind era she would have been hung. I find her even worse than Snowden because she betrayed the trust of the entire military.

It was a crime when Bush admin did it to Valerie Plame, it was a crime when Manning did it, it was always always a crime.

She is not a hero shes a god damn disgrace.
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Eddv posted...

It doesnt matter. Lets not pretend this on the same level as people leaking the contents of memos or Trumps mood.

Manning wasnt leaking hot gossip, she leaked state secrets, some of it top secret.

She put real live people at risk and kingmade the king shithead Julian Assange. She took the entire process into her own hands and unilaterally made decisions that effected millions. All because she was selfish and couldnt be assed to go through proper channels to express her concerns. She is a traitor. In a less kind era she would have been hung. I find her even worse than Snowden because she betrayed the trust of the entire military.

It was a crime when Bush admin did it to Valerie Plame, it was a crime when Manning did it, it was always always a crime.

She is not a hero shes a god damn disgrace.

https://media2.giphy.com/media/b9aScKLxdv0Y0/giphy.gif?response_id=591d04e3a802fae40ae41c39

Sums up my feelings exactly!
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More Flynn news!

Flynn delayed a US military operation on behalf of Turkey (who, as we recently found out, was paying him): http://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/article151149702.html

And Trump knew Flynn was under investigation for his ties to Turkey before his inauguration:
http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/333991-report-trump-knew-flynn-was-under-investigation-weeks-before

"Lock him up! Lock him up!"
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