Board 8 > Community Mafia Topic 17 - A 1 Hour Video Lecture by Guest Professor Turbopuns

(+) Yeah! (+)

But I don't see how scum ctes / MI would be working together to cause this to occur unless I was responsible for stripping ctes' vote all these days and just... coincidentally forgot to submit the action the same day kirby blocked Ulti

PunishedBen posted...

Blade has been saying Ulti and Ctes are a scum team and MI has latched onto that today

also wait

I've been saying they are a team for days now, I didn't just latch onto this today

I could kill Ctes, I just don't think its the wisest and safest play. I really refuse to believe in a world MI is town here. Can ANYONE tell me who the hell can be scum if MI is town?? I need at least two.

PunishedBen posted...

I could kill Ctes, I just don't think its the wisest and safest play. I really refuse to believe in a world MI is town here. Can ANYONE tell me who the hell can be scum if MI is town?? I need at least two.

Ctes & Ulti.

And I've already said I'd sooner believe Ulti is town than even believe Blade is town. Besides just posts he's made and scum have made about him, the redirect could also have only been used to mess with Ulti

Kirby what do you think? I'm still committed to the idea of letting Ctes try to prove himself so that sorting out the power claims is easier moving forward, and MI is just massive POE. I'm really bad at proving people are scum though

Kirby doesn't have a vote down but is likely going to go back to me

@IfGodCouldDie

We kind of are going to need your vote here. I'm hoping you feel like you can trust me more today.

PunishedBen posted...

I could kill Ctes, I just don't think its the wisest and safest play. I really refuse to believe in a world MI is town here. Can ANYONE tell me who the hell can be scum if MI is town?? I need at least two.

Well okay counterpoint: if you need at least two, who is MI's scum partner?

If Blade thinks Ulti and Ctes are a scum team, he must know by now Ulti is not getting enough votes, right? So isnt that a vote for Ctes in waiting?

Blade is already on ctes

Kirby321 posted...

Well okay counterpoint: if you need at least two, who is MI's scum partner?

Ctes or FD, with a very distant chance of Chang that I can only accept defeat if he;s evil Jeff

Kirby321 posted...

Well okay counterpoint: if you need at least two, who is MI's scum partner?

According to Ben, the person I've been wanting to lynch for multiple days.

TotallyNotMI posted...

Blade is already on ctes

Oh, never mind, for some reason I thought Ulti still had two votes but thats ME

Yeah that's why I said ill be voting you if I have to.

PunishedBen posted...

Kirby what do you think? I'm still committed to the idea of letting Ctes try to prove himself so that sorting out the power claims is easier moving forward, and MI is just massive POE. I'm really bad at proving people are scum though

I agree with you that evidence points to Ulti being town.

The more MI and Ctes keep talking, the more I keep doubting and going back and forth on whether they're scum or not. Something just doesn't feel right about either of their lynches, and yet I don't have any easy answers.

Logically speaking, lynching MI clears doubts of whether scum was hiding in Vanilla or not. But then that raises the question of: how does that benefit us?

One crackpot theory I've had is that Ctes and IGCD's vig shots were designed around each other, with Ctes' being the town counterpart to IGCD's scum counterpart.

I feel like this is one situation where I'd be grateful to have Lopen alive to say stuff, because I feel like the correct answer is something so out there that none of us could conceivably think of it.

I just get the vibe that Ctes and MI are genuinely fighting to solve the game when town seems deaf to their pleas. That's not to say they aren't scum, but it feels like they're trying way too hard in a situation where they'd be on their back foot. My intuition is telling me that there's scum in the people sitting back and deliberately not engaging with the game.

Two of the towniest people, Kirby and IGCD, are the only ones without a vote down (not counting ctes). I guess better they decide than the scummiest looking people.

I've made my case against all 3 of the vote leaders and could see any of them flipping scum. But I very much doubt that all 3 of them are scum, if only because that would be too easy. So it stands to reason that it's still possible to miss today.

Kirby321 posted...

I agree with you that evidence points to Ulti being town.

The more MI and Ctes keep talking, the more I keep doubting and going back and forth on whether they're scum or not. Something just doesn't feel right about either of their lynches, and yet I don't have any easy answers.

Logically speaking, lynching MI clears doubts of whether scum was hiding in Vanilla or not. But then that raises the question of: how does that benefit us?

One crackpot theory I've had is that Ctes and IGCD's vig shots were designed around each other, with Ctes' being the town counterpart to IGCD's scum counterpart.

I feel like this is one situation where I'd be grateful to have Lopen alive to say stuff, because I feel like the correct answer is something so out there that none of us could conceivably think of it.

I just get the vibe that Ctes and MI are genuinely fighting to solve the game when town seems deaf to their pleas. That's not to say they aren't scum, but it feels like they're trying way too hard in a situation where they'd be on their back foot. My intuition is telling me that there's scum in the people sitting back and deliberately not engaging with the game.

IGCD being scum requires Blade being scum though, right?

Gonna be honest. If there's one person I'd choose to lynch right now completely disregarding roles, it would be Blade.

I don't know if anyone agrees with me, nor do I know if anyone else would be willing to share the shame if Blade indeed flips Doctor... but Blade just feels like the correct answer. Especially given how disorienting this game has been and how inexplicable the scum night actions have been (that we know of at least).

Vanishing Lopen? Killing Isquen and SBell? Bus Driving Ctes and Red? None of those seem optimal in the slightest. I feel like scum doesn't make those decisions unless they know they can hide within the chaos well enough to escape suspicion.

PunishedBen posted...

IGCD being scum requires Blade being scum though, right?

Yes, it only works if there was a deliberate No Kill last night.

..

well actually it also works if Death was the kill target, but I think we can discount that?

Kirby321 posted...

Gonna be honest. If there's one person I'd choose to lynch right now completely disregarding roles, it would be Blade.

I don't know if anyone agrees with me, nor do I know if anyone else would be willing to share the shame if Blade indeed flips Doctor... but Blade just feels like the correct answer. Especially given how disorienting this game has been and how inexplicable the scum night actions have been (that we know of at least).

Vanishing Lopen? Killing Isquen and SBell? Bus Driving Ctes and Red? None of those seem optimal in the slightest. I feel like scum doesn't make those decisions unless they know they can hide within the chaos well enough to escape suspicion.

I absolutely 100% can see it. He through town for a loop in Bloodbourne and I think he would absolutely embrace the chaos after falling down 2 strong roles days 1/2.

But as much as I can see it I just don't think I can vote for that today. It might be right, but I just don't have the guts to do it.

Forceful_Dragon posted...

Yes, it only works if there was a deliberate No Kill last night.

..

well actually it also works if Death was the kill target, but I think we can discount that?

Either outcome dispels the notion that IGCD and Blade are confirmed town.

The question is whether or not those players, if scum, would agree to a gambit like that. Or anything that's happened thus far.

Kirby321 posted...

Gonna be honest. If there's one person I'd choose to lynch right now completely disregarding roles, it would be Blade.

I don't know if anyone agrees with me, nor do I know if anyone else would be willing to share the shame if Blade indeed flips Doctor... but Blade just feels like the correct answer. Especially given how disorienting this game has been and how inexplicable the scum night actions have been (that we know of at least).

Vanishing Lopen? Killing Isquen and SBell? Bus Driving Ctes and Red? None of those seem optimal in the slightest. I feel like scum doesn't make those decisions unless they know they can hide within the chaos well enough to escape suspicion.

If I'm being honest I don't like that Blade doesn't read the whole game. Feels disingenuous to play that way. But that could just be something he does as town too.

Kirby321 posted...

Gonna be honest. If there's one person I'd choose to lynch right now completely disregarding roles, it would be Blade.

I don't know if anyone agrees with me, nor do I know if anyone else would be willing to share the shame if Blade indeed flips Doctor... but Blade just feels like the correct answer. Especially given how disorienting this game has been and how inexplicable the scum night actions have been (that we know of at least).

100% yes, if it didn't require a no kill to be made last night that would be wheee I pushed fully and Blade is clever enough to make that move. That anticipated Death town flip really made it seem like he was just waiting for an excuse to go after Ulti and I but to this moment he still hasn't been able to explain that connection (it isn't there but you get the point). I have also been after him before.

If there's anyone who would fit into any possible scumteam, it's Ben. MI/Ulti/Ctes would be some of the greatest theater I've ever seen so MI is only scum if they're both town. Ben can be scum with essentially anyone in the game.

I don't see what lynching him achieves when I got shot tonight and Ulti just walks over the rest of the game laughing, but he's pretty much the compromise if you guys want to feel good about yourselves for a day.

Anyway I'm waiting at my Orthopedist now hopefully setting up some actual help for the elbow itself after being dragged for 3 months.

Btw Kirby put me on block after this game it's for your own good.

Kirby321 posted...

The question is whether or not those players, if scum, would agree to a gambit like that.

The main thing in IGCD's favor is that if his whole thing was a gambit it started day 1, when he claimed Vigi with a sidequest. I don't see that. A regular ass town vigilante exists in SO many games that you are effectively just deleting yourself to fake claim a town vigi, with or without a sidequest.

I still regret not making IGCD type ##Kill before the sidequest was complete, just to verify the quest was even part of it, but I just can't see him staking his entire claim on no town vigi.

And sure, you can count Ctes if he's town? But if that role is real then imo it only counts for like 5% of a vigi because that's how often I think it would even come to pass. So instead we have a regular vig with a 3 day delay (or 5 days when you screw up twice) and maybe 5% of a vigi in ctes?

Also anyone pushing IGCD is an embarrassment to Mafia who should never play again or is scum.

Forceful_Dragon posted...

And sure, you can count Ctes if he's town? But if that role is real then imo it only counts for like 5% of a vigi because that's how often I think it would even come to pass. So instead we have a regular vig with a 3 day delay (or 5 days when you screw up twice) and maybe 5% of a vigi in ctes?

Where was thus argument doing the "can they coexist" part lol.

Can scum even afford to no kill is there is a risk that Kirby blocks a scum member? Like yeah, he blocked Death so it didnt matter, but it could just as easily make one of their own look bad with the no kill yesterday

It would be comically embarrassing to start a special on Blade just for us to completely turbo off a cliff if he ends up being town. That would be... incredibly bad.

And yet, I feel way better about lynching Blade than I do MI. (Or Ctes or especially Ben, for that matter)

Somebody talk me out of this because I just might put my vote on Blade.

PunishedBen posted...

Can scum even afford to no kill is there is a risk that Kirby blocks a scum member? Like yeah, he blocked Death so it didnt matter, but it could just as easily make one of their own look bad with the no kill yesterday

A scum team with MI on does not, that's for sure. Otherwise, yeah probably.

ctesjbuvf posted...

Where was thus argument doing the "can they coexist" part lol.

I'm pretty sure I've already said something to the effect. Maybe not IMMEDIATELY when you claimed, but upon reflection. What you claimed could coexist with IGCD. But I also just don't really think it coexists with itself -_-

It's too bad the gambling mechanic you're claiming is based upon making an unlikely prediction instead of a simple coin flip or you might have "won" 2.5 times already.

I honestly don't even feel like MI is gonna flip scum, based on today he really just seems town.

There is just... no one left in the poe otherwise but it's really all it comes down to, so we just like have to like try to figure out what the hell we are missing if that is not the obvious lynch.

Kirby321 posted...

It would be comically embarrassing to start a special on Blade just for us to completely turbo off a cliff if he ends up being town. That would be... incredibly bad.

And yet, I feel way better about lynching Blade than I do MI. (Or Ctes or especially Ben, for that matter)

Somebody talk me out of this because I just might put my vote on Blade.

I think if we lynched blade today and he flipped town doctor I would completely lose the will to press on. If someone is hiding behind Lopen's role then it's something that will have to be dealt with at some point, but this doesn't feel like the time for a hail mary.

PunishedBen posted...

Can scum even afford to no kill is there is a risk that Kirby blocks a scum member? Like yeah, he blocked Death so it didnt matter, but it could just as easily make one of their own look bad with the no kill yesterday

Well, if the scum team is IGCD and Blade, if I jail IGCD, it could be explained away as "he was shot at". Meanwhile, after I already jailed Ulti and felt bad for it, there'd be an extremely low chance that I'd jail the Doctor. Kinda. Could also be explained away as scum tried to shoot the Doctor.

But FD is right. IGCD committed to his claim extremely early into the game and could've easily been counterclaimed with a dayvig bullet if he was scum.

Kirby321 posted...

It would be comically embarrassing to start a special on Blade just for us to completely turbo off a cliff if he ends up being town. That would be... incredibly bad.

And yet, I feel way better about lynching Blade than I do MI. (Or Ctes or especially Ben, for that matter)

Somebody talk me out of this because I just might put my vote on Blade.

Just vote MI. We cant believe in insane scum gambit theories unless MI is town, and there is no reason to believe he is over the players who have actual evidence pointing to town.

What are votals at right now?

Forceful_Dragon posted...

I think if we lynched blade today and he flipped town doctor I would completely lose the will to press on. If someone is hiding behind Lopen's role then it's something that will have to be dealt with at some point, but this doesn't feel like the time for a hail mary.

Well, I have no reason to doubt that you're town, so I'll trust your judgment.

If my options are between Ben, Ctes, and MI, the choice is... obvious. But I feel like we're gonna see a town flip. I'm sorry, MI, but I agree that it's best to play the safe game.

##Vote: MI

Everyone is saying I'll flip town and that nothing will be gained if I flip town

And then still voting me

Wtf

UltimaterializerX posted...

If IGCD is scum, hes their extra kill

I suppose Lopen kidnapped himself then?

Honestly if you guys are thinking "MI is probably town but I mean what other options do we have that murdering four vanilla in a row?" I honestly have nothing

Ulti sounds like he needs some love tonight

Also if your perspective is "I think MI is town but gosh nothing else to do" it shouldn't be this fucking silent 45 minutes before lynch holy shit