Board 8 > Star Wars and Pokemon Mafia Topic 11 - Puzzle League

(+) Yeah! (+)

MZero didn't full claim? Bummer.

But you know what, that's two contradictions MZero has pointed out on potential suspects. I'm liking him more and more, so who cares about the claim.

That JC post did strike me as off initially, but I brushed it off as "There's some logic here I don't quite follow, but I'll roll with it." Now it makes sense why that post didn't make sense; it didn't cross my mind that it only checks out if there are five scum.

I finally caught up on the day.

Red's stuff was confusing, but at the end of the day his role seems...Useless for town? From what I gathered it can't kill people on the dark side & only protects himself.

JC had a very odd claim, but is there reason as scum he would claim "hated"? Maybe in some roundabout way to get himself to live?

Also confused on how the "Clear" would happen, but it seems you all have discussed it already.

JC: What do you mean you would be cleared? How would you be cleared?

Has Scare posted at all this day?

I recall Scare posting at least once, but I forgot what he said.

ScareChan posted...

and if we do

He asked me about doctor

If we do have a doctor the roles should be within range of a normal game. Although it is pretty hard to figure that out given the format.

DoomTheGyarados posted...

He asked me about doctor

If we do have a doctor the roles should be within range of a normal game. Although it is pretty hard to figure that out given the format.

Aha, thanks.

It makes sense to me. Town has one full time protection (doctor) and one full time scanner (tracker/flavor cop) and then the balance works out from there.

Yup, definitely don't agree with the people saying Ulti should be lynched right now.

ViolentAbacus posted...

Yup, definitely don't agree with the people saying Ulti should be lynched right now.

Who are those people?

Would be an awfully bold claim when there are 4 people completely (Though I've read that Sbell's was revealed? I must have missed it) unclaimed in me, chris, sbell, and scare.

DoomTheGyarados posted...

Who are those people?

I guess it was just Sbell, looking back.

Kirby mused about Ulti being dark side, but then decided on Mzero.

Ah, well Sbell is already accounted for so fair enough.

I like to think if I had Ben and Sheep on my team I just throw one of our many, many, many lesser contributing town members day 1 into a wood chipper instead.

Lmao I'm so fucking bad at this game. I don't think anything I say will convince you guys that I didn't have a perspective slip there but it's pretty clear that I was just operating on the assumption it's a 5 man team. If it's a 6 man team then we're in a far worse situation and it makes even more sense for me to die today from a hated townie perspective. I was just following Kirby's logic that I'm not the role thief and if there's a 5 man team and we lynch the scum that's not the role thief. I could argue that I thought there was an independent still, but honestly I wasn't thinking that at the time when I made that 'slip' so I won't.

I kind of deserve the lynch for such a blatant fuckup but when I flip you'll all be thinking 'damn jc you're terrible at this game' instead of patting yourselves on the back for catching a slip.

Anyways for some QUICK MATH parting shots if we're assuming that Chris is town, then by process of elimination that leaves the following:

Town
Sbell
Scare
Chris
Hb
Red
Kirby
Ulti

Scum remains in:
Lea
Mzero
VA

What would it take people to lynch MZero/Lea over me today? Because I think that's still the best course of action but somehow I doubt that's going to happen.

I am always wary of slips, they aren't that great. What makes me concerned is how you masterfully avoided discussing in any real sense ben, sheep, or isquen day 1 when there was plenty of opportunity provided to discuss all 3 at various points. I made sure of it.

DoomTheGyarados posted...

I am always wary of slips, they aren't that great. What makes me concerned is how you masterfully avoided discussing in any real sense ben, sheep, or isquen day 1 when there was plenty of opportunity provided to discuss all 3 at various points. I made sure of it.

I avoided discussing them because I didn't have anything else to add - a lot of those conversations had prior game context iirc and I had a hard time parsing a lot of of it (hence me asking for clarification on Sheep D1). And as I told plum when he brought up my walls of text, I was trying to come up with my own separate reads and help add to the conversation that way.

It would be pretty sick if you just so happened to talk a lot about town and none about scum as town.

Remind me who you have your vote on atm? Also we have been discussing six man teams *a lot*, did you give any prior indication that you thought this was wrong?

Also my pokemon flavor has been changed to Lechonk

I will take no questions about this.

DoomTheGyarados posted...

It would be pretty sick if you just so happened to talk a lot about town and none about scum as town.

It is unfortunately 'pretty sick'.

I don't have my vote on anyone at the moment but I'm prepared to vote MZero/Lea. I was hoping for some consolidation on one but I don't think I'll have that luxury.

I hadn't discussed the number of people that could be on the scum team at any point up until that post, no.

Chris, I'll offer up a bunch of wine in front of you and put out a counter-argument to why I'm scum. Would a scum member essentially offer themselves up as a lynch target by claiming hated townie? I'm acknowledging how anti-town my role is and accepting that it's not a bad decision to lynch me. While I do want to defend myself, I am prepared to accept my fate with no malice because my role is so anti-town. Would a scum member come in and throw themselves on the sword like that?

I'm already drunk by the end of that paragraph good lord.

Chaeix posted...

It is unfortunately 'pretty sick'.

I don't have my vote on anyone at the moment but I'm prepared to vote MZero/Lea. I was hoping for some consolidation on one but I don't think I'll have that luxury.

I hadn't discussed the number of people that could be on the scum team at any point up until that post, no.

Chris, I'll offer up a bunch of wine in front of you and put out a counter-argument to why I'm scum. Would a scum member essentially offer themselves up as a lynch target by claiming hated townie? I'm acknowledging how anti-town my role is and accepting that it's not a bad decision to lynch me. While I do want to defend myself, I am prepared to accept my fate with no malice because my role is so anti-town. Would a scum member come in and throw themselves on the sword like that?

I'm already drunk by the end of that paragraph good lord.

*Sips on some wine*

One of my favorite activities as a leisure time mafia activity is to break through wifom even though the most prudent thing to do is to ignore it. May I?

Lea offered herself up as a lynch for Arti. She said it was a mistake to lynch Arti instead of her because he was a claimed scanner. She defended Arti not only day 3 but day 4 and despite questioning the role meta she never wavered in thinking that Arti was town and she thought it was a mistake to not just get her lynch out of the way, especially when she said the lynch was set anyway. You think she is scum. What's the difference? You are town for acting this way but you think her prior performance makes her squarely scum.

Go on.

Gengar, Tangela, Votals, Spearow
[2] JC: Chris, (Ulti), Ulti
[1] Red: Hb, (Kirby)
[1] MZero: Lea, (Kirby)
[1] Ulti: SBell
[1] Lea: (Ulti), Kirby
[0] Abacus: (Ulti)

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to reach majority. Day ends at 7pm eastern on Wednesday, roughly 6 hours from now.

That's a fair point on Lea offering herself up quite frankly but you'll note that I never said that's why I think Lea's scum. I think Lea's scum because of the interaction with red's role and more recently I give credence to the auto-roleblock theory. I had Lea squarely in my ??? category on Day 3/4 (I think) while all of that was going on. Anyways if you look at my 'process of elimination' chart up above listing MZero/Lea/VA as possible scumspects assuming all of the above are town, there really isn't another conclusion for me to come to.

I of course have the benefit of knowing that I'm town, which you don't, but I still appreciate your point. I hope this is all useful info when I'm dead.

Chaeix posted...

That's a fair point on Lea offering herself up quite frankly but you'll note that I never said that's why I think Lea's scum. I think Lea's scum because of the interaction with red's role and more recently I give credence to the auto-roleblock theory. I had Lea squarely in my ??? category on Day 3/4 (I think) while all of that was going on. Anyways if you look at my 'process of elimination' chart up above listing MZero/Lea/VA as possible scumspects assuming all of the above are town, there really isn't another conclusion for me to come to.

I of course have the benefit of knowing that I'm town, which you don't, but I still appreciate your point. I hope this is all useful info when I'm dead.

*bites apple*

You'll note that I never said that's why I think you are scum either. I don't really have much thought about your role claim other than it being novel.

This is the annoying part of games where you are deciding between people who mostly haven't done overly much. If you had more content day one maybe you say something that looks great in hindsight. Like Lea being the 4th vote on sheep when she could very well have started another train. Or how Lea was on Isquen's ass. We can talk about role meta and possible bussing but those things look decent at a glance. Defense of arti when she didn't have to do that is... decent again. Lea can be scum, but she has things going for her at least that make me hesitate to fall victim into role meta. It is a big reason why I urge caution. Because we have to handwave a lot of positives Lea has done this game to presume her scum today and as I've said before handwave we may need to do... but I'd much rather be careful here as Lea has contributed much more meaningfully than anyone else not already cleared.

What do you think was your best post this game, JC?

DoomTheGyarados posted...

What do you think was your best post this game, JC?

Honestly there isn't one, I've been playing terribly and what I thought was my best read was on chang and then that went out the window when he flipped town. But gun to my head, my questions to Kirby when he gladiated?

Mafia is hard. I wish I could be like 'Yeah look at JC is for sure scum' but apparently I get a limit of two of those a game lol. It's such a WIFOM position of 'I suck I accept this' because obviously mafia can say that as a form of reverse psychology. Ben tried to do that day 2 after all I was just full of zeal. Did you ever consider not playing terrible? You got a few hours.

DoomTheGyarados posted...

Did you ever consider not playing terrible?

never crossed my mind

Chaeix posted...

never crossed my mind

You fell victim to one of the classic blunders

Anyway JC I'd suggest voting for someone. Holding off makes you seem like you are offering up information denial. Put your back into it young man~

You ask and you shall receive.

##Vote: Lea

I've thought MZero was scum since D2 but I like to think an autoblocker/role thief split seems appropriate and if we lynch the role thief it's better for town.

Actually clarification question for someone with a better memory because it impacts my logic above - was red roleblocked the same or a different night than the role thief was active?

Red was roleblocked on Pokemon and Role Thief is Star Wars

Chaeix posted...

I avoided discussing them because I didn't have anything else to add - a lot of those conversations had prior game context iirc and I had a hard time parsing a lot of of it (hence me asking for clarification on Sheep D1). And as I told plum when he brought up my walls of text, I was trying to come up with my own separate reads and help add to the conversation that way.

For what it's worth, this is consistent with what he said on D1 when I asked him for thoughts about... something. I remember expressing lots of frustration at the lack of D1 activity from some players, especially JC.

That being said, I think the lynch is clearly between MZero and JC today. We'll find out about Lea's truthfulness tonight. For now... I'm leaning toward JC.

Chaeix posted...

You ask and you shall receive.

##Vote: Lea

I've thought MZero was scum since D2 but I like to think an autoblocker/role thief split seems appropriate and if we lynch the role thief it's better for town.

JC, your argument is that you can't be the Role Thief because you didn't move N3. Unless you're a Ninja Role Thief, this is a fair argument to make.

Did you forget that Lea didn't move N1? She can't be the thief unless she's also a ninja, unless you want to propose that the Role Thief didn't move N1.

If you're going to use that as an argument, MZero should have been your vote, not Lea.

Oh we're finally lynching JC

##vote: JC

Kirby321 posted...

JC, your argument is that you can't be the Role Thief because you didn't move N3. Unless you're a Ninja Role Thief, this is a fair argument to make.

Did you forget that Lea didn't move N1? She can't be the thief unless she's also a ninja, unless you want to propose that the Role Thief didn't move N1.

If you're going to use that as an argument, MZero should have been your vote, not Lea.

Oh yeah I actually totally forgot about the N1 scan. So I suppose there's no basis for my logic there.

<b>##unvote: Lea
##vote: MZero</B>

##unvote: Lea
##vote: MZero

why am i so bad at remembering not to use html

... Got anything else you'd like to say Scare?

Scare is just screaming innocent-scanning independent coasting by on a scan to me, absent a second godfather.

You know, JC largely forgetting important points stressed throughout the entire game is making me wary that he's scum. You would think that scum would be more paranoid about not looking bad through careless mistakes.

Then again, you would also think that a purported Hated townie would also be wary about being mislynch from contradictions.

Yeah, let's lynch JC today. With four hours left, there's still stuff we can talk about, but I'd rather our course be set rather than leaving any room for people to try and change the direction of the lynch at the last second.

##Unvote
##Vote: JC

Who will be brave enough to toss in the next vote? Either the day gets hammered early, or nothing happens at all. Only time will tell.

Kirby321 posted...

You know, JC largely forgetting important points stressed throughout the entire game is making me wary that he's scum.

Dumb, not scum campaign 2022

in JCs defense. I haven't remembered major plot points in this game and I'm constantly asking people to restate information.

and I'm clearly town.

Though I'd like to stress that we need to talk about Lea tomorrow. I agree with Ulti in that I believe her flip tells us the most info.

But we'll still get a good chunk of info out of JC's flip. The scum pool is shrinking day by day, and we're only getting closer to uncovering the truth.

Kirby321 posted...

You know, JC largely forgetting important points stressed throughout the entire game is making me wary that he's scum. You would think that scum would be more paranoid about not looking bad through careless mistakes.

This is an 11 topic game.

UltimaterializerX posted...

Justin once claimed scum in an old Fettbox game, in a spot very similar to this, and with similar scum would never do this logic. This feels correct.

And if Han actually used hated townie, then Han shouldnt host. I get some banned roles being stretched and used, but not that one.

I don't see anything inherently wrong with the role.
it's just an unlucky vanilla. and in a game this large. being a 50% of the time unlucky vanilla... if ever there wad a game to bring jt back, this is it.

We need like a bravely default system where we can lynch two people in the same day.

.