Board 8 > transience asks questions about the bracket

(+) Yeah! (+)

CaptainOfCrush posted...

EDIT: Wait, was that match during the same day as the big Starcraft/ME2 showdown? I kinda remember that "a-ha!" moment at the time when we realized that two rallied western games would help Bioshock.

That was also factor, and one that I took into consideration when making the stats, although it was still doing very well even before that.

Some more comparison numbers (with some removed just so the list isn't really long):

Kingdom Hearts II - 32.82768
Metal Gear Solid 3 - 31.17118976
Metal Gear Solid - 31.16495552
Kingdom Hearts - 31.08406576
Shadow of the Colossus - 28.94601069
Metal Gear Solid 2 - 28.86813516
Goldeneye - 28.81953144
Bioshock - 28.46677734
Final Fantasy IV - 28.28954
Grand Theft Auto V - 28.0987136
Final Fantasy Tactics - 27.188227
Metal Gear Solid 4 - 27.10909814
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_SJimW_ posted...

It annoys me that people are almost certainly going to vote based on a few big releases rather than quantity of releases, because the latter has how I've always judged gaming years as someone who buys dozens of games a year.

I grew up with the "you get one game on your birthday" approach and had to make games really last. I was always really confused by people who played dozens of games each year, because I usually pick games I know I can spend a long time on, and then do so. For me, it makes sense to only look at games of personal value or of significance to the gaming community.

I can't wait to read the 2009 writeup
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transcience posted...

Silent Hill/Bioshock is one in a line of old > new results that I'm expecting to see here.i wish we had more matchups like 1999/2007 because while 07 is a much better year, I could see a glory year way overperforming because of our audience withdrawing from video games after a certain time.

Silent Hill 2 is one of those games that has legitimately grown in strength over time. It's one of those legacy games that people are deeming a classic now that a lot of time has passed. That completely lines up with GameFAQs' love of old games, so yeah.

also I mentioned mgs5! post #96 yo

So you did! That's just how forgettable the game is heh heh hehe
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So do people think God of War is still legit on gamefaqs in 2017? I have my doubts. Like, "Phoenix Wright could be 2005's 3rd-strongest game at this point" doubts. God of War doesn't feel like a very gamefaqs-y kind of game, it's out of the peak nostalgia zone and doesn't have a major gamefaqs-approved franchise to fall back on, Kratos looked dreadful in 2013 (https://www.gamefaqs.com/poll/5249-character-battle-ix-division-9-round-2-mega-man-vs-kratos-vs) and while God of War missing the 2015 bracket isn't completely damning it's certainly not a good sign. (DDJ's unofficial THE LIST from 2014 suggests it probably wouldn't have had enough nominations to make the bracket even if SBAllen had just picked the top 128 most nominated games.)
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AxemRedRanger posted...

So do people think God of War is still legit on gamefaqs in 2017?

Not at all, it's done nothing but decline since 2010. It didn't have a single representative in the 2015 games contest, and Kratos himself looked a lot weaker in 2013. I honestly think Phoenix Wright might be a bigger asset for 2005 than GoW is nowadays.
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totally. that might change when the new one comes out, but for now that series is toast.
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It's kind of too bad that 2017 isn't in this. Breath of the Wild is possibly the strongest game since 2006.
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Shadow of the Colossus proved it was legit in the last Games Contest, but it can't carry a year. RE4 is 2005's big representative and it looked a little shaky last contest. It underperformed in every match. Ace Attorney is only worth so much. I had 2005 > 2003 initially, but the more I thought about it, I ended up swapping to 2003 winning.
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I think SOTC is only legit by modern standards. put it against a classic and it folds hard. Tetris would whoop it.
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Tetris was fairly close to SotC in the stats anyway, and that's if you don't think RBY did some funky sort of SFF to it. It really never got a chance to prove itself.
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CaptainOfCrush posted...

AxemRedRanger posted...

So do people think God of War is still legit on gamefaqs in 2017?

Not at all, it's done nothing but decline since 2010. It didn't have a single representative in the 2015 games contest, and Kratos himself looked a lot weaker in 2013. I honestly think Phoenix Wright might be a bigger asset for 2005 than GoW is nowadays.

God of War probably lost it's strength as soon as votals dropped off.

I can't imagine it ever beating Tales of Symphonia again.
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transcience posted...

- is SOTC legit?
- can Phoenix Wright bring in its enthusiastic fanbase on its own?
- does the Xbox 360 launch matter?

Not sure, I feel like hype for it is not the same anymore.
Maybe, with these votals a core B8 series might help.
Hell no.
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Is WW really that strong?

Is it one of those things where b8 is completely disconnected with the rest of the internet?
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Wind Waker broke 46% on FFVI last contest
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transcience posted...

I think SOTC is only legit by modern standards. put it against a classic and it folds hard. Tetris would whoop it.

Eh, I don't believe Tetris would whoop anything people actually like. Tetris whips fodder or things people have never heard of.
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I think it would win like 61-39.
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I'm not convinced it actually wins!

Tetris is that game everybody played but most people don't actually care about that much. It's the original mobile game.
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totally. I don't think 50% of the voters have even played SOTC. I just don't trust it at all.
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I didn't trust it last contest either, and it keeps proving me wrong.

Tetris is a game I don't trust against anything worth its salt.
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I have played Tetris but not SOTC, and I would probably vote for the later!
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LeonhartFour posted...

I'm not convinced it actually wins!

Tetris is that game everybody played but most people don't actually care about that much. It's the original mobile game.

I'm actually a huge Tetris fan but I realize I'm in the minority there. The people who actually care about Tetris as Tetris wouldn't be nominating Tetris, they'd be nominating Tetris: the Grand Master 3 or Tetris DS or something (depending on how hardcore they are about it). I don't think I trust its strength either.
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I've never played SotC so I'd easily vote for Tetris
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2006

top 5 games: Zelda: Twilight Princess, Oblivion, Final Fantasy XII, Okami, Kingdom Hearts 2
notable consoles/technology: Wii, PS3
GameFAQs strength: high
historical importance: high
rally potential: low
overall: medium-high

2006 is a pretty good at the top: two Zeldas and three RPGs. that's pretty much all that GameFAQs likes! Twilight Princess probably gets slightly weaker every year but it's still around Wind Waker's level at worst. Okami got like 42% on Metroid Prime which went toe to toe with Skyrim. KH2's hard to gauge but seems to be in that MGS3/RE4 range. FF12 seems to be growing in popularity as we get further away from it. it's not great but it can hold its own and brings the Final Fantasy name that has shown brand power over the years. Oblivion might be the weakest game in the pack at this point -- thanks, Skyrim -- but is still a nice fifth game. there's also Gears of War and Wii Sports which are probably the two biggest game to the mainstream public.

2006 draws 2011. that's a really interesting matchup. on paper, 2006 probably wins but Skyrim is a beast and will look like a champ if Oblivion is in the same match. Skyrim might be the strongest game on either side. then again, you've got Twilight Princess vs. Skyward Sword and 2006 just has more depth. it's an interesting matchup.

2006 also has the Wii and the PS3. the Wii would have been a big deal in 2006 or 2007 but I think people kind of scoff at it now. the PS3 might be a little bit better. I'm not sure. when I think of the PS3 and 2006, I think of 599 us dollars. it's probably a wash anyway.

if 2006 gets by 2011, it draws either 2004 or 1994. 2004 probably won't be too tough as 2006 has the bigger GameFAQs games. 1994 could be tough -- that said, Wind Waker hung with FF6 and KH2 might be able to hang with Super Metroid. if 2006 can neutralize those two monsters at the top, maybe it can pull off an upset. it certainly has more diverse games than 94 does.

if 2006 can beat 94, I don't see why it couldn't take out 91 or 02. if it's 91, Mario World/FF4 isn't radically different from Super Metroid/FF6 and I'd take TP/KH2 over Prime/KH1. I think 2006 is a fun pick to roll the dice with. it could make it all the way to 98.
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LeonhartFour posted...

I've never trusted GoldenEye's perceived strength and I don't think any of us would think it was worth that much if not for that Top Ten contest back in 2005 when it finished 8th out of nowhere.

Whoaaaa there mister, I'll have you know it was Goldeneye 007.

http://board8.wikia.com/wiki/Top_Ten_Games_List_2005

And I can assure you the poor showing in 2015 was entirely Undertale's fault. I haven't figured out how yet, but it MUST be true.


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I absolutely do not see 06 beating 94. I think if anything the Wii/PS3 works against those years and I don't think anything that year really stands up to FF6/Super Metroid at all. Plus 90s nostalgia.
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Mac Arrowny posted...

It's kind of too bad that 2017 isn't in this. Breath of the Wild is possibly the strongest game since 2006.

2017 could end up being our strongest year of the 2010s if we end up having another GotD contest.

We already have Breath of the Wild and Persona 5 as strong representatives for 2017, and we haven't even gotten Super Mario Odyssey yet (which is likely to get high review scores). Mass Effect: Andromeda turned out to be the biggest dud of 2017 so far, but the good news is that we still have 8 more months of games to strengthen a fairly good year. Very few late 2017 games are even known at this point, so we won't know until E3 the line-up of games to arrive later this year.
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surprised there wasn't more talk about 06! 07 coming soon
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2007

top 5 games: Super Mario Galaxy, Bioshock, Portal, Mass Effect, Call of Duty 4
GameFAQs strength: medium
historical importance: medium
rally potential: low
overall: medium

2007's funny. it's the PS3/360 equivalent of 2001 - TONS of new, huge franchises - but we're kind of biased against western games. we have some decent games like Bioshock and Portal here but they're so much less popular than they probably should be. Mario Galaxy has always been a weird anomaly - it's this hugely popular game on a platform that nobody likes - and was never as popular as it feels like it should be. it seems like it should be on the Mario 64 level but it came out in 2007 and not 1996.

2007 draws 2012 which we'll get to, but let's just say the result there isn't in question. it then runs into a brick wall in the form of 1997. I would have picked against 07 in a lot of instances but its path is set in stone.

- is Portal still popular a decade later with the memes being long dead?
- has Mass Effect fallen off with Andromeda being such a dud?
- is Galaxy going to grow as it gets older? it's had a great year, a horrid year and a nice rebound.
- COD4 is the biggest game of 07. is it old enough to be nostalgic yet? feels like it should be, but this is gamefaqs and we're not going to get too touchy-feely over a military fps.
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transience posted...

has Mass Effect fallen off with Andromeda being such a dud?

I don't think Andromeda really has any bearing on the original trilogy's popularity.
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same question for Mass Effect 3 I guess
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ME3 probably did hurt the series' overall stock, yeah.

(which is a shame because it's a top ten game and has the single best DLC I've ever played)
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2008

top 5 games: Super Smash Bros. Brawl, Fallout 3, Metal Gear Solid 4, Persona 4, Left 4 Dead
GameFAQs strength: medium
historical importance: low
rally potential: low
overall: medium

2008 was a giant year when it happened. Brawl, MGS4 and Fallout 3 were all top 20 games by 2009. since then, Brawl has become somewhat irrelevant with the hype gone and Smash 4 having replaced it. MGS4 has really fallen within the series and is a clear fourth. I think Fallout 3 is the 2008 GOTY at this point? it's still the high point of the series and the second strongest Bethesda game after Skyrim.

I always saw 2008 as a repeat of 2006 - a few big games that could carry the year - but after thinking about it, I think it's dangerous to rely on it too much. it faces 2009 in a match that should be easy before being fed to 2001. 2008's path seems clear.

- does Brawl still rate? we could get a Brawl/Melee repeat in round 2.
- does MGS4 have anything left? we could get a MGS4/MGS2 matchup in round 2.
- can Fallout 3 carry the year?
- Persona 4 has really grown. could it help 2008 shore up its newly found deficiencies?
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You are now remembering how ME2 went from dominating Game of the Year to getting annihalated by MGS3.

It actually ended up lower in the stats than 1 and 3 because I didn't know what to do with that result!
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This is where the years start getting REALLY weak, isn't it.
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transience posted...

COD4 is the biggest game of 07. is it old enough to be nostalgic yet? feels like it should be, but this is gamefaqs and we're not going to get too touchy-feely over a military fps.

Not really related to this contest but I was thinking earlier today, if we did another BGE contest, what if the CoD community tried rallying CoD4? This is pretty much the worse possible scenario in terms of the arguments people would have and what it would do to this community IMO.
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CoD4 would never be rallied in a million years. Most of the games people put forth as being rally-able...well, aren't. A rally requires a perfect storm of:

1. A really dumb (but easy to understand) joke

or

1. Is, at the moment, very popular and has a lot of people talking
2. A massive fanbase focused on that specific thing
3. A fanbase that feels like they have something to prove and/or feels like they're the plucky underdog
4. A fanbase that loves it (this does not go hand in hand with popularity)

L-Block was a dumb joke that everyone could understand. Draven was honestly more of a joke than people really wanting to support Draven or LoL - the character is an in-game meme. Undertale started as the second scenario and then took on some aspects of the first (lots of memes being thrown around in the later rounds), but overall its rally mostly stemmed from the game being at its peak of popularity/love and having a strong internet presense.

Call of Duty 4 doesn't fit any of those things. It's not a series that inspires great love in those who play it, even those that play it a ton. It doesn't have any big in-jokes to latch onto. After Infinite Warfare the series has the worst word-of-mouth its had in a while. Who in the world would rally for CoD4 here? Who would care? Even if people love the game it's old and not particularly relevant these days.

People were wondering if Hearthstone had a chance at catching a rally but that never had a shot either. I'm not going to call myself a genius on this subject because I did really badly in the 2015 contest, but overall I felt like Undertale had a large chance at catching a stupid rally and Hearthstone had no chance whatsoever. Heartstone might be played but a buttload of people but those people don't even like Hearthstone that much. That includes the people who play it a lot! Some games are more addicting than fun! There's nothing to inspire the sort of love that would make you cast your vote for something.

I'm going to go further - League of Legends only has a slightly better chance of catching a rally than Hearthstone does. Latching onto a LoL character is one thing. More universally understood and easier to get behind. The game itself, though? Man LoL's fanbase has never been happy with LoL. You put LoL up against any decent Mario game and it would fold immediately. The fanbase would vote Mario out of respect for the Mario legacy and because of how upset they are that X character is broken in Patch Y. LoL is one of those 'addicting but frustrating' games.

You know what series could have very easily caught a rally back when it was at the apex of its popularity? Five Nights at Freddy's. Fits everything in the second scenario and could easily become a joke in and of itself. If you thought GameFAQs was upset about Undertale - a game that is styled after 16-bit SNES JRPGs - then be glad FNAF was never given that chance.
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In fact, I think you can use Pokemon as an example of how difficult it is to get a real rally going. Pokemon is probably the most popular game series of all time. It's constantly current thanks to a stream of games/merchandising/anime ect. Its online communities are huge. And it still takes big rallying efforts to barely overcome our pitiful votals. As annoying as it is to see Pokemon characters win 99% of the time in close matches, by all rights those matches shouldn't be close if people were able to make even 1% of the Pokemon fanbase care. And even with huge inherent GameFAQs strength behind RBY and Melee, both of which are also two of the most beloved Nintendo games of all time with huge online presenses...they still couldn't overcome Undertale despite their own rally efforts.

Even though it's happened 3 times, creating a successful rally is really lightning in a bottle. I don't think anything right now would catch a rally. Maaaaaybe an Overwatch character? Definitely not the game itself.
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I think that's an interesting point. Undertale is a game whose fans regard it as a life-changing emotional experience, not just a good game. The love for the game itself is overwhelming, rather than it being simply a sometimes fun sometimes frustrating online game with a big online community around it. I think this is the secret sauce that made a Melee rally possible, too, it's not quite the same thing as Undertale but people who still stick with Melee are really seriously deep into it.

Also years.
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Paratroopa1 posted...

I think that's an interesting point. Undertale is a game whose fans regard it as a life-changing emotional experience, not just a good game. The love for the game itself is overwhelming, rather than it being simply a sometimes fun sometimes frustrating online game with a big online community around it. I think this is the secret sauce that made a Melee rally possible, too, it's not quite the same thing as Undertale but people who still stick with Melee are really seriously deep into it.

In addition to that - Melee fans have something to prove. They always will. Melee survived years of Brawl, Smash 4, and people labeling it 'Not a real fighting game', and it's somehow more popular than ever. That takes a dedicated fanbase that refuses to budge.

And even then, Melee's rally failed in part because they knew Undertale was the bigger Underdog. Some big Melee players actually told their fanbase to let Undertale have it because they'd played/loved the game and knew it needed the buzz more.
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2009

top 5 games: Uncharted 2, Arkham Asylum, Assassin's Creed 2, Dragon Age: Origins, Demon's Souls
notable releases: Modern Warfare 2, League of Legends, Minecraft Alpha
GameFAQs strength: low
historical importance: medium
rally potential: high
overall: ???

2009 is nuts. by gamefaqs standards it's a pretty bad year, almost definitely the worst of the 2000s. quick, what wins a GOTY poll if we re-ran it? Uncharted 2? Dragon Age? I don't know but it wouldn't be pretty. Japan straight up bailed on 2009: its most notable release looks kinda like a western RPG and the alternatives are the underwhelming NSMB Wii or Resident Evil 5.

the scary part comes in the form of League of Legends, and to a lesser extent Minecraft. let's start with League. first of all, it doesn't take a whole lot to turn these contests. this contest probably gets even less votes than your standard contest due to 'who the hell cares about video game years?'. I'm sure that League fans remember what happened, and if they can find a cause they might do something. it's unlikely, yes, but this contest is quite literally a house of cards. all you need is a gust of wind to knock the whole thing over.

Allen decided to go with 2009 for Minecraft which is the year of the alpha. its 1.0 release is 2011. I remember the Minecraft vs. Halo arguments, and as much as this site is averse to shooters, I think it prefers a real, legit game to something like Minecraft that is very sandbox-y and aimless. Minecraft has never shown an interest in overlapping with the gamefaqs audience so this one is even more unlikely -- but all you need is one thing to move the needle here. as we advance in years, we start getting more and more dedicated communities and less big gamefaqsy games.

2009 drew 2008 so it auto-loses if it's competing on gamefaqs strength. if it can draw from elsewhere, all bets are off.

- will Allen avoid putting League into the match pictures due to his poor experiences?
- Draven won as a joke; is League even a valid comparison?
- what would win a GOTY rematch?
- is this the worst japanese year of all time?
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I forget that LoL and Minecraft are so old.

I'm not sure either one can rally. I have little faith in 2009 to really accomplish anything. 2008 isn't strong, but it should whip 2009 pretty easily. And then get eaten by... 2001 next, right? Yeah.

When I was going over years and trying to compile a list of games that I really liked - know that my tastes trend really old-school, and thus trend japanese/indie and typically far away from western AAA with a few exceptions - 2009 is my least favorite year of gaming since 1986. It's just barren. My top 100 games had like only one 2009 game (L4D2) and nothing else that was even close.

The LoL Reddit page hated that rally nonsense as much as we did and banned it after that contest, so I'm not sure it tries anything.
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I also get the sense that maybe LoL is more beside the point now. Like, it's going as strong as ever, it's a huge fucking deal, but I don't think the fanbase is really at this point where it's ready to be mobilized to rally for a stupid contest, it's not new enough to inspire that kind of fervor. Overwatch is a more dangerous version of LoL but I don't know its community well enough to know 100% for sure

I think it'll be exceptionally difficult for any one game to get a rally in this format, even moreso than usual. It's about gaming years, not specific games.

Minecraft is fun but it doesn't inspire that 'love' I talked about. Maybe hype would be a better word? Minecraft is like the video game version of legos. People like it a lot, but no one is going to rally for legos.

Paratroopa1 posted...

I also get the sense that maybe LoL is more beside the point now. Like, it's going as strong as ever, it's a huge fucking deal, but I don't think the fanbase is really at this point where it's ready to be mobilized to rally for a stupid contest, it's not new enough to inspire that kind of fervor. Overwatch is a more dangerous version of LoL but I don't know its community well enough to know 100% for sure

This is also pretty spot-on. Draven was, what, 4 years ago? Back then League was relatively new and there was a sense of growing community that was exciting. The game is still popular but is much less exciting. The fans aren't going to go out in droves to vote for LoL on GameFAQs ever again.

Overwatch is much more dangerous, yeah. It's still in the honeymoon period though. People will be a lot more tired of Overwatch by the time it has a chance to actually do damage (in this format it has no chance). Right now if there was a character contest, an Overwatch character might be able to do something but there's no Draven type character for the fanbase to latch onto so it would be difficult.
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oh hey here's a fun poll

prove your worth Mario RPG
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Before I even look at the results of the poll, I can already tell you that SMRPG and Earthbound are going to be the two overperformers.

WHY DOES MARIO RPG ALWAYS GET THE MOST UNBALANCED POLLS argh
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anyway, I think the most interesting thing to watch here is Super Metroid as compared to LTTP. 10 years ago, Super Metroid would have gotten absolutely buried.
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