Current Events > Been single for 27 years lol

(+) Yeah! (+)

MyBirthRight posted...

Men and women aren't the same. Woken are raised and treated drastically different from men

In society, its socially acceptable for a woman to have high standards. Man must be tall, not bald, decEnt looking, have a personality, have a good career. A man must have several things going on to be considered

NoxObscuras posted...

If you truly don't care about being in a relationship, then there's nothing wrong with that. But generally speaking, men can't take the "I'll just let a relationship happen naturally" approach because men have to be the ones to initiate.

So I get why he said it's a bad attitude to have. Because some guys just sit and wait for it to fall into their lap and then get mad when nothing happens. That's what you don't want to fall into.

I am not the type to initiate. From my perspective, the "right one" will occur naturally. And if it doesn't happen, then it wasn't meant to be (and that's completely fine). No reason to get mad or sad or anything like that. I'd rather be single the rest of my life than to go out of my way trying to find/force a relationship by having to change and be someone I'm not (i.e., initiating myself).

Like this past weekend: I was with family and we went out to dinner. I thought the waitress was cute, and my family could tell. They kept telling me to ask for her number and I told them "no." Rather than respect my wishes, my sister pretended to be me and wrote a note to the waitress giving her my number. Then they kept asking me if she texted or anything the rest of the weekend. She didn't but I wouldn't have expected her to. I thought she was cute, but there wasn't a spark during our interactions as she waited on us. My family just didn't seem to understand that. When they pushed me to ask for her number, it felt fake, unnatural, non-organic, forced. It would have been completely different if, say, as she took my order something clicked, like she made a comment or we accidentally touched hands or laughed at something together. But going out of my way to push something? That doesn't feel right and I know that, even if we did get together, it wouldn't have lasted, as it wasn't something natural, something organic/happenstance.

Sufferedphoneix posted...

Yeah in my case I was just always oblivious until a long time after thr fact and I'd realize the girl had been hitting on me.

I was oblivious at first and kept going to talk to other people and the she would find me again. Eventually, I was like "wait, is she into me?". I am so happy she basically smacked me into paying attention, as that was a turning point for me,

KogaSteelfang posted...

Even that must be nice.

I am positive it has happened to you and you were oblivious. You can't say "no" if you were oblivious.

WTGHookshot posted...

But going out of my way to push something? That doesn't feel right and I know that, even if we did get together, it wouldn't have lasted, as it wasn't something natural, something organic/happenstance.

Uh, that is how 95% of relationships happen. I am sorry, but you have the wrong mindset.

WTGHookshot posted...

I am not the type to initiate. From my perspective, the "right one" will occur naturally. And if it doesn't happen, then it wasn't meant to be (and that's completely fine). No reason to get mad or sad or anything like that. I'd rather be single the rest of my life than to go out of my way trying to find/force a relationship by having to change and be someone I'm not (i.e., initiating myself).

Like this past weekend: I was with family and we went out to dinner. I thought the waitress was cute, and my family could tell. They kept telling me to ask for her number and I told them "no." Rather than respect my wishes, my sister pretended to be me and wrote a note to the waitress giving her my number. Then they kept asking me if she texted or anything the rest of the weekend. She didn't but I wouldn't have expected her to. I thought she was cute, but there wasn't a spark during our interactions as she waited on us. My family just didn't seem to understand that. When they pushed me to ask for her number, it felt fake, unnatural, non-organic, forced. It would have been completely different if, say, as she took my order something clicked, like she made a comment or we accidentally touched hands or laughed at something together. But going out of my way to push something? That doesn't feel right and I know that, even if we did get together, it wouldn't have lasted, as it wasn't something natural, something organic/happenstance.

Yeah, you really don't understand how any of this works lol what you're describing isn't "natural." You're expecting a supernatural intervention to basically make a woman fall into your lap without you doing anything at all. That's not "organic" or anything of the sort. It's a fantasy.

Sufferedphoneix posted...

Makes you feel like a idiot. The one I remember this most is this red head. That's the one I regret not picking up on

I can see that.

bsp77 posted...

I am positive it has happened to you and you were oblivious. You can't say "no" if you were oblivious.

I'm positive it hasn't. It's a nice sentiment to say it's happened and I didn't notice, but that's hardly different from just imagining scenarios. Neither of us can actually know for certain either way, but I have the ability to look back and see how likely it is while you're just guessing. I can imagine lots of things that may have happened that I've been oblivious to.

KogaSteelfang posted...

I'm positive it hasn't

This is the problem. NO ONE should be able to say that they are positive about things they may have simply missed. That is the point; you couldn't know. But you are so dead set in believing that no one could ever be interested in you that you can't see it. Nothing is going to change for you until you realize that you have these incorrect assumptions about yourself.

bsp77 posted...

Uh, that is how 95% of relationships happen. I am sorry, but you have the wrong mindset.

Personally, I feel that it's those 95% of relationships that have the wrong mindset. Looking at how many relationships end? Yeah, I'll take my chances with the 5% than the 95%.

lolife67 posted...

Yeah, you really don't understand how any of this works lol what you're describing isn't "natural." You're expecting a supernatural intervention to basically make a woman fall into your lap without you doing anything at all. That's not "organic" or anything of the sort. It's a fantasy.

From my perspective, that's what relationships and romance are supposed to be about in the first place. It is supposed to be something that is pretty much "supernatural." I observe everything around me and I feel that 99.99% of the relationships I've seen should never have happened from my perspective, which is why so many of them end. They just weren't meant to be, yet pursued it anyways rather than be fine being alone. Look no further than the divorce rates. That should easily tell you the wrong people are getting together. Those shouldn't have happened in the first place, from my perspective.

You can call my mindset "wrong." You can tell me I'm an idiot or I don't understand. But none of that is going to change my mind on this. I feel deep within my bones and soul that romance is supposed to be fantastical, pretty much unreal, magical.

It's why I want religion and government to get out of marriage. It's why I want there to be less pressure on marriage being "the next step." No... Marriage is something that is supposed to be truly, truly special, in my eyes. It is the union of two people into one inseparable being, not from a religious or governmental perspective, but from the perspective of those romantic partners themselves. That they cannot live without one another. Anything less than that, from my perspective, is a farce. It is grotesque. I'd rather see 99.99999% people go unmarried than for people to get married and corrupt the (non-religious) sanctity of that act.

WTGHookshot posted...

From my perspective, that's what relationships and romance are supposed to be about in the first place. It is supposed to be something that is pretty much "supernatural."

Yeah, this isn't at all true and the crux of your issue. Your perspective is completely incorrect. But as you say, you're dead set on believing you're 100% right (which is, ironically, not logical at all) so I won't keep going back and forth about it.

bsp77 posted...

This is the problem. NO ONE should be able to say that they are positive about things they may have simply missed. That is the point; you couldn't know. But you are so dead set in believing that no one could ever be interested in you that you can't see it. Nothing is going to change for you until you realize that you have these incorrect assumptions about yourself.

If I can't be certain, neither can you. If it's such an unknown, how are you so sure that I've just been oblivious to it?

WTGHookshot posted...

I think we found a real life Disney Princess!

WTGHookshot has created his own worldview about how relationships should work that is divorced from reality.

Its like thinking that the job that you really want and pays well and fits your passion should magically fall in your lap. For 99% of people, it doesnt. Youre not going to be sitting on your ass when someone walks buys and says you should work for my video game design company for six figures!

99% of people have to work for it, pursue it, and position themselves for the job they want. The same is true of relationships. In my single days I studied a lot of relationship experts and advice and its 100% clear that this mindset of some magical fairy tale meet the one divine intervention holds people back. Dating is a numbers game.

KogaSteelfang posted...

If I can't be certain, neither can you. If it's such an unknown, how are you so sure that I've just been oblivious to it?

You are right, I can't be 100% certain that they actively engaged with you, but you have a look that appeals to quite a few women. I guarantee that you sometimes get attention, but I can't 100% guarantee that women have actually acted on it.

The point is that your 100% certainty that you never have had someone into you is the crux of your problem. That and your inability to talk about common interests with people in person.
Fix those two things and I think you would do fine. I understand that shaking your doubts is exceedingly hard, but practicing talking about movies and games with people should be very doable.

lolife67 posted...

Yeah, this isn't at all true and the crux of your issue. Your perspective is completely incorrect. But as you say, you're dead set on believing you're 100% right (which is, ironically, not logical at all) so I won't keep going back and forth about it.

Thank you for not going back and forth on it and wasting your time.

I don't have an issue. I am completely fine living my life alone, if nothing ever comes to be. I would rather die than give in to the peer pressure of others to believe what they believe on this topic.

-Kicksave- posted...

WTGHookshot has created his own worldview about how relationships should work that is divorced from reality.

Its like thinking that the job that you really want and pays well and fits your passion should magically fall in your lap. For 99% of people, it doesnt. Youre not going to be sitting on your ass when someone walks buys and says you should work for my video game design company for six figures!

99% of people have to work for it, pursue it, and position themselves for the job they want. The same is true of relationships. In my single days I studied a lot of relationship experts and advice and its 100% clear that this mindset of some magical fairy tale meet the one divine intervention holds people back. Dating is a numbers game.

I fully disagree with that, personally. I feel those "dating" is an affront to true romance. "Holds people back"... From what? Pursuing relationships that shouldn't be? From just picking and choosing a mate like you would a piece of furniture, waiting for the "best fit"? Only to maybe find a different piece of "furniture" you like better later? To treat people as disposable, interchangeable commodities? To settle for someone due to some stupid desire for companionship?

What makes them relationship experts? Because they know how to "sell" people like they would a house or car and get a decent correlation? (I.e., "I'll keep this car until I drive it into the ground")

Thanks, but I will pass.

bsp77 posted...

That and your inability to talk about common interests with people in person.

I know this is a huge issue, and it undermines most of what I hope for. It's the very reason I tried therapy. I know I have several big hurdles to overcome, but this is the biggest imo.

Even if I did meet someone, or get a date... I wouldn't be able to talk. Awkward is one thing, but shutting down entirely is totally different. I can force it into just awkward territory if they take control of the conversation, but like, beyond one or two light conversations I've got nothing to say.

Why even bother when I'm just going to give them an uncomfortable and awkward time that they hate? There wouldn't be a second date, or anything beyond. It'd just be a waste of both our time.

I just wish that someone would see me, get to know me enough to see the real me, and still decide that I'm worth being with. Everyone I work with or get to know eventually grows to like me irl(opposite of how it works online). It just takes so long for me to be comfortable around a person and lower my guard. No one wants to give a chance to someone like me. I thought that wouldn't be obvious on a dating site, but that never led to anything either.

I'm just no good. That's all there is. Even if I personally found success, it'd be nothing but a waste for the other person.

WTGHookshot posted...

I fully disagree with that, personally. I feel those "dating" is an affront to true romance. "Holds people back"... From what? Pursuing relationships that shouldn't be? From just picking and choosing a mate like you would a piece of furniture, waiting for the "best fit"? Only to maybe find a different piece of "furniture" you like better later? To treat people as disposable, interchangeable commodities? To settle for someone due to some stupid desire for companionship?

What makes them relationship experts? Because they know how to "sell" people like they would a house or car and get a decent correlation? (I.e., "I'll keep this car until I drive it into the ground")

Thanks, but I will pass.

So if you ever met this person randomly and you dont want to date. What do you think is gonna happen? Youre gonna sit in your room and play the switch while they sit there and watch and grow more in love with you?

WTGHookshot posted...

From my perspective, that's what relationships and romance are supposed to be about in the first place. It is supposed to be something that is pretty much "supernatural." I observe everything around me and I feel that 99.99% of the relationships I've seen should never have happened from my perspective, which is why so many of them end. They just weren't meant to be, yet pursued it anyways rather than be fine being alone. Look no further than the divorce rates. That should easily tell you the wrong people are getting together. Those shouldn't have happened in the first place, from my perspective.

You can call my mindset "wrong." You can tell me I'm an idiot or I don't understand. But none of that is going to change my mind on this. I feel deep within my bones and soul that romance is supposed to be fantastical, pretty much unreal, magical.

Hey, you're free to believe all of that if you like.

Just know that it's an unrealistic expectation and the odds of finding a romance that goes like that are astronomically low. Not just because situations don't typically play out like they do in movies, but also because there are a lot of people out there that you'd just flat out never meet if you weren't looking.

Take my girlfriend for example. She's everything I could ask for in a partner, and I'm already 100% sure I'm going to marry her in the future. But I never would have met her, let alone dated her, if I didn't go on dating sites and actively pursue a relationship. She doesn't live anywhere near me, or the places I frequent.

I4NRulez posted...

So if you ever met this person randomly and you dont want to date. What do you think is gonna happen? Youre gonna sit in your room and play the switch while they sit there and watch and grow more in love with you?

I think my wording was previously off. What I meant by "not date" is "not date around." Sorry if that was unclear. What I meant is not go through a bunch of dates with different people, looking for the person you just don't grow bored of. I did not mean not go on dates with "this person." Sorry if that was unclear.

As far as "sit in your room and play the Switch while they sit there and watch": in a way, yes, they would at times. They would also play the Switch with me at times. I would watch them play at times, too. We would complete each other, not looking to change one another, just fitting comfortably into each other's lives.

However, that's a huge assumption that I would ever randomly meet that person. Realistically, I wouldn't (and that's completely fine by me). Just like realistically, 99.999% of people won't (which is why so, so, so, so many people settle for others).

WTGHookshot posted...

I fully disagree with that, personally. I feel those "dating" is an affront to true romance. "Holds people back"... From what? Pursuing relationships that shouldn't be? From just picking and choosing a mate like you would a piece of furniture, waiting for the "best fit"? Only to maybe find a different piece of "furniture" you like better later? To treat people as disposable, interchangeable commodities? To settle for someone due to some stupid desire for companionship?

What makes them relationship experts? Because they know how to "sell" people like they would a house or car and get a decent correlation? (I.e., "I'll keep this car until I drive it into the ground")

Thanks, but I will pass.

For better or worse, humans would be extinct if others had your view. Also, why does your first relationship have to be a perfect fit? Learning and growing is part of what it means to be alive. You are letting life pass you by with this attitude. If you are happy being alone, then kudos. I mean it. But maybe keep your mouth shut, as your views on relationships is frankly insulting to humanity.

KogaSteelfang posted...

I know this is a huge issue, and it undermines most of what I hope for. It's the very reason I tried therapy. I know I have several big hurdles to overcome, but this is the biggest imo.

Even if I did meet someone, or get a date... I wouldn't be able to talk. Awkward is one thing, but shutting down entirely is totally different. I can force it into just awkward territory if they take control of the conversation, but like, beyond one or two light conversations I've got nothing to say.

Why even bother when I'm just going to give them an uncomfortable and awkward time that they hate? There wouldn't be a second date, or anything beyond. It'd just be a waste of both our time.

As I said, work on talking with others about common interests. Practice with co-workers. Go to a gaming store where people sit around and play games and then practice with them. Just practice. I practiced randomly talking to store employees, from Gamestop to the local grocery store. Don't just accept shutting down.

I just wish that someone would see me, get to know me enough to see the real me, and still decide that I'm worth being with. Everyone I work with or get to know eventually grows to like me irl(opposite of how it works online). It just takes so long for me to be comfortable around a person and lower my guard. No one wants to give a chance to someone like me. I thought that wouldn't be obvious on a dating site, but that never led to anything either.

But why would someone do that? Not to be harsh, but why would someone waste their time getting to know someone when they don't know if there is potential? Once again, this gets to what I said in the above paragraph. Get them to know your worth by communicating.

I'm just no good. That's all there is. Even if I personally found success, it'd be nothing but a waste for the other person.

Stop

NoxObscuras posted...

Hey, you're free to believe all of that if you like.

Just know that it's an unrealistic expectation and the odds of finding a romance that goes like that are astronomically low. Not just because situations don't typically play out like they do in movies, but also because there are a lot of people out there that you'd just flat out never meet if you weren't looking.

Take my girlfriend for example. She's everything I could ask for in a partner, and I'm already 100% sure I'm going to marry her in the future. But I never would have met her, let alone dated her, if I didn't go on dating sites and actively pursue a relationship. She doesn't live anywhere near me, or the places I frequent.

I do realize that finding a romance like that is astronomically low. However, I sincerely believe with every single bone, drop of blood, tissue, and cell in my body that it should be that way for everyone. As in, very, very, very, very, very few people should ever be in relationships to begin with.

As for your situation, I appreciate that you are seemingly happy in this moment. However, please come back to me on your or her deathbed and tell me: A) if it's your deathbed, it worked out and you stayed together for the rest of your life and she is ready to kill herself the moment you die in order to not live without you; B) if it's her deathbed, do you plan to kill yourself the moment she flatlines? If not, then no matter how long and happy your lives were together, it won't even slightly change my mind on the topic.

WTGHookshot posted...

As for your situation, I appreciate that you are seemingly happy in this moment. However, please come back to me on your or her deathbed and tell me: A) if it's your deathbed, it worked out and you stayed together for the rest of your life and she is ready to kill herself the moment you die in order to not live without you; B) if it's her deathbed, do you plan to kill yourself the moment she flatlines? If not, then no matter how long and happy your lives were together, it won't even slightly change my mind on the topic.

Shut the fuck up. I don't think you have any idea how insulting you are.

WTGHookshot posted...

I think my wording was previously off. What I meant by "not date" is "not date around." Sorry if that was unclear. What I meant is not go through a bunch of dates with different people, looking for the person you just don't grow bored of. I did not mean not go on dates with "this person." Sorry if that was unclear.

As far as "sit in your room and play the Switch while they sit there and watch": in a way, yes, they would at times. They would also play the Switch with me at times. I would watch them play at times, too. We would complete each other, not looking to change one another, just fitting comfortably into each other's lives.

However, that's a huge assumption that I would ever randomly meet that person. Realistically, I wouldn't (and that's completely fine by me). Just like realistically, 99.999% of people won't (which is why so, so, so, so many people settle for others).

I'm going to say this and im going to try to be as cordial as possible about it.

You sound entitled and pompous. You have no idea how the real world works and you sound like an edgy teenager. I'm glad you're ok with being alone because you will be and with that attitude it's deserved.

I hope if you do ever find someone to be with that your attitude changes and if not i wish god's mercy for that person.

bsp77 posted...

For better or worse, humans would be extinct if others had your view. Also, why does your first relationship have to be a perfect fit? Learning and growing is part of what it means to be alive. You are letting life pass you by with this attitude. If you are happy being alone, then kudos. I mean it. But maybe keep your mouth shut, as your views on relationships is frankly insulting to humanity.

It is clear we probably have not conversed prior to this topic before, as you'd most likely already know my views on humanity's existence.

I disagree on what it means to be alive, personally (which I guess isn't shocking, considering we view things very differently).

Are you and everyone else disagreeing with me going to keep their mouths shut? No? Then why would I?

bsp77 posted...

But why would someone do that? Not to be harsh, but why would someone waste their time getting to know someone when they don't know if there is potential?

They wouldn't. They haven't. They won't. That's what I've been saying. I'm not worth being with.

KogaSteelfang posted...

They wouldn't. They haven't. They won't. That's what I've been saying. I'm not worth being with.

You didn't respond to the important part about practicing conversing.

What you just wrote would be true of me as well, and most others here, if we didn't have conversations with others about personal interests.

What I see here is that it's about fear and intolerance to discomfort. Fear of failure to cope, rejection from peers, and emotional and mental conflict. We have two different types of delusions to look at and both are pretty harmful and deeply set.

If there's any hope for them, it will be because they have the nerve to make major changes and challenge their worldviews. It certainly won't be here.

WTGHookshot posted...

I do realize that finding a romance like that is astronomically low. However, I sincerely believe with every single bone, drop of blood, tissue, and cell in my body that it should be that way for everyone. As in, very, very, very, very, very few people should ever be in relationships to begin with.

As for your situation, I appreciate that you are seemingly happy in this moment. However, please come back to me on your or her deathbed and tell me: A) if it's your deathbed, it worked out and you stayed together for the rest of your life and she is ready to kill herself the moment you die in order to not live without you; B) if it's her deathbed, do you plan to kill yourself the moment she flatlines? If not, then no matter how long and happy your lives were together, it won't even slightly change my mind on the topic.

Wow that's uh... Quiet a viewpoint there... What's the logic behind that?

NoxObscuras posted...

Wow that's uh... Quiet a viewpoint there... What's the logic behind that?

Isn't it obvious? If you aren't like Romeo and Juliet and stab yourself in the heart upon her death, then you don't love her. Why don't you love your girlfriend, Nox? Huh, tell me why?!?

bsp77 posted...

Shut the fuck up. I don't think you have any idea how insulting you are.

If you feel I am breaking the TOS, please feel free to report me. If not and you still don't want to read my posts, then I would suggest you use the Block feature, the Ignore feature, or the Tag feature (and then just manually ignore my posts).

bsp77 posted...

You didn't respond to the important part about practicing conversing.

I don't disagree with that part. Life in general would be 1,000 times easier if I could actively converse with people.

But that's the sole reason I went to therapy, and he suggested a job where I deal with lots of people. Which I got. I talk with and handle lots of people each week, and after a few years I've definitely seen an improvement. A big improvement. In both my ability to communicate and my anxiety levels around people.

But no one cares about that. No one cares about how much I've tried and how things are working out, because all anyone wants to see is results. I'm not where I want to be, and I'm not where you guys want me to be, so everything is thrown out me not doing anything. It doesn't matter that I can now go shopping and actually pay for my stuff without freaking out and having a panic attack in the parking lot. Or that I can go to the movie theatre and ask for tickets to a movie I want to see without hyperventilating in the dark for the next 15 minutes.

I've made big strides for myself, but none of that matters because it's not enough. Even at my best I'm not worth anyone's consideration. It hurts, it hurts a lot.

I4NRulez posted...

I'm going to say this and im going to try to be as cordial as possible about it.

You sound entitled and pompous. You have no idea how the real world works and you sound like an edgy teenager. I'm glad you're ok with being alone because you will be and with that attitude it's deserved.

I hope if you do ever find someone to be with that your attitude changes and if not i wish god's mercy for that person.

My attitude will not change. It has been the same for 34 years. You are most likely right in that I will be alone, but I am okay with that. I can't change the rest of the world/rest of people, and I myself am unwilling to change. So, it is a puzzle without a solution.

NoxObscuras posted...

Wow that's uh... Quiet a viewpoint there... What's the logic behind that?

Because the "right one" completes you, the other half of a single entity. There is no more "you" (individually) and no more "them." It would now be "you," a singular entity of two combined pieces that has melded together into one. How can someone live with half a heart? How can someone live with half a brain? How can someone live with half a soul?

bsp77 posted...

Isn't it obvious? If you aren't like Romeo and Juliet and stab yourself in the heart upon her death, then you don't love her. Why don't you love your girlfriend, Nox? Huh, tell me why?!?

"You don't love her." I never said that.

You can love someone and them still not be the "right one."

KogaSteelfang posted...

I don't disagree with that part. Life in general would be 1,000 times easier if I could actively converse with people.

But that's the sole reason I went to therapy, and he suggested a job where I deal with lots of people. Which I got. I talk with and handle lots of people each week, and after a few years I've definitely seen an improvement. A big improvement. In both my ability to communicate and my anxiety levels around people.

But no one cares about that. No one cares about how much I've tried and how things are working out, because all anyone wants to see is results. I'm not where I want to be, and I'm not where you guys want me to be, so everything is thrown out me not doing anything. It doesn't matter that I can now go shopping and actually pay for my stuff without freaking out and having a panic attack in the parking lot. Or that I can go to the movie theatre and ask for tickets to a movie I want to see without hyperventilating in the dark for the next 15 minutes.

I've made big strides for myself, but none of that matters because it's not enough. Even at my best I'm not worth anyone's consideration. It hurts, it hurts a lot.

All that stuff does matter, not least because it seems to matter to you. If it seems like people are piling on, it might be because you often come across as hopeless. I wonder if you've ever talked with your therapist about celebrating your progress or at least framing it in a way that you can feel good about it.

And if you are affected that much by the people here and how "we" view you, then that's something that could stand to change at some point. I myself know how a message board like this can be the only social group someone has but ideally, the opinions of (relative) strangers on the internet would factor nil or at least very low in the equation of a person's social life.

WTGHookshot posted...

As for your situation, I appreciate that you are seemingly happy in this moment. However, please come back to me on your or her deathbed and tell me: A) if it's your deathbed, it worked out and you stayed together for the rest of your life and she is ready to kill herself the moment you die in order to not live without you; B) if it's her deathbed, do you plan to kill yourself the moment she flatlines? If not, then no matter how long and happy your lives were together, it won't even slightly change my mind on the topic.

Jesus Christ...

KogaSteelfang posted...

I don't disagree with that part. Life in general would be 1,000 times easier if I could actively converse with people.

But that's the sole reason I went to therapy, and he suggested a job where I deal with lots of people. Which I got. I talk with and handle lots of people each week, and after a few years I've definitely seen an improvement. A big improvement. In both my ability to communicate and my anxiety levels around people.

But no one cares about that. No one cares about how much I've tried and how things are working out, because all anyone wants to see is results. I'm not where I want to be, and I'm not where you guys want me to be, so everything is thrown out me not doing anything. It doesn't matter that I can now go shopping and actually pay for my stuff without freaking out and having a panic attack in the parking lot. Or that I can go to the movie theatre and ask for tickets to a movie I want to see without hyperventilating in the dark for the next 15 minutes.

I've made big strides for myself, but none of that matters because it's not enough. Even at my best I'm not worth anyone's consideration. It hurts, it hurts a lot.

Hey, those strides are great, and it seems that they have made your life a lot better. So don't sell yourself short there. All I am saying is that you need to practice conversing about personal interests, especially if they are shared interests with others. I know you struggle with that. If you have made those other (IMO bigger) strides, I think you could tackle this one too. Being able to have light hearted conversations about random stuff is probably one of the bigger things to getting into a relationship.

berlyman101 posted...

All that stuff does matter, not least because it seems to matter to you.

It's not that it matters to me, it's just that I have made an effort and done things to try and improve myself and my life. I've just noticed the difference in how I can go out. There is improvement, just not enough to count for anything.

berlyman101 posted...

If it seems like people are piling on, it might be because you often come across as hopeless.

Because I am.

berlyman101 posted...

wonder if you've ever talked with your therapist about celebrating your progress or at least framing it in a way that you can feel good about it.

I'm no longer in therapy. He was terrible, I've just stayed at the same job.

berlyman101 posted...

And if you are affected that much by the people here and how "we" view you, then that's something that could stand to change at some point. I myself know how a message board like this can be the only social group someone has but ideally, the opinions of (relative) strangers on the internet would factor nil or at least very low in the equation of a person's social life.

It is my only social group. Idk why the opinions of posters here should matter less. Each of you is a person behind a screen like I am. I don't consider you guys any different from any other people I see out. It's just easier to communicate here.

WTGHookshot posted...

I fully disagree with that, personally. I feel those "dating" is an affront to true romance. "Holds people back"... From what? Pursuing relationships that shouldn't be? From just picking and choosing a mate like you would a piece of furniture, waiting for the "best fit"? Only to maybe find a different piece of "furniture" you like better later? To treat people as disposable, interchangeable commodities? To settle for someone due to some stupid desire for companionship?

No, dating is how you even discover the perfect piece of furniture and learn what you really like. The right furniture doesnt magically show up at your doorstep without effort, and your view is similarly confounding.

If you surveyed all the couples with a great marriage and asked how they met their beloved soulmate, almost all if not all of them will say dating. Approximately zero will say that God miraculously placed their partner in front of them and that they did no work.

Your mental rationalization of dating is not unique. Just the opposite. I hear it all the time from friends who are, subconsciously or consciously, simply insecure about dating. Then they date, eventually meet the right person, and realize they never had the right view.

-Kicksave- posted...

No, dating is how you even discover the perfect piece of furniture and learn what you really like. The right furniture doesnt magically show up at your doorstep without effort, and your view is similarly confounding.

...you seemed to miss my point. A significant other is NOT a piece of furniture, so we shouldn't be doing the same things that we do to discover the perfect piece of furniture for significant others. Yet, that is exactly what you are saying to do: treat romantic interests like furniture.

If you surveyed all the couples with a great marriage and asked how they met their beloved soulmate, almost all if not all of them will say dating. Approximately zero will say that God miraculously placed their partner in front of them and that they did no work.

I can already tell we disagree on what "couples with a 'great' marriage" would be in the very first place.

Your mental rationalization of dating is not unique. Just the opposite. I hear it all the time from friends who are, subconsciously or consciously, simply insecure about dating. Then they date, eventually meet the right person, and realize they never had the right view.

Well, you will never see that from me, as I won't date. My view isn't changing on this, sorry.

-Kicksave- posted...

Your mental rationalization of dating is not unique. Just the opposite. I hear it all the time from friends who are, subconsciously or consciously, simply insecure about dating. Then they date, eventually meet the right person, and realize they never had the right view.

Oh, trust me, he knows. He knows that he's incredibly dead wrong and that is not at all how life works even in the slightest. So he pretends to "rationalize" it this way. And he'll constantly tell you that you can't change his mind, even though no one has said they were trying to change his mind.

WTGHookshot posted...

...you seemed to miss my point. A significant other is NOT a piece of furniture, so we shouldn't be doing the same things that we do to discover the perfect piece of furniture for significant others. Yet, that is exactly what you are saying to do: treat romantic interests like furniture.

No offense, but a person who has no experience dating has no idea what romance is. None. Youre inventing a worldview that protects you from having to put yourself out there.

And youre missing the point. If there is a perfect anything (furniture, relationship, vacation experience) for you somewhere out in the world, you will never, ever, EVER, find it unless you go looking for it. It is not going to be drop shipped to you.

I can already tell we disagree on what "couples with a 'great' marriage" would be in the very first place.

It doesnt matter whose criteria we use, find whichever couples out there you think have the perfect divine relationship. Most likely they met through dating.

Well, you will never see that from me, as I won't date. My view isn't changing on this, sorry.

Well yeah. Ive also never met a guy who suddenly said yeah, youre right, I just need to get over my own discomfort. Few guys own up to that, especially to others. But with enough reinforcement from different sources, introspection and self study, a few of them eventually make the leap on their own terms and ultimately find the soulmate they should be with. But at some level there needs to be a seed planted that God is not going to bring you your soulmate, you must eventually discover her yourself.

-Kicksave- posted...

Your mental rationalization of dating is not unique. Just the opposite. I hear it all the time from friends who are, subconsciously or consciously, simply insecure about dating. Then they date, eventually meet the right person, and realize they never had the right view.

This is exactly it. He's not enlightened lol he's just scared of rejection/failure and weirdly thinks people don't grow or evolve in life.

bsp77 posted...

Hey, those strides are great, and it seems that they have made your life a lot better. So don't sell yourself short there.

Yeah, I can now barely function and accomplish the most basic of functions without breaking down. >_>

bsp77 posted...

All I am saying is that you need to practice conversing about personal interests, especially if they are shared interests with others. I know you struggle with that.

I know, and I'm trying. But mental illnesses aren't exactly easy to just power through. I do have actual diagnosed social anxiety(they referred to it as Social phobia). I'm doing what I can, and I'm sorry that I still struggle. Sometimes its just too much.

bsp77 posted...

If you have made those other (IMO bigger) strides, I think you could tackle this one too. Being able to have light hearted conversations about random stuff is probably one of the bigger things to getting into a relationship

I've tried various things over the years to find friends, or groups to join. I still can't really meet new people without freaking out or shutting down. So, dates are out of the question for now, which is part of why I'm not trying to get one. It'd be so much easier and better to have someone already in my life decide to develop a relationship with me rather than just going online and choosing a stranger to try and meet.

KogaSteelfang posted...

It's not that it matters to me, it's just that I have made an effort and done things to try and improve myself and my life. I've just noticed the difference in how I can go out. There is improvement, just not enough to count for anything.

I know I'm usually a sad sack when it comes to these kinds of topics... But improvement is improvement... You don't need to measure it against others... As long as it counts for you, it counts for something...

At least you can see improvement in how you act... I've been stagnant for years lol...

random_man9119 posted...

At least you can see improvement in how you act... I've been stagnant for years lol...

Barely, I've just gone from almost non-functional to almost functional. :/

Threads like this are a nice reminder of who I'm posting with

There's absolutely nothing wrong with being single, happy for you OP.