Current Events > i don't like it when people use "drug addict" to devalue people

(+) Yeah! (+)

its a disease, bruh. we shouldnt be writing these people off, they need support and assistance, not alienation.
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It's a self inflicted disease in most cases
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But some guy on Facebook with no education in the field said it's not a disease!
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Irony posted...

It's a self inflicted disease in most cases

Whether or not it's self-inflicted doesn't make it any less difficult for those who go through it
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I hate when I'm making points about gun control and they say but what about the drugs
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Irony posted...

It's a self inflicted disease in most cases

a world where someone has to suffer socially, physically, mentally, emotionally, financially, for one bad choice often made in a weakened state is not a world im okay with

billcom6 posted...

But some guy on Facebook with no education in the field said it's not a disease!

oh shit wait i know him
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Lord_Shadow posted...

I hate when I'm making points about gun control and they say but what about the drugs

i havent argued about guns in a long time, does this actually happen?
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ok
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BloodyNate posted...

Lord_Shadow posted...

I hate when I'm making points about gun control and they say but what about the drugs

i havent argued about guns in a long time, does this actually happen?

This was more a issue with all the school shootings were happening I was making some point about it and the other person who I'm going to refer to as peasant said well Drugs kill more people then guns do why aren't we doing more about that instead dealing with guns or something like that I had to point out that doing drugs are usually a choice that don't wipe entire classrooms and getting shot by a gun in that situation is really a choice.
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Lord_Shadow posted...

This was more a issue with all the school shootings were happening I was making some point about it and the other person who I'm going to refer to as peasant said well Drugs kill more people then guns do why aren't we doing more about that instead dealing with guns or something like that I had to point out that doing drugs are usually a choice that don't wipe entire classrooms and getting shot by a gun in that situation is really a choice.

its also always a shitty argument to say well theres this bad thing why cant we address that instead like bruh why dont we just do both and save so many lives
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BloodyNate posted...

they need support and assistance, not alienation.

but that requires effort. labeling, shaming, and mocking doesn't
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catboy0_0 posted...

but that requires effort. labeling, shaming, and mocking doesn't

it doesnt take very much effort to acknowledge the fact, though. if more people were empathetic to the most vulnerable then perhaps those who have the power to make change would actually do so
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well, you alienate yourself from your peers if you acknowledge that fact instead of jumping on the shame train though
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catboy0_0 posted...

well, you alienate yourself from your peers if you acknowledge that fact instead of jumping on the shame train though

id like to live in a world where empathy and consideration is the norm, rather than the exception.
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They have money thu n choose to spend it on drugs.. meanwhile some ppl have no money n have real problems..

bossjony posted...

They have money thu n choose to spend it on drugs.. meanwhile some ppl have no money n have real problems..

its less of choosing to spend money on drugs and more of have a compulsion to obtain drugs with money as the sole obstacle.

what about drug addiction is not a real problem, my friend?
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BloodyNate posted...

bossjony posted...

They have money thu n choose to spend it on drugs.. meanwhile some ppl have no money n have real problems..

its less of choosing to spend money on drugs and more of have a compulsion to obtain drugs with money as the sole obstacle.

what about drug addiction is not a real problem, my friend?

JUS let them die who cares?

bossjony posted...

JUS let them die who cares?

some people do
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catboy0_0 posted...

bossjony posted...

JUS let them die who cares?

some people do

Those ppl need worry about themselves n mind there own.

But long as the system makes money of addicts there will be them, jail, rehabs, medicine to cure them it's a cash cow.

i dont like 2018 because i feel like youre trolling except that i know people with that actual opinion
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bossjony posted...

Those ppl need worry about themselves n mind there own.

a lot of them were former users and it's rewarding to help people that were like them at a point in their lives
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BloodyNate posted...

Lord_Shadow posted...

This was more a issue with all the school shootings were happening I was making some point about it and the other person who I'm going to refer to as peasant said well Drugs kill more people then guns do why aren't we doing more about that instead dealing with guns or something like that I had to point out that doing drugs are usually a choice that don't wipe entire classrooms and getting shot by a gun in that situation is really a choice.

its also always a shitty argument to say well theres this bad thing why cant we address that instead like bruh why dont we just do both and save so many lives

I agree they didn't like me pointing that out either as I recall not to mention drugs had nothing to do with the discussion at hand they're too worried about someone taking their precious toys away to care about the lives of children.
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Lord_Shadow posted...

I agree they didn't like me pointing that out either as I recall not to mention drugs had nothing to do with the discussion at hand they're too worried about someone taking their precious toys away to care about the lives of children.

i struggle a bit with devaluing the feelings of those who want to keep guns. theres a lot of history and fear tied up in it, and saying that theyre afraid of someone taking their precious toys away is grossly oversimplifying the subject. that said, i also agree that guns do make our society more dangerous, but nobody is going to be convinced by being condescended to

but also, when i get frustrated i do sometimes condescend so i get where it comes from too. i think we all just need to try to listen a bit more
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As someone who has been poor af and generally struggled through life without drinking or even taking Tylenol as far as drugs go, I just gotta tell addicts with sob stories and reasonings to man up. And I had a pretty shit life. Reliance on something else to make me feel happy just would never cut it for me, had to actually get there.

Life is hard. Just gotta deal with it. Granted I've actually helped two friends kick their habits and kinda converted them to my ways.

They do need help, but not pity. They need to face reality. It's a choice that turns in to a disease ultimately, but you always choose to get there in the end.

You're looking for compassion and empathy in absolutely the worst place, I'm afraid. Can't expect the usual suspects on CE to have goodwill towards other people when they clearly hate themselves so much.
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R_Jackal posted...

As someone who has been poor af and generally struggled through life without drinking or even taking Tylenol as far as drugs go, I just gotta tell addicts with sob stories and reasonings to man up. And I had a pretty shit life. Reliance on something else to make me feel happy just would never cut it for me, had to actually get there.

Life is hard. Just gotta deal with it. Granted I've actually helped two friends kick their habits and kinda converted them to my ways.

They do need help, but not pity. They need to face reality. It's a choice that turns in to a disease ultimately, but you always choose to get there in the end.

i don't think you understand what addicition is. it's not a coping mechanism. it's chemical reliance.

what's more, just because your life sucked and went in one direction, doesn't mean that it's the same for others. some people muscle themselves out of depression. others have to slowly rise. everyone's different, and empathy will help you realize this.

pinky0926 posted...

Yyou're looking for compassion and empathy in absolutely the worst place, I'm afraid. Can't expect the usual suspects on CE to have goodwill towards other people when they clearly hate themselves so much.

i'm not looking for empathy at all. i'm promoting it.
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Why not just stop taking the drugs?!?!
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Turbam posted...

Why not just stop taking the drugs?!?!

:):):)
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when you destroy your family over it im sorry but i kind of have a hard time feeling sorry for you.
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Irony posted...

It's a self inflicted disease in most cases

Like others have said, that doesn't really matter.

Realistically, though, that is not always the case. Not only are some people born into the harshest conditions where drug use is (often violently) encouraged, but some people are forced into drugs through sex slavery. You also have to recognize that desperate people do desperate things, and even though it seems stupid to you, you don't really know what they are going through or what lead them to that situation. On top of that, you also have people who are prescribed addictive medications that lead them to addiction.

A lot of the time, it's horrible circumstances that leads to addiction, and though you may lack basic human empathy, you have to logically realize that you, too, are part of the society that enables that sort of circumstances that lead to addiction and crime.

DocileOrangeCup posted...

when you destroy your family over it im sorry but i kind of have a hard time feeling sorry for you.

i feel the most sorry for those people, because they have lost everything and hurt others in the process, which means they are really in it bad.
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Dash_Harber posted...

Irony posted...

It's a self inflicted disease in most cases

Like others have said, that doesn't really matter.

Realistically, though, that is not always the case. Not only are some people born into the harshest conditions where drug use is (often violently) encouraged, but some people are forced into drugs through sex slavery. You also have to recognize that desperate people do desperate things, and even though it seems stupid to you, you don't really know what they are going through or what lead them to that situation. On top of that, you also have people who are prescribed addictive medications that lead them to addiction.

A lot of the time, it's horrible circumstances that leads to addiction, and though you may lack basic human empathy, you have to logically realize that you, too, are part of the society that enables that sort of circumstances that lead to addiction and crime.

well said
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DocileOrangeCup posted...

when you destroy your family over it im sorry but i kind of have a hard time feeling sorry for you.

I think that's the most pitiful kind of person, myself. Imagine having a problem so bad that you can't even put your family first.

I've seen someone who was a good mother get addicted to meth and eventually have her child taken away by social services by the grandmother. Imagine that; your own mother enacting legal proceeding to take your child away from you when just 2 years ago you were a model parent. I think that's fucking tragic.
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BloodyNate posted...

i feel the most sorry for those people, because they have lost everything and hurt others in the process, which means they are really in it bad.

yea i dont really feel that. i mean i might be biased but nah, that's fucked up, you made the decision to get into that shit and broke up a family over it. then act all surprised when you dont have anywhere to go.
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DocileOrangeCup posted...

BloodyNate posted...

i feel the most sorry for those people, because they have lost everything and hurt others in the process, which means they are really in it bad.

yea i dont really feel that. i mean i might be biased but nah, that's fucked up, you made the decision to get into that shit and broke up a family over it. then act all surprised when you dont have anywhere to go.

i think the issue is that you're seeing addiction as a decision rather than a condition, my friend. i respectfully encourage you to look further into the issues surrounding addiction before passing such judgement.
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BloodyNate posted...

i think the issue is that you're seeing addiction as a decision rather than a condition, my friend. i respectfully encourage you to look further into the issues surrounding addiction before passing such judgement.

at least in the case im talking about, they did it to fit in and because they were fuckin stupid. they were both clean for long amounts of time yet the minute they had the opportunity they did it again and hurt the most important person in their life multiple times, and once you do something like that then im sorry but i cant forgive it.
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DocileOrangeCup posted...

at least in the case im talking about, they did it to fit in and because they were fuckin stupid. they were both clean for long amounts of time yet the minute they had the opportunity they did it again and hurt the most important person in their life multiple times, and once you do something like that then im sorry but i cant forgive it.

i don't know the situation nor will i pretend to. i'm more speaking about addiction at large.

what i have learned since working through therapy is that there's nearly always a whole lot more going on when people make these bad choices than it appears, and with little exception, people don't realize that they're in trouble until it's too late.
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BloodyNate posted...

DocileOrangeCup posted...

BloodyNate posted...

i feel the most sorry for those people, because they have lost everything and hurt others in the process, which means they are really in it bad.

yea i dont really feel that. i mean i might be biased but nah, that's fucked up, you made the decision to get into that shit and broke up a family over it. then act all surprised when you dont have anywhere to go.

i think the issue is that you're seeing addiction as a decision rather than a condition, my friend. i respectfully encourage you to look further into the issues surrounding addiction before passing such judgement.

You don't just start out addicted to shit. It's a series of choices. Empathy is great and all, but I don't think we need to pretend all addicts are deserving of sympathy simply by virtue of being an addict.
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DocileOrangeCup posted...

BloodyNate posted...

i think the issue is that you're seeing addiction as a decision rather than a condition, my friend. i respectfully encourage you to look further into the issues surrounding addiction before passing such judgement.

at least in the case im talking about, they did it to fit in and because they were fuckin stupid. they were both clean for long amounts of time yet the minute they had the opportunity they did it again and hurt the most important person in their life multiple times, and once you do something like that then im sorry but i cant forgive it.

So it was a relapse situation? I only ask because you sort of make it sound like getting clean for a period of time means that you are 'cured' and any future issues are just them making a stupid choice again.

shnangyboos posted...

You don't just start out addicted to shit. It's a series of choices. Empathy is great and all, but I don't think we need to pretend all addicts are deserving of sympathy simply by virtue of being an addict.

choices, perhaps, but it's also often a whole lot of circumstance, and especially when addiction starts young or under dangerous circumstances (as it most often does), it can hardly be called a choice.

beyond that, there is a lot of information being learned in epigenetic research that suggests that we may not have as much agency as we think, although i'm not going to spend time trying to convince you of that.

any time someone is sick, it's natural and even admirable to feel empathy and pity for them, regardless of if their illness was caused by their choices or not. it's really not very difficult to, in fact.
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BloodyNate posted...

i don't think you understand what addicition is. it's not a coping mechanism. it's chemical reliance.

what's more, just because your life sucked and went in one direction, doesn't mean that it's the same for others. some people muscle themselves out of depression. others have to slowly rise. everyone's different, and empathy will help you realize this.

Outside of being forced in to being an addict, which I understand is a thing, for a large portion they choose to stay that course. It's not like the information isn't there, they likely know what they're doing ahead of time.

I understand it all pretty damn well though, most of my extended family were/are addicts. Empathy didn't get too far with most of them. Reality and honesty has a better track record for me.

BloodyNate posted...

i don't know the situation nor will i pretend to. i'm more speaking about addiction at large.

what i have learned since working through therapy is that there's nearly always a whole lot more going on when people make these bad choices than it appears, and with little exception, people don't realize that they're in trouble until it's too late.

yeah i will agree with you there, that's why i dont like weed because like a dozen people i know started out on that and eventually moved onto harder shit.

Dash_Harber posted...

So it was a relapse situation? I only ask because you sort of make it sound like getting clean for a period of time means that you are 'cured' and any future issues are just them making a stupid choice again.

yeah sort of, but like multiple times and with one of them it lead them to go right back to jail. i know it doesnt make them immune to being dumb but they were good people before all of this.
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Ya'll welcome to be empathetic and put up crack addicts in your spare rooms, but I've had to call the cops on family members because they were damaging property, assaulting other family members, or stealing stuff (often irreplaceable stuff like our great great grandfathers gold watch that had been passed down) enough times that I'm done with it.
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DocileOrangeCup posted...

yeah sort of, but like multiple times and with one of them it lead them to go right back to jail. i know it doesnt make them immune to being dumb but they were good people before all of this.

They probably still are, but there isn't really a cure-all for addiction, sadly. It's not like they see it as wrong and do it because it's fun, it's an addiction and it alters their minds so that they see it as the only logical solution. It's like brainwashing.

Dash_Harber posted...

They probably still are, but there isn't really a cure-all for addiction, sadly. It's not like they see it as wrong and do it because it's fun, it's an addiction and it alters their minds so that they see it as the only logical solution. It's like brainwashing.

they've done unforgivable things and even when sober are fucked up in the head, so i dont really know what to say about that.
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Drug addict =/= Bad person

Irony posted...

It's a self inflicted disease in most cases

Eh...I mean, Pharma doesn't help in most cases. >_>
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How very admirable of you!

But seriously, I'm not disagreeing with you, just saying maybe not apply this thinking to all addicts. Some of them, believe it or not, are just flat out pieces of shit.

Also, empathy goes both ways. It's not just for you to put yourself in the downtrodden's place. Try to put yourself in the place of someone who dismisses addicts completely, and understand why they're there.
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Turbam posted...

Why not just stop taking the drugs?!?!

because druggies are scum
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R_Jackal posted...

Outside of being forced in to being an addict, which I understand is a thing, for a large portion they choose to stay that course. It's not like the information isn't there, they likely know what they're doing ahead of time.

I understand it all pretty damn well though, most of my extended family were/are addicts. Empathy didn't get too far with most of them. Reality and honesty has a better track record for me.

what do you mean by "stay the course?" do you mean they keep falling into their addictions? most people don't realize they're addicted until it's too late. hell, how many times have you thought "i'll make sure to get off CE by 10pm" only to find it's 2:57am and you're debating the finer points of addiction? we all let ourselves fall in to something thinking we won't, it's just that the most vulnerable fall into the worst things.

in addition, it's a very privileged thing to say that "the information is there." most people who become addicted are either never exposed to that information, or have that information countered with false information at the wrong time. how many times has someone told you not to mix liquors because it'll fuck you up? it's bullshit, but that time you were at your first party and fucking Fratboy Garrett said that, you made sure to stick to just tequila for the night, and you still got fucked up anyway.

OR how many times have you tried something where someone said "you'll get hurt" and you thought "nah, not me." that's literally a neurological fact about being young -- you think you're always going to be the exemption, even when all of the evidence says otherwise. we are physically unable to properly register consequence until our brains are fully formed, and addiction nearly always takes place prior to that.

it's all so much more nuanced than "they made a bad choice," and to say otherwise is reductive and damaging and literally killing people.
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