Lurker > Lopen

ViolentAbacus posted...

I honestly can't see how he would get that number just from a single scan for you or Ben.

I also don't know why he has been cagey with his role. With no true protection at this point there isn't a reason to hide the role. So I guess the answer is no? At this point I would play more openly with my info. But I'm also bad at the game.

Yes exactly. This is exactly why you shouldn't believe it. His claimed actions don't fit his suspects. His claimed response to those actions (thinking two guys who suspected someone for a very standard reason are 70-80% scum, particularly after you felt this person was unsure enough to scan) don't fit what results he received from his actions in a realistic way.

He also has no reason to be dodgy with his role specifics aside from not wanting to be caught in a lie.

ViolentAbacus posted...

This kind of explains my thoughts on Sultan better than I could, but for opposite reasons of why you think it looks bad on HB. I felt his vote at the end that was thrown on Ctes seemed more of a "look at me and who I'm not voting for" and a way for them to easily say this:

I don't think scum sultan puts himself out there quite that late. It needlessly draws attention and the lynch was clearly sbell at that point. That feels more like town who wasn't paying enough attention to the time scrambling to me.

Han could be godfather on a scumteam that had this exact play in mind.

Anyway I'm cooling on Han being 100% scum here. I do think he is not playing well but that is probably my fault. I am getting frustrated with him not pushing any lynches though and believing people on very questionable material. There is no reason to believe hb is town here. There is no reason to not push BCT harder if you started the questioning line on him I'm trying to believe there is town rationale for playing this passively and I'm struggling. The only time he has been playing aggressively was close to end of day, and it was on sbell for dumb reasoning (he sheeped town lynching scum as third party and he's sheeping that same town this game so he's scum? huh?)

ViolentAbacus posted...

I would say no? I am still a bit confused. If you believe HB's claim, then it should factor into it because math. That would apply to everyone and is a nonfactor to specific individuals? If that makes sense. I'm probably not explaining it right but oh well.

Here's a hypothetical. Let's assume you're cop.

A couple of players suspect a player in the game who is mostly inactive, due to them being mostly inactive. You decide to use your night action to scan that player.

The first question as town is, why did you scan them to begin with. Logically, you probably thought their alignment was at least somewhat in question, otherwise you wouldn't use your scan on them, right?

You scan the player innocent.

Now think further-- where does your head go from that point? How do you play the game from that point? Do you think hb has played a game consistent with what you would expect a cop who innocent scanned you would?

ViolentAbacus posted...

I think there is merit saying that Ben has an above average chance of being Scum.

You I currently think are town.

That's not what I asked.

I'm asking whether you being mortally confirmed town should factor into calling us scum.

Also why did you swap over to me being town. Weren't you saying I was scum when you first replaced in.

Abacus

Do you think there is any merit to saying Ben and I are 70-80% scum entirely due to knowing you're Town?

At the very least we should demand a full claim from him. At the very least.

Because he's got three votes and wants to discredit people on him and get ahead of the ball

He can't make a stronger fakeclaim because it's too suspicious. The problem is, the logic for this being town play is suspicious.

Why does town take an innocent scan on a person to think two people who were lightly pressuring that person are scum with 80% certainty
Why does town hb use his scan on abacus of all people, particularly when ctes and ben were suspected and narrowly avoided lynch yesterday

My concern is if not Hb today then who

That's the most blatant fakeclaim of all time-- someone doesn't make a power claim entirely to push an agenda on two people voting him.

And I'm not letting him get away with it. My vote stays. I trust you're town Peaf but you're wrong.

Oh my god did he really get away with that

PunishedBen posted...

The only person I really saw give reasons for why they liked Chang near EoD was Han, and then after Han said this it swung to Ctes/Sbell. Chang I think is wayyyyy more likely scum than Ctes

So my big stopping point, especially after Hb's claim.

Do you think hb makes that super late swap as town for the reasons given?

Note pot of greed as written doesn't counter a night cop. I agree it's unlikely there is one.

I love these letters

Just thought it should be said

HanOfTheNekos posted...

As chang(I think it was him) pointed out already, I know about that combination because I also bought that combination of cards.

I'm a dog "yip yip!" and you're better at mafia than me or whatever it was I was supposed to say

Are you saying the host told you scum could target scum with that?

Kirby321 posted...

Han claims that it didn't cross his mind at first, either, until he really thought about it.

Han generated this theory before I was able to even react to BCT's post, 20 minutes into the day.

I mean yeah you could say he had time to "really think about it" in those 20 minutes but I nor anyone else thought about it in that time.

Like seriously

Even ignoring role meta

A cop never doesn't scan Ctes here in that dual wagon. Unless they're dead certain Ctes is scum and want to solve someone else. Otherwise it's prudent to clear Ctes.

Minion

Hey can someone that isn't me demand Hb do a full role claim here so we can skip the pleasantries.

Of course you don't think he's lying.

Because a jack with a cop scan makes sense with a jack flipped and a day cop in the setup.

Sigh. I know you know you can't convince me but maybe try convincing other people and bus him.

Hbthebattle posted...

A little bit of mystique is always good for adding a bit of spice and flavor and screwing with the heads of the scum team. I have at least one cop scan. I might have more. I might have totally different abilities. They aren't relevant right now.

Oh you should have definitely tracked me to a body. This is pitiful. We already had a jack flip and there's a day cop in the setup man.

Hbthebattle posted...

He was fairly insane as scum in Baseball Musical as well. That does not exonerate him.

I wasn't really. I got taunted to death before I did much.

My role was literally insane psychic

Is the idea that I am pushing lynching hb because my role is telling me a result that isn't true here because otherwise I don't get it

Hbthebattle posted...

And what will be your response if you lynch me and I flip town? Claim I'm a death godfather?

Godfather is a scum role so yeah I'll buy you as a death godfather.

I would claim multitracker personally. Say you saw me and Ben doing night kills.

Oh I will. I will

Unfortunately I can't vote as I've beaten you to the punch. Perhaps you should put more sauce into your fake claim than just confirming abacus town though, if you really want to be believable with that 70-80% confidence.

Great of you to resolve Abacus when he's received no pressure to speak of today.

You know who's vague about claims? Scum.

It's funny that he is 70 to 80 percent sure two out of the three votes on him are scum

Why not just fake a scan of me as scum if you're going to suicide onto me Hb

Kirby321 posted...

Okay, fair enough. When you describe it like that, it doesn't seem so contrived.

But let's suppose BCT was scum. Who else besides Sultan was really on his case enough that it'd be worth spending 150 Gems for this plan to make BCT look confirmed instead of saving up for potentially more powerful cards?

That's the thing I find gimmicky about this.

Devil's Advocate theory

What if scum mass pot of greeded last night and wanted the cop's scan (which would most likely hit town) to look like it has more credibility by having one pot cancel on BCT

Now you throw one more layer, have Han be the one to catch it. Now you've got layers upon layers of distancing and town confirmation and such.

Listen I'm not saying I would have thought of this, but my mind didn't immediately spring to scum pot of greeding their own either, so you know. If we run with that theory that it happened and the potential benefits, that's one if they really wanted to go ham with it.

HanOfTheNekos posted...

BCT gave a possible explanation where Scum thought Sultan was Day Cop and hadn't scanned BCT yet

Like the reason this explanation doesn't make sense is the only reason to think Sultan is day cop is because of his suspicion YESTERDAY. He wouldn't be so sure BCT was scum but wait to scan him till today. He would be so sure BCT was scum because he scanned him yesterday!

Castlevania

And not to derail, but that's incredible DK64 can be beaten with only 4% of the collectibles. Is that a glitch? Because in SM64 it's not a glitch.

Oh my gosh Han really is now saying its totally reasonable for BCT to say that?

This is incredible.

Han BCT Hb Ctes let's wrap this up.

You can't say "that's an interesting point" and then turn around and say I'm faking outlandish theories. Pick one. Either I make sense or I don't.

Han immediately jumping to that theory makes him appear scummy to me.

It's not an application I would have thought of were I not scum myself because of how contrived it is. Would you? Honestly?

Mundus

I like how Han hasn't pressed that slip BCT made though

Feels like this was scum theatre gone south here

So there are actually reasons there could have been a cancel outside that

BCT is claiming it was the pot of greed though so it had to have been one if he's not lying

TheSultanOfSlam posted...

Lopen I think keeps protecting BCT which is odd

You think so?

BlueCrystalTear posted...

Hmmm... this post from D1 is VERY, VERY unusual. Post 47 in this thread.

Maybe scum thought he was softclaiming Day Cop here, but didn't think he'd actually scanned me and was going to do that today? Or maybe that was an intentional mislead, seeing as Sultan has to be scum?

To elaborate

The only reason someone thinks Sultan might be daycop is if they think he day 1 scanned BCT (I came to this thought too that's why I said the scum team I did earlier as a possibility)

Which makes sense from anyone to think about EXCEPT BCT who knows he's town

Perspective slip letting scum discussion slip into the day as they say in the biz

BlueCrystalTear posted...

Hmmm... this post from D1 is VERY, VERY unusual. Post 47 in this thread.

Maybe scum thought he was softclaiming Day Cop here, but didn't think he'd actually scanned me and was going to do that today? Or maybe that was an intentional mislead, seeing as Sultan has to be scum?

BCT is scum and Han should feel bad for exposing his mate like this.

Who brought up Sultan being day cop

Hb, ctes, Han, BCT

That's actually possible.

I will say I didn't particularly think sbell was town. He was on my town reads but very low. Him being scum wasn't an impossibility

I meant I was ok with leaving my vote on Ctes after his claim

My math had him ahead at that moment. Possibly wrong math.

##Unvote:
##Vote: Hb

I'm cool with this one too

HanOfTheNekos posted...

But I'm officially not responding to you anymore unless you specifically say in your post "I was wrong Han, I'm sorry, you're more experienced than me." Every single post that you want me to care about. Otherwise, interacting with you further has literally zero to offer the game.

That's fine I was gonna suggest the same. I think I'm throwing you off. Your catch is more tinfoil than the stuff I spit out.

We just lynch Hb or Ctes and agree to agree on that.

Han your argument is bad because scum don't forget what town or scum they vote towards end of the day. It's all calculated and pre-meditated at some level.

Town similarly doesn't forget because while it's panicked the emotions stick.

Scum you catch by poking holes in their LOGIC.

BlueCrystalTear posted...

How do you know it's a 4/11 split? Wouldn't that with a scum extra kill be kinda broken? It makes MYLO possible on Day 3.

Mylo on day 3 is fine. Town should get one right in 3 shots.

3/15 is unfair to scum unless they're super op.

Kirby321 posted...

But Lopen and Chang, why did you guys vote for Sbell?

I didn't.

Peace___Frog posted...

Honestly shocked that corrik was town, and that both Han and Lopen are still alive. No doc fear here to play off of.

Reason 2 Han might be town.

Scum wants me to kill Han or vice versa