Current Events > Not sure u guys realize how bad Israel is for Dems

(+) Yeah! (+)

Rika_Furude posted...

Because more genocide is what Trump wants and that hasnt caused there to be any fewer Republican voters. All we see here are chuds saying not to vote for Biden - we know why they say this

Has there been a single post in this topic saying don't vote for him? Or even from users who say that?

I had personally said it in the past before realizing just how rigged the system is over there, hence the stance seen in post #38 of "yeah I get it if you vote him as the lesser of two evils but stop fucking pretending he's not still a massive evil".

Trumble posted...

Has there been a single post in this topic saying don't vote for him? Or even from users who say that?

I had personally said it in the past before realizing just how rigged the system is over there, hence the stance seen in post #38 of "yeah I get it if you vote him as the lesser of two evils but stop fucking pretending he's not still an evil".

This topic does not exist in a vacuum

"Guys let us consider the election and how Israel is bad for Biden but don't you dare bring up Trump."

That is a strange ask

WingsOfGood posted...

Why pretend he can't do it then? The only value of that claim seems to be to not fault him for it.
But he will get away with it if he is elected. Don't be fooled on that. If that scares you vote Biden.
He may even call you to help him deport people.

Would you grow up. He couldnt build a wall, he couldnt make Mexico pay for said non-existent wall, he couldnt replace the Affordable Care Act, he didnt cut the average mans taxes and tax the wealthy, he couldnt boost the economy by 4% each year, he couldnt eliminate the federal deficit (he increased it by 60% or more), he couldnt lower the price of prescription drugs (those prices increased), he couldnt lock up Hilary, he couldnt drain the swamp, etc.

I dont think I need to list more of his empty promises. Hes so full of shit his eyes are brown. Im going to be voting for Biden, but Im not going to praise him just because weve been given a choice between a giant douche and a turd sandwich.

WingsOfGood posted...

The issue is you are criticizing Biden for something Trump is far worse about.

Trump said he will deport protestors, support Israel more and called Gaza the worst terrorist haven on the planet.

No one said Trump would be better than Biden.

LonelyStoner posted...

Would you grow up. He couldnt build a wall, he couldnt make Mexico pay for said non-existent wall, he couldnt replace the Affordable Care Act, he didnt cut the average mans taxes and tax the wealthy, he couldnt boost the economy by 4% each year, he couldnt eliminate the federal deficit (he increased it by 60% or more), he couldnt lower the price of prescription drugs (those prices increased), he couldnt lock up Hilary, he couldnt drain the swamp, etc.

I dont think I need to list more of his empty promises. Hes so full of shit his eyes are brown. Im going to be voting for Biden, but Im not going to praise him just because weve been given a choice between a giant douche and a turd sandwich.

Oh noes you said the Souf Park thing, you lose! /s, also inb4 someone says that non-ironically

Here is thread about all Trump's statements about Israel and deporting protestors...
Trump is really bad on this issue Biden looks like a saint:

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/400-current-events/80777970

Rika_Furude posted...

This topic does not exist in a vacuum

You should really become a lawyer. Imagine how many people you could get off the hook with your amazing defence of "this case does not exist in a vacuum, this other criminal was way worse".

WingsOfGood posted...

Because Trump literally said himself he would do worse.

Yeah, and biden said there is a red line.

Rika_Furude posted...

Because more genocide is what Trump wants and that hasnt caused there to be any fewer Republican voters. All we see here are chuds saying not to vote for Biden - we know why they say this

I don't tell others how to vote, but it's pretty obvious this is an issue that is important not just to people on message boards, so it's worth taking seriously and not to just dismiss with "but other guy" or worse "it's an insignificant issue".

On a side note, did it occur to anyone else how much this resembles the Israel shills who assumed any criticism of Israel means you must be pro-Hamas?

Very interesting that people trying to downplay criticism around Biden's support for Israel are taking a tactic straight out of Israel supporters' playbook.

Trumble posted...

You should really become a lawyer. Imagine how many people you could get off the hook with your amazing defence of "this case does not exist in a vacuum, this other criminal was way worse".

nobody said that except you

1337toothbrush posted...

Yeah, and biden said there is a red line.

I don't tell others how to vote, but it's pretty obvious this is an issue that is important not just to people on message boards, so it's worth taking seriously and not to just dismiss with "but other guy" or worse "it's an insignificant issue".

If the issue matters so much to them, why dont they vote for whoever will cause the issue to be lesser? Instead all I see is people saying not to vote for just one of them in particular, never saying anything about the other one

I'm very worried that we're repeating the same cycle as 2016. Biden has serious flaws as a candidate that seem to be lowering the floor on his vote total. Democrats are currently the status quo in a time of bubbling discontent. Some Democrats are responding to that with arrogance, some with conspiracy theories, some with pre-blaming the left and the youth and the media, some focused on presenting arguments that only convince the already convinced like focusing on Trump's danger or the wonderfulness of incremental advances Biden has made.

These "debates" I'm seeing around Gaza, around the economy, they don't inspire confidence. There was a much greater sense of togetherness in 2020 and Biden still barely won. The main thing that gives me hope is that the bottom could fall out on Trump due to the trials and Roe v. Wade, and January 6th. But if not, we're likely in for a very very bad time.

LonelyStoner posted...

No one said Trump would be better than Biden.

Just that the dems are going to have extreme difficulty and Trump apparently isn't when he is worse on this issue?
Not to mention also suggesting that what makes Trump worse on this issue is just words and he could never fulfill his heinous promises?

What does saying all that accomplish for someone who is voting Biden as you said you are?

Trumble posted...

On a side note, did it occur to anyone else how much this resembles the Israel shills who assumed any criticism of Israel means you must be pro-Hamas?

Very interesting that people trying to downplay criticism around Biden's support for Israel are taking a tactic straight out of Israel supporters' playbook.

These If you criticize Biden youre a Trump supporter people arent the most forward thinkers

Trumble posted...

Israel likes Trump more. Israel supporters dislike Biden.

WingsOfGood posted...

Just that the dems are going to have extreme difficulty and Trump apparently isn't when he is worse on this issue?
Not to mention also suggesting that what makes Trump worse on this issue is just words and he could never fulfill his heinous promises?

What does saying all that accomplish for someone who is voting Biden as you said you are?

If you havent deduced that Trump is incapable of fulfilling such outlandish promises thats on you. Im not saying hes harmless. Im saying hell say literally any ridiculous thing to make his audience of sea lions clap on command when he has literally no plan on how to do it. His biggest weapon is spreading hate for applause. After they stop cheering he walks off slightly aroused and he redoes this routine at his next speech. Hes too lazy to lift a finger in order to fulfill his promises.

Rika_Furude posted...

If the issue matters so much to them, why dont they vote for whoever will cause the issue to be lesser? Instead all I see is people saying not to vote for just one of them in particular, never saying anything about the other one

They're doing a lot more than you or I, they're actually out there protesting to have their voices heard. Currently neither of the two candidates will cause the issue to be lesser because support for israel is completely unconditional for both biden or trump. If biden refuses to stop supporting *genocide* (highlighting to remind you of what biden is supporting here) during an election, willing to lose critical votes over the matter, what makes you think he will do anything if he's safe and secure in his second term?

LonelyStoner posted...

These If you criticize Biden youre a Trump supporter people arent the most forward thinkers

It's perfectly possible to criticize Biden without helping Trump. But that's not what we're seeing in these interminable topics.

Instead, what we're seeing is endless whining about "genocide Joe" and the like with a clear purpose of helping Trump. Anyone who goes down that path is just helping Trump, no matter what they claim about their motives etc.

LonelyStoner posted...

If you havent deduced that Trump is incapable of fulfilling such outlandish promises thats on you. Im not saying hes harmless. Im saying hell say literally any ridiculous thing to make his audience of sea lions clap on command when he has literally no plan on how to do it.

Then you are uninformed on the matter. There is a plan for it and it will work. He must not be elected.

So should we all join hands as Biden voters and say cumbaya Biden sucks, Biden is an evil genocider? What does that accomplish? Seems contradictory to what we both want which is a better world and Trump will be much much worse.

WingsOfGood posted...

Then you are uninformed on the matter. There is a plan for it and it will work.

How would that work, exactly? Hes always said he has a plan.

this topioc

LonelyStoner posted...

If you havent deduced that Trump is incapable of fulfilling such outlandish promises thats on you. Im not saying hes harmless. Im saying hell say literally any ridiculous thing to make his audience of sea lions clap on command when he has literally no plan on how to do it. His biggest weapon is spreading hate for applause. After they stop cheering he walks off slightly aroused and he redoes this routine at his next speech. Hes too lazy to lift a finger in order to fulfill his promises.

Trump is not the author of Project 2025, and Project 2025 is the plan for a fascist GOP takeover of America.

Indeed, Trump is just the asshole circus clown whose performances for his depraved audiences of deplorables may get the GOP in a position of power to do all that heinous shit.

EPR-radar posted...

It's perfectly possible to criticize Biden without helping Trump. But that's not what we're seeing in these interminable topics.

Instead, what we're seeing is endless whining about "genocide Joe" and the like with a clear purpose of helping Trump. Anyone who goes down that path is just helping Trump, no matter what they claim about their motives etc.

Pointing out that biden needs to actually do something about *genocide* is helpful because it's costing him votes. He's either too stupid and/or too committed to supporting *genocide* to do anything about it. If he doesn't want to be known as "genocide joe" then he should try not supporting *genocide*. If pointing this out helps trump, then biden must be trump's #1 fan for him to be fumbling such an easy issue as not supporting *genocide*.

LonelyStoner posted...

How would that work, exactly?

I have a whole topic on it. Look for Trump says he will deport protesters.

He plans to deport millions of "illegal" immigrants as well and cites as foundation to the plan Eisenhower Operation (slur I cannot type).

The military is involved but likely so will you as a regular citizen.

EPR-radar posted...

Trump is not the author of Project 2025, and Project 2025 is the plan for a fascist GOP takeover of America.

Indeed, Trump is just the asshole circus clown whose performances for his depraved audiences of deplorables may get the GOP in a position of power to do all that heinous shit.

And Trump first order of office is to remove all disloyal elements and fill his staff with people who refuse to say Joe Biden won in 2020.

WingsOfGood posted...

Then you are uninformed on the matter. There is a plan for it and it will work. He must not be elected.

So should we all join hands as Biden voters and say cumbaya Biden sucks, Biden is an evil genocider? What does that accomplish? Seems contradictory to what we both want which is a better world and Trump will be much much worse.

This, Trump and his team are masterminds who will have his fascist plan fully come to life and if we continue to discredit and criticize Biden then well be closer to having Trump elected again.

1337toothbrush posted...

They're doing a lot more than you or I, they're actually out there protesting to have their voices heard. Currently neither of the two candidates will cause the issue to be lesser because support for israel is completely unconditional for both biden or trump. If biden refuses to stop supporting *genocide* (highlighting to remind you of what biden is supporting here) during an election, willing to lose critical votes over the matter, what makes you think he will do anything if he's safe and secure in his second term?

No they arent. Its all entirely lip service at best, and thinly veiled Republican support in most cases that arent just lip service

The thing about Fascism is you don't need to be a mastermind to pull it off.

WingsOfGood posted...

The thing about Fascism is you don't need to be a mastermind to pull it off.

For example, many top Nazis were clowns. That's why Hitler was so pissed when Heydrich got himself killed by Czech partisans -- Heydrich was competent, and competent Nazis were rare.

EPR-radar posted...

Trump is not the author of Project 2025, and Project 2025 is the plan for a fascist GOP takeover of America.

Indeed, Trump is just the asshole circus clown whose performances for his depraved audiences of deplorables may get the GOP in a position of power to do all that heinous shit.

I agree. I just highly doubt Trump will win again. Especially with the increase of younger voters since 8 years ago. I simply dislike this talk of Any criticism of Biden means youre a Trumper.

Rika_Furude posted...

No they arent. Its all entirely lip service at best, and thinly veiled Republican support in most cases that arent just lip service

Painting everyone who criticizes democrats as secret republicans isn't the winning strategy that you think it is, especially when the criticism is about biden's support for *genocide*. You know, *genocide* used to be an issue that would be considered unimaginable to support.

1337toothbrush posted...

Painting everyone who criticizes democrats as secret republicans isn't the winning strategy that you think it is, especially when the criticism is about biden's support for *genocide*. You know, *genocide* used to be an issue that would be considered unimaginable to support.

Your actions speak louder than your words

Rika_Furude posted...

No they arent. Its all entirely lip service at best, and thinly veiled Republican support in most cases that arent just lip service

are you suggesting the Pro Palestinian protestors should just up and leave because they arent doing anything and worst case probably hurting Bidens odds? Interesting position for someone on the left, sounds like right wing logic tbh since they generally hate any protests whatsoever because godforbid people express their grievances of injustice being committed by those in power

LonelyStoner posted...

I agree. I just highly doubt Trump will win again. Especially with the increase of younger voters since 8 years ago. I simply dislike this talk of Any criticism of Biden means youre a Trumper.

That's not what people are arguing against. What people are arguing is that endless whining about Biden regarding Gaza can have only one effect -- to help Trump.

Since Trump would be worse than Biden, that undercuts any claim the whiners have to actually care about Palestinians. Note that this is not a defense of Biden, but an attack on the motives of the whiners.

LonelyStoner posted...

I agree. I just highly doubt Trump will win again. Especially with the increase of younger voters since 8 years ago. I simply dislike this talk of Any criticism of Biden means youre a Trumper.

Then this is a weird topic to post in.

"Israel is REALLY BAD for the dems!!!"

Guess you disagree then? Can't be that bad if Biden still wins. Like what does really bad mean here?

David1988 posted...

are you suggesting the Pro Palestinian protestors should just up and leave because they arent doing anything and worst case probably hurting Bidens odds? Interesting position for someone on the left, sounds like right wing logic tbh since they generally hate any protests whatsoever because godforbid people express their grievances of injustice being committed by those in power

Are the protestors voting for trump, or abstaining from voting? Because if they are thats what Im suggesting is more harm than good and what drowns any of their words

Rika_Furude posted...

Are the protestors voting for trump, or abstaining from voting? Because if they are thats what Im suggesting is more harm than good and what drowns any of their words

Exactly, actions speak louder than words.

Anyone taking concrete action to help Trump is not helping Palestinians, no matter what they say.

Okay

1337toothbrush posted...

Why are people assuming even more genocide if biden loses? He's already supporting israel to the maximum. Just because he says he's frustrated or that he has a red line, doesn't mean he actually does anything to stop or slow them down, as we've all seen. trump wouldn't pretend to care, but pretending to care doesn't matter if there is no limit to support of genocide regardless. This is that dumb "decorum" shit that democrats place way too much importance on.

Also, the "this is a small issue, no one actually cares, and biden has this election guaranteed unless he dies" talking point reeks of 2016 hillary.

Anyone who claims to only care about this one issue is a fraud and what they believe is bullshit

Ill just leave it at this:

You can vote for the lesser of two evils while criticizing the lesser of two evils.

Rika_Furude posted...

Are the protestors voting for trump, or abstaining from voting? Because if they are thats what Im suggesting is more harm than good and what drowns any of their words

I mean, literally some of Bidens biggest donors are funding these protests, so if theyll vote Biden Im pretty sure many of the protestors will as well. People should be free to protest anyway, but if youre saying they should only protest as long as Bidens still got their vote I dont think you have to worry about that for the majority of them

https://www.politico.com/news/2024/05/05/pro-palestinian-protests-columbia-university-funding-donors-00156135

LonelyStoner posted...

Ill just leave it at this:

You can vote for the lesser of two evils while criticizing the lesser of two evils.

This topic is about people not realizing how bad this is for Biden.

You say Biden will still win.

So why would someone support the topic that suggests this is ASTRONOMICALLY bad as tc op says literally, and think Biden still wins?

One can criticize Biden correct.
But this topic isn't about that. It is to suggest this is BAD for Biden.

But he...still wins?

Confusing

David1988 posted...

I mean, literally some of Bidens biggest donors are funding these protests, so if theyll vote Biden Im pretty sure many of the protestors will as well. People should be free to protest anyway, but if youre saying they should only protest as long as Bidens still got their vote I dont think you have to worry about that for the majority of them

https://www.politico.com/news/2024/05/05/pro-palestinian-protests-columbia-university-funding-donors-00156135

Im not commenting on whether they should be allowed to protest. If they are going to vote for Biden even though they are protesting, I can respect that. But if they abstain from voting or vote for trump as part of a protest, that is, in the most generous interpretation, lip service for an issue that doesnt matter to them

Rika_Furude posted...

Your actions speak louder than your words

What do you think my actions are? I can tell you that biden's full-throated support for *genocide* is speaking very loudly.

hockeybabe89 posted...

Anyone who claims to only care about this one issue is a fraud and what they believe is bullshit

There are plenty of single issue voters. It's gross to try and police what people care about. I'd say as far as single issues go, being against *genocide* is pretty dang noble.

1337toothbrush posted...

There are plenty of single issue voters. It's gross to try and police what people care about. I'd say as far as single issues go, being against *genocide* is pretty dang noble.

LOL. Anyone who is supposedly against genocide in a way that helps Trump win is not actually against genocide.

It really is that simple.

1337toothbrush posted...

What do you think my actions are? I can tell you that biden's full-throated support for *genocide* is speaking very loudly.

There are plenty of single issue voters. It's gross to try and police what people care about. I'd say as far as single issues go, being against *genocide* is pretty dang noble.

I cal tell you Ive seen plenty of people on this board whose words were to not support Biden and whose actions are to not vote for Biden. Factually that is more of a benefit to Trump than it is to Biden, therefore their words are anti-genocide but their actions are pro-genocide given Trumps stated desire for Palestine. Again, lip service at best, and likely to be malicious

Rika_Furude posted...

Im not commenting on whether they should be allowed to protest. If they are going to vote for Biden even though they are protesting, I can respect that. But if they abstain from voting or vote for trump as part of a protest, that is, in the most generous interpretation, lip service for an issue that doesnt matter to them

Literally the only credible threat a person can make to a politician in a democracy is to threaten not to vote for them. If you express that you don't like their handling of an issue, do you really think they give a shit about that if you pledge undying loyalty for them with a guaranteed vote? That's the most impotent kind of protest one can make to a politician. Saying "I don't want you to do this, but I guarantee my vote to you so you can continue doing it" is the ultimate lip service.

If you care aboit Palestine or Genocide you vote against Trump.

Any other action and you would be supporting this:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/may/27/trump-donors-israel-gaza-palestinian-protests

Donald Trump has told a group of wealthy donors that he will crush pro-Palestinian protests on university campuses if he is returned to the White House.

The former president and presumptive Republican nominee called the demonstrations against Israels war in Gaza part of a radical revolution and promised the predominantly Jewish donors that he would set the movement back 25 or 30 years if they helped him beat Joe Biden in Novembers presidential election.

If you get me re-elected, were going to set that movement back 25 or 30 years, Trump replied,

EPR-radar posted...

LOL. Anyone who is supposedly against genocide in a way that helps Trump win is not actually against genocide.

It really is that simple.

Show me the anti-genocide candidate. Don't give me vague bullshit about how it could somehow maybe get worse even though biden supports it to the max.

Rika_Furude posted...

I cal tell you Ive seen plenty of people on this board whose words were to not support Biden and whose actions are to not vote for Biden. Factually that is more of a benefit to Trump than it is to Biden, therefore their words are anti-genocide but their actions are pro-genocide given Trumps stated desire for Palestine. Again, lip service at best, and likely to be malicious

Biden has two options:

1. Stop supporting *genocide* and gain votes
2. Keep supporting *genocide* and lose votes

Seems like an obvious choice, but instead he's going full steam ahead on *genocide* and I guess relying on people like you to pretend it's impossible to not support *genocide*. If someone doesn't want to support genocide, who can they vote for?