Board 8 > Star Wars and Pokemon Mafia Topic 8 - Ruby/Sapphire

(+) Yeah! (+)

Did Isquen claim flavor at all? He only claimed Miller IIRC

Yeah uhh it looks like not

Isquen please give us both your flavors and cite the posts day 1 where you hinted your flavor. Thank you.

Ulti let me know when you are around for a few minutes want to ask you a question

UltimaterializerX posted...

I will but it's my bed time. I will do it tomorrow, promise.

(What does Arti not voting Ben D2 matter? <_<)

Why bus so hard day 1 and then not do the easy second stab after I got ham on Ben

htaeD posted...

Sultans gonna have to explain why he slept with JC honestly. Then again JC's status depends on Kirby's own status. But I liked JC's input last night.

Probably just fishing for information from an unknown quantity.

Kirby321 posted...

Red scans as suspicious to me, so given that's exactly what I thought last game until my scans proved me otherwise, I'm labeling him off as town since it seems he's playing similarly to that game

I have seen so little of red that I can't say in one way or another what they are, and that is starting to hit the alarm. One can only coast so far. But on the flip side...

Chaeix posted...

I'm not sure if I like MZero more or less because his defense of chang ultimately ended up being correct. However I'm curious about a line of reasoning - MZero, can you give me the cliff's notes on the relationship between chang and Isquen? You mentioned that one of the two is scum but from Topic 7 I couldn't really get a full understanding of why they were interlinked (I saw your independent Isquen reasoning in post 170). It may have been mentioned elsewhere but I have to head out soon and don't have the time to look into every topic.

MZero posted... (topic 7, the post in question)

Isquen has much more conviction as town, even if his logic and be a bit wonky at times. Every time he's been pushed back against this game he's backed off. We saw it again today with HB

That is some flimsy-ass logic from MZero and I don't know anything I had to do with chang beyond a "no, u." I'm attempting to tunnel someone I'm certain is scum, get flabbergasted at the claim that went around, and briefly aimed at the counterclaimee rather than the counterclaimer who I was already on. Later, when dueling time came around, I opted for the one that hasn't blipped my radar more than the one who's struck the sonar "I'm town! Look at me! Town with a town-unfriendly role!" Stranger things have happened, cough town unmoving Ninja in FFXIV Mafia cough.

I guess I don't have as much "conviction" because of two reasons: 1, I'm not being buried in textual diarrhea and getting ignored by everyone? No need to scream my head off if they aren't screaming back. 2, most of my ire was directed at Lopen and then Arti had to go and be juuuust reasonable enough to ease off the throttle on day 1.

But only day 1. No more free passes. You're next when Arti flips scum, MZ.

Obellisk posted...

weird... ya know that you would be sitting on that quote of mine...

and that it would be your first post too.

Did I miss something here with the string of posts about Lea? That looks fine to me, or was the timing off?

TheSultanOfSlam posted...

Everyone who is not chris should we be worried about Chris still being alive??

CONSTANT VIGILANCE (but it's like, 10% chance, if that, at this point that he's scum)

DoomTheGyarados posted...

Isquen fits the profile of 'new player who Chris defends because it is good policy but eventually regrets it'

I would like that star wars flavor and where you were hinting it today I think, isquen

I'm disappointed that for your reputation you haven't divined it already. I thought my breadcrumbing was heavy-handed. I have other posts where I kinda threw lines out there, but they got ignored too (brains instead of a blaster, proclaiming I hate Han.)

1-186, and I'm hitting the quote block limit:
Isquen posted...
Let me see. Actually using logic and reasoning things out, rather than obfuscating text behind 30 posts of word salad will usually guide my intuition well (even if it was wrong on Crescent in Elden Ring, while it caught Sultan at the end, so... 50-50?) No one is hard-towncleared until flips prove them otherwise; don't think you're exempt from this either, Chris. Of the posts so far, no one really stands out to me as innocent, merely overeager or a generic "lol day 1 who cares" attitude.

And for the post above:
DoomTheGyarados posted...
Because why was arti suspected day 2? I had misgivings about him so I put him on my list after Ben to be examined. He got several votes day 2. Then I examined and was like oh man, this is better than I remember. If arti didn't have people suspicious of him what do we think of him going wtf I am flavor cop too? So we have to examine that suspicion to see if we learn something.
htaeD posted... (7-471)
Thinking about this
Psychic + Watcher + 2 flavorcops...is that too much scanning for night2?
This is eating at my attention. It went from gut feeling to something more, plus whatever the hell Ulti is if he's Mewtwo.

UltimaterializerX posted...

I am here but you have 5 minutes.

For the role meta in you. Why is the Miller on the side that has no flavor split?

As for Poke, Landorus. Flavor about looking as sinister as Thundurus and Tornadus, but more pleasant comparatively in that he doesn't roam the land being a jerk you have to chase down.

Isquen posted...

As for Poke, Landorus. Flavor about looking as sinister as Thundurus and Tornadus, but more pleasant comparatively in that he doesn't roam the land being a jerk you have to chase down.

Although tbh this makes sense ;o

Okay I feel better about isquen for now. Good response tbh

For what its worth most of the fanbase really hates the Landorus and its brethren so it kinda fits

UltimaterializerX posted...

Although he's clearly about to claim something fun with Lando anyway so it's a moot point.

Only that I literally have a hermit tattoo. That's why I said it was perfect.
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/8/5/5/AAAACbAADRMX.jpg

So speaking of bad arti posts

This is to jc eod 2

Arti posted...

The only real two lurkers have been yourself and MZero, neither of you have been doing much even when you are around

There are some people like red that have not posted much either but have thoughts about other players that you can clearly see in their limited posts

My only hesitation is town chang literally thought jc was inactive until I put a wall of posts by him so... maybe people universally don't know who jc is still. Like not mentioning scare and saying you can't tell what jc is thinking is pretty absurd.

So I looked back at Topics 3, 4, and 5. Arti arguing with Ben -- sure, I can grant that Arti grilled Ben fairly hard.

... But does it not bother you at all, Chris, that Arti said this about Sheep early in Topic 3:

Arti posted...

Hardly. I don't like Corrik's posts this game either and I've noted that already! As for Sheep, I'm currently null on him - I might have to look back and get a more thorough read on him before the end of the day.

Then after Sheep claimed (before being countered by Hb), this is all he had to say, in response to red (essentially) saying "You guys aren't lynching Sheep just because he claimed power? This is a good way to never lynch scum":

Arti posted...

Depends on the game itself, obviously. Do you think Sheep is scum based on the claim?

After the counterclaim, Arti made no mention of it at all, aside from this passing remark:

Arti posted...

Lea has also not posted since the counterclaim, which is odd considering she was active immediately prior to that.

And finally, he was the third-to-last person to vote Sheep.

Regarding your point about Arti not voting for Ben until the last minute, shouldn't that seem suspicious? Dude just grilled him hard on Day 1, and the only reason Ben didn't die was because Sheep got countered. So... he opens up the day voting for Lea?!

Arti posted...

[votal history]

Not too much of interest here. Interesting that Sheep both voted Plum and Death in the early going, and I was thinking both were town through most of the day 1 that I played through. IGCD used his vote a lot - his vote was on Isquen last before voting Sheep after the counterclaim.

Anyway

##Vote: Lea

I have some questions for her myself, but I will wait until she comes back, whenever that is.

Later on in D2, he says this, clearly indicating his suspicion of Ben:

Arti posted...

I said this back in topic 3, but it bears repeating - Ben is really playing the entire game from a scum perspective. He really should be looking into other people if he was town, yet he isn't even voting anyone to get more information or force them to post more content.

... But the vote is still on Lea! Eventually, Arti takes his vote off of Lea and acknowledges that Ben is going to be lynched by the end of the day in Topic 5. Until then, he had only been engaging with Lea and never once mentioned Ben. He expressed that he was going to vote for Ben...

Arti posted...

I'll probably be voting Ben at the end of day but I'll see if there's anything I can find in a reread tomorrow. Won't be on GameFAQs much tonight.

... And then never did.

He also called my D1 wall "lackadaisical". Who even uses that word besides SCUM?! /s

I don't see what's so town-like about his behavior. What I see is someone seeing both scummates in hot water, so he tries to bus one scummate (Ben, the Neighborizer) in an attempt to save the other (Sheep, with the far more valuable Tracker). That catastrophically fails when the other scummate gets countered and is dead to rights, so he hesitantly joins the train just to save face (and apparently, it worked since no one batted an eye about his last-minute switch in votes). Next day rolls around, and although the other scummate was in hot water and almost got lynched, maybe the focus could be shifted on to someone else (Lea). Eventually, it's clear those efforts were fruitless and the bussed scummate is going to die anyway, so he might as well bus that scummate some more for townie points.

Quick before trying to sleep top to bottom list from town to scum not overthinking it.

HB
Sultan
Kirby
Death
Red
Sbell
JC
Mzero
Isquen
Ulti
Abacus
Arti
Scare
Lea

Fuck me did I just spend over a day thinking about this game only to arrive back to where I started Basically. Everyone above abacus feels like they have something potentially clearing. Scare does too but he has done nothing.

Really interested to see what everyone has to say I suppose.

I see we're not in disagreement over Arti, then. The only thing that punches a hole in my little theory is if Lea is scum, since Arti bussing three of his scummates just seems insane. But maybe Lea is a generic Goon or something with no special powers.

In any case, Arti dies today. I don't have fancy Gladiator powers today, but I sure as hell have regrets. Chang, we will avenge you.

##Vote: Arti

Sheep that is very good research into arti. Especially the null to harsh after claim. That is the type of effort I want in making sure we get it right. Thank you.

Lea as arti's defense attorney I expect a rebuttal.

Sheep on the mind there. Kirby*

Also, I'm not too familiar with how Thief works around these parts. Is it a common role? Is it usually limited shots? I know we've confirmed its existence on the Star Wars side, but who's to say there isn't one on the Pokmon side. I know this is metaing the host/role metaing, but I just want to make an informed choice about night actions.

Lea I am not accusing you of playing bad. There just is a lot of people with a lot better town cases than you right now. I feel it is appropriate for you to claim today given that so we can sort better into the future.

##unvote: ulti
##vote: arti

Kirby321 posted...

Also, I'm not too familiar with how Thief works around these parts. Is it a common role? Is it usually limited shots? I know we've confirmed its existence on the Star Wars side, but who's to say there isn't one on the Pokmon side. I know this is metaing the host/role metaing, but I just want to make an informed choice about night actions.

Thief that literally steals a scan I can't recall lol. So rare

Don't know if we've ever had anyone outright steal a scan. We've seen things that mimic scans, I think we've had things that permanently steal roles, but a single scan steal not to be my knowledge.

Chaeix posted...

I'm not sure if I like MZero more or less because his defense of chang ultimately ended up being correct. However I'm curious about a line of reasoning - MZero, can you give me the cliff's notes on the relationship between chang and Isquen? You mentioned that one of the two is scum but from Topic 7 I couldn't really get a full understanding of why they were interlinked (I saw your independent Isquen reasoning in post 170). It may have been mentioned elsewhere but I have to head out soon and don't have the time to look into every topic.

Ben's dying breath was "chang and isquen 100% town" no way both were scum

DoomTheGyarados posted...

The two people on Ben who I think could be scum? Ulti and isquen

The two who voted arti day 2 besides ben? Ulti and isquen

The two people voting arti today? Ulti and isquen.

Something tells me that pairing isn't 0 scum. But willing to hear theories.

could i interest you in 2 scum

Scare being lethargic is not good. The thing is, he was super lethargic in Chris Mafia as well from what I saw. I also don't really understand why red's getting more of a pass when he's also been relatively absent. I know you said "ben would never neighborize me if red was there in scumchat" but that feels really WIFOMy and opens him up to "Why didn't you use it on Chris" questions when he claims. I just... don't see him as being more towncleared than others.

I also think votals on Ben aren't very valuable to really look at. The moment Chris effectively laid down the law, everyone (especially including scum given how Ben played) knew he would be lynched. Votals like that only feel valuable to me when there's an actual competing lynch, which there wasn't.

I don't know if lethargic is a word I could even use for Scare here. That implies actively being around and subdued on some level.

Anyway red, I think it's been long enough that you can tell us your thoughts on the game now. Are you still suspicious of Death?

Game state has said that I shouldn't be.

If I'm wrong and my initial instincts were right I'll be kicking myself for awhile.

d1
[11] Sheep: Kirby, (Chris), (Ben), plum, (Chris), (Lea), Hb, Death, Chris, JC, IGCD, Ben, Arti/Lopen, Sultan, chang
[3] Ben: (Chris), (Sultan), (Arti/Lopen), Sheep, (Chris), Ulti, ViolentAbacus
[1] Chris: Corrik, (Sultan), (IGCD)
[1] Isquen: (Arti/Lopen), (Lea), MZero, (IGCD)
[1] IGCD: Isquen
[0] Corrik: (IGCD), (Ben)
[0] Lea: (Hb)
[0] No Lynch: (Arti/Lopen)
[0] Kirby: (Plum), (Arti/Lopen)
[0] Plum: (Scare), (Sheep)
[0] Arti/Lopen: (Isquen), (Isquen), (IGCD)
[0] chang: (SBell), (Chris), (Arti/Lopen)
[0] Death: (Sheep)
[0] Ulti: (MZero)
[0] Sultan: (Isquen)

No vote: Red
No vote at end: Lea, SBell, Scare

d2
[7] Ben: (Hb), (Ulti), Sultan, Chris, Ulti, Kirby, Isquen, Plum, Chang
[1] Arti: (Isquen), (Ulti), Ben
[1] Ulti: (Isquen), SBell, (Ben)
[1] Chris: (Ulti), Corrik
[0] Red: (Plum)
[0] Lea: (Arti)
[0] Corrik: (Ulti), (Isquen)
[0] Abacus: (Ulti)

No vote: Death, JC, Lea, MZero, Red, Scare, ViolentAbacus
No vote at end: Arti, Hb

d3 (pre-gladiator)
[5] Chang: Chris, (Ulti), Sultan, Abacus, Lea, Ulti
[3] Arti: (Ulti), (Isquen), (Chris), Plum, Chang, Isquen, (Chris), JC, (Ulti)
[1] MZero: (Lea), Arti
[1] Ulti: SBell, (Sultan)
[1] Scare: MZero
[0] Hb: (Isquen)

I don't think there's much value in the post-gladiator votals.

I think where I am right now is here

Town
me
Death
Hbthebattle
Isquen
Kirby
Lea
Sultan
Ulti

Scum
MZero
ViolentAbacus

???
JC
Red13n
Scare
SBell
Chris

based on Chang's flip and what I was thinking near the end of the day. There feels to me like I'm overlooking something in my reads, but I'm not sure what that could be.

Chris in ??? is fascinating

also do you have a reason to think I'm scum other than "inactive" because if not I reckon Scare should be in there too

I'm a ???

that's... odd

oh right, you talked about Scare and Sheep's interaction yesterday

fair enough

Venomoth, Poliwag, Nidorino, Votals
[4] Arti: Ulti, Isquen, Kirby, Chris
[1] Scare: Lea
[0] Ulti: (Chris)

With 15 alive, it takes 8 votes to reach majority. Day ends Friday at 7 eastern, roughly 36 hours from now.

Hbthebattle posted...

I also think votals on Ben aren't very valuable to really look at. The moment Chris effectively laid down the law, everyone (especially including scum given how Ben played) knew he would be lynched. Votals like that only feel valuable to me when there's an actual competing lynch, which there wasn't.

Hbthebattle posted...

Scare being lethargic is not good. The thing is, he was super lethargic in Chris Mafia as well from what I saw. I also don't really understand why red's getting more of a pass when he's also been relatively absent. I know you said "ben would never neighborize me if red was there in scumchat" but that feels really WIFOMy and opens him up to "Why didn't you use it on Chris" questions when he claims. I just... don't see him as being more towncleared than others.

Possibly on votals but it still feels off that no scum would be on Ben. One of those 'really?' Type things but maybe they just didn't care. Ultimately I did decide not to be that fanciful though.

As for red I am not trying to give him a pass I just haven't felt bad about his content. Any time he has posted I have been like 'this makes sense' but it has been fairly limited.

I think the one thing I ought to be careful about is over liking red and jc's content just because I have been in a position to defend it a bit. Like plum was talking about red being scum earlier in the game in such a wild manner that I had to be like 'plum please.' Jc too has been said to be inactive and null and that's just not true. Doesn't make him tippy top town but its hard not to want to defend him. The jc thing is wild because it feels like everyone is doing it lol

Oh as for neighbor red is really stubborn about night actions. He might have just not had Ben use it over using it on me. Really the only hesitation about that for me is I know red was swamped so using my knowledge of red may have a hole in it due to circumstance.

Hbthebattle posted...

Scare being lethargic is not good. The thing is, he was super lethargic in Chris Mafia as well from what I saw. I also don't really understand why red's getting more of a pass when he's also been relatively absent. I know you said "ben would never neighborize me if red was there in scumchat" but that feels really WIFOMy and opens him up to "Why didn't you use it on Chris" questions when he claims. I just... don't see him as being more towncleared than others.

Scare literally didn't post for like 40 hours day 3

I present you every Scare post from Day 3

ScareChan posted...

Maybe Scum is numbered to where they know there is a third party and they've been thinking Ulti?

ScareChan posted...

I imagine we're past this, but the person I would have pushed to be in the rotation for lynching is Chang

Chang was the first one to bring up flavor and Ben gave him town credit immediately

I also don't like that Chang suddenly became very cutesy when Sheep was set to be lynched, calling him Woolo. It feels out of character to me.

Fastbreak posted...

Lea hasn't flirted with me once

Probably scum

Fastbreak posted...

That doesn't impact my statement!

I mean, even ignoring the inactivity factor that's not great content. Pushing a mislynch and speculating on 3rd party

also funny that he said "we're probably past this" and then changmas ended up getting lynched

Mzero if you were a big shot who would you shoot and why

Lol vig*

Not big

DO YOU WANNA BE A BIG SHOT?

I am sorry I couldnt resist

TheSultanOfSlam posted...

Mzero if you were a big shot who would you shoot and why

I am a big shot

If I were vig I would have shot Isquen days ago tbh I have a lot of faith in my day 1 reads

I can respect that.

htaeD posted...

DO YOU WANNA BE A BIG SHOT?

I am sorry I couldnt resist

Because you had to be a big shot, didn't you, You had to open up your mouth

Obellisk posted...

weird... ya know that you would be sitting on that quote of mine...

and that it would be your first post too.

Lea never did answer this, did she?
And she voted Scare instead.
Interesting interesting.

I have a comment on that but I'll hold it until Lea responds

Arti, do you have anything to say in defense of yourself?