Current Events > Man it's hard to go back to old Mario games after Mario Odyssey

(+) Yeah! (+)

Mario 64 - Crappy controls and awful camera, strange level design and loads of bad game mechanics
Galaxy - Super linear and slow. Feels like a slog.
Sunshine - I mean it's Sunshine come on lol

Odyssey took like all the best parts of the franchise so far including the 2D games and put it into one game with immense freedom and smooth great control of both Mario and the camera.

One of those games that you don't appreciate how good it is until you go back to other games.

The camera was the only sucky part of SM64

Fuck you, Lakitu. I think you're trying to kill Mario

Nothing is worse than the galaxy camera that just makes you get stuck upside down if you decide to walk backwards.

Cant go back to 2D Mario after odyssey. Fuck all the stars and moons they crammed into the game though because they are some bullshit.

For some reason I hated Mario 64 as a kid and remember being blown away by Galaxy.

Galaxy is still great, but when I tried to replay it my interest just kind of fizzled out. Maybe because Odyssey upstaged it and was a natural evolution with M64 like open worlds?

And then when I replayed Mario 64 with that collection I'm talking about, I loved it. I knew the mechanics and my muscle memory didn't go away, so short of a few annoying parts like slide obstacles or flying, I would cruise through the game. It's pretty fun and well made for being the first of its kind.

Still haven't played Sunshine.

I just wish that collection had Galaxy 2. I never did get to play it.

i dont even mind the camera in sm64. most of the time it's fine, but you do have to play it like a "side scroller" at times.

i still play that game and i never have huge camera problems.

HylianFox posted...

The camera was the only sucky part of SM64

Fuck you, Lakitu. I think you're trying to kill Mario

Nah, Mario has WAY too much momentum in 64. Once you hit the jump button, you pretty much can't adjust that jump outside of microscopic movements to the left and right. When you land, you keep going for about 5 Mario lengths before you come to a full stop. You can dive, but that only puts you even more out of control. Mario also really likes to slide at the slightest incline, and sliding is even more uncontrollable than jumping.

HylianFox posted...

The camera was the only sucky part of SM64

Fuck you, Lakitu. I think you're trying to kill Mario

i know theres also like invisible walls, and certain mechanics that can make Mario teleport to certain areas of the map.

weird stuff that happens whenever Mario crosses a invisible wall, ceiling limit, and out of bounds zone

some guy on YouTube like made it his mission to explain those weird mechanics in great detail

https://youtu.be/YsXCVsDFiXA?feature=shared

All of them still plays fine

Garioshi posted...

Nah, Mario has WAY too much momentum in 64. Once you hit the jump button, you pretty much can't adjust that jump outside of microscopic movements to the left and right. When you land, you keep going for about 5 Mario lengths before you come to a full stop. You can dive, but that only puts you even more out of control. Mario also really likes to slide at the slightest incline, and sliding is even more uncontrollable than jumping.

???

SM64 was like the first ever fully 3D game t actually get analog controls right

Still feels good even today, to just run around in circles and jump and shit

Garioshi posted...

Nah, Mario has WAY too much momentum in 64. Once you hit the jump button, you pretty much can't adjust that jump outside of microscopic movements to the left and right. When you land, you keep going for about 5 Mario lengths before you come to a full stop. You can dive, but that only puts you even more out of control. Mario also really likes to slide at the slightest incline, and sliding is even more uncontrollable than jumping.

I feel like we didn't even play the same game.

Homeless_Waifu posted...

weird stuff that happens whenever Mario crosses a invisible wall, ceiling limit, and out of bounds zone

You can't cross an out of bounds zone at all. If you somehow glitch into an out of bounds area you die instantly.

that sounds sad, i'm sad for you tc

I'm fine with the controls in all the 3D Mario games, and while the camera is never perfect, it's mostly tolerable in all of them as well.

Odyssey is just another level. It is the best controlling Mario game by far. I have not played any of the 3D Marios since playing Odyssey, but I could see going back to the old ones being jarring. Odyssey is just that smooth.

Garioshi posted...

Nah, Mario has WAY too much momentum in 64.

the momentum in mario 64 is part of what makes its movement so good. compare its walljumps to the extremely depressing ones in odyssey, or how nice it feels to chain longjumps compared to how they are in galaxy

Tyranthraxus posted...

You can't cross an out of bounds zone at all. If you somehow glitch into an out of bounds area you die instantly.

supposedly Marios hat is like a checksum.
that video I linked, is how I found out about how being out of bounds can instant kill mario, mechanics that can cause derpy physics or potentially put mario in a segment of the map with nothing loaded up properly effectively trapping mario in a closed space

i went like some 20 years not knowing any of this! Its pretty amazing imo

HylianFox posted...

The camera was the only sucky part of SM64

Fuck you, Lakitu. I think you're trying to kill Mario

you've heard of unreliable narrator now meet the unreliable camera man

Sunshine still the GOAT.

I went back to Sunshine, and it definitely took some getting used to, but once I did it was so much fun. The best Mario to control.

The only 3D platformers from the N64 that are still enjoyable are the GOATs

Banjo-Kazooie and Tooie

I haven't had the drive to play a Mario game in a long time.

Closest thing I've played is pizza tower

I think odyssey is vastly overrated. Its like the poster child for wide as an ocean deep as a puddle

HylianFox posted...

???

SM64 was like the first ever fully 3D game t actually get analog controls right

Still feels good even today, to just run around in circles and jump and shit

I agree that he's very fun to control, but it's not good for the level of precision the game asks of you.

ssb_yunglink2 posted...

I think odyssey is vastly overrated. Its like the poster child for wide as an ocean deep as a puddle

Disagree.

The movement controls and level design are incredible. There's an easy intended path for low skill players but you can also trick jump and explore the maps to pull off incredible rewarding shit if you're good.

None of the other game have this.

I'd say Galaxy is the worst Mario game for having loads in it but not much to do.

Super Mario Sunshine is still hella fun to play!

i dare to say that i enjoyed it more than both 64 and Galaxy combined!

Guns_of_Verdun posted...

Mario 64 - Crappy controls and awful camera, strange level design and loads of bad game mechanics
Galaxy - Super linear and slow. Feels like a slog.
Sunshine - I mean it's Sunshine come on lol

Odyssey took like all the best parts of the franchise so far including the 2D games and put it into one game with immense freedom and smooth great control of both Mario and the camera.

One of those games that you don't appreciate how good it is until you go back to other games.

Odyssey is easily a top 10 game of the decade, possibly top 5.

Homeless_Waifu posted...

i know theres also like invisible walls, and certain mechanics that can make Mario teleport to certain areas of the map.

weird stuff that happens whenever Mario crosses a invisible wall, ceiling limit, and out of bounds zone

some guy on YouTube like made it his mission to explain those weird mechanics in great detail

https://youtu.be/YsXCVsDFiXA?feature=shared

Watching it now!

I honestly really appreciate the linearity in Galaxy. I feel it led to more creativity. I can replay that game a lot easier than the others. My need for completionism might affect that though and Odyssey is the biggest slog to complete of them all.
That said I do think Odyssey's actual gameplay is the smoothest and capturing is the best mechanic.

Guns_of_Verdun posted...

Disagree.

The movement controls and level design are incredible. There's an easy intended path for low skill players but you can also trick jump and explore the maps to pull off incredible rewarding shit if you're good.

None of the other game have this.

I'd say Galaxy is the worst Mario game for having loads in it but not much to do.

Theres no reward for doing any of that in Odyssey except maybe a moon that you could also get from spending a few coins or pressing on a random spot on the floor. I dont think Odysseys level design is better than either Galaxys or even 64.

Once the spectacle of Odyssey is gotten over, it just feels hollow to me.

GiftedACIII posted...

I honestly really appreciate the linearity in Galaxy. I feel it led to more creativity. I can replay that game a lot easier than the others. My need for completionism might affect that though and Odyssey is the biggest slog to complete of them all.
That said I do think Odyssey's actual gameplay is the smoothest and capturing is the best mechanic.

I agree with this. Linearity in games is not always a bad thing. I can complete everything in galaxy and have fun doing it. Getting every moon in odyssey is not something that can be called fun in any way.

I like the movement in odyssey but i thought the capture mechanic was honestly half baked

dogshit topic

I disagree that there's no "reward" from exploring the levels and getting the collectables in cool fast ways.

It's good game design, it rewards skilled players without punishing less skilled ones. It would not be improved if they put moons in bullshit locations only skilled trick-jumpers could reach.

This is especially true for replay value. There's almost no part in the entire game that drags.

Guns_of_Verdun posted...

I disagree that there's no "reward" from exploring the levels and getting the collectables in cool fast ways.

It's good game design, it rewards skilled players without punishing less skilled ones. It would not be improved if they put moons in bullshit locations only skilled trick-jumpers could reach.

This is especially true for replay value. There's almost no part in the entire game that drags.

If you want to get every moon then the entire post-main game experience is a drag. Some kingdoms like lakeside I didnt even like much the first go through. Attempting to get every moon is probably a big reason i burned out and dislike the game as much as i do.

odyssey could really do with like 80% fewer moons because
ssb_yunglink2 posted...

a moon that you could also get from spending a few coins or pressing on a random spot on the floor

basically none of these are interesting at all

What were not gonna do is talk shit about Sunshine. That game was and still is a treasure.

Yeah I agree with the notion that Odyssey had too many collectibles.

Some of the moons were worse than the eggs in Spyro 3.

Too many moons to collect and coins are meaningless. Why do you only lose 10 coins for dying? Also, Cappy is cringe.

6/10 game

I really wanted to love Galaxy, and parts of it I do (especially the soundtrack). But if I'm being perfectly honest, I played Galaxy twice all the way through and Odyssey only once, and Odyssey was still infinitely more memorable.

masterpug53 posted...

I really wanted to love Galaxy, and parts of it I do (especially the soundtrack). But if I'm being perfectly honest, I played Galaxy twice all the way through and Odyssey only once, and Odyssey was still infinitely more memorable.

This is basically how I feel about Galaxy and Odyssey.

Im actually very surprised of this topic as usually Galaxy gets a big circlejerk on this board. I think its the most overrated Mario game, its the only 3D Mario that I didnt finish because I got so bored with it around 75% of the way through.

Was meaning to go back and finish it but its been like 3-4 years now since I last played, so not anytime soon.

64 and Sunshine still feel fun to play today (especially with the 3D All-stars slight polish)
for me at least.

Galaxy is hard to get into again for some reason. I prefer my 3D Marios as collectathons, and in that vein Odyssey is indeed my favorite.

Galaxy does have banger music going for it.

I don't know that Nintendo actually intended you to collect all the moons tbh.

I mean, I did, but I don't think they want you to.

pegusus123456 posted...

I don't know that Nintendo actually intended you to collect all the moons tbh.

I mean, I did, but I don't think they want you to.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bAxyxlkD_g0

I think I remember watching that video before playing Mario Odyssey.

And I was naive to think that he'd made up the taxi thing

I just finished the story this morning. Good game love the controls and fun levels.

It's hard for me to want to play Mario Odyssey

Guns_of_Verdun posted...

I disagree that there's no "reward" from exploring the levels and getting the collectables in cool fast ways.

It's good game design, it rewards skilled players without punishing less skilled ones. It would not be improved if they put moons in bullshit locations only skilled trick-jumpers could reach.

This is especially true for replay value. There's almost no part in the entire game that drags.

I'd say this is true for the first time for the novelty of them and the thrill of discovery. But the opposite on replays. On a replay the entire game drags with hundreds of inconsequential moons that have the same gimmick across every level feeling like padding.
DavidZ2844 posted...

This is basically how I feel about Galaxy and Odyssey.

Im actually very surprised of this topic as usually Galaxy gets a big circlejerk on this board. I think its the most overrated Mario game, its the only 3D Mario that I didnt finish because I got so bored with it around 75% of the way through.

Was meaning to go back and finish it but its been like 3-4 years now since I last played, so not anytime soon.

I've 100%ed Galaxy three times from scratch from various times so that's six playthroughs taking the Mario and Luigi stars as separate playthroughs. I didn't burn out for any of them. I 100%ed Odyssey once and then I could only get to the Lake Kingdom before I burned out on my 2nd playthrough because it just got too dull. I don't feel like replaying Odyssey any time soon while I still feel like I can replay Galaxy if I ever get the itch.

EndOfDiscOne posted...

I went back to Sunshine, and it definitely took some getting used to, but once I did it was so much fun. The best Mario to control.

I disagree strongly. Going back and playing sunshine I thought it was one of the worst to control.

Guns_of_Verdun posted...

I disagree that there's no "reward" from exploring the levels and getting the collectables in cool fast ways.

It's good game design, it rewards skilled players without punishing less skilled ones. It would not be improved if they put moons in bullshit locations only skilled trick-jumpers could reach.

This is especially true for replay value. There's almost no part in the entire game that drags.

Agreed strongly. The stuff you can do with Mario that's not glitches is so cool. The hat, dive, jump mechanics are so sublime. Easily some of the best platforming control ever. There's elements of the game I'm not a fan of, but how Mario controls was so impressive

Also RE: Mario 64. I feel like context is necessary for the game. There's loads of problems... but it was literally one of the first 3D platformers. And at the time it was mind blowing how well they stuck the landing.

The camera is also bleh, but that was a problem in many games for some time around that time period. It took some time for that particular problem to get solved.