Current Events > Nintendo's new 'summon and fight' patent could threaten hundreds of video games

(+) Yeah! (+)

https://www.windowscentral.com/gaming/palworld-isnt-the-only-target-nintendos-latest-patent-could-touch-hundreds-of-games

The Patent '397 covers the fundamental mechanics of summoning a character to have it fight another. So yes, sounds like Pokmon. However, it also describes things that many other games do.

Unlike many patents, which often face heavy scrutiny or rejections before theyre approved, this one glided through the U.S. Patent Office without objections. It was filed in March 2023 and granted just last week.

Patent '397 is potentially explosive for the gaming industry, because it isn't just about Palworld. If a game does all of the following, it could be challenged.

• There must be a PC, console or other computing device and the game is stored on a drive or similar storage medium.
• You can move your main character in a virtual space.
• You can summon a secondary character (called the sub character in the patent).
• If theres an enemy present, the summoned character fights it (either automatically or based on your input.)
• If there isnt, the summoned character can still move and fight when it encounters an enemy later.

If a game does those things, Nintendo now has a patent that could be used to argue infringement. I'm sure you can think of 100s of games that do this. This isnt just a Pokmon thing. The patent language is so broad that it could arguably apply to mechanics across RPGs, action games, MMOs, and the list goes on.

Take Diablo 4, where the Necromancer class is built around summoning skeletons, golems, and other minions that fight automatically or under your direction. In World of Warcraft, warlocks summon demons, hunters summon pets. In Elden Ring, if youre not one of those solo purists, you might summon your Mimic Tear to help in battle (or, in my case, just finish the battle for me). The list is endless.

In other words, if youve played games at all in the last 20 years, youve seen this mechanic everywhere. And now, at least in the U.S., Nintendo has a patent claim that could theoretically be pointed at any of them.

This is absolutely insane. This patent is so vague and casts such a wide net that even something as far removed from Pokemon as calling in an attack helicopter in Call of Duty could fall under it and be grounds for Nintendo to file a patent claim. We're talking hundreds of games that are suddenly in Nintendo's crosshairs for them patenting a vague and generic game mechanic that's been in use for decades. And the worst part is that Nintendo can apparently sue companies for games released before this patent was filed. They sued Pocketpair with one of their previous patents despite Pocketpair showing off the feature coming to Palworld a full 6 months before the patent was even filed.

Seriously, fuck Nintendo. This is so beyond fucked.

Fucking hell, this isn't even the first goddamn time Nintendo got it in their greedy heads that they could patent a concept. You can't patent the act of sending minions to fight for you in video games!

Anyways, someone get TMOG in here.

My undending and ever-increasing disdain for Nintendo continues apace.

This reminds me of the idiot that sued activision for copyright infringement for their "idea" of a game (pretty sure it wasn't made) with such reasons reasons being "the character has my first name" and "The characters used a rocket launcher". This dumb as shit is like trying to copyright someone using a gun.

This could get a bunch of games banned in Japan potentially, but I don't think this would fly in the US. You can't copyright genres.

I thought you can't own generic game mechanics, just the intellectual property/artistic assets behind a franchise.

Fuck Nintendo.

PMarth2002 posted...

I thought you can't own generic game mechanics, just the intellectual property/artistic assets behind a franchise.

You can't, the idea of summoning minions to fight for you is way too generic and ubiquitous, this won't hold up in court.

can they even enforce this? I mean even in japan pokemon's not the only big monster catching game when you have digimon and SMT

Nintendo is really pissed other games do Pokemon better than they are.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


Exactly. If no one is allowed to make anything remotely resembling Pokemon, then Nintendo and Gamefreak don't have to put any actual effort into their Pokemon games because "what else are you gonna play?"

BlackScythe0 posted...

This could get a bunch of games banned in Japan potentially, but I don't think this would fly in the US. You can't copyright genres.

Unfortunately, it says right in the article that this patent was granted in the United States. This isn't just about Japan anymore.

I'm tired, boss.

Calwings posted...

Unfortunately, it says right in the article that this patent was granted in the United States. This isn't just about Japan anymore.

Yea you don't often hear good things about the patent office, you would think people would be young enough to be tech savvy in most jobs now days. I still stand by saying this shouldn't stand up in court here in the states.

this could decimate the video game industry

mehmeh1 posted...

can they even enforce this? I mean even in japan pokemon's not the only big monster catching game when you have digimon and SMT

Not to mention summoning as a mechanic has been around in games long before Pokemon, like with FF3.

Ok now I am like fuck you nintendo actually

Yeah, this is bullshit. Hopefully it doesn't stand up if any games get taken to court.

Metal_Gear_Raxis posted...

Anyways, someone get TMOG in here.

For anybody missing context, Raxis is apparently still butthurt over this topic where I refused to blame Nintendo for Trump's tariffs:
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/400-current-events/81037806

Who at Nintendo is pulling this shit anyway? This particular one is immensely garbage

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/7/774c8bf5.jpg

$80 games fueling future lawsuits

Good going gamers

PMarth2002 posted...

I thought you can't own generic game mechanics, just the intellectual property/artistic assets behind a franchise.

Intellectual property/artistic assets would be copyrights. Game mechanics would be patents. So they are different, but both are forms of intellectual property. Patents are much more limited though, in that copyrights are automatic and last for longer, while patents have to be applied for and last for a much shorter time.

I think it's about time Nintendo got humbled in regards to copyright again because they'd be absolutely insane to take it this far.

The penalty for applying for frivolous patents should be the immediate expiration of all other patents the company holds. That might actually make them think twice.

This would undoubtably affect games like SMT, despite the original release of SMTV being a switch exclusive

what the fuck are they doing

ssb_yunglink2 posted...

This would undoubtably affect games like SMT, despite the original release of SMTV being a switch exclusive

what the fuck are they doing

Also SMT predates Pokemon. By like a decade. If anything, Sega should sue Nintendo for making Pokmon. Under Nintendo's logic

Also Square Enix could sue too. Because of Dragon Quest. I think DQ 5 had elements of monster catching and battling. And I'm pretty sure that game also still predates pokemon

Zikten posted...

Also SMT predates Pokemon. By like a decade. If anything, Sega should sue Nintendo for making Pokmon. Under Nintendo's logic

It doesn't matter who came up with it, all that matters is who applied for the patent.

They're really going scorched earth just because of Palworld.

"This will finally kill Palworld!"

Yeah, and tons of other games too, assholes.

Kisai posted...

They're really going scorched earth just because of Palworld.

"This will finally kill Palworld!"

Yeah, and tons of other games too, assholes.

I really hate how it feels like this is literally just the domino meme

The tiny domino is "Palworld released" and the huge one is "Nintendo works on patent to destroy summoning in video games"

Kisai posted...

They're really going scorched earth just because of Palworld.

"This will finally kill Palworld!"

Yeah, and tons of other games too, assholes.

This isnt even about palworld.

article says this was filed for in March 2023. This is just because Nintendo is horrifically greedy

RIP Final Fantasy 10

Tyranthraxus posted...

RIP Final Fantasy 10

Also 14. The Summoner job is fucked

Also in World of Warcraft, Hunter class and Warlock class is doomed

Zikten posted...

Also 14. The Summoner job is fucked

Also in World of Warcraft, Hunter class and Warlock class is doomed

Also the entire megaten subseries thats literally just called devil summoner lmao

How can they do that for their shitty ass knockoff series when SMT was doing it at least a decade before?

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

Reading through these articles was pretty interesting, and kind of has me wondering now how many games Nintendo has actually shut down for patent infringement. The only two examples from them in all three articles are for the D-Pad and Eternal Darkness's sanity system, both of which already expired. The only thing that comes to mind other than Palworld is that I remember something about the Switch's controllers a while back, and as I recall that was somebody else trying to sue Nintendo.

Maybe this will shake some people off of the ridiculous idea that Nintendo is any less opportunistic and greedy than their competitors at the end of the day

I can't see this holding up in court at all. It's so vague and Generic and would only be a terrible precedent.

Zikten posted...

Also 14. The Summoner job is fucked

Yuna was defeated not by Sin, but by Nintendo lawyers taking her to court for copyright infringement.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/f/f52e3129.jpg

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


I do wonder how much review patents actually go through. My best guess is when it comes to tech stuff like this if it's reviewed at all before getting a stamp they just look at it go "that seems pretty specific" and just approve of it then it becomes a burden on the court.

Can you patent thing that happen in real life? Like I want to patent breathing and eating so people have to pay me to breath and eat. I mean people have called for help from others, or dogs to fight for them for thousands of years. Heck the Bible says King Salomon summoned demons to do things for him. These ideas should be free market imo.

Metal_Gear_Raxis posted...

Fucking hell, this isn't even the first goddamn time Nintendo got it in their greedy heads that they could patent a concept. You can't patent the act of sending minions to fight for you in video games!

Anyways, someone get TMOG in here.

Pretty sure lufia 2 predates pokemon.

The player's party supports up to four characters at once, along with a Capsule Monster.

vycebrand2 posted...

Pretty sure lufia 2 predates pokemon.

Final fantasy 4 also. It had summons, and extra summons dropped by beating monsters like Imps.

I'm sure Nintendo fanboys on this site and elsewhere are going to defend this bullshit patent to the death.

People say 'fuck Nintendo', and yes, let's do that.

But also, fuck the patent office for letting such a vague and general mechanic get a patent decades, and hundreds of games, after it was first introduced.

They are supposed to be regulating this shit, not just rolling over and saying 'sure' every time someone asks nicely. Of course corporations are going to try their luck. Patent offices are supposed to keep them in check.

Mistere_Man posted...

Final fantasy 4 also. It had summons, and extra summons dropped by beating monsters like Imps.

Summons in FF4 and 3 are just glorified attack spells. They don't follow the summon & replace the main character system outlined in the patent. FF10 through 14 all qualify though. As would MegaTen, practically all creature collectors including Digimon, various RPGs like Wizardry 4, Geneforge, etc.

ai123 posted...

People say 'fuck Nintendo', and yes, let's do that.

But also, fuck the patent office for letting such a vague and general mechanic get a patent decades, and hundreds of games, after it was first introduced.

They are supposed to be regulating this shit, not just rolling over and saying 'sure' every time someone asks nicely. Of course corporations are going to try their luck. Patent offices are supposed to keep them in check.

The thing is that there's an absolutely impossible number of patents.

What's needed is a complete overhaul of trademark, patent and copyright laws. All 3 are completely insane and ridiculously tilted in favour of massive corporations.

Tyranthraxus posted...

Summons in FF4 and 3 are just glorified attack spells. They don't follow the summon & replace the main character system outlined in the patent. FF10 through 14 all qualify though. As would MegaTen, practically all creature collectors including Digimon, various RPGs like Wizardry 4, Geneforge, etc.

Fair point, I misread/misunderstood the fight automatically part. I apologize.